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Halflife
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 Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2021 7:25 pm Post subject: |
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| J.C. Smith wrote: | | Kuzma was held out of that trade because he made less money and had less value. It was a win to keep him too, but I don't see many cases where a GM would think that he was more valuable than Ingram. I don't think it was the Lakers choice. I think they probably fought to keep some assets and Kuzma was the compromise. But I don't think there is any way that deal gets made without having BI and Lonzo in included. |
if pels wanted kuz they would have kuz. they didnt. |
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Lakerz113
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| Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2021 7:43 pm Post subject: |
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| I just hope someone wants him. |
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Halflife
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| Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2021 7:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Lakerz113 wrote: | | I just hope someone wants him. |
someone will. IMO hes painfully underrated here |
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Lakerz113
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| Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2021 7:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Halflife wrote: | | Lakerz113 wrote: | | I just hope someone wants him. |
someone will. IMO hes painfully underrated here |
I’ve watched him for years and he does show glimpses of another level. Consistency has been his issue. His handles/passing/shooting/finishing/free throw shooting all are a rollercoaster. |
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Halflife
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| Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2021 7:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Lakerz113 wrote: | | Halflife wrote: | | Lakerz113 wrote: | | I just hope someone wants him. |
someone will. IMO hes painfully underrated here |
I’ve watched him for years and he does show glimpses of another level. Consistency has been his issue. His handles/passing/shooting/finishing/free throw shooting all are a rollercoaster. |
hes pretty big with decent movement. has improved defensively and like you said has moments.
he would do well on nets, 76ers, blazers, celtics, heat. |
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Lakerz113
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| Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2021 7:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Halflife wrote: | | Lakerz113 wrote: | | Halflife wrote: | | Lakerz113 wrote: | | I just hope someone wants him. |
someone will. IMO hes painfully underrated here |
I’ve watched him for years and he does show glimpses of another level. Consistency has been his issue. His handles/passing/shooting/finishing/free throw shooting all are a rollercoaster. |
hes pretty big with decent movement. has improved defensively and like you said has moments.
he would do well on nets, 76ers, blazers, celtics, heat. |
I agree he belongs in the league, but isn’t a great fit for this team. Has the ability to to a little of everything, but master of none. |
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ahaider
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| Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 10:58 am Post subject: |
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There is some Kuzma slander on this board that I don't think deserves merit. The guy improved as a defender and a rebounder tremendously this past year. He had several double double games where he was getting boards.
You look at his first two years - he didn't play with any fear within the offense. He'd attack off the dribble and go and get in rhythm. The truth of the situation is we haven't had any offensive coaching worthwhile in a long time. It's frustrating that we didn't go after some one like Kenny Atkinson to address it.
Vogel doesn't know how to put guys in position to succeed offensively. He has not for throughout the tenure of this contract. Kuzma has his flaws but there are plenty of guys who are jack of all trades putting up some decent numbers. If we trade him - we're going to have sour grapes - not because it was wrong to trade him but rather because he'll blossom somewhere else where he has an offensive coach who understands how to put him in a position to succeed.
Kuz has never been a 3&D guy and we've shoehorned him into this position because that's the type of player you need around AD + LBJ in closing lineups. That's on Pelinka & Vogel because the guy can put up numbers if he's in a position to do so. He's hammered on this thread because he has plenty of plays where he has low BB IQ. I still think he'll fall under the same category of all our young players and we'll have trader's remorse once he's gone and blossoming on another team.
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Halflife
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| Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 11:01 am Post subject: |
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| ahaider wrote: | There is some Kuzma slander on this board that I don't think deserves merit. The guy improved as a defender and a rebounder tremendously this past year. He had several double double games where he was getting boards.
You look at his first two years - he didn't play with any fear within the offense. He'd attack off the dribble and go and get in rhythm. The truth of the situation is we haven't had any offensive coaching worthwhile in a long time. It's frustrating that we didn't go after some one like Kenny Atkinson to address it.
Vogel doesn't know how to put guys in position to succeed offensively. He has not for throughout the tenure of this contract. Kuzma has his flaws but there are plenty of guys who are jack of all trades putting up some decent numbers. If we trade him - we're going to have sour grapes - not because it was wrong to trade him but rather because he'll blossom somewhere else where he has an offensive coach who understands how to put him in a position to succeed.
Kuz has never been a 3&D guy and we've shoehorned him into this position because that's the type of player you need around AD + LBJ in closing lineups. That's on Pelinka & Vogel because the guy can put up numbers if he's in a position to do so. He's hammered on this thread because he has plenty of plays where he has low BB IQ. I still think he'll fall under the same category of all our young players and we'll have trader's remorse once he's gone and blossoming on another team. |
you know how it goes.
Kuzma is trash, lets trade him for an all star. |
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AD23
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| Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 1:48 pm Post subject: |
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Kuzma is an all star and 25 ppg scorer!
That's what he thinks he is  |
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DLaker
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| Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 2:47 pm Post subject: |
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| AD23 wrote: | Kuzma is an all star and 25 ppg scorer!
That's what he thinks he is |
What wrong with believing you can reach that level, Kyle Kuzma Believes He ‘Definitely Can’ Be An All-Star And Is Looking Forward To ‘A More Consistent Space Next Year’, better than other players we have who demand starting position, but has not earned it (DS and Drumond).
Kuz just like to get picked on by Lakers fan. But facts are he didnt shoot horribly on the 3pt line .361 is close to league average. He was the 113 rank 3pt% shooter, notable players below him are Herro, Kemba, Luka and Beal. He is rank 50th in the league in reb/game. He is playing better D, he is not overpaid, He plays hard every game, he play team ball, but for some reason is the reason we lost this year. Crazy how hatred for a player stems form bias, because in there NBA 2K mind that he should have been the one traded. |
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Halflife
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| Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 2:51 pm Post subject: |
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| DLaker wrote: | | AD23 wrote: | Kuzma is an all star and 25 ppg scorer!
That's what he thinks he is |
What wrong with believing you can reach that level, Kyle Kuzma Believes He ‘Definitely Can’ Be An All-Star And Is Looking Forward To ‘A More Consistent Space Next Year’, better than other players we have who demand starting position, but has not earned it (DS and Drumond).
Kuz just like to get picked on by Lakers fan. But facts are he didnt shoot horribly on the 3pt line .361 is close to league average. He was the 113 rank 3pt% shooter, notable players below him are Herro, Kemba, Luka and Beal. He is rank 50th in the league in reb/game. He is playing better D, he is not overpaid, He plays hard every game, he play team ball, but for some reason is the reason we lost this year. Crazy how hatred for a player stems form bias, because in there NBA 2K mind that he should have been the one traded. |
Iirc he shot 3s better than trae. |
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activeverb
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| Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 3:12 pm Post subject: |
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| DLaker wrote: | | AD23 wrote: | Kuzma is an all star and 25 ppg scorer!
That's what he thinks he is |
What wrong with believing you can reach that level, Kyle Kuzma Believes He ‘Definitely Can’ Be An All-Star And Is Looking Forward To ‘A More Consistent Space Next Year’, better than other players we have who demand starting position, but has not earned it (DS and Drumond).
Kuz just like to get picked on by Lakers fan. |
Basically, every player outside of Lebron and AD who Lakers fans perceive as not knowing their place got picked on this year -- Kuzma, Schroder, Hazzell, and Drummond in particular.
Each of them, in different ways, expressed what they feel they are worth and what they deserved. This enraged Lakers fans because the team had a bad year and none of them had a particularly notable season. They were all different types of mediocrity.
Kuzma brought it on himself by declaring he could be an all-star after a 6-4-1 on 29%-17%-68% playoffs.
KCP and Caruso escaped the censure because they fly under radar. THT escaped it too because fans hope he can become a star. |
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KindCrippler2000
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| Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 3:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Kuz needs a mentor and motivator. Young players are more susceptible to being worn down, and some of the recent coaching hires (Billups, Udoka, Green, etc) are being made to bridge the gap between coaches and players. I honestly believe he would be a different player under Lue or Monty. Not quite at the 25 ppg mark, but around 17-20 ppg within the team context. Look at how Reggie Jackson and Cameron Payne revived their careers. Kuz needs a similar revival. I don't think it's going to happen in LA. |
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RashardA
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| Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 3:49 pm Post subject: |
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| KindCrippler2000 wrote: | | Kuz needs a mentor and motivator. Young players are more susceptible to being worn down, and some of the recent coaching hires (Billups, Udoka, Green, etc) are being made to bridge the gap between coaches and players. I honestly believe he would be a different player under Lue or Monty. Not quite at the 25 ppg mark, but around 17-20 ppg within the team context. Look at how Reggie Jackson and Cameron Payne revived their careers. Kuz needs a similar revival. I don't think it's going to happen in LA. |
That could be Fizdale.
That said, moving Kuz (in a deal that makes sense) is most likely best for both he and the team.
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hype
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| Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 3:59 pm Post subject: |
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| activeverb wrote: | | DLaker wrote: | | AD23 wrote: | Kuzma is an all star and 25 ppg scorer!
That's what he thinks he is |
What wrong with believing you can reach that level, Kyle Kuzma Believes He ‘Definitely Can’ Be An All-Star And Is Looking Forward To ‘A More Consistent Space Next Year’, better than other players we have who demand starting position, but has not earned it (DS and Drumond).
Kuz just like to get picked on by Lakers fan. |
Basically, every player outside of Lebron and AD who Lakers fans perceive as not knowing their place got picked on this year -- Kuzma, Schroder, Hazzell, and Drummond in particular.
Each of them, in different ways, expressed what they feel they are worth and what they deserved. This enraged Lakers fans because the team had a bad year and none of them had a particularly notable season. They were all different types of mediocrity.
Kuzma brought it on himself by declaring he could be an all-star after a 6-4-1 on 29%-17%-68% playoffs.
KCP and Caruso escaped the censure because they fly under radar. THT escaped it too because fans hope he can become a star. |
Yeah, my only major problem with Kuz and it's a troubling one is that he has now had back2back Playoffs where he was anywhere from mediocre to awful. Ever since he came back into the bubble last year especially I was starting to really get behind him as it was pretty astounding imo how much work he put in and better he became not only just on the defensive end but his actual bbiq. He looked so much more poised and confident on that end from rarely fouling 3 point shooters to staying with just about anyone he was asked to guard and doing it well. He was even not picking up hardly any offensive charges which he used to routinely do.
Then in the Playoffs he'll have games or entire series where a lot of that progress looks like it just vanished overnight. I think shooting wise he reminds me a lot of a very poor mans Booker where he needs to keep shooting to eventually find that touch and when/if he does he can light a team on fire real fast. But with Kuz on the bench and two vastly better players ahead of him he simply can not do that. I have no doubt he could average 20+ with ease on a mediocre to bad team where he has the green light and very possibly have some 40-50 point games but I don't see that team doing anything but hitting the lottery.
I'm not exactly upset with what Kuz said but when you absolutely play horribly in a first round exit while being mediocre for much of the previous years Playoffs, coming out and saying you can be a 25+ ppg all-star is not a good look at all and is obviously going to rain down a bunch of criticism. He had solid regular seasons both of the last two years especially when you look at his improved defense but when you play for the Lakers where it's Championship or bust, the Playoffs matter much more and it's been a rough 2 years for him to say the least.
I really wish we'd have him moving off the ball much more because he's great at cutting and finishing plus getting a few easy baskets could go a long way for his confidence on the perimeter shots. Like everyone I still see the occasional potential there and will hope for the best as long as he's on the Lakers but I also wouldn't be upset if he's included in a trade to try and shake the roster up a bit for next season. Saying that, I don't think he's overpaid or should be moved for trash at all. |
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Halflife
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| Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 4:02 pm Post subject: |
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| kuz almost has to be moved to add anything of quality. |
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RashardA
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| Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 4:09 pm Post subject: |
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Another thing I think is willfully overlooked is the fact Kuz has put in a lot of work on his game.
He shot the three better this season, was a much better defender, rebounder & playmaker.
Kuz, just like everyone else on that title winning team, had 71 days off between seasons.
Not a lot of time.
With a full offseason I completely expect Kuz will come back next season with improvements in his game.
Be it here in Los Angeles with the Lakers or someplace else.
The secret is how to get him out of his own head at playoff time and get him to just go out there and play his game with confidence & stop overthinking everything.
That's where Fiz comes in if Kuz is still a member of the Los Angeles Lakers.
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Halflife
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| Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 4:13 pm Post subject: |
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| RashardA wrote: | Another thing I think is willfully overlooked is the fact Kuz has put in a lot of work on his game.
He shot the three better this season, was a much better defender, rebounder & playmaker.
Kuz, just like everyone else on that title winning team had 71 days off between seasons.
With a full offseason I completely expect Kuz will come back next season with improvements in his game.
Be it here in Los Angeles with the Lakers or someplace else.
The secret is how to get him out of his own head at playoff time and get him to just go out there and play his game with confidence & stop overthinking everything.
That's where Fiz comes in if Kuz is still a member of the Los Angeles Lakers. |
probably but whats his role? Starting? 6th man? It sounded like from a tweet I posted earlier from steinline that bron will play more 4. Kuz has been pretty clear about wanting an elevated role.
he has his ring and endorsements. I wouldnt be surprised if he has requested a trade deep deep behind closed doors. IMHO |
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RashardA
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| Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 5:38 pm Post subject: |
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| Halflife wrote: | | RashardA wrote: | Another thing I think is willfully overlooked is the fact Kuz has put in a lot of work on his game.
He shot the three better this season, was a much better defender, rebounder & playmaker.
Kuz, just like everyone else on that title winning team had 71 days off between seasons.
With a full offseason I completely expect Kuz will come back next season with improvements in his game.
Be it here in Los Angeles with the Lakers or someplace else.
The secret is how to get him out of his own head at playoff time and get him to just go out there and play his game with confidence & stop overthinking everything.
That's where Fiz comes in if Kuz is still a member of the Los Angeles Lakers. |
probably but whats his role? Starting? 6th man? It sounded like from a tweet I posted earlier from steinline that bron will play more 4. Kuz has been pretty clear about wanting an elevated role.
he has his ring and endorsements. I wouldnt be surprised if he has requested a trade deep deep behind closed doors. IMHO |
I believe Kuz is fine with a bench role because he never would have signed that extension.
I think lines got blurred when he thought he was going to be the 6th man this season and then the Lakers went out and signed the winner of the 6th man of the year of award and the runner up.
IMO, Kuz wants a defined role as 6th man.
Not just the title of 6th man, but to actually be a FEATURED player on offense.
Vogel rarely if ever calls plays for Kuz.
Look at a guy like JC who has the ultimate green light to shoot and shoot and shoot whenever he hits the court.
Im not saying Kuz wants or should have that kind of green light, but it would be nice if they actually installed an offensive package for Kuz into their offense.
Too many times players who I believe should have been further down the pecking order took more shots than Kuz and like the good solider he is, he never complained.
He just focused on other things like rebounding, defending and making plays for his teammates.
What Vogel and his teammates have to do is empower him to be who he is offensively during the regular season.
Build his confidence so come playoff time he's ready.
All these young players we see thriving in the playoffs are doing so because their coaching staffs and teammates built them up during the regular season.
It didnt happen overnight.
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DLaker
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| Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Just because he had a bad playoff does not mean he sucks. if he didn’t show improvement in the reg season, then maybe we should hear some noise. Markieff and KCP was huge last year in the playoff, but is no where to be found this year’s playoff, but you don’t hear any bashing about their performance. Kuz is going to his 5th season, he is still young and just like the Clippers Reggie Jackson in this year’s playoff, I can see Kuz having that kind of playoff performance in the for us in the future playoff. He surely has that confidence in himself like Reggie does. Sometimes fans are quick to judge, as for Kuz, I have not seen a plateau yet. He still have a chance to reach his goal by working on his game. |
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Halflife
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| Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:44 pm Post subject: |
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Kuzmas comments coincide with a bunch of young studs shining bright in the post season.
Obviously he wants that but the problem is he won’t find THAT here. Imho he’s not on the level of spida, Luka, book, Trae but like all athletes with egos he probably thinks he is.
He will over discover that reality on a team like kings, cavs, etc. |
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LGFan
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| Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Halflife wrote: | Kuzmas comments coincide with a bunch of young studs shining bright in the post season.
Obviously he wants that but the problem is he won’t find THAT here. Imho he’s not on the level of spida, Luka, book, Trae but like all athletes with egos he probably thinks he is.
He will over discover that reality on a team like kings, cavs, etc. |
He was given a chance this postseason on a silver plate, he didn’t take it
Last playoffs he was below average too
He has to blame himself for no show and nobody else |
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ContagiousInspiration
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| Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 10:10 pm Post subject: |
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activeverb
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| Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 10:38 pm Post subject: |
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| hype wrote: | | Like everyone I still see the occasional potential there and will hope for the best as long as he's on the Lakers but I also wouldn't be upset if he's included in a trade to try and shake the roster up a bit for next season. Saying that, I don't think he's overpaid or should be moved for trash at all. |
Kuzma is turning 26 and heading into his 5th people. He's coming right up to the point (if he's not already there) where it's time to stop talking about what he might become and to start accepting what he is.
Right now, I consider him an average NBA player -- a serviceable journeyman and solid rotation player. He doesn't really excel at any one thing, but his overall game is competent.
Has he been put in the ideal position to succeed? No, but that's true for 95% of the players in the league.
I wouldn't trade him for the sake of trading him. But I also don't think we need to put any kind of priority to keeping him. If we can improve the team by moving him out, no reason not to. |
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epic_
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| Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 10:46 pm Post subject: |
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Kuz got a ring before BI, Julius, Zo, JC, DLo!
He's the man!!!
He's gonna end his career with more rings than all of them combined!
He's gonna have more than Tatum, Spider and Trae combined.
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