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Wilt LG Contributor
Joined: 29 Dec 2002 Posts: 13731
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Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2009 8:51 am Post subject: Initiating the Offense (LG Blog) |
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In this blog, I am covering the interplay between the lead and off guard in the initiation of the offense.
As we all know, the Triangle does not feature one PG, but a two-guard front. This is what mostly Ariza/Fisher did last year, and what will hopefully Artest/Fisher will be doing as the season develops.
The exchange of sides between the two guards occurs, more or less, on every possession. So pay attention to this whenever you watch the Lakers and see how the guards work together.
http://forums.lakersground.net/blog.php/2009/09/22/initiating-the-triangle-offense/
Enjoy. _________________ ¡Hala Madrid! |
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Vishnu Franchise Player
Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 16558
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Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2009 8:54 am Post subject: |
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First.
Thanks |
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GoldenThroat Moderator
Joined: 25 Jul 2005 Posts: 37474
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Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2009 8:57 am Post subject: |
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Thanks, Wilt. I think that this is where we'll see the biggest upgrade over Ariza. He's a poor ball handler and passer, whereas those are two of Artest's strengths. |
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Wilt LG Contributor
Joined: 29 Dec 2002 Posts: 13731
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Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2009 3:58 pm Post subject: |
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It's all about saving Kobe's energy. If Artest can master the two-guard front, Kobe can relax on the wing. _________________ ¡Hala Madrid! |
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danish87 Star Player
Joined: 18 May 2009 Posts: 1869
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Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2009 11:01 pm Post subject: |
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GoldenThroat wrote: | Thanks, Wilt. I think that this is where we'll see the biggest upgrade over Ariza. He's a poor ball handler and passer, whereas those are two of Artest's strengths. |
i'm not sure Artest is that great a passer... I remember quite well vs. Houston how he would often turn the ball over or make an ill-advised pass when doubled in the post. While I agree with you that Ariza was surely not a great dribbler, he was never really required to pass the ball too well in his position. Hopefully, with Ron on the block, he can become proficient at hitting cutters etc but I definitely wouldn't say he is there quite yet. IMO _________________ "I can picture in my mind a world without war, a world without hate. And I can picture us attacking that world, because they'd never expect it." - Jack Handey |
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JUST-MING Retired Number
Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 43990
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Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2009 11:48 pm Post subject: |
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One thing I miss about not having Horry. Rob could inbound the ball better than any role player we have ever had. |
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JUST-MING Retired Number
Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 43990
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Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2009 11:53 pm Post subject: |
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i'm not sure Artest is that great a passer
Artest is actually a very good passer. Very good post-entry passer. Aside from McGrady, he was one of the best on the team at getting Yao, and Scola, the ball at their spots in the post. I tried to create an "Artest defensive video" thread: http://forums.lakersground.net/viewtopic.php?t=96039
Artest defends James: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbqKbI_qYN4 (@ :45)
Artest defends Roy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYpBi1WxhtY
Artest defends Lewis: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KEx3GlCOjPc (@ 1:35, @ 1:55, @ 3:55)
Artest defends Anthony: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cBzF4sKCxg (@ 4:00)
*I only watched the first 4:00 of each 9:00 highlight video. Very underrated passer. I could have marked at least 3 times in each video where he found the open shooter spot-up/set on the perimeter. And those were just highlights of made shots. Instead, I marked post-entry passing.
Just watch some of his passing/shooting, and of course his defense. I'd do a breakdown; but DancingBarry has posted a better one, I suggest you take a glance over: http://forums.lakersground.net/viewtopic.php?t=95769 (HOF-worthy thread, which should be stickied)
*I apologize for using the word "very" to describe Artest's passing ability -- he is "that great" afterall -- but Artest is a better passer/shooter/defender than Odom! |
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wolfpaclaker Retired Number
Joined: 29 May 2002 Posts: 58344
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Posted: Wed Sep 23, 2009 6:58 am Post subject: |
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Many Lakers will probably take turns.
Fish, Ron, LO, Kobe all will initiate. Probably see either Brown or Farmar do a little bit of bringing the ball up and initiating, too.
It's not that hard to initiate, what is hard for some of these guys is to initiate the offense then read the defense and get your own shots/scoring opportunities. Pippen could do that. Kobe could do that. Lamar couldn't and neither could Payton.
The best initiators of the Triangle are guys who can do the guard work AND work off the ball to make themselves a scoring threat.
With the team LA has, I don't see Phil relying so much on 1 guy to start the offense as he did in the past with Pippen or Kobe. I think he has a bunch of them share the duties. This will also force the other team to constantly be thinking of cross matches and how to deal with them. That usually leads to mismatch in the post for LA. |
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B_P Star Player
Joined: 28 May 2003 Posts: 8598 Location: (physically) West Seattle (heart) Venice Beach
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Posted: Wed Sep 23, 2009 9:27 am Post subject: |
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With the spacing and clean cutting angles the triangle creates (not to mention all the potent offensive players drawing attention), Artest should have some beautiful passing angles to work with when he's in the post - especially when he gets doubled.
Even an average passer would/should have a field day picking apart defenses with those advantages.
As long as Artest is patient, he should have no problem passing on this team. _________________ Everything. Changes. |
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70sdude Star Player
Joined: 05 Feb 2009 Posts: 4567
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Posted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 6:36 am Post subject: |
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B_P wrote: | With the spacing and clean cutting angles the triangle creates (not to mention all the potent offensive players drawing attention), Artest should have some beautiful passing angles to work with when he's in the post - especially when he gets doubled.
Even an average passer would/should have a field day picking apart defenses with those advantages.
As long as Artest is patient, he should have no problem passing on this team. |
Yeah, I think so and yet there's obviously more to it than just patience. A Laker plan to minimize disasters will help.
Even as a real vocal Artest doubter, I can accept some mistakes from Ron this season. He'll make the mistakes typical to most newbies in our system: 1) holding the ball a tick too long while processing the player positions, movement, coverages; 2) telegraphing his next pass; 3) delivering the ball casually, without snap across passing lanes. These are all typical problems in any offense, but we seem prone to higher rates of acclimatization errors in our system because of our system.
I see the most important element in leading to his success within the offense this year as being a preventative one. I want to see both Kobe and Pau assert themselves as the best "end of clock" targets and thereby minimize the extent to which Ron becomes the offense's final option (ball in hand) in the last eight seconds of the shot clock. |
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