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venturalakersfan
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Joined: 14 Apr 2001
Posts: 144466
Location: The Gold Coast
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 Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 8:49 am Post subject: |
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| JUST-MING wrote: | | The pieces are there, it’s on the coach to put it together. This team has like seven hall of fame players. It does not lack talent. |
Maybe 1.5 are playing now like Hall of Famers. The past wins 0 games.
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LakerMindLA
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Joined: 26 Dec 2008
Posts: 5344
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 9:23 am Post subject: |
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| JUST-MING wrote: | | The pieces are there, it’s on the coach to put it together. This team has like seven hall of fame players. It does not lack talent. |
We might as well bring MJ, Magic and Kareem back because once you are a HOF, based on your logic, you’ll always produce and play at that level.
This team has a talent and age issue. Minimum salary players are minimum salary players for a reason. |
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lakersboy
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Joined: 20 Jul 2006
Posts: 8518
Location: Left coast
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 10:05 am Post subject: |
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| ducasse wrote: | | phantasyman wrote: | | When LeBron and AD go 34/11 and 33/11 respectively and you have Westbrook and you still lose by 7 at home, ummm, yeah, you're gonna hard time convincing me we can even make it to the WCF |
How well did the Heat do to start their first season when they had prime Bron, Wade and Bosh? They started 9-8 losing 4 out of 5 at one point. Give this team 20 games and let's see. |
They had young talent in their prime, others had plenty athletic ability, and they had a nice mix of big and small. Additionally, Lebron was much more explosive than he is now. That team had interchangeable defensive abilities that this one lacks. If Carmelo is your backup big wing defender..... nuff said. |
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LAKERMIKE2
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Joined: 26 Oct 2005
Posts: 2080
Location: Jack's Crib
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 10:13 am Post subject: |
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Well, Frank Vogel will have to play Monk, Nunn & TNT once they are healthy. They are the ones who can run & cover the 3 pt shooters we’re gonna see if they wanna win!!!
LBJ has to be a shooter which he looked good last night, AD needs to stay below the foul line & leave the 3’s to shooters, Russ will figure it out & should do more damage when LBJ sits.
Those 3 guys I mentioned MUST get shots also, I don’t wanna hear about pecking order or big 3. Share the friggin ball & don’t ice out the young guys or they’ll be in trouble!!!
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LAKERMIKE2
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Joined: 26 Oct 2005
Posts: 2080
Location: Jack's Crib
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 10:27 am Post subject: |
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Yeah, we only need one point guard in the game technically but with no Nunn & THT our bench isn’t set. Gotta let Monk get some touches & shots. Our rotations gotta be on point to defend, recover & not get out hustled for ball.
AD is going to have to play more 5 against teams like Warriors, Suns & small ball teams & get some shooting or defense in the game!!! Jordan & Dwight we’re not effective.
Frank needs to wise up!!!
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My Laker squad.
Mr. Clutch, Nixon, Eddie, Nick, Magic, Kareem,
Silk, Cooper, AC, Worthy, Horry, Shaq, Kobe.
HC: Riley |
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laker50
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Joined: 07 Mar 2014
Posts: 2140
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 10:47 am Post subject: |
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Unless Westbrook learns to shoot the Lakers do not have a chance unless they trade him.
The shots he takes are not even close. Westbrick is a good name.
And he doesn't move on offense without the ball.
And his defense is not good.
It goes to show better to pass the eyeball test than looking at stats. |
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governator
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Joined: 28 Jan 2006
Posts: 25092
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 12:35 pm Post subject: |
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| My people, AD and Bron looked healthy… and we have 80 games to fine tune, of course we can win this |
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ducasse
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Joined: 05 Sep 2002
Posts: 8259
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 1:06 pm Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | ducasse wrote: | | phantasyman wrote: | | When LeBron and AD go 34/11 and 33/11 respectively and you have Westbrook and you still lose by 7 at home, ummm, yeah, you're gonna hard time convincing me we can even make it to the WCF |
How well did the Heat do to start their first season when they had prime Bron, Wade and Bosh? They started 9-8 losing 4 out of 5 at one point. Give this team 20 games and let's see. |
Because we have prime Lebron, Wade and Bosh? One thing is not like the other. |
The parallel is that this roster has had a huge overhaul and has talented players on it. The Heat were similarly overhauled and had more talent than the Lakers do now and they looked awful in their first 17 games. They needed time to learn how to play together. This team can't be judged on any level until they have had some time to play together. I'd say 20 games minimum before drawing any conclusions. Vogel needs more time with these guys to get the defense in order and they need time to integrate Westbrook.
Last edited by ducasse on Wed Oct 20, 2021 1:12 pm; edited 5 times in total |
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yinoma2001
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Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 1:07 pm Post subject: |
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How many thought that the Bucks would win it all last year? Or that the Suns would be in the Finals?
Way too soon to guess anything, especially with health/COVID, etc. still a major factor. |
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jodeke
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Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 67703
Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 1:36 pm Post subject: |
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We have the tools. How to use them to get the max is the challenge. Once a formula is created and the team gets on board with it, we will be in great shape to bring home the trophy. IMO Westbrook has to come off the bench. He has to stop deferring and initiate the offense. He can't do that playing with AD and Bron. Vogel has his job cut out for him.
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Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
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krisobe
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Joined: 24 Jun 2005
Posts: 3309
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 2:07 pm Post subject: |
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put TWO SHOOTERS with Brody/Bron/AD in the starting 5 and it will free up the paint for brody to be effective. Having DJ in there hinders WB.
Once Ellington gets healthy or Ariza... you gotta replace em with DJ in the starting unit. Need to free up the paint and put one extra shooter.
WB / Ellington / Baze or Ariza / Bron / AD ----- better spacing, perimeter defense and shooting.
WB / Baze / Bron / AD / DJ ------ spacing & shooting from the team other than AD/BRON was cringe.
Last edited by krisobe on Wed Oct 20, 2021 2:09 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Rek
Star Player
Joined: 24 Apr 2008
Posts: 2228
Location: SoCal
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 2:09 pm Post subject: Re: I honestly can't see us winning the chip this year |
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| phantasyman wrote: | | And it's not because we went 0 - 6 in preseason, losing by an average of 15 ppg, nor is it because of their ages, The Lakers look simply lost out there. Again, they continue to defer to LeBron to create rather than creating as a unit. That's why defenses are able to easily clamp down Lakers as the game progresses because they know we are looking to LeBron for the shot. I also can't see the Lakers perfecting chemistry in one season with all the roster changes. That's why Phoenix, GS, Dallas, and others play so fluid because they have developed that chemistry with minimal changes to the core and bench. Let's see what happens, but it's my belief that we won't be successful this year. |
I'm not a fan of how everything revolves around Bron, either. Players already established to have real skills are often diminished when they play alongside him. That being said, they will need some time to adapt to the new roster and sort out rotations and especially tighten up defensive assignments and communications on the floor. And also, seems like Bron's teams always start out slow no matter how the roster is constructed. I'll be more interested in how they are meshing a month or two into the season and obviously later towards the playoffs.
My main gripe is knowing we could have afforded to keep Caruso and added DeRozan for less than what we're paying Russ. So, I just hope it all works out. |
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Outspoken
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Joined: 11 Feb 2015
Posts: 8451
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 2:32 pm Post subject: |
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| I can't say right now. It all depends on how the big 3 adjust to each other. The others will fall in line. I think, right now, Westbrook is the weak link because he does virtually what Bron does, but not as good because of his decision making isn't the best and he still can't shoot. If Westbrook could shoot, I would say we are gonna win. We also don't have our whole team, as well as we don't know what our actual starting line up is/will be. I don't think Bazemore is a starter. I actually trust Austin more than him and a lot of players. I would have loved to see how Austin would have done against the Warriors. Not saying Austin should have started, just played. |
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activeverb
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Joined: 17 Jun 2006
Posts: 37470
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 2:53 pm Post subject: |
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| JUST-MING wrote: | | This team has like seven hall of fame players. It does not lack talent. |
Deandre Jordan made an all-star team 5 years ago. Do you think that makes him an all-star talent today? |
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LakerEric
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Joined: 03 May 2002
Posts: 7193
Location: Vegas
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 3:06 pm Post subject: |
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I really don't like the roster construction. Westbrick's contract just forced scrapped parts. LBJ and AD are sooo freaking great but losing Caruso and KCP and not able to get a guy like Hield is devastating. Russ isn't a "star" at all. He's good but watching him play last night...his deficiencies and lack of shot is AWFUL!
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jodeke
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Posts: 67703
Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 5:16 pm Post subject: |
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People, People, People!!! There are only 3 carryovers from last season, THT, AD, and Bron. This is a brand new team. It's going to take at least 20 games for them to find their footing. Patience is the keyword. For me, this season Vogel has to prove he belongs.
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Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
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Steve007
Franchise Player
Joined: 21 Jul 2006
Posts: 13227
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| Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 12:46 am Post subject: |
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| lakurluv wrote: | Playoffs maybe our ceiling, but we will have to reach them first. We have a nostalgic roster and the very thought of this team is simply amazing, however that proved to not be successful two times prior with the Lakers franchise.
2003-2004 - Kobe, Payton, Malone, Shaq, Grant
2012-2013 - Kobe, Nash, Howard, Gasol, Artest
Essentially having potential HOF players on one roster does NOT equate to a championship, especially in today's NBA. The players (kids) coming into the league now are a different breed, no FEAR, no Reverence for what's gone before them, the game is simply a game-controller in their hand with unlimited range and athleticism.
My thoughts for the season is simply this: If we can't defend the perimeter, we won't win! |
Both of those rosters underperformed because of injuries and age, which unfortunately can easily be a problem with the current roster. |
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hype
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Joined: 19 Nov 2007
Posts: 4377
Location: Lake Nacimiento
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| Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 1:04 am Post subject: |
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| Steve007 wrote: | | lakurluv wrote: | Playoffs maybe our ceiling, but we will have to reach them first. We have a nostalgic roster and the very thought of this team is simply amazing, however that proved to not be successful two times prior with the Lakers franchise.
2003-2004 - Kobe, Payton, Malone, Shaq, Grant
2012-2013 - Kobe, Nash, Howard, Gasol, Artest
Essentially having potential HOF players on one roster does NOT equate to a championship, especially in today's NBA. The players (kids) coming into the league now are a different breed, no FEAR, no Reverence for what's gone before them, the game is simply a game-controller in their hand with unlimited range and athleticism.
My thoughts for the season is simply this: If we can't defend the perimeter, we won't win! |
Both of those rosters underperformed because of injuries and age, which unfortunately can easily be a problem with the current roster. |
Yup, no doubt it's a big gamble but both of those rosters above are clear Favorites if they make it healthy into the Playoffs which they obviously didn't. The one thing about this current roster though is that we are VASTLY more deep them either of them especially that 04 team so we can do some rest management. Who knows how things end up but the Lakers have always been a gambler on big talent. We look to win Championships not to field a team of young potential talent that makes the Playoffs every year but is not quite good enough to actually win it all which will happen to all the "young" teams in the NBA like every other season.
Also, this Lakers team is nearly the exact average age of the great 1998 Bulls. Not saying we'll be as good as them but there's a def. middle ground which if we fall in by the end of the season we're still the WC favorites imo. There's no other powerhouses in the WC and every decent team has plenty of there own question marks. |
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roger_federer
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Joined: 01 Mar 2020
Posts: 3114
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| Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 11:57 am Post subject: |
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| Its a foregone conclusion on the day we signed WB over Heild and then chose THT over AC |
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Outspoken
Star Player
Joined: 11 Feb 2015
Posts: 8451
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| Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 12:07 pm Post subject: |
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| silkwilkes wrote: | How can you tell anything before the team has played a single regular-season game looool.
Health will be the issue. Nothing else. If AD, LBJ, and Westbrook stay healthy, we're competing for everything.
IF LBJ and AD were healthy last season, I believe we repeat and fairly easily so. |
Repeating? Lol yea, right. |
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Swagron12
Starting Rotation
Joined: 27 Sep 2020
Posts: 328
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| Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 12:20 pm Post subject: Re: I honestly can't see us winning the chip this year |
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| phantasyman wrote: | | And it's not because we went 0 - 6 in preseason, losing by an average of 15 ppg, nor is it because of their ages, The Lakers look simply lost out there. Again, they continue to defer to LeBron to create rather than creating as a unit. That's why defenses are able to easily clamp down Lakers as the game progresses because they know we are looking to LeBron for the shot. I also can't see the Lakers perfecting chemistry in one season with all the roster changes. That's why Phoenix, GS, Dallas, and others play so fluid because they have developed that chemistry with minimal changes to the core and bench. Let's see what happens, but it's my belief that we won't be successful this year. |
Phoenix lost last night too. Guess they are out of it too. |
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Swagron12
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Joined: 27 Sep 2020
Posts: 328
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| Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 12:22 pm Post subject: |
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| LakerEric wrote: | | I really don't like the roster construction. Westbrick's contract just forced scrapped parts. LBJ and AD are sooo freaking great but losing Caruso and KCP and not able to get a guy like Hield is devastating. Russ isn't a "star" at all. He's good but watching him play last night...his deficiencies and lack of shot is AWFUL! |
Did you watch ANY of the playoffs last year??? Caruso and KCP offered as much as I did- nothing. |
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PlantedTanks
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Joined: 01 Jul 2017
Posts: 3156
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| Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 12:47 pm Post subject: |
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At the start of the season for the last 3 years.
Had GSW as prohibitive favorites and never expected Toronto to win in 2018-2019.
Was unsure of the Lakers chances in 2019-2020 but not surprised.
Had favorite odds on the Lakers and never expected the Bucks to win in 2020-2021.
2021-2022 your guess is as good as anyone's.
Too many issues to consider. Injuries, Kyrie, Simmons, Westbrook, future player acquisitions. However to write off the Lakers after 1 game just seems wrong. |
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Swagron12
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Joined: 27 Sep 2020
Posts: 328
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| Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 6:07 pm Post subject: Re: I honestly can't see us winning the chip this year |
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| Swagron12 wrote: | | phantasyman wrote: | | And it's not because we went 0 - 6 in preseason, losing by an average of 15 ppg, nor is it because of their ages, The Lakers look simply lost out there. Again, they continue to defer to LeBron to create rather than creating as a unit. That's why defenses are able to easily clamp down Lakers as the game progresses because they know we are looking to LeBron for the shot. I also can't see the Lakers perfecting chemistry in one season with all the roster changes. That's why Phoenix, GS, Dallas, and others play so fluid because they have developed that chemistry with minimal changes to the core and bench. Let's see what happens, but it's my belief that we won't be successful this year. |
Phoenix lost last night too. Guess they are out of it too. |
Dallas lost tonight. Out of the playoffs. |
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Baron Von Humongous
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Joined: 02 Jul 2015
Posts: 32979
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| Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 6:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Swagron12 wrote: | | LakerEric wrote: | | I really don't like the roster construction. Westbrick's contract just forced scrapped parts. LBJ and AD are sooo freaking great but losing Caruso and KCP and not able to get a guy like Hield is devastating. Russ isn't a "star" at all. He's good but watching him play last night...his deficiencies and lack of shot is AWFUL! |
Did you watch ANY of the playoffs last year??? Caruso and KCP offered as much as I did- nothing. |
Yes, they won a title last year.
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