Marvelous Marvin Nathaniel Hagler (May 23, 1954 – March 13, 2021)
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Black20Ice
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 13, 2021 5:04 pm    Post subject: Marvelous Marvin Nathaniel Hagler (May 23, 1954 – March 13, 2021)

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Marvin Hagler, the middleweight boxing great whose title reign and career ended with a split-decision loss to "Sugar" Ray Leonard in 1987, died Saturday. He was 66.

Wife Kay G. Hagler confirmed the death on Facebook on the verified Marvelous Marvin Hagler Fan Club page.

"I am sorry to make a very sad announcement," she wrote. "Today unfortunately my beloved husband Marvelous Marvin passed away unexpectedly at his home here in New Hampshire. Our family requests that you respect our privacy during this difficult time."

Hagler was 62-3-2 with 52 knockouts from 1973 to 1987. He was the undisputed middleweight champion from 1980 to his loss to Leonard at Caesars Palace in Las Vegas on April 6, 1987.

The fierce left-hander had two of his biggest victories at Caesars Palace, unanimously outpointing Roberto Duran in 1983 and knocking out Thomas Hearns in the third round in 1985.

Hagler was born in Newark, New Jersey, and moved with his family to Brockton, Massachusetts, in the late 1960s. He was inducted into the International Boxing Hall of Fame and World Boxing Hall of Fame in 1983.


https://www.espn.com/boxing/story/_/id/31059483/marvin-hagler-middleweight-boxing-great-dies-66
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 13, 2021 5:10 pm    Post subject:

I totally remembering watching those fights.

RIP
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 13, 2021 5:11 pm    Post subject:

Just heard it waiting for the Chocolatito fight on DZAN. The announcer said he talked to Sugar Ray Leonard. He asked him what he remembered about the classic matches he had with Marvelous Marvin. Sugar said it was the closest he's come to death. RIP Marvelous.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 13, 2021 5:22 pm    Post subject:

Just watching that man fight, you would have thought he was indestructible. RIP to the Marvelous one!
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 13, 2021 6:00 pm    Post subject:

jodeke wrote:
Just heard it waiting for the Chocolatito fight on DZAN. The announcer said he talked to Sugar Ray Leonard. He asked him what he remembered about the classic matches he had with Marvelous Marvin. Sugar said it was the closest he's come to death. RIP Marvelous.


Nothing will ever come close to the era that had Duran, Sugar Ray, Hagler and the Hitman.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 13, 2021 6:50 pm    Post subject:

jonnybravo wrote:
jodeke wrote:
Just heard it waiting for the Chocolatito fight on DZAN. The announcer said he talked to Sugar Ray Leonard. He asked him what he remembered about the classic matches he had with Marvelous Marvin. Sugar said it was the closest he's come to death. RIP Marvelous.


Nothing will ever come close to the era that had Duran, Sugar Ray, Hagler and the Hitman.


It certainly was a great era.

RIP Marvelous Marvin
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 13, 2021 7:08 pm    Post subject:

One of the greatest of all time. Undisputed middleweight champ for 7 years. That Hagler-Hearns fight is the stuff of legend. Three toe-to-toe rounds, and Round 1 was like something out of a Rocky movie.

The fight against Sugar Ray Leonard in 1987 is one of the first ones I fully remember as a kid. Having seen it many times over the years, I believe the decision for Leonard was correct, but the fight was notable in that neither guy hurt the other. No one ever landed a big-time shot. Hagler didn't throw as many punches and he didn't land as many punches in that fight, but nonetheless it's not like Leonard ever hurt him. He did have an aura of invincibility, and even in that fight, which proved to be his last, he wasn't even close to hurt or rattled.

Gone too soon.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 13, 2021 8:35 pm    Post subject:

jonnybravo wrote:


Nothing will ever come close to the era that had Duran, Sugar Ray, Hagler and the Hitman.


Loved watching those guys!

Yeah Hagler was a beast, you couldn't stop him and Sugar Ray never hurt him, he just out-pointed him and did rope-a-dope tactics, if he had tried to stand toe-to-toe with Marvin, he would have gotten knocked out...!
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 13, 2021 8:37 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
One of the greatest of all time. Undisputed middleweight champ for 7 years. That Hagler-Hearns fight is the stuff of legend. Three toe-to-toe rounds, and Round 1 was like something out of a Rocky movie.

The fight against Sugar Ray Leonard in 1987 is one of the first ones I fully remember as a kid. Having seen it many times over the years, I believe the decision for Leonard was correct, but the fight was notable in that neither guy hurt the other. No one ever landed a big-time shot. Hagler didn't throw as many punches and he didn't land as many punches in that fight, but nonetheless it's not like Leonard ever hurt him. He did have an aura of invincibility, and even in that fight, which proved to be his last, he wasn't even close to hurt or rattled.

Gone too soon.


I read this AFTER I made my post, seems like we agree with the Hagler vs Sugar Ray fight...
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 13, 2021 8:45 pm    Post subject:

unleasHell wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:


Nothing will ever come close to the era that had Duran, Sugar Ray, Hagler and the Hitman.


Loved watching those guys!

Yeah Hagler was a beast, you couldn't stop him and Sugar Ray never hurt him, he just out-pointed him and did rope-a-dope tactics, if he had tried to stand toe-to-toe with Marvin, he would have gotten knocked out...!


Yep. He's not the dude you want to get in the phone booth with.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 14, 2021 7:59 am    Post subject:

Hagler was an amazing fighter who earned everything he got, he was not a "golden boy" boxer type and had to literally fight his way to the title.

He won his first title over Alan Minter of England in 1980. The fight was held in London before an obviously extremely pro-Minter crowd.

After Hagler methodically beats him down, the crowd is so frustrated they rain debris down all over the ring and he is escorted out by security ducking flying beers and such.

That to me is the essence of Marvelous Marvin Hagler, he earned every single dollar he made in the ring, here is that fight if you are interested as it is worth a few minutes with the legendary Howard Cosell on the call:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fpk-hJGhTAA

RIP Marvelous.....
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 14, 2021 8:24 pm    Post subject:

Hard for me to handicap Hagler vs Leonard. Hagler was just a beast, a force of nature, but Leonard was that and the speed and skills that Hagler didn’t have. I’m respectful of the argument, but the fact is Leonard went toe to toe with Duran in his prime, and Duran probably hit as hard if not harder than Hagler (that might seem an odd claim to some but Duran was known as hands of stone for a reason). But Hagler was a man for sure, and would have owned any other era.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 14, 2021 8:57 pm    Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:
I totally remembering watching those fights.

RIP


1985 vs Hearns, Round 1, man. Dayum.

Got a bunch of BSPN SportsCentury eps on DVDs, Marvelous MH is one of them. He demanded that you called him Marvelous Marvin, btw. If you called him Marvin, he'd make you say it. Bro had a bullet shaped head, Burt Sugar said. True, he didn't have much in the way of a neck, either. He wasn't goin down from anything from Leonard, Hearns, or Duran any time soon. I thought he got screwed a time or two by the scorekeepers, but he was overwrought w/ notions of sabotage and paranoid to the point that he couldn't take pride in his accomplishments, which was sad. Never thought the people appreciated him.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 14, 2021 8:57 pm    Post subject:

jonnybravo wrote:
jodeke wrote:
Just heard it waiting for the Chocolatito fight on DZAN. The announcer said he talked to Sugar Ray Leonard. He asked him what he remembered about the classic matches he had with Marvelous Marvin. Sugar said it was the closest he's come to death. RIP Marvelous.


Nothing will ever come close to the era that had Duran, Sugar Ray, Hagler and the Hitman.


We will see no mas of those kind of fighters again.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2021 8:57 am    Post subject:

unleasHell wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
One of the greatest of all time. Undisputed middleweight champ for 7 years. That Hagler-Hearns fight is the stuff of legend. Three toe-to-toe rounds, and Round 1 was like something out of a Rocky movie.

The fight against Sugar Ray Leonard in 1987 is one of the first ones I fully remember as a kid. Having seen it many times over the years, I believe the decision for Leonard was correct, but the fight was notable in that neither guy hurt the other. No one ever landed a big-time shot. Hagler didn't throw as many punches and he didn't land as many punches in that fight, but nonetheless it's not like Leonard ever hurt him. He did have an aura of invincibility, and even in that fight, which proved to be his last, he wasn't even close to hurt or rattled.

Gone too soon.


I read this AFTER I made my post, seems like we agree with the Hagler vs Sugar Ray fight...


Hagler vs. Leonard 1987
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2021 9:03 am    Post subject:

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jonnybravo wrote:
jodeke wrote:
Just heard it waiting for the Chocolatito fight on DZAN. The announcer said he talked to Sugar Ray Leonard. He asked him what he remembered about the classic matches he had with Marvelous Marvin. Sugar said it was the closest he's come to death. RIP Marvelous.


Nothing will ever come close to the era that had Duran, Sugar Ray, Hagler and the Hitman.


We will see no mas of those kind of fighters again.


The game has changed from the Joe Louis, Sugar Ray Robinson, Ezer Charles, Rocky Marciano, Willie Pep, days when the best fought the best. It's a promoter's game now, all about the Benjamin's.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2021 10:11 am    Post subject:

I would love to take prime mayweather back to that era and let all of those guy beat him like a rented goalie.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2021 10:55 am    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
I would love to take prime mayweather back to that era and let all of those guy beat him like a rented goalie.


The Mayweather that put the beatdown on Chico Corrales would give any fighter in history a run for his money. Floyd vs Duran at Lightweight/Junior Welterweight would be a show and my guess is Floyd would come out on top just like Leonard did once he stopped being stupid in the second fight and actually boxed instead of going toe to toe.

As for Marvin Hagler, I considered him the greatest out of the 4 Kings and objectively scored the Leonard-Hagler fight at 115-113 Hagler but in fights that close it really can go either way. I think you measure peak vs peak amongst the 4 Kings, none of the other 3 are beating Marvin Hagler at his best. Something happened during the Hearns fight where Hagler looked like he slipped vs Mugabi but the Hagler that came into the Hearns fight, there is no version of Leonard beating that Hagler

Marvin Hagler is along with Sonny Liston I think the two most intimidating and underrated fighters in history. You talk to people who closely worked with Mike Tyson, George Foreman and Sonny Liston and to them it was clear Liston was the best of the three. Similarly to me, it was obvious Hagler was the best of the 4 kings even though he didnt get that respect
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2021 8:31 am    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
I would love to take prime mayweather back to that era and let all of those guy beat him like a rented goalie.


I disagree. I think the dislike, if you do dislike him, of Floyd may be causing you to overlook his skills. He's an excellent boxer. He didn't start his career as a boxer. He went toe to toe early on.

He then decided to win was what it was all about and started to do what's known in the game as hit and not be hit. That style made his fights boring to some. IMO he would have been the Ali of that era minus the knockouts.

I would have loved to have seen him in the square jungle with Sugar Ray Leonard.
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2021 10:43 am    Post subject:

jodeke wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
I would love to take prime mayweather back to that era and let all of those guy beat him like a rented goalie.


I disagree. I think the dislike, if you do dislike him, of Floyd may be causing you to overlook his skills. He's an excellent boxer. He didn't start his career as a boxer. He went toe to toe early on.

He then decided to win was what it was all about and started to do what's known in the game as hit and not be hit. That style made his fights boring to some. IMO he would have been the Ali of that era minus the knockouts.

I would have loved to have seen him in the square jungle with Sugar Ray Leonard.


I would have loved to see him try Thomas Hearns. Hearns is everything wrong for Floyd and Floyd doesnt the one weapon at the Welterweight division that can counteract Hearns' weakness which is Hearns' chin. Floyd wouldnt dare trade bombs with Hearns and try outboxing Hearns and you run into the same problem people had with Liston which is that Hearns and Liston were the extremely rare sluggers who were arguably even more comfortable boxing than slugging as both had the ridiculous wingspans to keep people at a distance and both had tremendous jabs (Liston is pretty much said by all the experts to have had the best/strongest jab in boxing history and Hearns set up his opponents with the jab to crush them with his dynamite right cross). Sugar Ray tried outboxing Thomas Hearns: didnt work out too well for him and he was clearly getting schooled in the first fight until his late KO win and the 2nd fight was all Hearns. Thomas Hearns would have been Floyd Mayweather Jr's worst matchup and nightmare at welterweight and above.
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2021 11:34 am    Post subject:

1995Lakers wrote:
jodeke wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
I would love to take prime mayweather back to that era and let all of those guy beat him like a rented goalie.


I disagree. I think the dislike, if you do dislike him, of Floyd may be causing you to overlook his skills. He's an excellent boxer. He didn't start his career as a boxer. He went toe to toe early on.

He then decided to win was what it was all about and started to do what's known in the game as hit and not be hit. That style made his fights boring to some. IMO he would have been the Ali of that era minus the knockouts.

I would have loved to have seen him in the square jungle with Sugar Ray Leonard.


I would have loved to see him try Thomas Hearns. Hearns is everything wrong for Floyd and Floyd doesnt the one weapon at the Welterweight division that can counteract Hearns' weakness which is Hearns' chin. Floyd wouldnt dare trade bombs with Hearns and try outboxing Hearns and you run into the same problem people had with Liston which is that Hearns and Liston were the extremely rare sluggers who were arguably even more comfortable boxing than slugging as both had the ridiculous wingspans to keep people at a distance and both had tremendous jabs (Liston is pretty much said by all the experts to have had the best/strongest jab in boxing history and Hearns set up his opponents with the jab to crush them with his dynamite right cross). Sugar Ray tried outboxing Thomas Hearns: didnt work out too well for him and he was clearly getting schooled in the first fight until his late KO win and the 2nd fight was all Hearns. Thomas Hearns would have been Floyd Mayweather Jr's worst matchup and nightmare at welterweight and above.

I agree. That would have been another classic. Boxer punchers are a rare breed. If Hearns didn't have such a weak chin I think he'd win. However, with his chin being so suspect, IDK?
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 18, 2021 10:54 am    Post subject:

jonnybravo wrote:
jodeke wrote:
Just heard it waiting for the Chocolatito fight on DZAN. The announcer said he talked to Sugar Ray Leonard. He asked him what he remembered about the classic matches he had with Marvelous Marvin. Sugar said it was the closest he's come to death. RIP Marvelous.


Nothing will ever come close to the era that had Duran, Sugar Ray, Hagler and the Hitman.


Don't forget about some of the others. Alexis Arguello, Aaron Pryor, Julio Cesar Chavez. That was the pinnacle of middleweight boxing.

Gotta say, Hagler was probably my favorite.
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 18, 2021 11:06 am    Post subject:

jodeke wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
I would love to take prime mayweather back to that era and let all of those guy beat him like a rented goalie.


I disagree. I think the dislike, if you do dislike him, of Floyd may be causing you to overlook his skills. He's an excellent boxer. He didn't start his career as a boxer. He went toe to toe early on.

He then decided to win was what it was all about and started to do what's known in the game as hit and not be hit. That style made his fights boring to some. IMO he would have been the Ali of that era minus the knockouts.

I would have loved to have seen him in the square jungle with Sugar Ray Leonard.


Go back and watch his match with Oscar De La Hoya. Oscar was an excellent boxer and outclassed him in that match but Vegas-being-Vegas, he didn't win. It was a travesty on the same level that Oscar losing to Trinidad was a travesty. I truly believe Oscar could have been successful in that 80s era but Mayweather would have been shown up. Those guys were boxers and punchers. Not so much with Mayweather. He's a points guy with no knock out punch.

EDIT: went back and watched this fight again. Mayweather didn't throw a single powerful punch. He'd get his butt kicked in the 80s. He's a patty-cake puncher. Tap-tap-tap. I honestly can't imagine how he'd exist in any other era.
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Last edited by Heartburn on Thu Mar 18, 2021 11:42 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 18, 2021 11:16 am    Post subject:

I’m a huge fan of defensive savants (Wilfred Benitez is my favorite boxer and I loved sweet pea Whitaker), but I’m less a fan of guys who take that approach to how and when they fight anyone as well. Mayweather assiduously avoided fighting anyone who wasn’t on the way up or down, and prime vs prime he had nothing for the four kings (I think Leonard was the best of them based on totality of skills and attributes, and Hearns probably number four, but I have no heartburn with different rankings), and raised the spectacle of touch boxing to an art form.
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 18, 2021 11:28 am    Post subject:

The other thing is watching a fight without listening to commentators is WAAAY different than what you eyes are telling you. In almost every fight.

In any event, Boxing is a dead sport. It's completely corrupt and outside of an outright knockout, the results are totally incongruent with what you actually see.
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Last edited by Heartburn on Thu Mar 18, 2021 11:46 am; edited 1 time in total
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