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kikanga
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 Posted: Sat Jan 15, 2022 8:50 pm Post subject: Yes |
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Nevermind.
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Last edited by kikanga on Sun Jan 16, 2022 3:02 am; edited 1 time in total |
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FernieBee
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| Posted: Sat Jan 15, 2022 10:05 pm Post subject: |
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Unfortunately, dumbasses and racists - - oftentimes a two-fer - - have as much right to vote as the rest of us.
This country is screwed: with a capital F.
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focus
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 9:23 am Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | Wilt wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | Wilt wrote: |
And don't get me started on the "progressives" that are already planning to sit the next election out. |
At this point. I think that might be an antiquated perspective. Screw "progressives" there are people who got us those 2 Senate seats in Georgia who are far from Bernie voters who will say, "screw it". I was told. If we get these 2 seats. We have power. And X, Y, and Z would get done. And they aren't getting done/won't get done between now and 2022 and 2024.
As if that's not enough. they're seeing inflation faaar outpacing cost of living wages, gas prices, COVID fatigue, etc, etc.
We have alot to do this upcoming year if just breaking even is the goal. |
Politics is the art of the possible. You never sit out an election, never, especially when the other side is a bunch of blood hungry authoritarians. No amount of inflation, COVID fatigue, gas prices, unfulfilled campaign promises should result in unilaterally surrendering. |
The problem is, the alleged progressives who sit out don't see it as surrendering. They are just as stupid as Trumpies—they think they are "owning" the Left. They aren't getting their own way, so they want to make sure that everyone else suffers for it. Which is why I have been saying for years that those who call themselves "progressive" while sitting out or "protest" voting have no concept of how progress works and are just intellectual toddlers. |
You guys are blaming progressives (or "alleged progressives") again already? At least wait until the election is actually lost, just to pace yourselves. |
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kikanga
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 9:25 am Post subject: |
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| focus wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | Wilt wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | Wilt wrote: |
And don't get me started on the "progressives" that are already planning to sit the next election out. |
At this point. I think that might be an antiquated perspective. Screw "progressives" there are people who got us those 2 Senate seats in Georgia who are far from Bernie voters who will say, "screw it". I was told. If we get these 2 seats. We have power. And X, Y, and Z would get done. And they aren't getting done/won't get done between now and 2022 and 2024.
As if that's not enough. they're seeing inflation faaar outpacing cost of living wages, gas prices, COVID fatigue, etc, etc.
We have alot to do this upcoming year if just breaking even is the goal. |
Politics is the art of the possible. You never sit out an election, never, especially when the other side is a bunch of blood hungry authoritarians. No amount of inflation, COVID fatigue, gas prices, unfulfilled campaign promises should result in unilaterally surrendering. |
The problem is, the alleged progressives who sit out don't see it as surrendering. They are just as stupid as Trumpies—they think they are "owning" the Left. They aren't getting their own way, so they want to make sure that everyone else suffers for it. Which is why I have been saying for years that those who call themselves "progressive" while sitting out or "protest" voting have no concept of how progress works and are just intellectual toddlers. |
You guys are blaming progressives (or "alleged progressives") again already? At least wait until the election is actually lost, just to pace yourselves. |
My thing is. Not everyone disappointed and turned off by us not getting things done is a "progressive". Sure in the past that is true. But Manchin and Sinema are doing things under the label of "Democrat" that few others before them did. And it makes sense it will have an impact we haven't seen before.
We've overpromised, and under-delivered. Maybe Biden, Pelosi, and Schumer overestimated the pressure they could put on Manchin and Sinema. 33% approval rating for Biden isn't just "progressives" being displeased.
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 10:03 am Post subject: |
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| focus wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | Wilt wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | Wilt wrote: |
And don't get me started on the "progressives" that are already planning to sit the next election out. |
At this point. I think that might be an antiquated perspective. Screw "progressives" there are people who got us those 2 Senate seats in Georgia who are far from Bernie voters who will say, "screw it". I was told. If we get these 2 seats. We have power. And X, Y, and Z would get done. And they aren't getting done/won't get done between now and 2022 and 2024.
As if that's not enough. they're seeing inflation faaar outpacing cost of living wages, gas prices, COVID fatigue, etc, etc.
We have alot to do this upcoming year if just breaking even is the goal. |
Politics is the art of the possible. You never sit out an election, never, especially when the other side is a bunch of blood hungry authoritarians. No amount of inflation, COVID fatigue, gas prices, unfulfilled campaign promises should result in unilaterally surrendering. |
The problem is, the alleged progressives who sit out don't see it as surrendering. They are just as stupid as Trumpies—they think they are "owning" the Left. They aren't getting their own way, so they want to make sure that everyone else suffers for it. Which is why I have been saying for years that those who call themselves "progressive" while sitting out or "protest" voting have no concept of how progress works and are just intellectual toddlers. |
You guys are blaming progressives (or "alleged progressives") again already? At least wait until the election is actually lost, just to pace yourselves. |
Where did I blame anyone? I'm simply discussing the dynamics in their flawed logic.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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FernieBee
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 11:35 am Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | I'm simply discussing the dynamics in their flawed logic. |
Demz may have some flawed logic, but Repubz have some very flawed people.
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jodeke
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 1:36 pm Post subject: |
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Politicians are like the police. They're a flawed, corrupt necessary evil.
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Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
Last edited by jodeke on Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:47 am; edited 1 time in total |
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 2:57 pm Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | | focus wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | Wilt wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | Wilt wrote: |
And don't get me started on the "progressives" that are already planning to sit the next election out. |
At this point. I think that might be an antiquated perspective. Screw "progressives" there are people who got us those 2 Senate seats in Georgia who are far from Bernie voters who will say, "screw it". I was told. If we get these 2 seats. We have power. And X, Y, and Z would get done. And they aren't getting done/won't get done between now and 2022 and 2024.
As if that's not enough. they're seeing inflation faaar outpacing cost of living wages, gas prices, COVID fatigue, etc, etc.
We have alot to do this upcoming year if just breaking even is the goal. |
Politics is the art of the possible. You never sit out an election, never, especially when the other side is a bunch of blood hungry authoritarians. No amount of inflation, COVID fatigue, gas prices, unfulfilled campaign promises should result in unilaterally surrendering. |
The problem is, the alleged progressives who sit out don't see it as surrendering. They are just as stupid as Trumpies—they think they are "owning" the Left. They aren't getting their own way, so they want to make sure that everyone else suffers for it. Which is why I have been saying for years that those who call themselves "progressive" while sitting out or "protest" voting have no concept of how progress works and are just intellectual toddlers. |
You guys are blaming progressives (or "alleged progressives") again already? At least wait until the election is actually lost, just to pace yourselves. |
My thing is. Not everyone disappointed and turned off by us not getting things done is a "progressive". Sure in the past that is true. But Manchin and Sinema are doing things under the label of "Democrat" that few others before them did. And it makes sense it will have an impact we haven't seen before.
We've overpromised, and under-delivered. Maybe Biden, Pelosi, and Schumer overestimated the pressure they could put on Manchin and Sinema. 33% approval rating for Biden isn't just "progressives" being displeased. |
True. But that's not the point. While there are many who are disappointed, most aren't going to go the childish route that progressives did in 2016 and toss their vote away.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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non-player zealot
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 3:29 pm Post subject: |
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I was rewatching a Frontline episode from 2016 on HRC and DT. I remember posting the link back then. It backgrounds each candidate from childhood on. It's depressing every time I see a slug who has had little to no redeeming qualities since childhood to appeal to so many American voters. He was a little sh even as a kid, the kind of dummy bully who stomped on other kids' sandcastles. It's the same kind of depression that never fails to surface when I see the footage from 9/11.
We Americans have the situation we are in because so many of us are incapable and unwilling of vetting politicians for their achievements and/or stated platforms that seek to provide for the 99%ers. Instead, they vote for Trump cuz he speaks the tRooF!1 Then he gets in and is every bit the sleezebag we knew he was and MORE. Another win for the 1%ers who don't need it while the middle class keeps dwindling away like the glaciers. Self-inflicted, Gawd-injected, and hate-of-others injected wounds over decades. I don't think it's possible to understand why the middle class would want Reagan for 8 years, especially for the 2nd term when he was already experiencing senility. Then the two Gong Show contestants, Dubya n Trump, for 12 years. 20 years of that crap takes its toll. Dubya being the one who choked on a pretzel and passed out, but who had the wiles to duck TWO shoes thrown at his head. Bimbos as Maher calls them. DT, Dubya, Palin, Bachman, Quayle, MTG and that type, etc, etc, etc. End rant.
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 3:40 pm Post subject: |
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| non-player zealot wrote: | I was rewatching a Frontline episode from 2016 on HRC and DT. I remember posting the link back then. It backgrounds each candidate from childhood on. It's depressing every time I see a slug who has had little to no redeeming qualities since childhood to appeal to so many American voters. He was a little sh even as a kid, the kind of dummy bully who stomped on other kids' sandcastles. It's the same kind of depression that never fails to surface when I see the footage from 9/11.
We Americans have the situation we are in because so many of us are incapable and unwilling of vetting politicians for their achievements and/or stated platforms that seek to provide for the 99%ers. Instead, they vote for Trump cuz he speaks the tRooF!1 Then he gets in and is every bit the sleezebag we knew he was and MORE. Another win for the 1%ers who don't need it while the middle class keeps dwindling away like the glaciers. Self-inflicted, Gawd-injected, and hate-of-others injected wounds over decades. I don't think it's possible to understand why the middle class would want Reagan for 8 years, especially for the 2nd term when he was already experiencing senility. Then the two Gong Show contestants, Dubya n Trump, for 12 years. 20 years of that crap takes its toll. Dubya being the one who choked on a pretzel and passed out, but who had the wiles to duck TWO shoes thrown at his head. Bimbos as Maher calls them. DT, Dubya, Palin, Bachman, Quayle, MTG and that type, etc, etc, etc. End rant. |
Because they are also slugs with no redeeming qualities. If there's one lesson of the last six years it's that almost half of this country is comprised of disgusting, hateful, vermin devoid of integrity.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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FernieBee
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 3:48 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | half of this country is comprised of disgusting, hateful, vermin devoid of integrity. |
They're easy to spot: Trump and all his supporters.
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kikanga
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 3:48 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | focus wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | Wilt wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | Wilt wrote: |
And don't get me started on the "progressives" that are already planning to sit the next election out. |
At this point. I think that might be an antiquated perspective. Screw "progressives" there are people who got us those 2 Senate seats in Georgia who are far from Bernie voters who will say, "screw it". I was told. If we get these 2 seats. We have power. And X, Y, and Z would get done. And they aren't getting done/won't get done between now and 2022 and 2024.
As if that's not enough. they're seeing inflation faaar outpacing cost of living wages, gas prices, COVID fatigue, etc, etc.
We have alot to do this upcoming year if just breaking even is the goal. |
Politics is the art of the possible. You never sit out an election, never, especially when the other side is a bunch of blood hungry authoritarians. No amount of inflation, COVID fatigue, gas prices, unfulfilled campaign promises should result in unilaterally surrendering. |
The problem is, the alleged progressives who sit out don't see it as surrendering. They are just as stupid as Trumpies—they think they are "owning" the Left. They aren't getting their own way, so they want to make sure that everyone else suffers for it. Which is why I have been saying for years that those who call themselves "progressive" while sitting out or "protest" voting have no concept of how progress works and are just intellectual toddlers. |
You guys are blaming progressives (or "alleged progressives") again already? At least wait until the election is actually lost, just to pace yourselves. |
My thing is. Not everyone disappointed and turned off by us not getting things done is a "progressive". Sure in the past that is true. But Manchin and Sinema are doing things under the label of "Democrat" that few others before them did. And it makes sense it will have an impact we haven't seen before.
We've overpromised, and under-delivered. Maybe Biden, Pelosi, and Schumer overestimated the pressure they could put on Manchin and Sinema. 33% approval rating for Biden isn't just "progressives" being displeased. |
True. But that's not the point. While there are many who are disappointed, most aren't going to go the childish route that progressives did in 2016 and toss their vote away. |
I mean. We won't know that till the midterms. Outside the California recall. The results for Governor races haven't been encouraging.
It's a bit funny to complain about people not voting and then simultaneously refuse to pass legislation that protects people's right to vote.
There are 2 routes. You can demonize people contributing to Biden's low approval rating among all Democrats (not just progressives). Or you can give more people a reason to change their mind.
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kikanga
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 4:02 pm Post subject: |
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DMR. I agree the right thing to do is stay engaged. Push the Senate to a 52/48 Dem majority in 2022. And hope 1 more Senator doesn't become the new Manchin or Sinema.
But at the same time, we gotta acknowledge we aren't doing enough to motivate people, heck even give people the ability, to vote.
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Omar Little
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 4:11 pm Post subject: |
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I’m not too worried about Biden’s approval rating because it is just a sign of the times. The guy got us out of Afghanistan, passed a huge relief bill and then a big infrastructure bill, and has been on point about the BBB and voting rights bills, but he’s being stymied by two people he can’t coax or bully. So the GOP hates him (duh) progressives think he hasn’t done enough, and independents blame him for not stopping covid while they are out in the bars and restaurants. Such is life in America these days. I’m pleased that a sober, decent, competent person is running the executive wing, and wish we had a couple more senators.
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kikanga
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 4:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Omar Little wrote: | | I’m not too worried about Biden’s approval rating because it is just a sign of the times. The guy got us out of Afghanistan, passed a huge relief bill and then a big infrastructure bill, and has been on point about the BBB and voting rights bills, but he’s being stymied by two people he can’t coax or bully. So the GOP hates him (duh) progressives think he hasn’t done enough, and independents blame him for not stopping covid while they are out in the bars and restaurants. Such is life in America these days. I’m pleased that a sober, decent, competent person is running the executive wing, and wish we had a couple more senators. |
How does that translate to success in 2022?
I'm just a bit worried about the authoritarian alternative presented by Republicans. And I'd like to avoid it if possible.
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LakerSanity
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 4:43 pm Post subject: |
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National approval ratings used to matter when you could rely on voters to vote based on their approval or disapproval of the federal government/President. However, because politics have become so regional/local, national approval numbers now mean squat when it comes to how Congress will vote.
Even in the presidential election, national approval numbers aren't the end all. Trump had historically low approval numbers, yet almost won re-election. Thank the purple states and the electoral college. Even if approval numbers for Biden are low in heavily populated states, those are likely the states Biden would either win or lose regardless of his national approval numbers. States like Florida and Texas are still red states who are going republican regardless, while states like California and New York are still blue states that are going dem regardless. Only approval numbers that matter are those in the purple/swing states. Just like with the Senate, those are who the candidates will also cater too.
____________________________________
One comment on Sinema. Watch her go all voting rights and progressive again as soon as its clear that her vote on such things wouldn't make a difference. She and Manchin are everything wrong with politicians. Usually you find those solely on the right, but the left clearly still has a few of their own as well.
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 4:44 pm Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | DMR. I agree the right thing to do is stay engaged. Push the Senate to a 52/48 Dem majority in 2022. And hope 1 more Senator doesn't become the new Manchin or Sinema.
But at the same time, we gotta acknowledge we aren't doing enough to motivate people, heck even give people the ability, to vote. |
And what exactly is Biden supposed to do to "motivate" people when he is faced with multiple roadblocks? Those who aren't "motivated" at this point aren't paying attention. As for the "ability to vote" the restrictions to that have nothing to do with Biden. What's he supposed to do? Just single handedly wish away the GOP's voter suppression efforts?
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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kikanga
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 5:15 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | DMR. I agree the right thing to do is stay engaged. Push the Senate to a 52/48 Dem majority in 2022. And hope 1 more Senator doesn't become the new Manchin or Sinema.
But at the same time, we gotta acknowledge we aren't doing enough to motivate people, heck even give people the ability, to vote. |
And what exactly is Biden supposed to do to "motivate" people when he is faced with multiple roadblocks? Those who aren't "motivated" at this point aren't paying attention. As for the "ability to vote" the restrictions to that have nothing to do with Biden. What's he supposed to do? Just single handedly wish away the GOP's voter suppression efforts? |
So you're saying its a lost cause trying to pass legislation in these areas. It was never gonna happen. And people who are too stupid to realize it are lost causes as well?
I mean to alot of people, majorities in both chambers of Congress and the WH is enough to pass legislation.
If you told alot of people in Georgia in early 2021 this reality, they probably would've stayed home. And Georgia isn't a Bastian of progressives. It's full of our base. AA voters.
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Last edited by kikanga on Sun Jan 16, 2022 5:21 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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kikanga
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 5:19 pm Post subject: |
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| LakerSanity wrote: | National approval ratings used to matter when you could rely on voters to vote based on their approval or disapproval of the federal government/President. However, because politics have become so regional/local, national approval numbers now mean squat when it comes to how Congress will vote.
Even in the presidential election, national approval numbers aren't the end all. Trump had historically low approval numbers, yet almost won re-election. Thank the purple states and the electoral college. Even if approval numbers for Biden are low in heavily populated states, those are likely the states Biden would either win or lose regardless of his national approval numbers. States like Florida and Texas are still red states who are going republican regardless, while states like California and New York are still blue states that are going dem regardless. Only approval numbers that matter are those in the purple/swing states. Just like with the Senate, those are who the candidates will also cater too.
____________________________________
One comment on Sinema. Watch her go all voting rights and progressive again as soon as its clear that her vote on such things wouldn't make a difference. She and Manchin are everything wrong with politicians. Usually you find those solely on the right, but the left clearly still has a few of their own as well. |
____________________________________
I'm with you. But what are your thoughts on Governor races in New Jersey and Virgnia in 2021. Both were disappointing compared to the 2020 results in both states.
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | DMR. I agree the right thing to do is stay engaged. Push the Senate to a 52/48 Dem majority in 2022. And hope 1 more Senator doesn't become the new Manchin or Sinema.
But at the same time, we gotta acknowledge we aren't doing enough to motivate people, heck even give people the ability, to vote. |
And what exactly is Biden supposed to do to "motivate" people when he is faced with multiple roadblocks? Those who aren't "motivated" at this point aren't paying attention. As for the "ability to vote" the restrictions to that have nothing to do with Biden. What's he supposed to do? Just single handedly wish away the GOP's voter suppression efforts? |
So you're saying its a lost cause trying to pass legislation in these areas. It was never gonna happen. And people who are too stupid to realize it are lost causes as well?
I mean to alot of people, majorities in both chambers of Congress and the WH is enough to pass legislation. |
Where did you get that idea? Did you even bother to actually read my post?
Biden can't just will the GOP's voter suppression efforts away. Or do you actually believe he's just refusing to see the JLVRA get passed?
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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kikanga
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Location: La La Land
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 5:29 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | DMR. I agree the right thing to do is stay engaged. Push the Senate to a 52/48 Dem majority in 2022. And hope 1 more Senator doesn't become the new Manchin or Sinema.
But at the same time, we gotta acknowledge we aren't doing enough to motivate people, heck even give people the ability, to vote. |
And what exactly is Biden supposed to do to "motivate" people when he is faced with multiple roadblocks? Those who aren't "motivated" at this point aren't paying attention. As for the "ability to vote" the restrictions to that have nothing to do with Biden. What's he supposed to do? Just single handedly wish away the GOP's voter suppression efforts? |
So you're saying its a lost cause trying to pass legislation in these areas. It was never gonna happen. And people who are too stupid to realize it are lost causes as well?
I mean to alot of people, majorities in both chambers of Congress and the WH is enough to pass legislation. |
Where did you get that idea? Did you even bother to actually read my post?
Biden can't just will the GOP's voter suppression efforts away. Or do you actually believe he's just refusing to see the JLVRA get passed? |
I'm just gonna circle back.
DMR. I agree the right thing to do is stay engaged. Push the Senate to a 52/48 Dem majority in 2022. And hope 1 more Senator doesn't become the new Manchin or Sinema.
But at the same time, we gotta acknowledge we aren't doing enough to motivate people, heck even give people the ability, to vote.
I think you are caught up on process. I'm talking about results.
People have never voted on process. They've always voted on results. Always. Otherwise, they'd be legislators and not voters.
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DaMuleRules
Retired Number
Joined: 10 Dec 2006
Posts: 52657
Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 5:45 pm Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | DMR. I agree the right thing to do is stay engaged. Push the Senate to a 52/48 Dem majority in 2022. And hope 1 more Senator doesn't become the new Manchin or Sinema.
But at the same time, we gotta acknowledge we aren't doing enough to motivate people, heck even give people the ability, to vote. |
And what exactly is Biden supposed to do to "motivate" people when he is faced with multiple roadblocks? Those who aren't "motivated" at this point aren't paying attention. As for the "ability to vote" the restrictions to that have nothing to do with Biden. What's he supposed to do? Just single handedly wish away the GOP's voter suppression efforts? |
So you're saying its a lost cause trying to pass legislation in these areas. It was never gonna happen. And people who are too stupid to realize it are lost causes as well?
I mean to alot of people, majorities in both chambers of Congress and the WH is enough to pass legislation. |
Where did you get that idea? Did you even bother to actually read my post?
Biden can't just will the GOP's voter suppression efforts away. Or do you actually believe he's just refusing to see the JLVRA get passed? |
I'm just gonna circle back.
DMR. I agree the right thing to do is stay engaged. Push the Senate to a 52/48 Dem majority in 2022. And hope 1 more Senator doesn't become the new Manchin or Sinema.
But at the same time, we gotta acknowledge we aren't doing enough to motivate people, heck even give people the ability, to vote.
I think you are caught up on process. I'm talking about results. |
I'm not "caught up" in anything other than the reality of what is going on . . . but let's just ignore that for the sake of entertaining your premise . . .
- "Push the Senate to a 52/48 Dem majority in 2022. And hope 1 more Senator doesn't become the new Manchin or Sinema."
OK . . . how? I mean other than closing his eyes and wishing.
- "But at the same time, we gotta acknowledge we aren't doing enough to motivate people, "
OK, how does Biden "motivate" people who aren't already engaged? Because if someone isn't engaged at this point, they have already made the choice to be decidedly uninvolved. He's done everything he could under the circumstances. He got us out of 20 year, unwinnable war. He's done everything he can to offset a deadly pandemic even though a large portion of leadership and the population refuses to do the things necessary to help end it. He's tried to pass legislation to help rebuild the economy, infrastructure, childcare . . . but has been thwarted by a couple of charlatans in the Democratic party. Is he supposed to just lock Manchin and Semina in a room and beat them into submission?
You say I'm "caught up in the process", but it sounds like you don't even understand that the process is the inescapable reality of getting things done.
"- heck even give people the ability, to vote."
So it's your position that it is Biden who is restricting people's ability to vote?
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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kikanga
Retired Number
Joined: 15 Sep 2012
Posts: 29337
Location: La La Land
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 5:53 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | DMR. I agree the right thing to do is stay engaged. Push the Senate to a 52/48 Dem majority in 2022. And hope 1 more Senator doesn't become the new Manchin or Sinema.
But at the same time, we gotta acknowledge we aren't doing enough to motivate people, heck even give people the ability, to vote. |
And what exactly is Biden supposed to do to "motivate" people when he is faced with multiple roadblocks? Those who aren't "motivated" at this point aren't paying attention. As for the "ability to vote" the restrictions to that have nothing to do with Biden. What's he supposed to do? Just single handedly wish away the GOP's voter suppression efforts? |
So you're saying its a lost cause trying to pass legislation in these areas. It was never gonna happen. And people who are too stupid to realize it are lost causes as well?
I mean to alot of people, majorities in both chambers of Congress and the WH is enough to pass legislation. |
Where did you get that idea? Did you even bother to actually read my post?
Biden can't just will the GOP's voter suppression efforts away. Or do you actually believe he's just refusing to see the JLVRA get passed? |
I'm just gonna circle back.
DMR. I agree the right thing to do is stay engaged. Push the Senate to a 52/48 Dem majority in 2022. And hope 1 more Senator doesn't become the new Manchin or Sinema.
But at the same time, we gotta acknowledge we aren't doing enough to motivate people, heck even give people the ability, to vote.
I think you are caught up on process. I'm talking about results. |
I'm not "caught up" in anything other than the reality of what is going on . . . but let's just ignore that for the sake of entertaining your premise . . .
- "Push the Senate to a 52/48 Dem majority in 2022. And hope 1 more Senator doesn't become the new Manchin or Sinema."
OK . . . how? I mean other than closing his eyes and wishing.
- "But at the same time, we gotta acknowledge we aren't doing enough to motivate people, "
OK, how does Biden "motivate" people who aren't already engaged? Because if someone isn't engaged at this point, they have already made the choice to be decidedly uninvolved. He's done everything he could under the circumstances. He got us out of 20 year, unwinnable war. He's done everything he can to offset a deadly pandemic even though a large portion of leadership and the population refuses to do the things necessary to help end it. He's tried to pass legislation to help rebuild the economy, infrastructure, childcare . . . but has been thwarted by a couple of charlatans in the Democratic party. Is he supposed to just lock Manchin and Semina in a room and beat them into submission?
You say I'm "caught up in the process", but it sounds like you don't even understand that the process is the inescapable reality of getting things done.
"- heck even give people the ability, to vote."
So it's your position that it is Biden who is restricting people's ability to vote? |
I really don't think you understand where we are disagreeing.
I agree Biden is doing the best he can.
I agree it's not Biden's fault. It's Manchin and Sinema's.
What I'm saying is that most people don't have the time, patience, or mental bandwidth to understand it's not his (or the D party's) fault. They and their spouse are working multiple jobs and still struggling to reach a comfortable living wage. Not to mention their commute (most people can't afford to live where they work, inflation, gas prices, COVID fatigue, etc).
We can either blame them. Or realize that swing voters in purple states want results.
I'm not purposing a solution (which is convenient).
I'm not saying your description of events is wrong.
I'm just acknowledging a truth. So when 2022 election results come around, we all know what's going on.
_________________
"Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better” |
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slavavov
Star Player
Joined: 03 Oct 2003
Posts: 8351
Location: Santa Monica
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 6:09 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | DMR. I agree the right thing to do is stay engaged. Push the Senate to a 52/48 Dem majority in 2022. And hope 1 more Senator doesn't become the new Manchin or Sinema.
But at the same time, we gotta acknowledge we aren't doing enough to motivate people, heck even give people the ability, to vote. |
And what exactly is Biden supposed to do to "motivate" people when he is faced with multiple roadblocks? Those who aren't "motivated" at this point aren't paying attention. As for the "ability to vote" the restrictions to that have nothing to do with Biden. What's he supposed to do? Just single handedly wish away the GOP's voter suppression efforts? |
Dems need to motivate swing voters who lean Democratic that if they're frustrated with Congress not passing voting rights legislation or BBB, they need to vote Democratic in November to widen the party's advantage so that fake Dems like Manchin and Sinema won't matter.
But I'm not that hopeful because Dems are too soft when it comes to messaging and marketing. They need to let people know, straight up, that if the GOP regains power, we will lose our free elections and the will of the people will be ignored. |
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DaMuleRules
Retired Number
Joined: 10 Dec 2006
Posts: 52657
Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.
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| Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2022 6:34 pm Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | I agree Biden is doing the best he can.
I agree it's not Biden's fault. It's Manchin and Sinema's.
What I'm saying is that most people don't have the time, patience, or mental bandwidth to understand it's not his (or the D party's) fault. They and their spouse are working multiple jobs and still struggling to reach a comfortable living wage. Not to mention their commute (most people can't afford to live where they work, inflation, gas prices, COVID fatigue, etc).
We can either blame them. Or realize that swing voters in purple states want results. |
So you want Biden to overcome all the obstacles he faces by "motivating" the people who don't have the time or inclination to be motivated. And I'm not blaming the people, I'm asking you to explain how you hold Biden accountable for not doing something you acknowledge he can't.
| Quote: | I'm not purposing a solution (which is convenient).
I'm not saying your description of events is wrong.
I'm just acknowledging a truth. So when 2022 election results come around, we all know what's going on. |
How is blaming Biden (who is doing what he can with what he is facing) for not doing anything to motivate voters who aren't going to be motivated acknowledging any "truth"? Short answer, it's not. What is "going on" is that Biden has tried to address all the concerns of the voters you talk about and the GOP and Manchin/Simena are doing everything they can to thwart him . . . so tell me again how the Dems are failing to "motivate" those voters . . .
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now |
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