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Brawn13 Star Player
Joined: 30 Jan 2019 Posts: 3941
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Posted: Sun Jul 02, 2023 10:44 pm Post subject: |
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venturalakersfan wrote: | Halflife wrote: | venturalakersfan wrote: | If Lebron and AD are healthier and better then the team likely improved. If not they likely didn’t. No other player on the roster can make up for the loss of one of them. It’s pretty much the way any two star team rolls. But no matter what, the Buss kids will make more money this season. |
We can afford to lose bron but not AD. After trade last year when bron was resting we played really good ball. I know our schedule was easy and some teams were tanking but it was still effective. |
That’s not close to being true. If Lebron misses 20+ games we are a 40 win team at best. |
If either one goes down for significant time we are in trouble. More so if AD does…just because we don’t have any decent big to replace him. We have a ton of wing depth now to at least throw out there in case Lebron misses time. We have Hayes to backup AD and that’s it. |
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LakerFan1987 Star Player
Joined: 30 Oct 2022 Posts: 1575
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Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 6:41 am Post subject: |
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Team age .... that's some great team building by Rob. We're going to have a nice core group to build with once LBJ leaves (maybe AD too)
38 — LeBron
30 — AD
29 — Prince
27 — DLo
27 — Vincent
25 — Rui
25 — Reaves
24 — Vando
23 — Reddish
23 — Hayes
20 — Christie
20 — Hood-Schifino
20 — Maxwell |
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LakerSD Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Nov 2016 Posts: 23805
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Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 6:50 am Post subject: |
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Tim Bontemps, who miraculously made the cut at espn, says no. So 100% they are better.
Always go opposite of what that clown says. |
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lakurluv Star Player
Joined: 17 May 2010 Posts: 2529
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Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 7:13 am Post subject: |
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I like what the FO has done in Free Agency, this is the most aggressive the team has been in years. I think the team has gotten younger and more athletic over the last 2 seasons, it's obvious they are planning for an LBJ exit sometime within the foreseeable future.
Players on paper always look better, but you can't truly tell until they hit that LA (Hollywood) Hardwood! It's a completely different animal!
I believe the team overall has more talent (potentially) than last year. How well this team meshes will be the determining factor, however keeping the core together was the biggest piece.
DLO + Reaves + LBJ + Vando + AD
This Unit could continue to do some damage, especially if they all come back better, especially the three younger pieces. DLO will need to be more consistent and a greater threat (all around) he needs to be effective on both ends and it will take commitment defensively. Vando and Reaves need to become better 3pt shooters, we have to spread the floor in order for LBJ and AD to have more opportunities. Our Two Superstars need load management and good health in order for the Lakers to make a deep playoff run and possibly make it to the finals.
I don't know if either of the rookies will get a chance to have an Impact, but it's possible they could level up and make a difference, two highly talented prospects! We'll get a glimpse today!
Overall, I'd say we're a better team.
Vincent + Reddish + Prince + Rui + Hayes
could provide adequate rotation minutes during the course of the season and should take some miles off of both LBJ and AD. Once again chemistry will play a roll in how well that unit can produce. Either way we have some legit vets coming off of our bench that are young, athletic with a ton of talent.
We may even have a few with chips on their shoulder that can provide some tough competition and add to the Lakers swag on the floor. We're built with defense in mind, so let's see what coach Ham can produce! |
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SGSD32 Starting Rotation
Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 532
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Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 7:32 am Post subject: |
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venturalakersfan wrote: | Halflife wrote: | venturalakersfan wrote: | If Lebron and AD are healthier and better then the team likely improved. If not they likely didn’t. No other player on the roster can make up for the loss of one of them. It’s pretty much the way any two star team rolls. But no matter what, the Buss kids will make more money this season. |
We can afford to lose bron but not AD. After trade last year when bron was resting we played really good ball. I know our schedule was easy and some teams were tanking but it was still effective. |
That’s not close to being true. If Lebron misses 20+ games we are a 40 win team at best. |
With a worse roster last year, they won 43 games with BOTH missing more than 25 games. |
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Megaton Retired Number
Joined: 18 Feb 2015 Posts: 25703
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Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 7:40 am Post subject: |
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SGSD32 wrote: | venturalakersfan wrote: | Halflife wrote: | venturalakersfan wrote: | If Lebron and AD are healthier and better then the team likely improved. If not they likely didn’t. No other player on the roster can make up for the loss of one of them. It’s pretty much the way any two star team rolls. But no matter what, the Buss kids will make more money this season. |
We can afford to lose bron but not AD. After trade last year when bron was resting we played really good ball. I know our schedule was easy and some teams were tanking but it was still effective. |
That’s not close to being true. If Lebron misses 20+ games we are a 40 win team at best. |
With a worse roster last year, they won 43 games with BOTH missing more than 25 games. |
Just ignore VCF. _________________ Darvin Scam: https://media.tenor.com/images/3c15249955860a4b16b59e8ae035fb75/tenor.gif |
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LakersRGolden Star Player
Joined: 13 Jan 2002 Posts: 7947 Location: Lake Forest
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Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 8:57 am Post subject: |
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SGSD32 wrote: | venturalakersfan wrote: | Halflife wrote: | venturalakersfan wrote: | If Lebron and AD are healthier and better then the team likely improved. If not they likely didn’t. No other player on the roster can make up for the loss of one of them. It’s pretty much the way any two star team rolls. But no matter what, the Buss kids will make more money this season. |
We can afford to lose bron but not AD. After trade last year when bron was resting we played really good ball. I know our schedule was easy and some teams were tanking but it was still effective. |
That’s not close to being true. If Lebron misses 20+ games we are a 40 win team at best. |
With a worse roster last year, they won 43 games with BOTH missing more than 25 games. |
Don't encourage the Clipper fan. |
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venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144576 Location: The Gold Coast
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Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 9:12 am Post subject: |
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SGSD32 wrote: | venturalakersfan wrote: | Halflife wrote: | venturalakersfan wrote: | If Lebron and AD are healthier and better then the team likely improved. If not they likely didn’t. No other player on the roster can make up for the loss of one of them. It’s pretty much the way any two star team rolls. But no matter what, the Buss kids will make more money this season. |
We can afford to lose bron but not AD. After trade last year when bron was resting we played really good ball. I know our schedule was easy and some teams were tanking but it was still effective. |
That’s not close to being true. If Lebron misses 20+ games we are a 40 win team at best. |
With a worse roster last year, they won 43 games with BOTH missing more than 25 games. |
I don’t agree that it was a worse roster. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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defense Retired Number
Joined: 12 Jan 2010 Posts: 39685
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Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 9:19 am Post subject: |
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SGSD32 wrote: | venturalakersfan wrote: | Halflife wrote: | venturalakersfan wrote: | If Lebron and AD are healthier and better then the team likely improved. If not they likely didn’t. No other player on the roster can make up for the loss of one of them. It’s pretty much the way any two star team rolls. But no matter what, the Buss kids will make more money this season. |
We can afford to lose bron but not AD. After trade last year when bron was resting we played really good ball. I know our schedule was easy and some teams were tanking but it was still effective. |
That’s not close to being true. If Lebron misses 20+ games we are a 40 win team at best. |
With a worse roster last year, they won 43 games with BOTH missing more than 25 games. |
That was with the Westbrook start and a bunch of new guys. We will be more consistent this year. VLF steady pooping on the team, management and ownership. It's personal for him. |
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CamReddish Star Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2015 Posts: 8043
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Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 9:37 am Post subject: |
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venturalakersfan wrote: | SGSD32 wrote: | venturalakersfan wrote: | Halflife wrote: | venturalakersfan wrote: | If Lebron and AD are healthier and better then the team likely improved. If not they likely didn’t. No other player on the roster can make up for the loss of one of them. It’s pretty much the way any two star team rolls. But no matter what, the Buss kids will make more money this season. |
We can afford to lose bron but not AD. After trade last year when bron was resting we played really good ball. I know our schedule was easy and some teams were tanking but it was still effective. |
That’s not close to being true. If Lebron misses 20+ games we are a 40 win team at best. |
With a worse roster last year, they won 43 games with BOTH missing more than 25 games. |
I don’t agree that it was a worse roster. |
It was easily worse, if you compare the pre trade roster to the one we have now. You won't do that though _________________ Previously LBJ23 |
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venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144576 Location: The Gold Coast
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Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 9:47 am Post subject: |
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I would compare last year’s total roster to this years. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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Hanging from Rafters Star Player
Joined: 31 Jul 2018 Posts: 4574
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Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 9:57 am Post subject: |
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lakurluv wrote: | I like what the FO has done in Free Agency, this is the most aggressive the team has been in years. I think the team has gotten younger and more athletic over the last 2 seasons, it's obvious they are planning for an LBJ exit sometime within the foreseeable future.
Players on paper always look better, but you can't truly tell until they hit that LA (Hollywood) Hardwood! It's a completely different animal!
I believe the team overall has more talent (potentially) than last year. How well this team meshes will be the determining factor, however keeping the core together was the biggest piece.
DLO + Reaves + LBJ + Vando + AD
This Unit could continue to do some damage, especially if they all come back better, especially the three younger pieces. DLO will need to be more consistent and a greater threat (all around) he needs to be effective on both ends and it will take commitment defensively. Vando and Reaves need to become better 3pt shooters, we have to spread the floor in order for LBJ and AD to have more opportunities. Our Two Superstars need load management and good health in order for the Lakers to make a deep playoff run and possibly make it to the finals.
I don't know if either of the rookies will get a chance to have an Impact, but it's possible they could level up and make a difference, two highly talented prospects! We'll get a glimpse today!
Overall, I'd say we're a better team.
Vincent + Reddish + Prince + Rui + Hayes
could provide adequate rotation minutes during the course of the season and should take some miles off of both LBJ and AD. Once again chemistry will play a roll in how well that unit can produce. Either way we have some legit vets coming off of our bench that are young, athletic with a ton of talent.
We may even have a few with chips on their shoulder that can provide some tough competition and add to the Lakers swag on the floor. We're built with defense in mind, so let's see what coach Ham can produce! |
Hopefully it was just an oversight typo including Vand in the tier with AD/LBJ/AR/Dlo and then putting Rui with Hayes/Prince/Cam/Vinc. We just spent 17m on Rui and clearly it should be the other way around. If not…well…would have to question all your logic after that. _________________ “When it looks as if it is a realistic possibility, I want to focus on winning a ship like it’s a goal that can’t be denied. I didn’t see that this off season.” |
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BILBJH Star Player
Joined: 23 Jul 2020 Posts: 5146
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Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 10:20 am Post subject: |
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Last year's opening day starting lineup
AD
LBJ
Westbrook
Lonnie
PatBev
Nunn
Matt Ryan
AR
JTA
Wenyen
This year
AD
LBJ
Rui
AR
DLo
Hayes
Vando
Prince
Gabe
JHS
MaxC
Reddish
We had JTA, Matt Ryan, and Wenyen playing as rotation players.
We upgraded Lonnie and PatBev with DLo and AR.
How is this team not better?
And this is if the new additions play at their floor instead of their potential. |
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activeverb Retired Number
Joined: 17 Jun 2006 Posts: 37470
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Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 12:21 pm Post subject: |
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BILBJH wrote: | Last year's opening day starting lineup
AD
LBJ
Westbrook
Lonnie
PatBev
Nunn
Matt Ryan
AR
JTA
Wenyen
This year
AD
LBJ
Rui
AR
DLo
Hayes
Vando
Prince
Gabe
JHS
MaxC
Reddish
We had JTA, Matt Ryan, and Wenyen playing as rotation players.
We upgraded Lonnie and PatBev with DLo and AR.
How is this team not better?
And this is if the new additions play at their floor instead of their potential. |
I think most people agree that the current team is better than the team we had at the start of last season.
The question of whether the current team is better than the team we had at the end of last season is less clear to me.
I like this team better than the team we had in October 2022. Not sure I really like this team any better than the team we had in April 2023. |
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lakersboy Star Player
Joined: 20 Jul 2006 Posts: 8528 Location: Left coast
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Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 12:52 pm Post subject: |
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manlisten wrote: | Think Thomas Bryant has to be factored in. Couldn't defend but much more productive than either Bamba or Hayes and was huge when AD missed time. Big downgrade there. | My problem with that is Bryant didn’t factor into the “good” Lakers squad. He was part of the bad one and wasn’t there contributing when they were winning. |
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BandwagonLBJhopper Star Player
Joined: 07 Feb 2020 Posts: 3609
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Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 3:00 pm Post subject: |
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Need another strong big so AD can man the 4
Who is our answer for Jokic and Embid types? Need a big |
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Hanging from Rafters Star Player
Joined: 31 Jul 2018 Posts: 4574
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Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 3:35 pm Post subject: |
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LakerDYnasty72 wrote: | We are absolutely better. The experience of making it all the way to the WCF, and then to bring back the core, and then add reinforcements to the core like Prince, Vincent, and a physical freak in Hayes, means we'll be a much better, balanced team.
We need another veteran 5, but otherwise the front office is truly on a mission, and it's being accomplished very impressively. |
The team is not better. It may be similar and that’s not a bad thing given how they played after the trade dead line including the post season.
Vinc replaced Shro
Prince replaced TBjr
Hayes replaced Gabe
That’s really about the same give or take a few points. The difference that may keep the team from being better…or at least questionable…is losing the 4th guard without a suitable replacement. Hopefully Cam will improve his game to be that. For now the team is at best the same but certainly not better. _________________ “When it looks as if it is a realistic possibility, I want to focus on winning a ship like it’s a goal that can’t be denied. I didn’t see that this off season.” |
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lar9149 Star Player
Joined: 10 Jul 2010 Posts: 2420
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Posted: Tue Jul 04, 2023 6:53 am Post subject: |
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I think the Lakers got better but even if they are about he same..I think we should consider the competition
From what I heard about the Nuggets they lost Brown..don't know if they got a suitable replacement yet or if they are going to at all
The Suns..got Bradley Beal..could be a great team..but given history of injuries from Beal and Durant..possible they won't go as far as they should
Given perhaps the Nuggets were the only better team than the Lakers last year..the Lakers chances are probably better this year than previous even if they didn't improve |
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Dr. Laker Franchise Player
Joined: 12 Apr 2002 Posts: 17147
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Posted: Tue Jul 04, 2023 8:48 am Post subject: |
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Lakers got better.
Nuggets got worse and have to deal with post-championship syndrome. Does Joker show up at camp weighing 380#?
Suns got worse (IMO, not a Beal believer), KD never healthy. Booker at the 1.
Dubs in major decline everywhere. Klay - DONE. Dray - DONE.
Clippers still toxic and injury prone. Harden wouldn't help that if he came.
Grizzlies could be a major problem . . . or a major disaster. Where is Ja's head?
Will Sasha Vezenkov be a difference maker in Sacto? Maybe. Brown is coaching them up.
Pelicans are out of control.
Blazers are dead in the water.
OKC is on the come up and could make the playoffs.
Houston won't be pathetic.
T-Wolves are dysfunctional.
Spurs will anchor the lottery.
Mavs. I just don't see Kyrie & Luka working.
Utah is smartly rebuilding.
The Lakers are certainly Top-3 in the West. Where Dame lands could tip the balance, but I see him going East. _________________ On Lakersground, a concern troll is someone who is a fan of another team, but pretends to be a Lakers fan with "concerns". |
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venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144576 Location: The Gold Coast
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Posted: Tue Jul 04, 2023 9:12 am Post subject: |
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BILBJH wrote: | Last year's opening day starting lineup
AD
LBJ
Westbrook
Lonnie
PatBev
Nunn
Matt Ryan
AR
JTA
Wenyen
This year
AD
LBJ
Rui
AR
DLo
Hayes
Vando
Prince
Gabe
JHS
MaxC
Reddish
We had JTA, Matt Ryan, and Wenyen playing as rotation players.
We upgraded Lonnie and PatBev with DLo and AR.
How is this team not better?
And this is if the new additions play at their floor instead of their potential. |
How did we upgrade with AR when he was in both lineups? Did we also upgrade with Lebron and AD? _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144576 Location: The Gold Coast
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Posted: Tue Jul 04, 2023 9:14 am Post subject: |
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BandwagonLBJhopper wrote: | Need another strong big so AD can man the 4
Who is our answer for Jokic and Embid types? Need a big |
Lebron is the 4 _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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SGSD32 Starting Rotation
Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 532
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Posted: Tue Jul 04, 2023 9:22 am Post subject: |
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venturalakersfan wrote: | BILBJH wrote: | Last year's opening day starting lineup
AD
LBJ
Westbrook
Lonnie
PatBev
Nunn
Matt Ryan
AR
JTA
Wenyen
This year
AD
LBJ
Rui
AR
DLo
Hayes
Vando
Prince
Gabe
JHS
MaxC
Reddish
We had JTA, Matt Ryan, and Wenyen playing as rotation players.
We upgraded Lonnie and PatBev with DLo and AR.
How is this team not better?
And this is if the new additions play at their floor instead of their potential. |
How did we upgrade with AR when he was in both lineups? Did we also upgrade with Lebron and AD? |
When they upgraded everything around them so that they won't be worn down come playoffs.
And are you suggesting AR didn't grow a bunch from the start of last season to the end? |
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Hanging from Rafters Star Player
Joined: 31 Jul 2018 Posts: 4574
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Posted: Tue Jul 04, 2023 12:37 pm Post subject: |
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Dr. Laker wrote: | Lakers got better.
Nuggets got worse and have to deal with post-championship syndrome. Does Joker show up at camp weighing 380#?
Suns got worse (IMO, not a Beal believer), KD never healthy. Booker at the 1.
Dubs in major decline everywhere. Klay - DONE. Dray - DONE.
Clippers still toxic and injury prone. Harden wouldn't help that if he came.
Grizzlies could be a major problem . . . or a major disaster. Where is Ja's head?
Will Sasha Vezenkov be a difference maker in Sacto? Maybe. Brown is coaching them up.
Pelicans are out of control.
Blazers are dead in the water.
OKC is on the come up and could make the playoffs.
Houston won't be pathetic.
T-Wolves are dysfunctional.
Spurs will anchor the lottery.
Mavs. I just don't see Kyrie & Luka working.
Utah is smartly rebuilding.
The Lakers are certainly Top-3 in the West. Where Dame lands could tip the balance, but I see him going East. |
I think it looks obvious that the Lakers didn’t get better when the logic used to indicate that they got better is a smokescreen avoiding the issue by describing other teams as the reason the Lakers got better. When describing the Lakers it seems pretty clear that they did not get better. To avoid that, just bring up other teams. We all know that even if other teams changed it doesn’t affect whether the Lakers got better or not. Sure, the Lakers chances of success may or may not change based in other teams changes but it is not related to the Lakers getting better or not.
The Lakers did not get better. Perhaps they have a better chance, maybe not, but they did not improve their team. _________________ “When it looks as if it is a realistic possibility, I want to focus on winning a ship like it’s a goal that can’t be denied. I didn’t see that this off season.” |
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Polarbear Star Player
Joined: 03 Nov 2003 Posts: 6129
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Posted: Tue Jul 04, 2023 1:01 pm Post subject: |
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It’s definitely not a worst roster, which is important because this team made the Western Conference finals last year
Whenever I look at terms of getting better, I also have to take into account what the team look like at the beginning of last season, not at the trade deadline. This roster was horribly and balanced. We had a Russell Westbrook problem, a rookie head coach, and because of all that we were losing games This year the roster goes into the season, balanced most of the players are back from the success that we had last year and they’re going to have a full training camp together which I think is equally important
People just seem to forget that the team was thrown together right before we had to head into the playoffs. What they did last year was miraculous beast just on that and then they made it one series away from the NBA finals. Very excited for this upcoming season. |
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manlisten Star Player
Joined: 09 Jul 2004 Posts: 3218
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Posted: Tue Jul 04, 2023 1:09 pm Post subject: |
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lakersboy wrote: | manlisten wrote: | Think Thomas Bryant has to be factored in. Couldn't defend but much more productive than either Bamba or Hayes and was huge when AD missed time. Big downgrade there. | My problem with that is Bryant didn’t factor into the “good” Lakers squad. He was part of the bad one and wasn’t there contributing when they were winning. |
He had a 20 game stretch where he averaged 16 and 10 on 63% when AD went down. He was absolutely crucial to keeping the team afloat. They don't even make the playoffs without his contribution last season. _________________ It was reminiscent of one of those Most Interesting Man in the World advertisements: "I don't always shoot 6-for-28 from the field, but when I do, I become the youngest player in league history to score 28,000 career points." |
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