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nickuku
Star Player
Joined: 09 Jul 2010
Posts: 7844
Location: Orange County
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 Posted: Sun Nov 03, 2019 11:37 am Post subject: |
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| ocho wrote: | | Just wanna say that I come to LG for in depth discussion of the Los Angeles Lakers. I stay for moments like “are you man enough to not eat pasta for a month?” |
I surely am not.
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LarryCoon
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Joined: 11 Aug 2002
Posts: 11266
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| Posted: Sun Nov 03, 2019 9:25 pm Post subject: |
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| I hear that research is the most conclusive when it's unblinded, uncontrolled, non-randomized, has an N of one, the experimenter IS the subject, and the conclusions you're testing for are chosen after the study is conducted, and not before. |
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Huey Lewis & The News
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Joined: 18 Dec 2015
Posts: 5234
Location: So what's the uh...topic of discussion?
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| Posted: Mon Nov 04, 2019 5:18 am Post subject: |
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| LarryCoon wrote: | | I hear that research is the most conclusive when it's unblinded, uncontrolled, non-randomized, has an N of one, the experimenter IS the subject, and the conclusions you're testing for are chosen after the study is conducted, and not before. |
"unblinded" is what keto did for dubaholic
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Omar Little
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Joined: 02 May 2005
Posts: 90307
Location: Formerly Known As 24
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| Posted: Mon Nov 04, 2019 12:54 pm Post subject: |
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I wonder how adding in some acupuncture and tongue reading would work?
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“We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel |
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LarryCoon
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Joined: 11 Aug 2002
Posts: 11266
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| Posted: Mon Nov 04, 2019 1:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Omar Little wrote: | | I wonder how adding in some acupuncture and tongue reading would work? |
Extraneous independent variables only improve the quality. |
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PHILosophize
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Joined: 05 Nov 2012
Posts: 10758
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| Posted: Mon Nov 04, 2019 2:19 pm Post subject: |
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one dog goes that way the other dog goes the other way |
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Omar Little
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Posts: 90307
Location: Formerly Known As 24
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| Posted: Mon Nov 04, 2019 3:19 pm Post subject: |
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I saw a werewolf drinking a keto shake at Trader Vics, and his hair was perfect...
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“We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel |
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dubaholic1
Star Player
Joined: 23 Dec 2004
Posts: 3016
Location: Quality over Quantity
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| Posted: Mon Nov 04, 2019 9:20 pm Post subject: |
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| nickuku wrote: | | dubaholic1 wrote: | | JerryMagicKobe wrote: | | dubaholic1 wrote: | | Omar Little wrote: | | JerryMagicKobe wrote: | | dubaholic1 wrote: | | Omar Little wrote: | | dubaholic1 wrote: | | Huey Lewis & The News wrote: | | dubaholic1 wrote: |
Gluten is the killer, sugar is the killer. The Med profession will never cop to this truth . |
This is some charlatan garbage, sir. Virtually all physicians, especially pediatricians, stress the dangers to metabolic health inherent in high-sugar diets. |
Funny how you chose to fixate on and paraphrase only one portion of my post. Interesting. Are you a medical professional or maybe a pharma rep?
Here is more "charlatan garbage" for you to refute:
https://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/13/well/eat/how-the-sugar-industry-shifted-blame-to-fat.html
The Medical establishment need people to remain unhealthy, as does big Pharma and Big Sugar. This has been perpetuated for the last 50 years.
They keep pushing the BS food pyramid as well as saying that juice is healthy and soda is OK in moderation and they keep giving diabetics juice and cookies.
FACT they preach that low fat, low cholesterol foods are good for you. This is all proven to be BS.
I dont need to look any further than my own results from remaining vigilant about my diet change to 70% Fat, 15% carbs and 15% Protein and Zero sugar. I dont even need to wear reading glasses anymore. I had to buy new clothes, as my old ones no longer fit. My hair grew back my BMI is now inline, and I no longer snore at night. |
Gluten is only a problem for a very small portion of the population, and is not the key health problem for most people. Refined carbs and sugars, processed foods of all types really, are the issue. Natural sugars in moderate amounts have no proven ill effects.
FWIW, I expect this Keto craze to come back to bite a lot of people down the road. The human body is designed to be omnivorous, not run chiefly on fat. And anyone who tells you their diet regrew their hair AND fixed their vision is probably not going to give you real objective info in my experience. |
Omar both of those things happened for me. My hair came back and so did my vision. I have no reason to lie. Also Keto is not meant to be a long term diet. You are in no position to tell me what my experience has been. Maybe do your research before commenting on something you clearly know nothing about? |
Please post evidence to support your extraordinary claim that keto regrows hair and restores vision. |
That was my point. One of the telltale signs of woo is the extraordinary claims that come with it. It's not, "I lost weight, felt better, and regained muscle tone". No, it's "my vision magically reversed itself and my hair grew back", neither of which I can find any empirical evidence of having any causal relationship from a keto diet. |
Again I really have no reason to lie. What do I have to gain from that? Once I quit bread,pasta,rice,sugar completely I had noticeable changes.
Once you train the body to stop looking for sugar for fuel it looks for something else to burn, which is fat. Starve the sugar out, and your body freaks out and goes looking for the next thing to burn. Sugar occurs naturally in certain things, like berries and dark chocolate. Eating those keeps a nominal amount of glucose necessary for vital function, but not enough for the body to think it can revert to burning it for consistent fuel.
Going keto and kicking gluten and sugar has reversed quite a few issues.
*Thicker and fuller hair ( crown and front hair line)
*eysight restored ( no longer need glasses when I sit at the computer)
*no longer need to take antacids
*morning wood back in full glory (sorry TMI)
* currently down 35 lbs since July 22nd
* A1C levels back within range
* BMI almost back within range ( few more lbs to go to hit target weight of 185)
All this from stopping bread, pasta, rice and sugar. one cheat day a month usually for beer and hot wings.
I really have no reason to lie and honestly if one person here is moved by my transformation and decides to give it a go PM me and I will help with recipes, shopping lists and general encouragement. It's really been a blessing. The only thing required is will power and the desire for a better version of yourself. |
I understand you are convinced based on your first person experience, but I am looking for evidence with a sample size greater than one. Surely with results this miraculous, there must be a mountain of evidence to support your belief that Keto regrows hair and restores vision and that your blessing is translatable to others.
Link please |
I dont understand why you are aggressively threadcrapping on me. Just be happy for me and encouraging. I probably had a severe and un-diagnosed gluten allergy and high blood pressure which explains the hair re-growth and re-gained eyesight. Why is that so hard to believe? I'm a much better version of myself now and certainly don't need to prove it to you or Omar. I don't care what you believe or dont believe. I'm happy with my results and want to share it with others who may benefit like I did. If you can't handle my truth that's your problem. It's never too late to change though. I challenge you to go a month with no bread, pasta or rice, or soda or sugar. Are you man enough? |
I think a lot of that is just cutting sugar out of your diet. Don't think your claims about hair and eyesight have any basis in science. Its more likely a placebo effect you're feeling rather than actual results. There could be a multitude of other reasons why you're experiencing what you are. |
You are wrong |
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dubaholic1
Star Player
Joined: 23 Dec 2004
Posts: 3016
Location: Quality over Quantity
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| Posted: Mon Nov 04, 2019 9:54 pm Post subject: |
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| JerryMagicKobe wrote: | | dubaholic1 wrote: | | I dont understand why you are aggressively threadcrapping on me. Just be happy for me and encouraging. I probably had a severe and un-diagnosed gluten allergy and high blood pressure which explains the hair re-growth and re-gained eyesight. Why is that so hard to believe? I'm a much better version of myself now and certainly don't need to prove it to you or Omar. I don't care what you believe or dont believe. I'm happy with my results and want to share it with others who may benefit like I did. If you can't handle my truth that's your problem. It's never too late to change though. I challenge you to go a month with no bread, pasta or rice, or soda or sugar. Are you man enough? |
You attributed the restoration of your vision and hair to keto and promoted the idea that keto could have similar results for others.
I asked for evidence.
Evidence
You offered alternatives (severe gluten allergy and high BP) that undermine your conclusion, admonished Omar and I for not sharing your (unsubstantiated) belief and then sprinkled in some good, old-fashioned manhood questioning.
Got anything else? |
This thread has taken quite a vicious tone. I'll take the high road and peace out of here. Hopefully someone here has benefited from reading my results and gives it a try. If so, don't hesitate to PM me for recipes, meal plans and encouragement. |
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JerryMagicKobe
Moderator
Joined: 28 Jul 2005
Posts: 15100
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| Posted: Mon Nov 04, 2019 11:12 pm Post subject: |
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| dubaholic1 wrote: | | This thread has taken quite a vicious tone. I'll take the high road and peace out of here. Hopefully someone here has benefited from reading my results and gives it a try. If so, don't hesitate to PM me for recipes, meal plans and encouragement. |
Not good enough. You’ve been a member here for 15 years which is long enough to know the rules about not making stuff up. If you make a claim, it is not vicious for someone to ask you to back it up with evidence. Backing it up is your responsibility. Not backing it up opens the door to being ridiculed, which brings us here.
Believe whatever you like
Play the martyr with me as the bad guy if you must
But recruiting followers with unsubstantiated claims will not be tolerated on this site.
Feel free to PM me for encouragement. |
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Huey Lewis & The News
Star Player
Joined: 18 Dec 2015
Posts: 5234
Location: So what's the uh...topic of discussion?
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| Posted: Tue Nov 05, 2019 1:46 am Post subject: |
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| dubaholic1 wrote: | | JerryMagicKobe wrote: | | dubaholic1 wrote: | | I dont understand why you are aggressively threadcrapping on me. Just be happy for me and encouraging. I probably had a severe and un-diagnosed gluten allergy and high blood pressure which explains the hair re-growth and re-gained eyesight. Why is that so hard to believe? I'm a much better version of myself now and certainly don't need to prove it to you or Omar. I don't care what you believe or dont believe. I'm happy with my results and want to share it with others who may benefit like I did. If you can't handle my truth that's your problem. It's never too late to change though. I challenge you to go a month with no bread, pasta or rice, or soda or sugar. Are you man enough? |
You attributed the restoration of your vision and hair to keto and promoted the idea that keto could have similar results for others.
I asked for evidence.
Evidence
You offered alternatives (severe gluten allergy and high BP) that undermine your conclusion, admonished Omar and I for not sharing your (unsubstantiated) belief and then sprinkled in some good, old-fashioned manhood questioning.
Got anything else? |
This thread has taken quite a vicious tone. I'll take the high road and peace out of here. Hopefully someone here has benefited from reading my results and gives it a try. If so, don't hesitate to PM me for recipes, meal plans and encouragement. |
I think most of the people who are poking fun at you, including me, would happily congratulate you on the improvements to your well-being that you say you have benefited from, but saying that these benefits were directly caused by your keto phase sounds more New Testament than personal testament, and it's dangerous.
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"All wars are civil wars, because all men are brothers."
http://forums.lakersground.net/profile.php?mode=viewprofile&u=13018 |
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LarryCoon
Site Staff
Joined: 11 Aug 2002
Posts: 11266
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| Posted: Tue Nov 05, 2019 8:15 am Post subject: |
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| dubaholic1 wrote: | | nickuku wrote: | | I think a lot of that is just cutting sugar out of your diet. Don't think your claims about hair and eyesight have any basis in science. Its more likely a placebo effect you're feeling rather than actual results. There could be a multitude of other reasons why you're experiencing what you are. |
You are wrong |
I know we're trying to wrap this up, but I did want to address this response. He's wrong about which part -- that your claim isn't based in science? This gets to the very heart of the claim I was making.
What you have provided to us is an anecdote, which as I joked in an unblinded, uncontrolled, non-randomized study with an N of one, where the experimenter IS the subject, and the conclusions you're testing for are chosen after the study is conducted, and not before.
Or to put it another way, this is exactly the antithesis of science. And for many, many, MANY phenomena, even ones that adherents will swear on a stack of bibles on, as soon as we examine the claims in a rigorous way, the effects go away. The better the study, the smaller the effect, and the best studies show no effect at all.
Why is this? Because we have human brains, which means we're pattern-seeking organisms, and we're really easy to fool. It doesn't make you an idiot when you swear something works when it really doesn't, it makes you human.
There really is some evidence that ketosis can be beneficial for certain things (epilepsy being among them). But it's vastly oversold as a miracle cure, and really is just another variation on several time-tested fad diets. Your specific claims (related to hair loss and eyesight) have very low prior plausibility, so when I see these claims as an anecdote I immediately think of how unblinded and uncontrolled anecdotes are, and I wonder what the actual science says. It's far, far, FAR more likely that your human brain is simply acting like a human brain than it is that you've found a miracle treatment, the effects of which disappear when examined rigorously. |
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