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Omar Little
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 03, 2021 7:37 pm    Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
kikanga wrote:
"Bloke" to Aussies, New Zealand-ers, and the like.

It reminds me of the way African Americans use n**ga.


Bloke is more “dude”. Now the brits with the C word...


Not really the same. It can be used as endearingly, or mockingly, but it's never really used casually as just a throw out word.


Unless you’re in a guy Ritchie movie.


A brilliant documentarian know for his restraint in depicting typical British life.


lol, that was the point. I have known some guys from Sheffield/Manchester/Liverpool area that do talk like that though.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 03, 2021 8:21 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
kikanga wrote:
"Bloke" to Aussies, New Zealand-ers, and the like.

It reminds me of the way African Americans use n**ga.


Bloke is more “dude”. Now the brits with the C word...


Not really the same. It can be used as endearingly, or mockingly, but it's never really used casually as just a throw out word.


Unless you’re in a guy Ritchie movie.


A brilliant documentarian know for his restraint in depicting typical British life.


lol, that was the point. I have known some guys from Sheffield/Manchester/Liverpool area that do talk like that though.


Yes, that was the point of my sarcasm.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2021 1:43 am    Post subject:

kikanga wrote:
LakersRGolden wrote:
kikanga wrote:

I don't disagree with anything you just said.

But I still do feel like the NBA went too far. The ratio of offense to defense. Acting vs. playing through contact. It's out of whack.

I think our defense, physicality, and athleticism helped us stand apart from international players and teams in the Olympics. Now I think that identity is getting lost because the league chose to purposely devalue those things to too far of a degree.


I have to agree. They "protect" the shooter way to much. My pet peeves.

1) No verticality on the perimeter. Instead it's automatic freethrows.
2) Initiating contact is never called an offensive foul. It's only a charge if the defender can provide last months utility bill proving he has been there the whole time.
3) The three step "gather" before making a move.
4) Shooters entitled to 3 feet of clear space in all directions from where they jump.


Ja averaged 30 in his first Playoff run, Trae averaged 29/10, Tatum just averaged 30 against a Superteam

40 Point Games are the new 30 Point Games at this point. Unless there are rule changes to restore the balance in the League & allow teams to play defense again then expect this to continue.

There's no defense in the League anymore, even in a Playoff setting. Nets, Jazz & Sixers all shattered PPG records in their respective series. We have 10+ players averaging 29 PPG+ in the Postseason which used to be unthinkable only a couple of years ago.

A lot of that is not because of the rules, but because of a faster pace and improved 3-point shooting.

The current "no touch" rule changes were implemented I think in 2005. But it took another decade for scoring to start to increase. It's only been the last couple years that we've seen mega-scoring like this.

Besides, I'm sure the Showtime Lakers averaged more PPG in a playoff series than the Nets, Jazz or Sixers just did.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2021 7:32 am    Post subject:

slavavov wrote:
kikanga wrote:
LakersRGolden wrote:
kikanga wrote:

I don't disagree with anything you just said.

But I still do feel like the NBA went too far. The ratio of offense to defense. Acting vs. playing through contact. It's out of whack.

I think our defense, physicality, and athleticism helped us stand apart from international players and teams in the Olympics. Now I think that identity is getting lost because the league chose to purposely devalue those things to too far of a degree.


I have to agree. They "protect" the shooter way to much. My pet peeves.

1) No verticality on the perimeter. Instead it's automatic freethrows.
2) Initiating contact is never called an offensive foul. It's only a charge if the defender can provide last months utility bill proving he has been there the whole time.
3) The three step "gather" before making a move.
4) Shooters entitled to 3 feet of clear space in all directions from where they jump.


Ja averaged 30 in his first Playoff run, Trae averaged 29/10, Tatum just averaged 30 against a Superteam

40 Point Games are the new 30 Point Games at this point. Unless there are rule changes to restore the balance in the League & allow teams to play defense again then expect this to continue.

There's no defense in the League anymore, even in a Playoff setting. Nets, Jazz & Sixers all shattered PPG records in their respective series. We have 10+ players averaging 29 PPG+ in the Postseason which used to be unthinkable only a couple of years ago.

A lot of that is not because of the rules, but because of a faster pace and improved 3-point shooting.

The current "no touch" rule changes were implemented I think in 2005. But it took another decade for scoring to start to increase. It's only been the last couple years that we've seen mega-scoring like this.

Besides, I'm sure the Showtime Lakers averaged more PPG in a playoff series than the Nets, Jazz or Sixers just did.


The bolded is a bad point to build an argument on. Since the league started, it's always taken time for coaches, players, and most importantly refs to adapt to rule changes. People like Durant and Lillard are still swiping through expecting shooting fouls they used to get calls on.

3pt shooting and pace play a part. Particularly 3pt shooting. When the Big O was averaging a triple double the pace was actually faster than nowadays.

But there is no denying the clip I showed of Luka launching himself at the defender on a jump shot and getting 3 FTs. That's the norm.

Acting > finishing through contact. It's very European football-y. You won't see a playoff game nowadays without an offensive player being rewarded for acting.

Not saying go back to how things were a decade ago. Just saying, the league has over-adjusted and gone too far. I know defense isn't as exciting as offense. But it is still 1/2 or 1/3 of the game (depending how you look at it).
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2021 8:29 am    Post subject:

Every fan has a tendency to find their era superior. I am forever a Showtime guy, and the new style is closer to that than the nadir of the NBA during my fandom, those Knicks/Rockets finals where 90 points was an explosion of scoring. I watched the MJ title runs and his team’s scoring go from 110 per during the first one to under a hundred per on the last. And the game was pretty boring to watch.

The casual fan will always appreciate pretty, higher scoring play, which is why every sport seeks it. The hat and the skills and ability to analyze the game are way better now, which gives offensive players the advantage. Things will come around, but try to enjoy what some of these guys are doing. Nothing in the rule book makes guys like a Steph and Dame able to put on 40-50 foot shooting clinics. Marvel at the skill and the talent. Yes, the league can really stand to improve its officiating, but I suspect that will come. Enjoy the show.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2021 2:16 pm    Post subject:

Back in the day basketball was dominated by Caucasian players. What Bill Russell had to contend with puts me in awe of him. If the mix was what it is today no way in hell Boston wins 8 ships in a row.

I don't know how many fans are aware that the Celtics were the first NBA team to start 5 Blacks.

KC Jones, Willie Naulls, Tom "Satch" Sanders, Bill Russell, and Sam Jones. Red Auerbach made history.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2021 3:02 pm    Post subject:

The league started implementing rule changes to increase scoring in 1994, not 2005. They did it in direct response to what Omar posted about the 94 Finals (7 gms w/ no 100 pt scores). The 95 Cavs under Fratello were blatantly milking the 24 sec clock to as low as they could possibly get it before shooting and gave up 88.5 ppg, a record low since the shot clock era began. They no doubt thought more bad teams were gonna employ the Fratello Cavs thing just to stay afloat when it was really just a fluke. Most teams w/ a lineup as mediocre as the Cavs' preferred to tank for high picks. They faced the Knicks in Rd 1 in 95, too, which didn't help things. Not that the Lakers didn't lose to those Cavs all the time -- in 95, they beat us by 38 on the road and Tony Smith banked in a miracle trey just to beat them by 1 at The Forum. They beat us both times in 96 as well, even w/ Earvin, I still have that road L.

But it was boring, low-scoring play of a handful of teams (this before Mike came back) which panicked Stern and rules committee into stupid reactionary stuff like making the arc a uniform 22 feet down from 23'9 and 22 at sides. Also, they eliminated the D Harp straight arm handcheck that offseason. Those were the first two rule changes and they started officially in Preseason 94/5. They've been adding to them ever since. They made fouls during 3 pt shots worth 3 FTAs that offseason as well, anything that would boost scoring no matter how little, it was added to the pile (tho by itself, the 3 for 3 rule made more sense than 2 for 3, especially if you were down 3 and needed to shoot one to tie a game only for the other team to foul you for only 2FTAs).

The watershed moment and/or breaking point was the notion that the NBA would never self-correct after the 94 Knicks made it to The Finals. In reality, they never won a title, Czar Fratello retired, and things were correcting slowly but Shirley back to a reasonable norm. It still had some sticking points even in the late 90s -- it took them awhile to banish stuff like Barkley's and Mark Jackson's 10 sec backdowns, but by 2000, the game was looking better and by 2005, it had rebounded more or less. At least to the point where they didn't need to keep changing rules to artificially inflate scores to the point that scoring became mastur-batory and boring in itself w/o any defense to go with it. As for late 90s to early 2Ks, we were seeing scores like 55, 57, 60 in games across the league, which were each little black eyes for the league, but still vastly blown out of proportion. The Jazz scored 57 in a Finals game one of those years. The 99 post MJ/Scott P Bulls scored 49 against MIA in a game. Not a good look, but isolated cases instead of the wave of the future.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2021 6:23 pm    Post subject:

^ npz, you say the league rebounded more or less by 2005, but scoring was still as low as it was in the 90s, and that continued until maybe 5-6 years ago when scoring and pace really started to improve.

The rule changes helped, but what really changed was coaching philosophies and better 3-point shooting. Back in the day, coaches didn't let their teams push the pace. They wanted them to walk the ball upcourt, be deliberate and play one or two-man iso basketball. Anytime the pace started to get a little fast, a coach would call a quick time out just to tell his team to slow things down again.

Nowadays, coaches constantly tell their players to "play with pace." When you do that, and when most stars are good or great 3-point shooters, you get scores in the 120s and 130s. That's the way basketball is supposed to be at the pro level.

I do agree that some things with officiating have gone too far. But they shouldn't repeal the rule changes from back in the day that helped open up the game and encourage free flowing, fast break basketball.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2021 6:39 pm    Post subject:

Analytics changed the game.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2021 8:08 pm    Post subject:

slavavov wrote:
^ npz, you say the league rebounded more or less by 2005, but scoring was still as low as it was in the 90s, and that continued until maybe 5-6 years ago when scoring and pace really started to improve.

The rule changes helped, but what really changed was coaching philosophies and better 3-point shooting. Back in the day, coaches didn't let their teams push the pace. They wanted them to walk the ball upcourt, be deliberate and play one or two-man iso basketball. Anytime the pace started to get a little fast, a coach would call a quick time out just to tell his team to slow things down again.

Nowadays, coaches constantly tell their players to "play with pace." When you do that, and when most stars are good or great 3-point shooters, you get scores in the 120s and 130s. That's the way basketball is supposed to be at the pro level.

I do agree that some things with officiating have gone too far. But they shouldn't repeal the rule changes from back in the day that helped open up the game and encourage free flowing, fast break basketball.


I didn't even go as far as you're claiming. I just discussed when rule changes to artificially inflate scoring began. I meant that the NBA rebounded in a general sense as compared ton 1994, I presented no stats. I'd rather clean a toilet than to do a statistical back n forth with anyone, it's not simply because I'm lazy (tho I am). I addressed a few teams in the 90s that scared the league into thinking that scoring was dead and they all pretty much vanished. Things in general normalized by 2005. Afaic. Maybe you see it differently. Que sera.

I disagree on the last point tho. The game is even more gross w/o defense than it is when it's predominantly 3 n D. Again, that's up to taste. I'd rather watch the 94 Finals than the more current GS titles. Today's league is more or less wuss.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2021 8:24 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:


_____ changed the game.


I don't think today's players are anywhere near as likeable and/or charismatic as the biggest stars were in the 80s and even the 90s slackers, too. I don't think that helps nuNBA, least if you can remember what came before it. I'm not just getting grumpier like Mule as I get older, but I don't like anyone in today's game, pretty much. Not the superstars at least. Even the Lakers' own, tho it's still too soon after that debacle we just witnessed. Or maybe it's that I didn't like the old players either, but I REALLY dislike the current ones and am holding on out of force of habit. I used to still be interested enough to see Mike play Chuck or any combo of the old guard. Bird... I didn't dislike Bird. Isiah I hated, but respected as a competitor purely as a hoops player. But now I don't even wanna watch people like KD and Kyrie and Curry and Booker. They just dislikeable. It's not their politics or anything like that. I lean more towards their side on social issues, but it doesn't help. KD getting word from his friend that Worthy "dissed" him and w/o even verifying it, he went online to snivel about it and talk about unsubstantiated nonsense as if it were true. I remember Worthy shaking his head and saying, "I don't understand that". I think what he meant is how I feel. Maybe I am getting older. If you think I sound like Mule, PM me. Don't say it in public.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2021 8:46 pm    Post subject:

You sound like mule.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2021 9:40 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
You sound like mule.


No, Mule in 10 years.






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PostPosted: Fri Jun 04, 2021 11:50 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
You sound like mule.



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PostPosted: Sat Jun 05, 2021 2:42 pm    Post subject:

La Croix is actually not bad. I bought a 12pack of the lemon lime flavor because it was on clearance for $2. I've heard people roasting the the brand and always wondered what the deal is. For something that's 0 calories and has no sugar, the carbonated kick and the faint sweetness relieves any of my cravings for the 300 calorie sugar bomb in a can of coke the same size...and it's just as hydrating as water.
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 05, 2021 3:04 pm    Post subject:

non-player zealot wrote:
If you think I sound like Mule, PM me. Don't say it in public.


You should be so lucky.
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 05, 2021 3:53 pm    Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:
non-player zealot wrote:
If you think I sound like Mule, PM me. Don't say it in public.


You should be so lucky.


Kylie Minogue - "I Should Be So Lucky" [Official Video]


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 05, 2021 6:38 pm    Post subject:

FernieBee wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
non-player zealot wrote:
If you think I sound like Mule, PM me. Don't say it in public.


You should be so lucky.


Kylie Minogue - "I Should Be So Lucky" [Official Video]


KB, have you listened to the lyrics of that song? What are you saying?
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 05, 2021 6:50 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
Analytics changed the game.


It's doing the same thing in baseball. Similar to the NBA's 3 ball+FT+shots near the cup, baseball is almost exclusively three true outcomes...strikeout, homerun, walk. Purists from both sports hate it. I'm torn. I do think the foul baiting has gone over the top but if the rules changes over the years led to something like the Warriors, it's almost worth it. They were obscenely entertaining.
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 05, 2021 7:08 pm    Post subject:

jonnybravo wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Analytics changed the game.


It's doing the same thing in baseball. Similar to the NBA's 3 ball+FT+shots near the cup, baseball is almost exclusively three true outcomes...strikeout, homerun, walk. Purists from both sports hate it. I'm torn. I do think the foul baiting has gone over the top but if the rules changes over the years led to something like the Warriors, it's almost worth it. They were obscenely entertaining.


Can you elaborate on the bolded? Pretty please!
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 05, 2021 8:09 pm    Post subject:

kikanga wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Analytics changed the game.


It's doing the same thing in baseball. Similar to the NBA's 3 ball+FT+shots near the cup, baseball is almost exclusively three true outcomes...strikeout, homerun, walk. Purists from both sports hate it. I'm torn. I do think the foul baiting has gone over the top but if the rules changes over the years led to something like the Warriors, it's almost worth it. They were obscenely entertaining.


Can you elaborate on the bolded? Pretty please!


Okay, since this is the controversial opinion thread, I think foul baiters should be slapped with a cattle prod after each infraction.
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 05, 2021 9:20 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
Analytics changed the game.


It revives marriages, too.
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 05, 2021 10:58 pm    Post subject:

non-player zealot wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Analytics changed the game.


It revives marriages, too.

It's also a scourge on humanity
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2021 9:22 am    Post subject:

jonnybravo wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Analytics changed the game.


It's doing the same thing in baseball. Similar to the NBA's 3 ball+FT+shots near the cup, baseball is almost exclusively three true outcomes...strikeout, homerun, walk. Purists from both sports hate it. I'm torn. I do think the foul baiting has gone over the top but if the rules changes over the years led to something like the Warriors, it's almost worth it. They were obscenely entertaining.


The purists opposed the forward pass in football, and thought Walsh was an abomination. Purist is mostly code for “I don’t like change”.
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2021 10:04 am    Post subject:

Nerds are cool.


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