And we wouldn't have even faced Denver in the first round because we'd have been a 55+ win team. _________________ How NBA 2K18 failed the All-Time Lakers:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxMBYm3wwxk
And we wouldn't have even faced Denver in the first round because we'd have been a 55+ win team.
I was always defending triangle and still I do in many occasions when I talk and discuss with others. With this roster where you have some high IQ players like Lebron or Reaves triangle would work perfectly. And in many situations and games they were playing and running like brainless chickens. In triangle you don't have this. Phil with this Team would be 50+ wins 100%.And plus he handles big egos perfectly.
Vogel has already proven he could win a championship with a healthy AD and without Westbrick. Don't really need Phil. Any half decent coach would have done better than Ham. I mean the games against the Nuggets were really close. We just needed a little bit better coaching and those close games would have tilted in our favor. _________________ Los Angeles Lakers 2025 NBA Champions!! Go JJ!
Hindsight is wonderful. Unfortunately Ham was the HC, not all the fantasy choices. Management and players dumped Vogel. Jackson was not an option and I am not so sure he would have fared much differently with this roster and current player dynamic.
All that matters is who is the next HC and how long it takes to build trust and chemistry as a team. This scapegoating of HCs and annual re- tooling of the roster will end at some point, right?
Building some consistent rosters and systems on both ends would be a nice start. That takes time and growth. Something Laker fan and management apparently has no patience for.
Be nice if they made a HC decision that lasted a few years. Wouldn’t that be a novel concept! Just my hope anyways.
Soooo…I completely disagree…the saying of it doesn’t make it true or not tho from either side, we’re all speculating, but there should be some logic such that we’re not just basing our opinion on feelings or on emotional/irrational/illogical/misguided assumptions.
You make many reasonable and good points.
The one thing you forget (and really the crux of my "emotional" conclusion) is that Lebron will be 1 year older. That's a major part of my calculus and of course it may just turn out that Lebron defies time yet again next year - but what are the odds of a 40yo Lebron maintaining his level from this year? Would Vegas take that bet?
Other factors: We're above the 1st apron, have mediocre trade assets (Rui, maybe DLO, AR, Gabe), have fewer FRP's to trade than many other teams, #17 in a pretty dismal draft, will need to replace Prince/Dinwiddie for sure, have multiple holes to fill (a decent big, at least 2-3 2-way starters/6th men types who play offense AND defense)
And we wouldn't have even faced Denver in the first round because we'd have been a 55+ win team.
This is probably the worst team for triangle offense,
Considering all the motion offense, pick and roll and off ball movement in the Triangle, it would have worked just fine.
A big like Davis who can pass and score from mid and inside is perfect for the triangle. Having 3 playmakers in the starting lineup additionally is great for the triangle. Having tall guards that can score off motion sets and pick and roll sets, is great for the Triangle.
The only thing is LeBron would have to accept playing in an actual system offense he isn't allowed to break for no reason. And he'd be forced to commit to his off ball movement cutting to the basket rolls which would be beneficial to him for this section of his career. _________________ How NBA 2K18 failed the All-Time Lakers:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxMBYm3wwxk
And we wouldn't have even faced Denver in the first round because we'd have been a 55+ win team.
This is probably the worst team for triangle offense,
There's a reason no one uses the triangle offense anymore. It's been stripped for parts and incorporated to a small extent in more modern offenses, but running a pure version of it would be insane.
And we wouldn't have even faced Denver in the first round because we'd have been a 55+ win team.
This is probably the worst team for triangle offense,
Not to mention how outdated PJ is to the modern game. It’s over. He showed his basketball knowledge for many years in the front offices. He couldn’t adapt. He’s a dino.
Joined: 15 Sep 2012 Posts: 29879 Location: La La Land
Posted: Sun May 19, 2024 10:20 pm Post subject:
pjiddy wrote:
mad55557777 wrote:
MJST wrote:
If Phil had this roster we'd have beaten Denver.
And we wouldn't have even faced Denver in the first round because we'd have been a 55+ win team.
This is probably the worst team for triangle offense,
There's a reason no one uses the triangle offense anymore. It's been stripped for parts and incorporated to a small extent in more modern offenses, but running a pure version of it would be insane.
A point forward with an open court and playmaking from the elbow in the halfcourt was the biggest dimension the triangle added. It's why Kukoc and Odom thrived so much and helped Phil beat the best of the best. Even Jordan and Kobe did the same from the same area of the court.
Old LBJ could've done that. But I think Phil passes on coaching our 2023-2024 roster. Not enough firepower. AD isn't a smart enough hub for an offense... yet.
Phil would probably want LBJ at the 3. and AD at the 4, playmaking from the elbow. With a big who can do alot of the things AD was doing for us. Maybe if we had a more developed Lively. Phil would be more interested.
LBJ and AD are Pick and roll dominant play-type players. Phil prefers an entry pass to P&R action. _________________ "Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better”
And we wouldn't have even faced Denver in the first round because we'd have been a 55+ win team.
This is probably the worst team for triangle offense,
There's a reason no one uses the triangle offense anymore. It's been stripped for parts and incorporated to a small extent in more modern offenses, but running a pure version of it would be insane.
You can run a triangle set you just need to adjust it to fit the modern game. Phil could adjust the triangle to make it work with the personnel and play it to his players strengths and to maximize the team. Tex Winters helped a lot with that.
Other Triangle guys that were Phil disciples just tried running "The triangle" and rather than making it fit their personnel, they tried to force their personnel to fit it.
Why Kerr was so successful was because he adapted the Triangle, but then he had Alvin Gentry implement some more modern sets into it and some pick and roll and utiizing more motion into it, and the entire league couldn't handle it. Because you had stars in a system offense, and intentional offense. Occasionally Steph could break it, but they got a lot of shots off in the offense.
It shows how the system offenses can work in todays league. LeBron would just have to buy into that.
Heck when the Lakers ran system offense this season they were VERY effective, it was when it'd break into non-system offense that we struggled.
When the Lakers would beat on Denver they'd be running 70% system offense, and then it'd go down to 30% and the Nuggets would come back and win, that is on Ham for never re-establishing.
Phil wouldn't let that happen.He'd occasionally let the offense break so they "play through it" but would then use the time out to make adjustments the team did to come back and then counter it and we'd run the sets out of the timeouts. It's why it worked. Ham would just let teams go on runs and then would not change anything when out of the timeouts. _________________ How NBA 2K18 failed the All-Time Lakers:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxMBYm3wwxk
No superstars would seriously challenged HCs like Phil (along with others like Pop).
Spoetra is successfuly because Riles has his back and Heat has no bonafide superstars (When Jimmy Buckets challenged Heat Culture, Riles made sure that there will be only people who have "Bought In" to Heat Culture will remain.
Pop's track record provide him the cachet to go through building stages the Spurs roster through draft choices, that got shortened with the arrival of Wemby
Kerr's track record and relationship with Steph provide him great latitude and freedom through challenging times
Clips fans want TLue out, even though he is avery good coach. Clips proclaimed strongest and balanced roster with three future HOFer can't overcome players earning/soon earning for the net few years making $50+ a year unable to play more than 60+ games a year - as seen the last four years
If J.J. is the next HC, he will need to have very experienced Assistant Head Coaches that will provide confidence in J.J.'s decisions (as oppose to the great inexperience in Ham's assistant head coaches - outside of Handy).
Many people have wondered why Coach Bud wasn't contacted or strongly considered. Reason - He is just an advance version of Ham and unable to bring out the best in the Greek Freak - consistently, even with a supposedly stronger roster.
Does LBJ/AD have confidence in Handy. If so, why isn't Handy being considered
Ironic that these Lakers would have a great chance of beating the TWolves and Mavs. Maybe the Lakers did the TWolves by wearing out the Nuggets during their playoff series - lol!!
Joined: 24 Dec 2007 Posts: 36409 Location: Santa Clarita, CA (Hell) ->>>>>Ithaca, NY -≥≥≥≥≥Berkeley, CA
Posted: Sun May 19, 2024 11:20 pm Post subject:
A Mad Chinaman wrote:
No superstars would seriously challenged HCs like Phil (along with others like Pop).
Spoetra is successfuly because Riles has his back and Heat has no bonafide superstars (When Jimmy Buckets challenged Heat Culture, Riles made sure that there will be only people who have "Bought In" to Heat Culture will remain.
Pop's track record provide him the cachet to go through building stages the Spurs roster through draft choices, that got shortened with the arrival of Wemby
Kerr's track record and relationship with Steph provide him great latitude and freedom through challenging times
Clips fans want TLue out, even though he is avery good coach. Clips proclaimed strongest and balanced roster with three future HOFer can't overcome players earning/soon earning for the net few years making $50+ a year unable to play more than 60+ games a year - as seen the last four years
If J.J. is the next HC, he will need to have very experienced Assistant Head Coaches that will provide confidence in J.J.'s decisions (as oppose to the great inexperience in Ham's assistant head coaches - outside of Handy).
Many people have wondered why Coach Bud wasn't contacted or strongly considered. Reason - He is just an advance version of Ham and unable to bring out the best in the Greek Freak - consistently, even with a supposedly stronger roster.
Does LBJ/AD have confidence in Handy. If so, why isn't Handy being considered
Ironic that these Lakers would have a great chance of beating the TWolves and Mavs. Maybe the Lakers did the TWolves by wearing out the Nuggets during their playoff series - lol!!
What did Butler do to challenge Heat culture? And how did Spoelstra manage LeBron, Wade, and Bosh? _________________ Damian Lillard shatters Dwight Coward's championship dreams:
I'm glad I can just opt out of Phil Jackson conversations in the year 2024.
Re: Nori, I'm still concerned about simplistic "Minnesota defense good, Micah Nori is defensive coordinator => Nori is a great candidate" philosophy. As mentioned I'd be worried about the offense under Nori, but ultimately I suppose it'd depend on who the assistants are
I'm glad I can just opt out of Phil Jackson conversations in the year 2024.
Re: Nori, I'm still concerned about simplistic "Minnesota defense good, Micah Nori is defensive coordinator => Nori is a great candidate" philosophy. As mentioned I'd be worried about the offense under Nori, but ultimately I suppose it'd depend on who the assistants are
I'm glad I can just opt out of Phil Jackson conversations in the year 2024.
Re: Nori, I'm still concerned about simplistic "Minnesota defense good, Micah Nori is defensive coordinator => Nori is a great candidate" philosophy. As mentioned I'd be worried about the offense under Nori, but ultimately I suppose it'd depend on who the assistants are
Micah Nori: (Defense)
Alvin Gentry, Mike D'Antoni: (Offense)
I'm glad I can just opt out of Phil Jackson conversations in the year 2024.
Re: Nori, I'm still concerned about simplistic "Minnesota defense good, Micah Nori is defensive coordinator => Nori is a great candidate" philosophy. As mentioned I'd be worried about the offense under Nori, but ultimately I suppose it'd depend on who the assistants are
Micah Nori: (Defense)
Alvin Gentry, Mike D'Antoni: (Offense)
Lebron would stop listening to Nori at the first sign of trouble. AD would just side with Bron. It would be over before it started. I’m 100% convinced the next coach is going to be JJ or some other Bron guy to see him get his farewell tour. That’s all that matters to ownership. Staying relevant. Staying in the spotlight. Desperately at that.
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 68621 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
Posted: Mon May 20, 2024 7:04 am Post subject:
kfkilla wrote:
MJST wrote:
tox wrote:
I'm glad I can just opt out of Phil Jackson conversations in the year 2024.
Re: Nori, I'm still concerned about simplistic "Minnesota defense good, Micah Nori is defensive coordinator => Nori is a great candidate" philosophy. As mentioned I'd be worried about the offense under Nori, but ultimately I suppose it'd depend on who the assistants are
Micah Nori: (Defense)
Alvin Gentry, Mike D'Antoni: (Offense)
Lebron would stop listening to Nori at the first sign of trouble. AD would just side with Bron. It would be over before it started. I’m 100% convinced the next coach is going to be JJ or some other Bron guy to see him get his farewell tour. That’s all that matters to ownership. Staying relevant. Staying in the spotlight. Desperately at that.
A name not mentioned in the coaching convo's is Kendrick Perkins. Listening to his analyst he knows X's and O's. I don't know how he'd relate to players. He impresses me as a man who would get their respect. I think Bron and AD would listen to him thus would the team. _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
I'm glad I can just opt out of Phil Jackson conversations in the year 2024.
Re: Nori, I'm still concerned about simplistic "Minnesota defense good, Micah Nori is defensive coordinator => Nori is a great candidate" philosophy. As mentioned I'd be worried about the offense under Nori, but ultimately I suppose it'd depend on who the assistants are
Micah Nori: (Defense)
Alvin Gentry, Mike D'Antoni: (Offense)
Lebron would stop listening to Nori at the first sign of trouble. AD would just side with Bron. It would be over before it started. I’m 100% convinced the next coach is going to be JJ or some other Bron guy to see him get his farewell tour. That’s all that matters to ownership. Staying relevant. Staying in the spotlight. Desperately at that.
pretty much. I can see JJ drawing up a play and Bron say: Thats great, but instead of this lets do this etc etc.
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