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gng930
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 1:38 pm    Post subject:

I wonder how long you can take to fulfill "future draft considerations". You see it mentioned all the time in trades but it ends up being marginal picks. Could they complete a trade now under that guise but then convey the 2023 pick on 7/1 to finally fulfill that obligation? Or is it just so obvious that the league would step in and no trade partner would want to assume that risk?
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 2:33 pm    Post subject:

Inspector Gadget wrote:
LakerSD wrote:
Quote:
McMenamin on LeBron signing his extension:

- Lakers were waiting for LeBron to extend to be willing to trade their picks

- Bron knows Lakers might wait until the deadline to make a big move, he's fine with that.

-LeBron still believes once he's in the playoffs, he has a shot


These wordings make no sense, LeBron pushed for Irving upon signing the extension yesterday.


They make sense. Lebron wants Kyrie, but doesn’t need him now.As I suspected, they will wait out the Net implosion for Irving.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 2:36 pm    Post subject:

levon wrote:
I know nobody asked but I just want to reiterate how ridiculous of an ask two first rounders for Buddy and Turner is.

Combined, they're maybe worth one unprotected first in value in terms of talent, though debatable in terms of production and contract value (Hield's extra year, resigning Turner).

I don't want to hear any garbage about it taking a first to unload Russ. (bleep) that. He's expiring sallary ballast that would save the Pacers boatloads of long-term money, both in terms of the Hield extra year and having to pay Turner or lose him for nothing. Miss me with that (bleep). He's perfectly acceptable salary ballast that you'd buy out in which he probably leaves a few cents on the table.

Two firsts for Buddy and Turner would be the equivalent of two firsts for Dennis and Montrez, then giving Dennis that huge extension. It's even more shakey due to Turner's injuries.

If that were to happen, it would be looked at as an all-time bad move in hindsight. Like comically bad. I'm not even sure about one pick for them, it'd depend on protections.

The Lakers are playing this right.


You are making too much sense, stop this!

That said it would actually be 3 first round picks + Kuz + KCP + Trezz + AC for Buddy & an expiring Turner when all is said and done.

Honestly, that sounds like the exact type of trade this front office would make.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 2:37 pm    Post subject:

I'm not sure that the Lakers will wait until after the season starts to make a big trade, assuming we do make (at least) one at all. If the Nets are going to hold Durant through camp, let's say, it suggests that they are going for it this year and at that point, the only way they'd move Kyrie during the season is if their season goes off the rails again to the point where it looks like they have no shot at competing for a title. And while that could be within the realm of possibility, it's probably not likely, and it's not something that you can count on. Occam's razor, after all. And considering that you don't know if other potential trades (that might be on the table now) will be on the table during the season, for all sorts of reasons, I am of the opinion that if we make a big move, it's going to happen before the season starts.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 2:42 pm    Post subject:

gng930 wrote:
I wonder how long you can take to fulfill "future draft considerations". You see it mentioned all the time in trades but it ends up being marginal picks. Could they complete a trade now under that guise but then convey the 2023 pick on 7/1 to finally fulfill that obligation? Or is it just so obvious that the league would step in and no trade partner would want to assume that risk?


I think when they say "future draft considerations" it just means the reporter doesn't have the final details yet.

The only 1st rounders the Lakers can trade are 2027 and 2029 because of the stepien rule. Which prohibits teams from being without a 1st rounder in back to back years.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:27 pm    Post subject:

Lucky_Shot wrote:
defense wrote:
activeverb wrote:
Lucky_Shot wrote:
activeverb wrote:
Lucky_Shot wrote:

My argument is based on the current market value of his potential not production: there will still be a market for a guy with THT's talent level. Now I could be wrong but because his ceiling is pretty high, I think another team will make a bet on him at 22 years old for 11m even if he doesnt improve that much this season.
.


I'm not sure there is that much enthusiasm around the league for THT.

He is overpaid for what he produces. He isn't on a cheap rookie contract.

He still can't shoot, and he didn't show any improvement last year.

The Lakers are deficient in talent, and yet no one thinks THT has a chance of starting for us.

If he was a free agent this season, I don't think any team would spend the MLE on him.


Players like THT don't grow on trees. Autin Reaves is a young good prospect and THT is 3 years younger than him



Again, I don't know that GMs share your enthusiasm for THT. I just see a second round pick, who's on a bigger contract than he deserves, that hasn't really shown much to date.


He's living on hopes and dreams


Okay, bet:

I wager he puts together his best season yet and makes a real step forward in 2023


What, in your view, would be the statistical marks that constitute "a real step forward"?
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:28 pm    Post subject:

Now that Lebron has signed his deal, the Lakers appear to be eager to part with Russ. If Kyrie is not available, the Lakers may well take the Pcers deal, as long as it is just one FRP.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:33 pm    Post subject:

waterman40 wrote:
Now that Lebron has signed his deal, the Lakers appear to be eager to part with Russ. If Kyrie is not available, the Lakers may well take the Pcers deal, as long as it is just one FRP.


What has happened to make the Lakers appear to be eager? I think they were eager to rid themselves of Westbrook six months ago. I don't know that anything has made them more eager.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 3:34 pm    Post subject:

waterman40 wrote:
Now that Lebron has signed his deal, the Lakers appear to be eager to part with Russ. If Kyrie is not available, the Lakers may well take the Pcers deal, as long as it is just one FRP.


Bro they’ve been eager to part with Russ since early last season
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 4:20 pm    Post subject:

Wish we would move on from the Kyrie/Nets situation. They seem to be as lost as he is sometimes.

Only thing is, if they don’t make a trade, they still have the potential of a top 5 team.

We don’t have that luxury.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 4:22 pm    Post subject:

So the Nets are now willing to trade Kyrie?

Quote:
The Brooklyn Nets want ‘win-now talent’ in return to part with Kyrie Irving, per @TheSteinLine

“The Nets’ current stance, sources say, is that they are unwilling to send out Irving in a trade if the deal solely brings back future assets”


https://marcstein.substack.com/p/the-lakers-pledge-to-lebron
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 4:23 pm    Post subject:

ocho wrote:
waterman40 wrote:
Now that Lebron has signed his deal, the Lakers appear to be eager to part with Russ. If Kyrie is not available, the Lakers may well take the Pcers deal, as long as it is just one FRP.


Bro they’ve been eager to part with Russ since early last season


There even more egar if there willing to part with the picks.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 4:28 pm    Post subject:

32 wrote:
So the Nets are now willing to trade Kyrie?

Quote:
The Brooklyn Nets want ‘win-now talent’ in return to part with Kyrie Irving, per @TheSteinLine

“The Nets’ current stance, sources say, is that they are unwilling to send out Irving in a trade if the deal solely brings back future assets”


https://marcstein.substack.com/p/the-lakers-pledge-to-lebron


If he's right -- and this could be BS, but let's just play along -- that could suggest that they'd rather have something like, say, Hield and Turner from the Pacers, as opposed to RW and 2 picks from us. Or at least Turner, certainly, as he would seem to be a good fit for most teams as a fairly modern 5 in today's game who can space the floor adequately while also providing solid defensive value. Or maybe something like Conley and another player (Bogs?) from Utah.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 4:31 pm    Post subject:

gng930 wrote:
I wonder how long you can take to fulfill "future draft considerations". You see it mentioned all the time in trades but it ends up being marginal picks. Could they complete a trade now under that guise but then convey the 2023 pick on 7/1 to finally fulfill that obligation? Or is it just so obvious that the league would step in and no trade partner would want to assume that risk?


I believe that NO has swap protection on our 23 first rounder so we couldn’t trade the pick itself. We could potentially trade the player we select.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 4:32 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
32 wrote:
So the Nets are now willing to trade Kyrie?

Quote:
The Brooklyn Nets want ‘win-now talent’ in return to part with Kyrie Irving, per @TheSteinLine

“The Nets’ current stance, sources say, is that they are unwilling to send out Irving in a trade if the deal solely brings back future assets”


https://marcstein.substack.com/p/the-lakers-pledge-to-lebron


If he's right -- and this could be BS, but let's just play along -- that could suggest that they'd rather have something like, say, Hield and Turner from the Pacers, as opposed to RW and 2 picks from us. Or at least Turner, certainly, as he would seem to be a good fit for most teams as a fairly modern 5 in today's game who can space the floor adequately while also providing solid defensive value. Or maybe something like Conley and another player (Bogs?) from Utah.


Possibly. And the team he iis traded to could buy him out and he can join the Lakers for the veteran minimum. Lol
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 4:36 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
32 wrote:
So the Nets are now willing to trade Kyrie?

Quote:
The Brooklyn Nets want ‘win-now talent’ in return to part with Kyrie Irving, per @TheSteinLine

“The Nets’ current stance, sources say, is that they are unwilling to send out Irving in a trade if the deal solely brings back future assets”


https://marcstein.substack.com/p/the-lakers-pledge-to-lebron


If he's right -- and this could be BS, but let's just play along -- that could suggest that they'd rather have something like, say, Hield and Turner from the Pacers, as opposed to RW and 2 picks from us. Or at least Turner, certainly, as he would seem to be a good fit for most teams as a fairly modern 5 in today's game who can space the floor adequately while also providing solid defensive value. Or maybe something like Conley and another player (Bogs?) from Utah.


None of those players scream win now. AD would be a player that wins now.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 4:41 pm    Post subject:

32 wrote:
So the Nets are now willing to trade Kyrie?

Quote:
The Brooklyn Nets want ‘win-now talent’ in return to part with Kyrie Irving, per @TheSteinLine

“The Nets’ current stance, sources say, is that they are unwilling to send out Irving in a trade if the deal solely brings back future assets”


https://marcstein.substack.com/p/the-lakers-pledge-to-lebron


It's just Marc Stein. It makes sense, though. The Nets aren't showing signs of wanting to blow it up.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 4:41 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
32 wrote:
So the Nets are now willing to trade Kyrie?

Quote:
The Brooklyn Nets want ‘win-now talent’ in return to part with Kyrie Irving, per @TheSteinLine

“The Nets’ current stance, sources say, is that they are unwilling to send out Irving in a trade if the deal solely brings back future assets”


https://marcstein.substack.com/p/the-lakers-pledge-to-lebron


If he's right -- and this could be BS, but let's just play along -- that could suggest that they'd rather have something like, say, Hield and Turner from the Pacers, as opposed to RW and 2 picks from us. Or at least Turner, certainly, as he would seem to be a good fit for most teams as a fairly modern 5 in today's game who can space the floor adequately while also providing solid defensive value. Or maybe something like Conley and another player (Bogs?) from Utah.


What about Randle and Fournier? I’ll argue that Randle could play a role like Blake Griffin and Evan Fournier could give them another shooter.
We sent Westbrook to the Knicks to get off two bad contacts. lakers send out the picks for compensation.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 4:42 pm    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
gng930 wrote:
I wonder how long you can take to fulfill "future draft considerations". You see it mentioned all the time in trades but it ends up being marginal picks. Could they complete a trade now under that guise but then convey the 2023 pick on 7/1 to finally fulfill that obligation? Or is it just so obvious that the league would step in and no trade partner would want to assume that risk?


I believe that NO has swap protection on our 23 first rounder so we couldn’t trade the pick itself. We could potentially trade the player we select.


Yep, we can still trade the 2023 1st pick swap with by adding another swap option to it, with the condition that the swapped pick we end up receiving from NO would then be swapped to a 3rd party if it falls higher than their own pick. So the swap order would be 1)NO, 2)mystery LA trading partner, 3)LA…where we get the worst if the pick swaps among the team we bring in via trade.

The player we do end up picking however cannot be traded till tge draft concludes. So we can’t outright trade our 2023 1st right now, cause it would potentially leave us without a FRP in consecutive years if NO ends up picking our 2024 1st instead of deferring it to 2025. We could however unlock our 2023 1st to trade if we get in the phone with Griff and incentive him enough to pick our 2025 1st outright by removing that deferment option.

Also, Woj now corroborating Stein’s latest rumor with BK wanting win-now players as well in any hypothetical Ky trade with us.

Quote:
Evan Sidery @esidery
Lakers update from @wojespn:

- Probably no move available to vault them to Finals contender
- Willing to offer 2027 + 2029 picks for Kyrie Irving, but Nets are not interested preferring a win-now package
- Unwilling to include both picks to Pacers for Buddy Hield + Myles Turner

pic.twitter.com/SY9mF7SAkd

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 4:49 pm    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
32 wrote:
So the Nets are now willing to trade Kyrie?

Quote:
The Brooklyn Nets want ‘win-now talent’ in return to part with Kyrie Irving, per @TheSteinLine

“The Nets’ current stance, sources say, is that they are unwilling to send out Irving in a trade if the deal solely brings back future assets”


https://marcstein.substack.com/p/the-lakers-pledge-to-lebron


If he's right -- and this could be BS, but let's just play along -- that could suggest that they'd rather have something like, say, Hield and Turner from the Pacers, as opposed to RW and 2 picks from us. Or at least Turner, certainly, as he would seem to be a good fit for most teams as a fairly modern 5 in today's game who can space the floor adequately while also providing solid defensive value. Or maybe something like Conley and another player (Bogs?) from Utah.


None of those players scream win now. AD would be a player that wins now.


I guess it depends on how you evaluate those players, and of course the question at hand would be how the Nets evaluate certain players. Cranjis, for example, would rather trade for Turner and Hield than for Kyrie. So I assume that if he were Sean Marks, he might make a deal like that, or maybe he'd want Turner and would rather get back a point guard in any Kyrie deal.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 4:55 pm    Post subject:

vasashi17+ wrote:
Also, Woj now corroborating Stein’s latest rumor with BK wanting win-now players as well in any hypothetical Ky trade with us.


Woj said that this morning, so if anything, it's the other way around.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 5:11 pm    Post subject:

@AH: Gotcha…well here’s more from Stein. Seems like his sources are corroborating what Buha/TheAthletic reported earlier.

Quote:
“L.A. has nonetheless pledged to James that it will indeed continue to aggressively pursue upgrades,” wrote NBA reporter Marc Stein on his substack. “League sources say James, in fact, has been assured that the Lakers are willing to trade both of their available future first-round picks in 2027 and 2029 if a trade that costs them both picks can realistically position the Lakers to return to contender status.”

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 5:20 pm    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
gng930 wrote:
I wonder how long you can take to fulfill "future draft considerations". You see it mentioned all the time in trades but it ends up being marginal picks. Could they complete a trade now under that guise but then convey the 2023 pick on 7/1 to finally fulfill that obligation? Or is it just so obvious that the league would step in and no trade partner would want to assume that risk?


I believe that NO has swap protection on our 23 first rounder so we couldn’t trade the pick itself. We could potentially trade the player we select.


It would be a pre-arranged much like they have done in the past, come to a handshake deal before the draft, draft desired player, and then make it official afterwards and once THT officially opts in. Once you have made the pick it is no longer a "future pick" and thus the Stepien rule no longer applies. This is how we managed to trade the 2021 pick despite not having the 2022 pick.

It's probably a moot point. I imagine the league would sniff this out and void it. I doubt anybody is willing to take that risk nearly a year beforehand.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 5:22 pm    Post subject:

vasashi17+ wrote:
@AH: Gotcha…well here’s more from Stein. Seems like his sources are corroborating what Buha/TheAthletic reported earlier.

Quote:
“L.A. has nonetheless pledged to James that it will indeed continue to aggressively pursue upgrades,” wrote NBA reporter Marc Stein on his substack. “League sources say James, in fact, has been assured that the Lakers are willing to trade both of their available future first-round picks in 2027 and 2029 if a trade that costs them both picks can realistically position the Lakers to return to contender status.”


It stinks to say it but IMO that makes the most sense. I don't think Buddy and Turner vaults us into the West's elite.

The Nets' stance makes obvious sense. You don't hold on to KD at this point in his career and then proceed to hoard picks.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2022 5:23 pm    Post subject:

Can't get Kyrie cuz Nets and Kyrie have a change of mind.
Can't trade for Hield and Turner cuz they're not worth both frps.

Last option, keep and buy out Brick and save capspace for next year. Wasting another prime Bron year and possibly a healthy AD. Championship opportunities don't come around easy but squandering last year and this year's championship opportunity makes me sick to my stomach.
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