| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
ArminNBA
Star Player
Joined: 20 Sep 2008
Posts: 2210
|
 Posted: Tue May 07, 2024 11:38 am Post subject: |
|
|
| jodeke wrote: | | I'll admit to being a Ham fanboy. That said I think he was in over his head. The team is too young and inexperienced. They need a leader with more coaching acumen. The next coach must have control of the team. The FO has to let him/her have the reigns. In Darvin's defense, I think they/Kurt had too much influence. He didn't choose his staff, they did. The next coaches hurdle will also be Bron. He has to convince him to accept his program. If he does the others will follow. |
Darvin hired nearly every person on his staff with zero influence from the front office, except for Phil Handy (a player dev expert).
Why do you think the only assistant with head coaching experience was Jent? And Jent only has 1 year of head coaching experience in the G-League.
In fact, the Lakers had the most inexperienced staff in the entire NBA. Fewest total years in the league.
Darvin did not want dissent or a potential usurper. He wanted to surround himself with neophytes and sycophants. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
jodeke
Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 68252
Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
|
| Posted: Tue May 07, 2024 11:47 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Bron2AD wrote: | | jodeke wrote: | | I'll admit to being a Ham fanboy. That said I think he was in over his head. The team is too young and inexperienced. They need a leader with more coaching acumen. The next coach must have control of the team. The FO has to let him/her have the reigns. In Darvin's defense, I think they/Kurt had too much influence. He didn't choose his staff, they did. The next coaches hurdle will also be Bron. He has to convince him to accept his program. If he does the others will follow. |
lol
if they micromanaged his staff then Ham would have ex head coaches on his staff, like Vogel and not the other way around |
You don't think they had a hand in choosing Vogel's staff? That's one of the reasons Lue didn't take the job. It's common knowledge Kurt has Jeanie's ear.
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Bron2AD
Star Player
Joined: 01 Jun 2021
Posts: 9632
|
| Posted: Tue May 07, 2024 12:00 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| jodeke wrote: | | Bron2AD wrote: | | jodeke wrote: | | I'll admit to being a Ham fanboy. That said I think he was in over his head. The team is too young and inexperienced. They need a leader with more coaching acumen. The next coach must have control of the team. The FO has to let him/her have the reigns. In Darvin's defense, I think they/Kurt had too much influence. He didn't choose his staff, they did. The next coaches hurdle will also be Bron. He has to convince him to accept his program. If he does the others will follow. |
lol
if they micromanaged his staff then Ham would have ex head coaches on his staff, like Vogel and not the other way around |
You don't think they had a hand in choosing Vogel's staff? That's one of the reasons Lue didn't take the job. It's common knowledge Kurt has Jeanie's ear. |
they absolutely hand picked Vogel and let Ham pick his own staff. both statements can be true.
there is no way they hand pick Vogel's staff with 2 Ex Head coaches and then say no thanks to the philosophy when it came to a rookie coach |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jodeke
Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 68252
Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
|
| Posted: Tue May 07, 2024 12:15 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Bron2AD wrote: | | jodeke wrote: | | Bron2AD wrote: | | jodeke wrote: | | I'll admit to being a Ham fanboy. That said I think he was in over his head. The team is too young and inexperienced. They need a leader with more coaching acumen. The next coach must have control of the team. The FO has to let him/her have the reigns. In Darvin's defense, I think they/Kurt had too much influence. He didn't choose his staff, they did. The next coaches hurdle will also be Bron. He has to convince him to accept his program. If he does the others will follow. |
lol
if they micromanaged his staff then Ham would have ex head coaches on his staff, like Vogel and not the other way around |
You don't think they had a hand in choosing Vogel's staff? That's one of the reasons Lue didn't take the job. It's common knowledge Kurt has Jeanie's ear. |
they absolutely hand picked Vogel and let Ham pick his own staff. both statements can be true.
there is no way they hand pick Vogel's staff with 2 Ex Head coaches and then say no thanks to the philosophy when it came to a rookie coach |
You sound absolute. Unless you have inside knowledge you have an opinion. Going by what I've read in the media I think Kurt had a hand in picking Vogel and Ham's staff. I have no proof of that, it's JMO. If you have proof of your statement please post it.
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Bron2AD
Star Player
Joined: 01 Jun 2021
Posts: 9632
|
| Posted: Tue May 07, 2024 12:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| jodeke wrote: | | Bron2AD wrote: | | jodeke wrote: | | Bron2AD wrote: | | jodeke wrote: | | I'll admit to being a Ham fanboy. That said I think he was in over his head. The team is too young and inexperienced. They need a leader with more coaching acumen. The next coach must have control of the team. The FO has to let him/her have the reigns. In Darvin's defense, I think they/Kurt had too much influence. He didn't choose his staff, they did. The next coaches hurdle will also be Bron. He has to convince him to accept his program. If he does the others will follow. |
lol
if they micromanaged his staff then Ham would have ex head coaches on his staff, like Vogel and not the other way around |
You don't think they had a hand in choosing Vogel's staff? That's one of the reasons Lue didn't take the job. It's common knowledge Kurt has Jeanie's ear. |
they absolutely hand picked Vogel and let Ham pick his own staff. both statements can be true.
there is no way they hand pick Vogel's staff with 2 Ex Head coaches and then say no thanks to the philosophy when it came to a rookie coach |
You sound absolute. Unless you have inside knowledge you have an opinion. Going by what I've read in the media I think Kurt had a hand in picking Vogel and Ham's staff. I have no proof of that, it's JMO. If you have proof of your statement please post it. |
| Quote: | | According to the buzz in NBA coaching circles over the weekend, Ham has likewise been promised the autonomy to pick his coaching staff and is said to have received assurances that Lakers senior advisor Kurt Rambis will not be a regular presence in coaching meetings like he was with Vogel. If those promises come to fruition and Ham actually receives all that latitude, they will rank as significant concessions secured by a first-time NBA head coach. |
show me otherwise in regards to Ham and not vogel |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jodeke
Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 68252
Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
|
| Posted: Tue May 07, 2024 12:26 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Bron2AD wrote: | | jodeke wrote: | | Bron2AD wrote: | | jodeke wrote: | | Bron2AD wrote: | | jodeke wrote: | | I'll admit to being a Ham fanboy. That said I think he was in over his head. The team is too young and inexperienced. They need a leader with more coaching acumen. The next coach must have control of the team. The FO has to let him/her have the reigns. In Darvin's defense, I think they/Kurt had too much influence. He didn't choose his staff, they did. The next coaches hurdle will also be Bron. He has to convince him to accept his program. If he does the others will follow. |
lol
if they micromanaged his staff then Ham would have ex head coaches on his staff, like Vogel and not the other way around |
You don't think they had a hand in choosing Vogel's staff? That's one of the reasons Lue didn't take the job. It's common knowledge Kurt has Jeanie's ear. |
they absolutely hand picked Vogel and let Ham pick his own staff. both statements can be true.
there is no way they hand pick Vogel's staff with 2 Ex Head coaches and then say no thanks to the philosophy when it came to a rookie coach |
You sound absolute. Unless you have inside knowledge you have an opinion. Going by what I've read in the media I think Kurt had a hand in picking Vogel and Ham's staff. I have no proof of that, it's JMO. If you have proof of your statement please post it. |
| Quote: | | According to the buzz in NBA coaching circles over the weekend, Ham has likewise been promised the autonomy to pick his coaching staff and is said to have received assurances that Lakers senior advisor Kurt Rambis will not be a regular presence in coaching meetings like he was with Vogel. If those promises come to fruition and Ham actually receives all that latitude, they will rank as significant concessions secured by a first-time NBA head coach. |
show me otherwise in regards to Ham and not vogel |
I was wrong. Ham was given autonomy, Vogel wasn't. LINK LINK Ain't no shame in my game.
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Bron2AD
Star Player
Joined: 01 Jun 2021
Posts: 9632
|
| Posted: Tue May 07, 2024 12:31 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| jodeke wrote: | | Bron2AD wrote: | | jodeke wrote: | | Bron2AD wrote: | | jodeke wrote: | | Bron2AD wrote: | | jodeke wrote: | | I'll admit to being a Ham fanboy. That said I think he was in over his head. The team is too young and inexperienced. They need a leader with more coaching acumen. The next coach must have control of the team. The FO has to let him/her have the reigns. In Darvin's defense, I think they/Kurt had too much influence. He didn't choose his staff, they did. The next coaches hurdle will also be Bron. He has to convince him to accept his program. If he does the others will follow. |
lol
if they micromanaged his staff then Ham would have ex head coaches on his staff, like Vogel and not the other way around |
You don't think they had a hand in choosing Vogel's staff? That's one of the reasons Lue didn't take the job. It's common knowledge Kurt has Jeanie's ear. |
they absolutely hand picked Vogel and let Ham pick his own staff. both statements can be true.
there is no way they hand pick Vogel's staff with 2 Ex Head coaches and then say no thanks to the philosophy when it came to a rookie coach |
You sound absolute. Unless you have inside knowledge you have an opinion. Going by what I've read in the media I think Kurt had a hand in picking Vogel and Ham's staff. I have no proof of that, it's JMO. If you have proof of your statement please post it. |
| Quote: | | According to the buzz in NBA coaching circles over the weekend, Ham has likewise been promised the autonomy to pick his coaching staff and is said to have received assurances that Lakers senior advisor Kurt Rambis will not be a regular presence in coaching meetings like he was with Vogel. If those promises come to fruition and Ham actually receives all that latitude, they will rank as significant concessions secured by a first-time NBA head coach. |
show me otherwise in regards to Ham and not vogel |
I was wrong. Ham was given autonomy, Vogel wasn't. LINK LINK Ain't no shame in my game. |
 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ziggy
Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Feb 2005
Posts: 12747
|
| Posted: Tue May 07, 2024 12:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
It always annoyed me the way they treated Vogel like a child, but then handed this first time coach the keys to the team. The leadership of this organization has really created an unattractive environment for potential coaching candidates.
People always talk about Dr Buss being a player first guy and cheaping out on coaches. But he had Pat Riley and Phil Jackson lol.
If you pay a star coach an average salary, you still get a star coach. If you pay an average/bad coach an average salary, you still get a average/bad coach. You can risk being cheap when you already have a solid coach. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jodeke
Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 68252
Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
|
| Posted: Tue May 07, 2024 1:57 pm Post subject: |
|
|
As previously posted I'm a Ham Fanboy. I've been given information that made me see reasons so many were down on him in game threads. I didn't like his rotation or lineups and I wore blinders and conjured excuses. The FO seems to have learned a lesson. The next coach may be given autonomy. I'll lose faith if they hire JJ Redick. That would be like the Nets hiring Steve Nash, a great player with no coaching experience. I hope they don't go after Doc Rivers. His only real achievement was a championship in 2008 with the Celtics. Mike Budenholzer would be a good choice. Whoever gets the job will have to convince Bron to get on board with his program.
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Halflife
Franchise Player
Joined: 15 Aug 2015
Posts: 17300
|
| Posted: Tue May 07, 2024 2:54 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| jodeke wrote: | | As previously posted I'm a Ham Fanboy. I've been given information that made me see reasons so many were down on him in game threads. I didn't like his rotation or lineups and I wore blinders and conjured excuses. The FO seems to have learned a lesson. The next coach may be given autonomy. I'll lose faith if they hire JJ Redick. That would be like the Nets hiring Steve Nash, a great player with no coaching experience. I hope they don't go after Doc Rivers. His only real achievement was a championship in 2008 with the Celtics. Mike Budenholzer would be a good choice. Whoever gets the job will have to convince Bron to get on board with his program. |
I don’t know where the hell you got doc rivers but that would be a buzzkill of epic proportions
_________________
Kobe.
https://www.instagram.com/reel/Clw9scopegx/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y= |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
27
Star Player
Joined: 26 Sep 2010
Posts: 4503
Location: Los Angeles, CA
|
| Posted: Tue May 07, 2024 3:13 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Halflife wrote: | | jodeke wrote: | | As previously posted I'm a Ham Fanboy. I've been given information that made me see reasons so many were down on him in game threads. I didn't like his rotation or lineups and I wore blinders and conjured excuses. The FO seems to have learned a lesson. The next coach may be given autonomy. I'll lose faith if they hire JJ Redick. That would be like the Nets hiring Steve Nash, a great player with no coaching experience. I hope they don't go after Doc Rivers. His only real achievement was a championship in 2008 with the Celtics. Mike Budenholzer would be a good choice. Whoever gets the job will have to convince Bron to get on board with his program. |
I don’t know where the hell you got doc rivers but that would be a buzzkill of epic proportions |
Yikes. Thankfully the Bucks saved us from making that move, if we ever wanted it. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jodeke
Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 68252
Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
|
| Posted: Tue May 07, 2024 3:25 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Halflife wrote: | | jodeke wrote: | | As previously posted I'm a Ham Fanboy. I've been given information that made me see reasons so many were down on him in game threads. I didn't like his rotation or lineups and I wore blinders and conjured excuses. The FO seems to have learned a lesson. The next coach may be given autonomy. I'll lose faith if they hire JJ Redick. That would be like the Nets hiring Steve Nash, a great player with no coaching experience. I hope they don't go after Doc Rivers. His only real achievement was a championship in 2008 with the Celtics. Mike Budenholzer would be a good choice. Whoever gets the job will have to convince Bron to get on board with his program. |
I don’t know where the hell you got doc rivers but that would be a buzzkill of epic proportions |
Doc did such a bad job with the Bucks for some unknown reason he popped into my head. 
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
lakeshowtacular
Starting Rotation
Joined: 22 Jul 2010
Posts: 712
|
| Posted: Tue May 07, 2024 3:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I was hyped for Darvin basically because I'm a Laker optimist and wanted to be all in on the newest rising star coach, but Hamm weren't it!!
The runs he would let other teams go on without calling TOs would make me furious. It was hard to watch.
Then I would harken back to the old PJ days, and he would let Kob and Shaq/Pau try to "figure it out" without calling a TO, but that team had sets they could go to every time that allowed them to exploit their advantages. I never saw a time where this year's squad would consistently attack an opponent's defensive weakness after exposing it. Specifically in these playoffs when AD was going off in the first half attacking the paint and left out of the offense in the second. I understand Den making adjustments, but that is insane not to have him take another shot in the paint until 3 mins left in the 4th or whatever it was. I don't care who is trying to stat pad, a real coach calls a timeout and says get AD the ball in space on the next 3 possessions. Screen, cut, back cut, whatever it takes AD get to your spot and win this game for us!!
...of course that didn't happen. I'm sorry I slipped into 1st person, Hamm will not be missed by me. I am just worried all the best coaches were available last offseason.
_________________
Magic*Kobe*LBJ*AD*Cap |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Hanging from Rafters
Star Player
Joined: 31 Jul 2018
Posts: 4676
|
| Posted: Tue May 07, 2024 3:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| lakeshowtacular wrote: | I was hyped for Darvin basically because I'm a Laker optimist and wanted to be all in on the newest rising star coach, but Hamm weren't it!!
The runs he would let other teams go on without calling TOs would make me furious. It was hard to watch.
Then I would harken back to the old PJ days, and he would let Kob and Shaq/Pau try to "figure it out" without calling a TO, but that team had sets they could go to every time that allowed them to exploit their advantages. I never saw a time where this year's squad would consistently attack an opponent's defensive weakness after exposing it. Specifically in these playoffs when AD was going off in the first half attacking the paint and left out of the offense in the second. I understand Den making adjustments, but that is insane not to have him take another shot in the paint until 3 mins left in the 4th or whatever it was. I don't care who is trying to stat pad, a real coach calls a timeout and says get AD the ball in space on the next 3 possessions. Screen, cut, back cut, whatever it takes AD get to your spot and win this game for us!!
...of course that didn't happen. I'm sorry I slipped into 1st person, Hamm will not be missed by me. I am just worried all the best coaches were available last offseason. |
I feel like the obvious no-brainer choice is Budenholzer. He is likely to have similar terminology and sets to Ham so the transition to a new coach could possibly be smoother than normal with the teacher replacing the student. Also, Budenholzer has won a championship in recent years which is necessary experience for a veteran team. Not having to take a year or two to learn what it takes to win a ship, and having somewhat of a posssible similar structure would give me hope that implantation of championship philosophy would be made sooner. Most anyone else would have to go through a much steeper learning curve.
The thing is, if LeBron and Dlo walk then what difference does it make who the coach is for what most likely would be a lottery team? On the other hand, if Budenholzer is hired before the opt out time maybe they opt in?
I think we’re heading for potter purgatory 
_________________
“When it looks as if it is a realistic possibility, I want to focus on winning a ship like it’s a goal that can’t be denied. I didn’t see that this off season.” |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Halflife
Franchise Player
Joined: 15 Aug 2015
Posts: 17300
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Hanging from Rafters
Star Player
Joined: 31 Jul 2018
Posts: 4676
|
| Posted: Wed May 08, 2024 1:18 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Halflife wrote: | | We have been a lottery team 2 of the last 6 years. Bud and other coaches would probably prefer a young team they can coach. |
I’ve wondered about that. I think…like us…coaches want to win a championship, so that a ready made possibility would be attractive. I’ve also wondered if they preferred a young lottery team they could build on their own instead of getting a veteran team already eyeing a ship run. It’s just Speculation…that could be different for different coaches and different circumstances…that we may never know truthfully unless they come out and say it. Either way, it’s up to the ship ready owner to make the coach a good enough offer to encourage them to take the “ship ready” team instead of their preference if it’s different.
May be moot since I don’t see the Lakers FO doing that and believe they’ve already past the point of being able to salvage a ship and a long lottery sentence. I’d be pleasantly surprised if LBJ/Dlo return with Bud and a legitimate back up C plus a defensive 3&D guard with the core intact. At least one of those things is going to be messed up if it goes like it has for the past several years with the exception of the 1 ship. Maybe the FO thinks that’s good enough for us fans to sit down and shut up to just be thankful. I’m still trying to justify them waffling on a ship commitment on purpose so I can maintain denial of them just being that inept.
_________________
“When it looks as if it is a realistic possibility, I want to focus on winning a ship like it’s a goal that can’t be denied. I didn’t see that this off season.” |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
LakersRGolden
Star Player
Joined: 13 Jan 2002
Posts: 7963
Location: Lake Forest
|
| Posted: Wed May 08, 2024 1:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| I think it's implicit in the Lakers HC position that the start from scratch and draft "your" guys to build a contender has too long of a timeframe that 99% of coaches wouldn't survive. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jodeke
Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 68252
Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
|
| Posted: Wed May 08, 2024 3:24 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| LakersRGolden wrote: | | I think it's implicit in the Lakers HC position that the start from scratch and draft "your" guys to build a contender has too long of a timeframe that 99% of coaches wouldn't survive. |
Danny Ainge did it with the Celtics. It takes time and the results are long lasting. You have youth to build on. Patience is key.
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
