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lakersboxershorts Starting Rotation
Joined: 02 Feb 2006 Posts: 196
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 3:33 am Post subject: |
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Ahhh.. the Kidd talks again. We all been there before. Kidd talks revisted. YES!
1. Kidd is a freak. My inclination would be get him here.
2. It would have to not cost us the nucleus of Kwame, Bynum, Odom, and Kobe. Everyone else is fair game.
3. Kidd would take us over the top easily. The man is a freak! Could you imagine a lineup of Kidd/Kobe/Lamar ???? Thats a triple double threat from each and everyone of those guys every night. YIKES!
4. We would be unstoppable. Ok.. ok.. put down the pipe.
5. It would never happen. David Stern would step in and VETO our trade. NJ would never let it happen. But if Mihm were healthy I'd ship him off to Jersey for Kidd along with other nickles and dimes here and there.
Kapeesh. |
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J.C. Smith Franchise Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 12707
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 8:15 am Post subject: |
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Kidd would be a good fit, and we all know that Phil likes him as he was willing to trade Kobe for him in the past. He's got a huge contract though, but he's still arguably the best point guard in the game all around (Sorry Nash). He is a great rebounder, passer and defender, who can also score.
I think that if New Jersey is willing to move Kidd, then they are also looking at the reality that Carter will probably be leaving next season, likely to Orlando. If they only take on expiring contracts and Carter walks that puts their salary at $42.3 million next season. I'm not sure where the cap will be, I think between $55-60 million so that gives them a lot of wriggle room, they could sign a player coming off their rookie deal to a maximum contract. Or more likely they could try to dump Richardson, as well, and get some draft picks and young players with cheap contracts to try to rebuild. The "big three" hasn't taken them anywhere, they probably realize that their best shot at turning that franchise around is to get rid of those three players and start from scratch.
If that is the case, what could we offer them? Kwame and Vlad wouldn't do it. Vlad has a long term deal, and they have Richardson already. Kwame's salary would ruin any cap dreams they might have in mind. I don't think the Lakers are willing to part with Bynum. So who does that leave who is either on a reasonable contract or in a last year? It leaves Chris Mihm, Aaron Mckie, Shammond Williams, Maurice Evans, Luke Walton, Brian Cook (who has a good contract for what he brings), Smush Parker, and Ronny Turiaf... None of those guys is making more than $4.2 million a season, and all of the combined don't equal out to Kidd's salary. It's a pipe dream, it couldn't happen unless we parted with Kwame or Odom. While the Lakers might be willing to part with Kwame, you'd likely have to throw in Radmanovic with him and filler to make the contracts meet. They don't have that many roster spots. It's an impossibility without a third team.
Last edited by J.C. Smith on Wed Jan 17, 2007 8:23 am; edited 3 times in total |
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karlmalonefan Star Player
Joined: 06 Jul 2004 Posts: 2608 Location: Phoenix, AZ
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 8:19 am Post subject: |
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24 wrote: | The only triple double Kidd should be worried about is the 3 children who are having their lives ruined by 2 jerks. | _________________ Welcome to OverreactionGround.net, where a single possession can make you the savior of mankind or a total moron. -Ozendorph |
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2Cleva Star Player
Joined: 17 Jun 2001 Posts: 9195
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 8:23 am Post subject: |
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Tonight's game is huge, not for the standings, but to show if Bynum and Turiaf can handle Duncan.
If they can - I would think long and hard if I was LA about dealing Kwame and change for Kidd.
Kwame, Mihm, McKie and Smush for Kidd.
LA loses a couple of backup big men in Kwame and Mihm but they can replace them easily in free agency next year. Centers were struggling for contracts because of the new rules. They can sign Doleac or the like and be set.
Only thing that Kwame brings is post defense. The rebounding will be fine with Odom and Kidd on board. But the only person that has to be defended in the post out West is Duncan. Even Amare doesn't post up much.
Yes, LA is close. And with a break or two could really win it all without Kidd. But adding him to the mix gets LA from that half-notch below Dallas and Phoenix. The ability to either nuetralize the MVP in a Phoenix matchup, or have the edge at the point (and 3.5 of 5) positions against Dallas is huge.
You already know the offense execution would only go up from all the easy baskets but the defense and pressure Kidd puts on opposing PGs mentally - man, you can't ignore that.
In such a deal - all LA is giving up is Kwame and if the choice is between Kwame's post defense and Kidd everything else, I'll take the daddy of the big head child with the crazy broad on the side. Besides, post defense would be help even more because PGs would have to work to even make that pass.
LA has to go for it... Of course they won't - but they should. |
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2Cleva Star Player
Joined: 17 Jun 2001 Posts: 9195
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 8:24 am Post subject: |
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As far as the concern about the salary - I don't think it would be that big of a deal. Getting out of Kwame's contract allows LA to keep a better player who is cheaper. With so many players under rookie or low Ks, LA's payroll would just be top-heavy with Kobe, Kidd, and LO but relatively cheap for everyone else. Maybe dump Rad if need be. |
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activeverb Retired Number
Joined: 17 Jun 2006 Posts: 37470
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 8:46 am Post subject: |
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Kidd makes $18 million a year. I don't think the Lakers could throw together enough salaries to balance the trade without including Kwame.
I mean, it would have to be Mihm, McKie, Shammond, Rad, Cook, Smush, and Evans or something. And no way would a 7-1 deal interest them.
lakersboxershorts wrote: | Ahhh.. the Kidd talks again. We all been there before. Kidd talks revisted. YES!
1. Kidd is a freak. My inclination would be get him here.
2. It would have to not cost us the nucleus of Kwame, Bynum, Odom, and Kobe. Everyone else is fair game.
3. Kidd would take us over the top easily. The man is a freak! Could you imagine a lineup of Kidd/Kobe/Lamar ???? Thats a triple double threat from each and everyone of those guys every night. YIKES!
4. We would be unstoppable. Ok.. ok.. put down the pipe.
5. It would never happen. David Stern would step in and VETO our trade. NJ would never let it happen. But if Mihm were healthy I'd ship him off to Jersey for Kidd along with other nickles and dimes here and there.
Kapeesh. |
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activeverb Retired Number
Joined: 17 Jun 2006 Posts: 37470
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 8:55 am Post subject: |
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2Cleva wrote: | LA loses a couple of backup big men in Kwame and Mihm but they can replace them easily in free agency next year. Centers were struggling for contracts because of the new rules. They can sign Doleac or the like and be set.. |
I think you're wrong there. If we sign Kidd, that will eat up all our maneurability and bring us to the cusp, if not over, the luxury cap. I think the mid-level wouldn't be used. And the replacement big men would be hard to find because we'd probably be offering the vet's minimum. |
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2Cleva Star Player
Joined: 17 Jun 2001 Posts: 9195
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 9:30 am Post subject: |
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activeverb wrote: | Kidd makes $18 million a year. I don't think the Lakers could throw together enough salaries to balance the trade without including Kwame.
I mean, it would have to be Mihm, McKie, Shammond, Rad, Cook, Smush, and Evans or something. And no way would a 7-1 deal interest them.
lakersboxershorts wrote: | Ahhh.. the Kidd talks again. We all been there before. Kidd talks revisted. YES!
1. Kidd is a freak. My inclination would be get him here.
2. It would have to not cost us the nucleus of Kwame, Bynum, Odom, and Kobe. Everyone else is fair game.
3. Kidd would take us over the top easily. The man is a freak! Could you imagine a lineup of Kidd/Kobe/Lamar ???? Thats a triple double threat from each and everyone of those guys every night. YIKES!
4. We would be unstoppable. Ok.. ok.. put down the pipe.
5. It would never happen. David Stern would step in and VETO our trade. NJ would never let it happen. But if Mihm were healthy I'd ship him off to Jersey for Kidd along with other nickles and dimes here and there.
Kapeesh. |
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Salaries don't have to match, just get within 25% iirc. |
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Klone_dd Star Player
Joined: 11 Mar 2002 Posts: 7330
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 9:59 am Post subject: |
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activeverb wrote: | I think you're wrong there. If we sign Kidd, that will eat up all our maneurability and bring us to the cusp, if not over, the luxury cap. I think the mid-level wouldn't be used. And the replacement big men would be hard to find because we'd probably be offering the vet's minimum. |
"Maneurability" - n. (man*nur*a*bill*it*ty) Discussion of trades that won't happen. |
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raffi LG Contributor
Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 9987
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 10:33 am Post subject: |
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24 wrote: | Exick wrote: | We don't have enough drama here, we need Joumana's crazy ass hangin around too? |
Word. Joumana is the likely result of Doug Christie's wife combined with a serious meth habit. |
They're done.
J-Kidd would hook-up with Posh Spice (or Halle Berry). |
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venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144637 Location: The Gold Coast
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 10:39 am Post subject: |
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jch31480 wrote: | i can't see lakers give up kwame to get kidd... of course kidd is more valuable and any team would want a player like Kidd.. but lakers are already in lack of size.. and for all the kwame's shortcoming on the offensive end, he is lakers best interior defensive player, and always play well against tough competition like Duncan, KG...
i wouldn't mind giving up either Walton/Smush/Vlad for Kidd though.. or Cook/Smush/Vlad for Kidd... |
I couldn't see the Lakers not giving up Kwame for Kidd. Decent center for top PG, easy decision to make. Especially when you drafted a center two years ago that the franchise is banking their future on. Kwame is a good man defender, but will we see him defending anyone anytime soon? I doubt it. The only thing that would keep the Lakers from trading Kwame for Kidd is money. Kwame is off the books after next season, and Kidd has around 20 mil for the next two. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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Dude Starting Rotation
Joined: 29 Nov 2005 Posts: 822
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 12:13 pm Post subject: |
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1. Kidd is possibly the worst, high volume shooter in NBA history. His career percentages are 40% FGs, 33% from beyond the arc.
2. Kidd's Old. He's got two elite years left, if that.
3. Kidd makes way too much money. A high 8-figure contract vs a low 6-figure contract for Smush. Farmar makes more than Smush. Anyway, let's love Smush Parker people, the reaper ain't finished yet.
4. Kidd's going through a messy divorce that will bring drama back to LA's lockeroom.
5. Jason Kidd is simply not a triangle point - he dominates the ball and can't shoot period.
To trade Kwame for him to make the salaries work would leave us with Bynum and Turiaf in the middle, which at this point in time, is not enough to compete in the West. This trade will never happen. |
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LakerJam Franchise Player
Joined: 02 Aug 2002 Posts: 18411 Location: Sherman Oaks, CA
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 12:37 pm Post subject: |
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LVLAKERFAN wrote: | Pass. We having something special going on. |
I agree, but some fans just don't get it. Sometimes, teams have a special chemistry going on and you don't go messing with that, just because the name on the back of the jersey is a better player. We're top 4 in the league right now and have maintained a top 5 record all season long, despite significant injuries. These guys play for each other and find ways to win. Outside of trading fringe players (Mihm, Mckie, Williams), this team deserves to stay together and see what they can do. |
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2Cleva Star Player
Joined: 17 Jun 2001 Posts: 9195
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 12:46 pm Post subject: |
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And sometimes, fans fall so in love with a team they can't bear to part with anyone on it - regardless of the need.
Many players potentially can disrupt chemistry when they arrive but a pass-first PG who can defend and finds others for easy baskets is not one. EVERYONE on the team would be happy to have Kidd getting them easy buckets as well as nuetralizing opposing PGs like Parker and Nash.
Brown and Parker for Kidd. LA gets a huge boost at the 1 and loses their backup center. But some call that crazy.
Not worried about cap space. LA won't have that anyway and the roster is full with young players under rookies or cheap Ks. Next summer, all LA is doing is adding a draft pick and re-signing Walton anyway. |
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LakerJam Franchise Player
Joined: 02 Aug 2002 Posts: 18411 Location: Sherman Oaks, CA
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 12:49 pm Post subject: |
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The Lakers aren't making that trade, no matter how much some of you think they should. Kidd has been available to the Lakers in the past when he was younger and better, and yet we never bit. Let alone the idea of trading a big man who can body up the biggest of the bigs and hold his position - a rare, invaluable and apparently severely underappreciated weapon to have defensively - for an old, aging PG with bad knees who can't shoot, but is owed 18 mill this year and for the next 2 after that.
Sure, that's worth doing, especially , since this team is sucking so bad this season. Makes perfect sense to do it. :roll:
It's not about falling in love with individual players, but appreciating that as a collective unit, this TEAM is showing something special here. |
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2Cleva Star Player
Joined: 17 Jun 2001 Posts: 9195
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 12:55 pm Post subject: |
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I said from the start LA is unlikely to make the deal. No argument there.
I agree the team is doing something special. It doesn't mean its perfect. If help can be gotten, no point in turning it down. |
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LuxuryBrown Franchise Player
Joined: 09 Jun 2006 Posts: 17429 Location: Mackadocious, Ca.
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:34 pm Post subject: |
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Quote: | 5. Jason Kidd is simply not a triangle point - he dominates the ball and can't shoot period. |
_________________
Quote: | Smooth, but I move like an army / Bulletproof down in case brothas try to bomb me / Puttin' brothas to rest like Elliot Ness / Cuz I don't like stress
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LakerSanity Moderator
Joined: 30 Nov 2006 Posts: 33474 Location: Long Beach, California
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:41 pm Post subject: |
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LuxuryBrown wrote: | Quote: | 5. Jason Kidd is simply not a triangle point - he dominates the ball and can't shoot period. |
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lol.... its like the never ending story, errm argument. We should just get an NBA panel together, sit them down, and hash this baby out. lol _________________ LakersGround's Terms of Service
Twitter: @DeleteThisPost |
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mttbk Starting Rotation
Joined: 31 Mar 2005 Posts: 623
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:47 pm Post subject: Loosecannons |
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On their top 10 countdown today they said the Lakers or Clippers or some other team (sorry I can't remember the other team) could be the the places Kidd could be traded. They didn't give anymore info. |
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aFFie Starting Rotation
Joined: 02 Jan 2006 Posts: 783
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:50 pm Post subject: |
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eww |
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Texas_Pete Franchise Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 12825 Location: Somewhere watching a Laker game
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:52 pm Post subject: |
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Short of Kobe or LO (NY Native), Kidd ain't coming here. I would welcome him here in a heartbeat though.
Now I'll pass the pipe... |
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KobeDunk Retired Number
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 26849
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:52 pm Post subject: |
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Oh GOD! What bs like all the rest of the dumb trade rumors!
If all these so called experts were right we would have a team of
Boozer
KG
Artest
Kobe
Kidd
by now! |
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KobeDunk Retired Number
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 26849
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:54 pm Post subject: |
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No salaries would match anyway unless LO or Kwame were involved and that ain't happening! so fogetabaitit
Cook+Smush for Kidd... maybe |
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LuxuryBrown Franchise Player
Joined: 09 Jun 2006 Posts: 17429 Location: Mackadocious, Ca.
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:55 pm Post subject: |
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LakerSanity wrote: | LuxuryBrown wrote: | Quote: | 5. Jason Kidd is simply not a triangle point - he dominates the ball and can't shoot period. |
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lol.... its like the never ending story, errm argument. We should just get an NBA panel together, sit them down, and hash this baby out. lol |
Dude, the facts are the facts: Kidd can't shoot and he dominates the rock = Not good for a Triangle PG. _________________
Quote: | Smooth, but I move like an army / Bulletproof down in case brothas try to bomb me / Puttin' brothas to rest like Elliot Ness / Cuz I don't like stress
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LakerSanity Moderator
Joined: 30 Nov 2006 Posts: 33474 Location: Long Beach, California
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Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:59 pm Post subject: |
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On the NBA rumor mill, Newsday stated that the likely trade partners would be the Pacers, Celtics, and Heat. They also stated that the teams which would benefit most from Kidd in the west would be the clippers and kings, with the lakers bumped up to contender status of we got kidd.
1 - we are already contender status, but we would become elite with kidd.
2 - if a trade occurs (which is probably unlikely given the NBA rumors in general), knock off the celtics and the clipper cause Kidd wouldn't want to go to either, plus Livingston is still the Clips PG of the future.
3 - If he does get traded, I think its between the Lakers and Heat, or maybe a darkhorse in Dallas. _________________ LakersGround's Terms of Service
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