| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Baron Von Humongous
Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015
Posts: 32979
|
 Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 8:00 am Post subject: |
|
|
The Playoff 7: AD, LeBron, DS, AC, KCP, Wes, Kuz
Everyone else is matchup dependent. I'd limit C minutes to one man per game if possible - designate one of Gasol, Drummond, or Harrell depending on matchups - use THT judiciously if Schröder or Caruso are struggling on offense, and keep Kieff involved enough that he'll be ready for the Clippers.
_________________
Under New Management |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
CRoost
Star Player
Joined: 21 Mar 2017
Posts: 4818
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 8:03 am Post subject: |
|
|
I am more interested on our death lineup at this stage.
To me it looks like
Lebron
AD
Caruso
KCP
Wes/Kuz/Kief - depending on matchup and who’s hot. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
AirTupac
Star Player
Joined: 04 Feb 2018
Posts: 1234
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 8:06 am Post subject: |
|
|
I really do like Bron-AD-KCP-AC. One of my fav line ups in a long long time.
_________________
I love my Lakies |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Baron Von Humongous
Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015
Posts: 32979
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 8:14 am Post subject: |
|
|
| CRoost wrote: | I am more interested on our death lineup at this stage.
To me it looks like
Lebron
AD
Caruso
KCP
Wes/Kuz/Kief - depending on matchup and who’s hot. |
That's who it's going to come down to.
_________________
Under New Management |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
LakerSD
Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Nov 2016
Posts: 23794
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 8:33 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | CRoost wrote: | I am more interested on our death lineup at this stage.
To me it looks like
Lebron
AD
Caruso
KCP
Wes/Kuz/Kief - depending on matchup and who’s hot. |
That's who it's going to come down to. |
The 3 closing guys imo need to be Lebron/AD/Caruso. They open up the offense with their basketball IQ and skill sets.
Wes/Kuz when we face wings that give us trouble with small guards.
KCP/DS for the 3 guard lineups.
But I have no issue yanking either of those guys and going to Wes and Kuz. Both those guys are bigger and can shoot. They also are better at reading the court than Dennis and KCP. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BandwagonLBJhopper
Star Player
Joined: 07 Feb 2020
Posts: 3609
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 8:36 am Post subject: |
|
|
We are gonna need Wes. We keep getting worked by wings and the difference when he came in on Wiggins for example was night and day.
He will be a must play against wing scorer heavy teams. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
LakerSD
Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Nov 2016
Posts: 23794
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 8:42 am Post subject: |
|
|
| BandwagonLBJhopper wrote: | We are gonna need Wes. We keep getting worked by wings and the difference when he came in on Wiggins for example was night and day.
He will be a must play against wing scorer heavy teams. |
Wes saved the game. Wiggins was killing us not only with his production but also for his offensive role to free up Curry and the other shooters.
When we were getting destroyed it was really Draymond and Wiggins running the offense and burning us.
AD to 5 on Draymond
Wes on Wiggins
Caruso on Steph
Game over. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Baron Von Humongous
Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015
Posts: 32979
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 9:19 am Post subject: |
|
|
| LakerSD wrote: | | BandwagonLBJhopper wrote: | We are gonna need Wes. We keep getting worked by wings and the difference when he came in on Wiggins for example was night and day.
He will be a must play against wing scorer heavy teams. |
Wes saved the game. Wiggins was killing us not only with his production but also for his offensive role to free up Curry and the other shooters.
When we were getting destroyed it was really Draymond and Wiggins running the offense and burning us.
AD to 5 on Draymond
Wes on Wiggins
Caruso on Steph
Game over. |
That's the biggest issue with Dennis in a lot of playoff matchups. I doubt he has as bad an offensive performance as he did last night for the rest of the playoffs, but teams will absolutely target him on defense with size. Can he hold up?
_________________
Under New Management |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
RI Laker
Star Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2005
Posts: 7171
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 9:22 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Lets not overhype Wes because he had a good game. He has played like crap this year (although I like him and there will be a time and place for him in our run). That being said, Frank better go easy on the DNP's because there may be scenarios where most of our guys are needed. He better keep guys motivated because there will be a time when we need Marc's bulk and smarts, Trez's engine, Morris's nastiness and outside shot (when his game is on), THT's change of pace, and even McLemore's 3 ball. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Lakeshow23_
Starting Rotation
Joined: 02 May 2021
Posts: 670
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 9:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
| As long as Vogel plays Wes/Kuzma, Caruso, KCP next to Bron and AD in the 4th this team will be fine. Bron and AD next to shooters and plus defenders has proven time and time again to be the Lakers best lineup. Trez, Drummond, THT should see limited action depending on matchups. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
CRoost
Star Player
Joined: 21 Mar 2017
Posts: 4818
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 9:36 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | LakerSD wrote: | | BandwagonLBJhopper wrote: | We are gonna need Wes. We keep getting worked by wings and the difference when he came in on Wiggins for example was night and day.
He will be a must play against wing scorer heavy teams. |
Wes saved the game. Wiggins was killing us not only with his production but also for his offensive role to free up Curry and the other shooters.
When we were getting destroyed it was really Draymond and Wiggins running the offense and burning us.
AD to 5 on Draymond
Wes on Wiggins
Caruso on Steph
Game over. |
That's the biggest issue with Dennis in a lot of playoff matchups. I doubt he has as bad an offensive performance as he did last night for the rest of the playoffs, but teams will absolutely target him on defense with size. Can he hold up? |
No Schroder can not. He does not have a strong base like Wes do and he should not be handling the ball down the stretch either. Let everyone already out and Lebron to figure it out . Playoff is not the time to be hoping, this is money time. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
troy
Star Player
Joined: 30 Jan 2013
Posts: 5047
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 9:37 am Post subject: |
|
|
| BandwagonLBJhopper wrote: | We are gonna need Wes. We keep getting worked by wings and the difference when he came in on Wiggins for example was night and day.
He will be a must play against wing scorer heavy teams. |
Good point. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vcdplaya3002
Starting Rotation
Joined: 21 Mar 2008
Posts: 272
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 9:46 am Post subject: |
|
|
| troy wrote: | | BandwagonLBJhopper wrote: | We are gonna need Wes. We keep getting worked by wings and the difference when he came in on Wiggins for example was night and day.
He will be a must play against wing scorer heavy teams. |
Good point. |
There is a good theory going around that Vogel did not show his full hand for this Warriors game because he doesn't want other teams to get an advantage scouting for Game 1 preparations. Vogel got a ton of good data from this Warriors game, and I think he is saving his big time adjustments for the Phx series.
Obvious corrections that need to be made going forward:
1) Wes Matthews needs to get minutes against any scoring wing or bigger guard. This will mean less THT and Mclemore minutes.
2.) Drummond can only play if the other team has a big loaf at Center, otherwise he must be benched.
3) The backup Center minutes need to go to Marc Gasol going forward.
4) Dennis might need to be benched for Caruso, if he is going to continue playing this poorly, but lets give him a few more games before going that route. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Baron Von Humongous
Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015
Posts: 32979
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 10:34 am Post subject: |
|
|
| RI Laker wrote: | | Lets not overhype Wes because he had a good game. He has played like crap this year (although I like him and there will be a time and place for him in our run). That being said, Frank better go easy on the DNP's because there may be scenarios where most of our guys are needed. He better keep guys motivated because there will be a time when we need Marc's bulk and smarts, Trez's engine, Morris's nastiness and outside shot (when his game is on), THT's change of pace, and even McLemore's 3 ball. |
The thing is Matthews didn't really have a good game on offense. What he did do was defend at a playoff level, which seems repeatable game to game while his offense comes and goes.
The team's winning formula has been AD at 5, LeBron, and three other switchable defenders who set screens/move without the ball and hit enough of their open looks on any given night. Wes fits into that dynamic.
_________________
Under New Management |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Baron Von Humongous
Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015
Posts: 32979
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 10:57 am Post subject: |
|
|
| CRoost wrote: | | Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | LakerSD wrote: | | BandwagonLBJhopper wrote: | We are gonna need Wes. We keep getting worked by wings and the difference when he came in on Wiggins for example was night and day.
He will be a must play against wing scorer heavy teams. |
Wes saved the game. Wiggins was killing us not only with his production but also for his offensive role to free up Curry and the other shooters.
When we were getting destroyed it was really Draymond and Wiggins running the offense and burning us.
AD to 5 on Draymond
Wes on Wiggins
Caruso on Steph
Game over. |
That's the biggest issue with Dennis in a lot of playoff matchups. I doubt he has as bad an offensive performance as he did last night for the rest of the playoffs, but teams will absolutely target him on defense with size. Can he hold up? |
No Schroder can not. He does not have a strong base like Wes do and he should not be handling the ball down the stretch either. Let everyone already out and Lebron to figure it out . Playoff is not the time to be hoping, this is money time. |
I wish Dennis had a quicker trigger on his 3s. In theory there's offensive value in having him out there as a driver on a team without many guys who can get to the rim, but defenders don't have to close as hard on his slow/hesitant release so he can't leverage his downhill speed.
And like you said, since LeBron is going to handle the ball for most possessions down the stretch, Schröder needs to find ways to add value off-ball if he wants to close games where he needs to offset his lack of size on defense with his scoring. I don't see how that happens without an off-season of work to speed up his release (see Caruso who's learned to let open shots fly).
Assuming Vogel keeps him in the starting rotation, I'd sub Schröder for Caruso first so Dennis can play more when LeBron sits. I think he'd also really benefit from more minutes with Gasol, but we'll see if Vogel gives Marc any playoff burn.
_________________
Under New Management |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 11:30 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | | I'd sub Schröder for Caruso first so Dennis can play more when LeBron sits. |
I think we've all been calling for this all season long. Vogel just doesn't stagger them. Not sure why.
_________________
From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Baron Von Humongous
Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015
Posts: 32979
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 11:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Quote: | | I'd sub Schröder for Caruso first so Dennis can play more when LeBron sits. |
I think we've all been calling for this all season long. Vogel just doesn't stagger them. Not sure why. |
No time like the *playoffs* to start doing the smart thing
_________________
Under New Management |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Mamba Mentality
Star Player
Joined: 04 May 2017
Posts: 3078
Location: The Left Coast
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 12:41 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | Quote: | | I'd sub Schröder for Caruso first so Dennis can play more when LeBron sits. |
I think we've all been calling for this all season long. Vogel just doesn't stagger them. Not sure why. |
No time like the *playoffs* to start doing the smart thing |
_________________
“You can't be held captive by the fear of failure or the fear of what people may say.” - Kobe Bryant |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
roger_federer
Star Player
Joined: 01 Mar 2020
Posts: 3138
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 1:56 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| vcdplaya3002 wrote: | | troy wrote: | | BandwagonLBJhopper wrote: | We are gonna need Wes. We keep getting worked by wings and the difference when he came in on Wiggins for example was night and day.
He will be a must play against wing scorer heavy teams. |
Good point. |
There is a good theory going around that Vogel did not show his full hand for this Warriors game because he doesn't want other teams to get an advantage scouting for Game 1 preparations. Vogel got a ton of good data from this Warriors game, and I think he is saving his big time adjustments for the Phx series.
Obvious corrections that need to be made going forward:
1) Wes Matthews needs to get minutes against any scoring wing or bigger guard. This will mean less THT and Mclemore minutes.
2.) Drummond can only play if the other team has a big loaf at Center, otherwise he must be benched.
3) The backup Center minutes need to go to Marc Gasol going forward.
4) Dennis might need to be benched for Caruso, if he is going to continue playing this poorly, but lets give him a few more games before going that route. |
I don't think that theory holds any value. Vogel is very stubborn to make adjustments. Almost every time he played Drumm and Trezz over Gasol.
Sliding AD to 5 is his go to move for all the problems.
we all though last year that Vogel was saving LBJ and ADs PnR game for playoffs and he will play that to death. w all know that was not true. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
audioaxes
Franchise Player
Joined: 26 Apr 2004
Posts: 12573
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 2:45 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| AirTupac wrote: | | I really do like Bron-AD-KCP-AC. One of my fav line ups in a long long time. |
totally agree
its clear that those 4 are our best core to fall onto
_________________
(bleep) Kawhi |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
audioaxes
Franchise Player
Joined: 26 Apr 2004
Posts: 12573
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 2:54 pm Post subject: |
|
|
luckily we have a little more leeway for players to work of rust and get rotations zoned in because I dont see the Suns or Nuggets beating us in the next 2 rounds.
But for us to beat the Clippers/Nets/Bucks/76ers/Jazz, we cant be messing around with lame rotations.
The biggest one off is Drummond. For every one thing he does good he does 2 bad things and then his presence alone in the paint kills our offense. Its time to go back to Gasol.
The second one is Dennis. Caruso is a way much better fit next to Lebron and AD over him. Time to bring him off the bench and let him run wild in lineups when Lebron sits.
_________________
(bleep) Kawhi |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vcdplaya3002
Starting Rotation
Joined: 21 Mar 2008
Posts: 272
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 2:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| audioaxes wrote: | luckily we have a little more leeway for players to work of rust and get rotations zoned in because I dont see the Suns or Nuggets beating us in the next 2 rounds.
But for us to beat the Clippers/Nets/Bucks/76ers/Jazz, we cant be messing around with lame rotations.
The biggest one off is Drummond. For every one thing he does good he does 2 bad things and then his presence alone in the paint kills our offense. Its time to go back to Gasol.
The second one is Dennis. Caruso is a way much better fit next to Lebron and AD over him. Time to bring him off the bench and let him run wild in lineups when Lebron sits. |
Due to the team politics I truly believe that Frank doesn’t have authority to make Dennis and or Drummond come off the bench to start games. I think management made promises to both players that they would be starters and Frank is being overridden on this decision. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
golden armor
Starting Rotation
Joined: 24 Jun 2005
Posts: 845
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 3:00 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| audioaxes wrote: | luckily we have a little more leeway for players to work of rust and get rotations zoned in because I dont see the Suns or Nuggets beating us in the next 2 rounds.
But for us to beat the Clippers/Nets/Bucks/76ers/Jazz, we cant be messing around with lame rotations.
The biggest one off is Drummond. For every one thing he does good he does 2 bad things and then his presence alone in the paint kills our offense. Its time to go back to Gasol.
The second one is Dennis. Caruso is a way much better fit next to Lebron and AD over him. Time to bring him off the bench and let him run wild in lineups when Lebron sits. |
Spot on. I was worried about Gasol early in the season. But, he is clearly the best option at the 5 (other than AD). His passing is elite. His D is superior. He's been making his 3s lately which really helps with spacing. He doesn't require touches and doesn't clog up the lane where AD and LBJ can operate.
AC should finish every game. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
CRoost
Star Player
Joined: 21 Mar 2017
Posts: 4818
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 3:24 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| vcdplaya3002 wrote: | | audioaxes wrote: | luckily we have a little more leeway for players to work of rust and get rotations zoned in because I dont see the Suns or Nuggets beating us in the next 2 rounds.
But for us to beat the Clippers/Nets/Bucks/76ers/Jazz, we cant be messing around with lame rotations.
The biggest one off is Drummond. For every one thing he does good he does 2 bad things and then his presence alone in the paint kills our offense. Its time to go back to Gasol.
The second one is Dennis. Caruso is a way much better fit next to Lebron and AD over him. Time to bring him off the bench and let him run wild in lineups when Lebron sits. |
Due to the team politics I truly believe that Frank doesn’t have authority to make Dennis and or Drummond come off the bench to start games. I think management made promises to both players that they would be starters and Frank is being overridden on this decision. |
Maybe for the regular season but I don’t think this is the case for the playoff. We have much bigger fish to fry than trying to fullfill promises to role players when it matters. I don’t think management should interfere with coaching especially at this stage. Vogel is a championship coach and we have a championship team, no role players should be given leverage nor dictate their terms on our team especially in the playoff. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
LoPro4u2c
Starting Rotation
Joined: 09 Jul 2014
Posts: 303
|
| Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 6:27 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Drummond should get Javale McGee minutes and Gasol should get Dwight Howard minutes. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
