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Sina
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Joined: 12 Jul 2015
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 Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 5:49 pm Post subject: |
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| It’s a good roster and just need a full season to work things out of them. |
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lar9149
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Joined: 10 Jul 2010
Posts: 2423
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 6:11 pm Post subject: |
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Would you guys say the Lakers are just as deep as last year?
Losing DS created a big hole in depth but it possible the new guys can fill that hole.
And I think this is important to keep LBJ AND AD healthy this year to make another deep run possible. |
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CamReddish
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Joined: 23 Jun 2015
Posts: 8043
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 6:20 pm Post subject: |
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| lar9149 wrote: | Would you guys say the Lakers are just as deep as last year?
Losing DS created a big hole in depth but it possible the new guys can fill that hole.
And I think this is important to keep LBJ AND AD healthy this year to make another deep run possible. |
The guy replacing DS is just as good and probably better
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TooMuchMajicBuss
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Joined: 17 Sep 2008
Posts: 21099
Location: In a white room, with black curtains near the station
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 7:29 pm Post subject: |
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I think we're potentially better but that's hard to tell just yet. We still seem to be shy one big enforcer.
I'll miss Dennis, Vincent is not a step down though, I liked Troy but I think Prince fills a need well, possibly better.
Biggest downside is we could use another big.
Biggest win is re-signing Reaves, DLO, Rui and having a full training camp with this roster. And we're way better now than we were the first 50 or so games last season. |
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lakers4life78
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Joined: 09 Apr 2012
Posts: 1985
Location: Southern California
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 7:38 pm Post subject: |
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Lakers potential second unit:
Bilt
Prince
Hayes
Christie
Vincent
Those are all good athletic defensive guys. Yeah, I know I’m stretching with Hayes but you get what I’m saying. Also, Bamba, Beasley and TBJ did nothing in the playoffs last year. So I’m not thinking they’re big losses. I’m
Not factoring in their draft class either. This roster is better.
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lakers4life78
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Joined: 09 Apr 2012
Posts: 1985
Location: Southern California
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 7:42 pm Post subject: |
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I love people acting like Bamba was a loss. He didn’t do anything to warrant a rating. Was meh in 9 games and then got hurt and was done. He didn’t have any impact on their team
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lakers4life78
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Joined: 09 Apr 2012
Posts: 1985
Location: Southern California
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 7:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Polarbear wrote: | I go back to the beginning of last year
A completely unbalanced roster
Total lack of wing players
Undersized
Then we got to the trade deadline and made a couple of trades it immediately fix the roster. Some of it addition by subtraction because Westbrook did not fit this team at all
Then they took what they did at the trade deadline, and through the draft and free agency kept building on it
It’s a very balanced roster, but more than that it’s not three stars in a bunch of veteran minimum contracts. It’s not three stars and a bunch of aging players. It’s two stars in a bunch of quality depth. This is how you build a modern NBA team. |
The Westbrook trade completely ruined their last two offseasons where they were forced to sign 6-7 league minimum stiffs
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chantruong
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Joined: 15 Jun 2009
Posts: 8894
Location: SGV
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 7:57 pm Post subject: |
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| I think we are definitely better on paper. But the main improvement this year will be from continuity, young player development, and less pressure on AD and Bron. |
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aiel
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Joined: 16 May 2001
Posts: 1211
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 8:55 pm Post subject: |
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| defense wrote: | | Could definitely see rebounding being an issue |
I agree, our rebounding especially from the guard and wing positions is still poor and while I think Max is a really good rebounder, we need more help. |
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Hanging from Rafters
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Joined: 31 Jul 2018
Posts: 4582
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 9:18 pm Post subject: |
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| MJST wrote: | Schroeder to Vincent is a lateral move which is not a bad thing. We got that bargain.
DLo, Reaves, Rui all coming back.
Vando remaining.
Reddish, Hayes, Prince replacing Beasley, Gabriel ,TBJ.
Yeah we not only kept our depth, we got more of it. The only thing we'd really be missing is Walker in the Lou Williams 6th man role because with Reaves starting, that role needs to be filled. Vincent can do what Schroeder did for us on that front. But for backup 2 we're either depending on a rookie, Reddish or Christie, all of which are currently unproven. |
Feel the same except…there was no replacement for Beasley, it wasn’t necessary…we just move on from Beasley because he wasn’t a contributor.
The replacements necessary were:
Vinc for Shro
Lakers improved by adding significantly better post season play including better defense (Shro’s was good too), better scoring (13ppg vs 7ppg) much better 3pt shooting(38% vs 33%) and better assists (3.5apg vs 2.9apg) Not only did Vinc game improve significantly in the post season to surpass Shro in every way, Shro declined by a staggering amount in the post season from the regular season totals.
Status - Upgrade
Cam for LWIV
Cam is 6’8” so there’s that. LWIV shot better from 3 and helped win a playoff game. Hopefully Cam will turn his game around but hasn’t done so yet. Having such a big guy playing SG may help with Jalen Brown and Paul George but Cam’s poor 3pt shooting may keep him off the court.
Status - Downgrade
Prince for TBjr
Same size (weight-height), and same 3pt%. TBjr younger and better rebounder but defense about the same but some say Prince is a better defense.
Status - Same but replaced for half the price
Wenyen Gabriel was not replaced
Cam is likely most effective at SF and with Prince on the team at SF too that means Vand could replace Gabriel’s PF minutes. Still, with TBjr on the team last year that could have happened too yet Vand wasn’t effective at PF.
Status - Undetermined
Hayes for Mo Bamba
Gabe was 205lbs and never really should have been considered C. Mo is purely speculation with only 9 games with the Lakers. Based on the 111 games just prior to the Lakers however, he looked like a good 3pt shooter and shot blocker, which is just what the team needed. Hayes has athleticism and has shown flashes but more concerns than optimism. This could be his last chance to be an NBA player.
Status - Downgrade in potential
Conclusion:
I think the Lakers will need to add Mo and/or LWIV (or better players) to make the team a clear upgrade. Still…a good job bringing back Dlo/AR/Vand/Rui and adding Vinc. I don’t consider it an overall downgrade…just maintaining a similar level of competitiveness…which may be all that was needed with full training camp and season to elevate to a ship.
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“When it looks as if it is a realistic possibility, I want to focus on winning a ship like it’s a goal that can’t be denied. I didn’t see that this off season.”
Last edited by Hanging from Rafters on Sat Jul 01, 2023 9:37 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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giordan0
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Joined: 05 Jan 2016
Posts: 1022
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 9:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Denny_Russo wrote: | | It seems clear Rob's motto is championship or bust. He has put the team in a perfect position to get it done. They improved in every facet. Would be a disappointment if they finished worse than last season. |
Pressure on Ham now to deliver. |
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Inverse
Star Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2014
Posts: 2096
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 9:37 pm Post subject: |
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| lar9149 wrote: | Would you guys say the Lakers are just as deep as last year?
Losing DS created a big hole in depth but it possible the new guys can fill that hole.
And I think this is important to keep LBJ AND AD healthy this year to make another deep run possible. |
I think Fino can replace Dennis’s defense at the guard position. Gabe replaced his offense. Don’t think we will feel Dennis’s absence tbh
Fino might surprise people this season and get some rotation minutes
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lakersfan32
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Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 3844
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 9:39 pm Post subject: |
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| company man john ireland saying lakers are the #2 team in the west after the moves, lol |
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Hanging from Rafters
Star Player
Joined: 31 Jul 2018
Posts: 4582
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 9:48 pm Post subject: |
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| giordan0 wrote: | | Denny_Russo wrote: | | It seems clear Rob's motto is championship or bust. He has put the team in a perfect position to get it done. They improved in every facet. Would be a disappointment if they finished worse than last season. |
Pressure on Ham now to deliver. |
Championship or bust would have been guaranteeing Mo, picking up Beasley’s option and then trading them with the FRP for an upgrade at C, and/or a better SF while keeping a fourth productive guard. The back up C and 4th guard are still holes. Still…good job trying to attempt a championship run while staying under the 1st apron…not championship or bust tho.
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“When it looks as if it is a realistic possibility, I want to focus on winning a ship like it’s a goal that can’t be denied. I didn’t see that this off season.” |
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kikanga
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Joined: 15 Sep 2012
Posts: 29629
Location: La La Land
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 9:51 pm Post subject: |
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Similar to last season. We'll go as far as our big 2 take us.
We're spending 2/3 of the salary cap on them.
So if they can't stay healthy and perform like superstars when they have to play every other day in the playoffs after an 82 game season. The pieces around them don't matter (when it comes to winning another chip or not).
I guess 1 thing is different for me vs. last year.
Jokic has proven himself in my book. And I don't have confidence AD can outplay him (like he did in the bubble).
If Embiid wants out of PHI in the future. I'd trade AD for him in a second. Specifically for the Jokic matchup.
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hydrohead
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Joined: 14 Jul 2003
Posts: 4126
Location: Space City
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 10:03 pm Post subject: |
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I think it’s a marginal improvement, with the exception of the wing, to which we made a big improvement in Taurean Prince.
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Hanging from Rafters
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Joined: 31 Jul 2018
Posts: 4582
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 10:04 pm Post subject: |
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| LakerMindLA wrote: | | The Lakers were exposed for only have 6 rotation players against Denver. Right now we are still at just 6 rotation level players. Perhaps Prince becomes the 7th or Vando develops a 3. If not, this team will be lucky to get out the 2nd round. |
Unfortunately I agree about the 6 rotation players (Dlo/Vinc/AR/LBJ/Rui/AD) but with a full season and second year of Ham I expect improved performance. Plus those 6 include a significant upgrade for the post season with Vinc over Shro (didn’t realize this at first with sticker shock). We should be able to get to the WCF again.
The wing by committee will likely have one of Vand/Prince/Cam/MaxL emerge as a playoff rotation player but the non-AD minutes were a major problem in the playoffs. That deficiency was not addressed. If Mo joins for vet min, or another C falls in our laps then we can realistically conceive a ship. As is, we can be excited with anticipation but have to hope we pull a shocker like Miami and beat a couple of teams that look much better to get the ring.
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“When it looks as if it is a realistic possibility, I want to focus on winning a ship like it’s a goal that can’t be denied. I didn’t see that this off season.” |
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Cutheon
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Joined: 10 Jul 2009
Posts: 12207
Location: Bay Area
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 10:48 pm Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | Similar to last season. We'll go as far as our big 2 take us.
We're spending 2/3 of the salary cap on them.
So if they can't stay healthy and perform like superstars when they have to play every other day in the playoffs after an 82 game season. The pieces around them don't matter (when it comes to winning another chip or not).
I guess 1 thing is different for me vs. last year.
Jokic has proven himself in my book. And I don't have confidence AD can outplay him (like he did in the bubble).
If Embiid wants out of PHI in the future. I'd trade AD for him in a second. Specifically for the Jokic matchup. |
What has you convinced Embiid can handle Jokic? Embiid kind of wilts in the playoffs in his own way, no? He’s basically the common denominator for Philly embarrassments at this point.
I’m not sure anyone can handle Jokic, but I’ll say this—if I could choose a player to be the centerpiece of any defensive scheme against Jokic (which is not necessarily the player that guards Jokic), it’s AD |
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Cutheon
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Joined: 10 Jul 2009
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Location: Bay Area
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 10:52 pm Post subject: |
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| LakerFan1987 wrote: | | Cutheon wrote: | | Basically a wash. Team will go as far as LeBron. Still not a match for the Nuggets. |
Nuggets just loss Brown and Green and Thomas Bryant (he's not that important).
Brown was their super 6th man. Green was an important PF/C backup.
Now they only got Braun off the bench.
Repeating isn't easy |
Definitely not. But Jokic raises the floor of anyone they use for that role and Braun can get better, I thought he showed some real potential for them throughout the year. And I don’t really think we added anyone that helps us defend the Nuggets any better. If their core 5 stay healthy, it’s a bad match up for us. |
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giordan0
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Joined: 05 Jan 2016
Posts: 1022
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 11:01 pm Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: |
If Embiid wants out of PHI in the future. I'd trade AD for him in a second. Specifically for the Jokic matchup. |
That guy has health issues as bad as AD, I don't trust those knees to hold up all season. |
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Dominic1981
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Joined: 09 Feb 2022
Posts: 1046
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2023 11:35 pm Post subject: |
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The season comes down to whether Rui, Reaves, and Vincent can be winning playoff caliber role players.
That’s the spot where the Lakers can improve from last year. AD/Lebron certainly aren’t getting better, likely will decline even more. DLO is maxed out. Hayes/Reddish are junk.
So I think the season comes down to Rui, Reaves, Vincent. If they make a leap, Lakers can be good. Maybe challenge Denver depending on if Denver has an off year
I think the big difference between last year and this year is our floor. At worst, we should be a 5-7 seed. Last year it felt like our floor was lottery 28-32 win type team |
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kikanga
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Joined: 15 Sep 2012
Posts: 29629
Location: La La Land
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| Posted: Sun Jul 02, 2023 12:41 am Post subject: |
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| Cutheon wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | Similar to last season. We'll go as far as our big 2 take us.
We're spending 2/3 of the salary cap on them.
So if they can't stay healthy and perform like superstars when they have to play every other day in the playoffs after an 82 game season. The pieces around them don't matter (when it comes to winning another chip or not).
I guess 1 thing is different for me vs. last year.
Jokic has proven himself in my book. And I don't have confidence AD can outplay him (like he did in the bubble).
If Embiid wants out of PHI in the future. I'd trade AD for him in a second. Specifically for the Jokic matchup. |
What has you convinced Embiid can handle Jokic? Embiid kind of wilts in the playoffs in his own way, no? He’s basically the common denominator for Philly embarrassments at this point.
I’m not sure anyone can handle Jokic, but I’ll say this—if I could choose a player to be the centerpiece of any defensive scheme against Jokic (which is not necessarily the player that guards Jokic), it’s AD |
Head to head. Embiid laid a beat down on Jokic last time they were matched up.
But big picture wise. AD and Embiid both have durability issues. But at least when Embiid is healthy. He plays like a wrecking ball. Zero fear of injury. Unlike AD. Which is why I’ve preferred him for years now.
AD plays too cautiously for my liking (for a starting Lakers Center superstar). Even Pau forced the issue physically when necessary in the playoffs. And Pau wasn’t blessed on the same level as AD athletically.
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Pidge
Starting Rotation
Joined: 11 Oct 2012
Posts: 446
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| Posted: Sun Jul 02, 2023 1:08 am Post subject: |
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Liking a lot of the moves. We're at 13 now (assuming the draft picks are signed), right?
Do we have anything left, or are we just expecting a couple of guys to come in but go to the G-league?
Any outside chance of TBJ or a vet C joining? Or are we done?
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A Mad Chinaman
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Joined: 07 Apr 2005
Posts: 6186
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| Posted: Sun Jul 02, 2023 1:18 am Post subject: |
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Will a team with more “stars” best a very good team?
Will a team with continuity where a defined system is in place where the culture/roles are well defined best a team with more talent that was recently put together
IMHO - Rob had a definite plan that was well executed
DS left, but Rob couldn’t pay or justify paying him $13M for somebody that is coming off the bench. DS did what he had to do to take care of his family and wish him the best of luck
With AR, Rui, Vanderbilt, Vincent, DLo, Prince, Reddish and Hayes will give Ham viable effective options. Choosing between Thompson, Bamba and Beasley will be the final decision of importance
Squad is looking strong, talented and with clear sense of continuity to have great success in a highly competitive Western Conference |
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Kobefied
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Joined: 17 May 2008
Posts: 560
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| Posted: Sun Jul 02, 2023 3:24 am Post subject: |
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I like the moves, the only one question is not paying DS $13M instead going for Vincent for $11M. To me DS was worth the extra $2M.
Okay jury will be out on that, I think we will miss DS's speed.
But one thing is forget DS was nothing most of the regular season, he only became an important player down the stretch into the playoffs.
So we should be equally patient with Vincent, and the trump card is really he was incredible for the Heat in the playoffs.
The only thing left I think like most are wandering who will be the backup C?
I have feeling they might bring back Thompson for minimum for another go around. He showed some flashes in the playoffs, and maybe that is enough - although would have preferred someone more athletic who could log some real minutes every game to really help AD. |
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