Vogel must feel a lot better. Knowing that a dude that replaced him last all of 2 years despite making the playoffs both years (although with a much better team).
The unreasonable demands on coaching while completely overlooking the GM continues. Wasn't Jeanie saying Pelinka and Ham were tied together contractually? Where's that baloney right now? Why are both not dismissed?
Since Phil in 1999, we have hired 2 good coaches. I was not a fan at all of one, and one I didn't know/care for but grew to respect a lot. That means in 25 years we've had 2 good coaches not named Phil, unless you want to count the Rudy era (which wasn't good either). MDA had some success in Houston and PHX. Vogel with us and IND. Outside of those 2, we've have hired crap. Really look back at the jobs Mike Brown, Byron Scott, Luke Walton and Ham have done. We've hired a lot of bad fits and coaches.
Yet now we're supposed to keep our fingers crossed that the same guys that hired Ham, fired Vogel who won you a ring, passed on Ty Lue and Monty, hired and fired Luke Walton, will now suddenly hire the right guy? Ok, fingers crossed I guess.
It's also the roster BTW. Vogel had a (bleep) roster that year and was not deservedly fired. Ham made some mistakes, but after a while he played the right lineup with Rui/Reaves/DLO. It was late, but he did it. And even then, we looked a Center and defensive guard short vs Denver. Who is that on? Pelinka. Who escapes it all? Pelinka. Who made the mess to have a roster that doesn't have a Center and a defensive PG even though we once had both? Pelinka. Yet the coaches all get the blame.
I just want Jeanie to hold Pelinka accountable the way she holds every head coach she has not had a sexual relationship with. I don't feel bad for Ham, because he was making mistakes and did get it way too late this season (and makes some nice 10M/2 years in change without stress of work). But I want someone to hold Pelinka accountable. He's had Anthony Davis and Lebron James and had only 2 truly good roster balance to date (the first 2 of the Lebron/AD era). He keeps escaping it all by blaming the coaching.
Not defending Ham but changing coaches every two years isn’t something that winning franchises do.
I think the last 10-15 years is a clear message that as a coach, you have two years to win a title here or you’re gone. I think this is certainly a team that can win in the next 2 years as constructed but if the good coaches are already under contract, then it’s likely another guy who is just wanting a job.
It's not even just the Lakers organization. The overall trend in the league now is you have 2-3 years to show results, or the organization will move on to someone new. Gone are the days where most coaches remain with one team for a decade or more.
Going into this season almost 2/3 of the league (19/30) had coaches entering their 3rd season with the team (or less). Not coincidentally, the four coaches with more than 5 years in the current stint with their team have all won championships. The coaching carousel is fast and vicious now.
Popovich - 28 years
Spoelstra - 16 years
Kerr - 10 years
M. Malone - 9 years
4-5 Years
Bickerstaff
Jenkins
Donovan
Lue
Finch
Thibs
3 Years
Vaughn (fired)
Carlisle (second stint in IND)
Kidd
Green
Mosley
Billups
Unseld Jr. (fired)
2 Years
Snyder
Mazzulla
Ham (fired)
Prunty
M. Brown
Hardy
S. Clifford (second stint in CHA) (quit)
1 Year
M. Williams
Udoka
A. Griffin (fired)
Nurse
Vogel
Rajakovic
Great list. Stealing and extending it w/ output
Quote:
Popovich - 28 years SAN Championship
Spoelstra - 16 years MIA Championship
Kerr - 10 years GOS Championship
M. Malone - 9 years DEN Championship
4-5 Years
Bickerstaff CLE 2nd Round (ongoing) - This year
Jenkins MEM 2nd Round - 2022
Donovan CHI 1st Round - 2022
Lue LAC Conf Finals - 2021
Finch MIN 2nd Round (ongoing) - This Year
Thibs NYK 2nd Round (ongoing) - This year
3 Years Vaughn (fired) BRK 1st Round (0/4 x2) - 2022 & 2023
Carlisle (second stint in IND) IND 2nd Round (ongoing) - This year
Kidd DAL 2nd Round (ongoing) - This year
Green NOP 1st Round - 2022 & 2024
Mosley ORL 2nd Round (ongoing) - This year
Billups POR 0 Playoff berth
Unseld Jr. (fired) WAS 0 Playoff berth
Daigneault OKC 2nd Round (ongoing) - This Year
2 Years
Snyder ATL 0 Playoff berth
Mazzulla BOS Conf Finals - 2023 Ham (fired) LAL Conf Finals - 2023
M. Brown SAC 1st Round - 2023
Hardy UTH 0 Playoff berth
S. Clifford (second stint in CHA) (quit) CHA 0 Playoff berth
1 Year
M. Williams DET 0 Playoff berth
Udoka HOU 0 Playoff berth
A. Griffin (fired) MIL 0 Playoff berth
Nurse PHL 1st Round - This year
Vogel PHX 1st Round - This year
Rajakovic TOR 0 Playoff berth
The unreasonable demands on coaching while completely overlooking the GM continues. Wasn't Jeanie saying Pelinka and Ham were tied together contractually? Where's that baloney right now? Why are both not dismissed?
It was always BS. She’s not going to fire Kobe’s BFF. This is why you don’t hire your buddies. _________________ 14-5-3-12
The unreasonable demands on coaching while completely overlooking the GM continues. Wasn't Jeanie saying Pelinka and Ham were tied together contractually? Where's that baloney right now? Why are both not dismissed?
It was always BS. She’s not going to fire Kobe’s BFF. This is why you don’t hire your buddies.
She was on the record in one of her interviews 2 years ago that a Pelinka extension was based on that a new coach needed to know his time intertwined with that of Pelinka or some BS like that. Yet, 2 years later, Ham is gone.
Look I'm not a Ham defender, and by no means do I think this was a bad decision. But I can't believe they keep overlooking the flaws with the roster. 2 years ago we had a top heavy roster with both AD/Bron injured half the season as well as a geriatric lineup around them. Coach's faul. This year, I give you that Ham lost the team with his lineups, but he did seem to recover midseason to end. He played the right lineups from Feb to season's end and the success was there. In the end though, I don't think any coach wins more than 2 games vs Denver with what we have to work with. We're a Center and defensive guard short of a contender. Pelinka has built a one way team, Rui/DLO/Reaves are all 1-way guys next to AD/Bron. Very easy for Denver to expose that. Any good team would have exposed our weaknesses.
Last edited by wolfpaclaker on Fri May 03, 2024 3:39 pm; edited 1 time in total
The unreasonable demands on coaching while completely overlooking the GM continues. Wasn't Jeanie saying Pelinka and Ham were tied together contractually? Where's that baloney right now? Why are both not dismissed?
It was always BS. She’s not going to fire Kobe’s BFF. This is why you don’t hire your buddies.
Kobe would have fired his own bff seeing how incompetent he has been
Joined: 16 Apr 2001 Posts: 12296 Location: Pasadena, CA
Posted: Fri May 03, 2024 3:37 pm Post subject:
ocho wrote:
Quote:
The unreasonable demands on coaching while completely overlooking the GM continues. Wasn't Jeanie saying Pelinka and Ham were tied together contractually? Where's that baloney right now? Why are both not dismissed?
It was always BS. She’s not going to fire Kobe’s BFF. This is why you don’t hire your buddies.
Exactly. The nepotism has to be eliminated, thus the reason I want the Buss family to sell to the highest bidder. Jeanie is an idiot, bimbo, who doesn't know how to run the Lakers, let alone her other favorite venture, Women in Wrestling. She's unfit to run a franchise....as is her friend/consultants, Linda and Kurt Rambis. Get rid of all of them!!!
Joined: 16 Apr 2001 Posts: 12296 Location: Pasadena, CA
Posted: Fri May 03, 2024 3:39 pm Post subject:
Bron2AD wrote:
ocho wrote:
Quote:
The unreasonable demands on coaching while completely overlooking the GM continues. Wasn't Jeanie saying Pelinka and Ham were tied together contractually? Where's that baloney right now? Why are both not dismissed?
It was always BS. She’s not going to fire Kobe’s BFF. This is why you don’t hire your buddies.
Kobe would have fired his own bff seeing how incompetent he has been
But Jeanie still stuck with this idiot palinka
Exactly.....
and I think how sadly the Buss family did Kobe at the end of his career. Some of those teams were pure crap and they let the Lakers roll out with that crap? I know that was Mitch/Jim but still was horrific what they did as Kobe was winding down his career.....
The unreasonable demands on coaching while completely overlooking the GM continues. Wasn't Jeanie saying Pelinka and Ham were tied together contractually? Where's that baloney right now? Why are both not dismissed?
It was always BS. She’s not going to fire Kobe’s BFF. This is why you don’t hire your buddies.
Kobe would have fired his own bff seeing how incompetent he has been
But Jeanie still stuck with this idiot palinka
Exactly.....
and I think how sadly the Buss family did Kobe at the end of his career. Some of those teams were pure crap and they let the Lakers roll out with that crap? I know that was Mitch/Jim but still was horrific what they did as Kobe was winding down his career.....
Not trying to get excited or anything but if Jeanie can fire Jim Buss her own sibling I don’t see why she can’t do it with Pelinka
She won’t fire Pelinka because she has no one to turn to. To her it’ll be too expensive to hire any legit basketball mind, she wants to hire her friends but she’s afraid the backlash comes with it. So Pelinka’s job is safe.
Last edited by SGV-Laker fan on Fri May 03, 2024 3:55 pm; edited 1 time in total
Joined: 16 Apr 2001 Posts: 12296 Location: Pasadena, CA
Posted: Fri May 03, 2024 3:50 pm Post subject:
Inspector Gadget wrote:
Not trying to get excited or anything but if Jeanie can fire Jim Buss her own sibling I don’t see why she can’t do it with Pelinka
It's different. I think she thinks Rob has done a great job. I doubt his job would ever be in jeopardy. If it is, hers should be as well. She is the big dummy who signs off on everything.
In my opinion, Rob has done an ok job at times but mostly has not. Blowing up the 2020 title roster was a huge blunder. Keeping THT over Caruso another blunder. Bringing the washed old team together a couple years ago was a huge blunder too. The list goes on and on...Westbrook......
His only saving grace, the trade deadline last season and resigning some of these guys back up over the summer...
That's it.....I give him a C-C- overall. Bob Myers would get us an A
Not trying to get excited or anything but if Jeanie can fire Jim Buss her own sibling I don’t see why she can’t do it with Pelinka
She won’t fire Pelinka because she has no one to turn to. To her it’ll be too expensive for any legit basketball minds, she wants to hire her friends but she’s afraid the backlash comes with it. So Pelinka’s job is safe.
If she wants LeBron to settle in and make 1 last run then she should do everything possible to get a GM to give him the best opportunity for a title, fact that he didn’t do anything at the trade deadline despite the amazing play of LeBron and AD should put him on the hot seat
Joined: 19 Apr 2003 Posts: 22888 Location: La Jolla, San Diego
Posted: Fri May 03, 2024 4:38 pm Post subject:
Halflife wrote:
Wilbon had an interesting perspective on firing
Stuff like "Darvin Ham is a helluva coach.." tells me I don't need to listen to rest of what they have to say, just like they didn't need to watch our basketball games, which they obviously didn't.
Stuff like "Darvin Ham is a helluva coach.." tells me I don't need to listen to rest of what they have to say, just like they didn't need to watch our basketball games, which they obviously didn't.
Imagine watching all Lakers game, watching this idiot speak garbage and then saying it's an interesting perspective 😂
Vogel must feel a lot better. Knowing that a dude that replaced him last all of 2 years despite making the playoffs both years (although with a much better team).
I don't know how good Vogel feels considering Ham's had more success with the Lakers than he's had with the Suns. _________________ How NBA 2K18 failed the All-Time Lakers:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxMBYm3wwxk
Stuff like "Darvin Ham is a helluva coach.." tells me I don't need to listen to rest of what they have to say, just like they didn't need to watch our basketball games, which they obviously didn't.
stats don't lie. He took a lottery team to the WCF finals. Only team to ever beat a Hamm coached team in the playoffs are the nuggets.
Is the first priority in hiring a new coach keeping Lebron happy?
We don't need a Coach that's first priority is to make LeBron happy.
We need a Coach that's first priority is to make LeBron better, and requires it of him with no excuses.
Along with everyone else on the team, and is the kind of Coach that is good at maximizing that. _________________ How NBA 2K18 failed the All-Time Lakers:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxMBYm3wwxk
Last edited by MJST on Fri May 03, 2024 5:36 pm; edited 1 time in total
Joined: 12 Mar 2012 Posts: 1787 Location: San Francisco, CA
Posted: Fri May 03, 2024 4:57 pm Post subject:
Halflife wrote:
Runway8 wrote:
Halflife wrote:
Wilbon had an interesting perspective on firing
Stuff like "Darvin Ham is a helluva coach.." tells me I don't need to listen to rest of what they have to say, just like they didn't need to watch our basketball games, which they obviously didn't.
stats don't lie. He took a lottery team to the WCF finals. Only team to ever beat a Hamm coached team in the playoffs are the nuggets.
I know reality is tough, especially when he wants players to be held accountable. On the to 4th in 6.
This is one of the dumbest takes and you just keep regurgitating it
What did HE do to take us to the WCF ? Because before the trade deadline he was 13th seed. We got there in spite of him, not because of him.
Is the first priority in hiring a new coach keeping Lebron happy?
I’m curious to see if LeBron knew that Phil Handy got canned, if not then it won’t sit well with him, maybe getting JJ Reddick will make him excited but it seems like that will be because they did a podcast together
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