CLIPPERS -at- LAKERS - 12/13 - Thoughts and :-)) Ratings
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DancingBarry
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2020 11:25 am    Post subject:

governator wrote:
Whoa 19-11-2 and I thought montrezl was bully ball Randle a little bit, better than my eye test (prob cause THT and Gasol looked so good on offense, everybody else looked just ok)


He's got some finesse to his game with his floater. I think he prefers to get into range for that versus taking a jumper.

When he's on the left block and attacking then you'll get all that bully ball (along with beasting on the offensive glass).
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2020 11:29 am    Post subject:

ChefLinda wrote:
That was fun. And so great to see "Gasol -- " in the T&R again! Deja vu.


When he was talking in the post game, I was definitely having flashbacks.
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2020 11:33 am    Post subject:

Laker7 wrote:

Vogel is going to be playing 10-12 guys a night. Deeep team. A little nicked up? Take the night off. No problem. We got some guys who can play.

Starters: LBJ, AD, Gasol, KCP and Schroeder.
Bench: Caruso, THT, Kuzma, Harrell, Morris, Matthews
Deep bench: Cook, Dudley, McKinnie
2 Way: Kostas and Cacok


Yeah, I think guys are probably not going to want to mention they've got a bump or bruise, ha ha.

But you probably can't understate the importance of depth in this short turnaround for a defending champion.
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2020 11:55 am    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:


Gasol - Lakers can run the offense through him. A lot different than Dwight or McGee, this is more like a restricted minutes Jokic. He posts up, then will find an open shooter like THT or KCP. He can set a pick, set up to pop or stop mid roll catch and pass. If you cut, he finds you. Kuzma is a guy that should get minutes with Gasol, I agree. One of the suggestions I had in the T&R thread from previous game, we maybe take Gasol out early (6 min) and bring him back for a run with the 2nd unit. It is like Rondo IQ there. I'm telling you. You can not teach what Marc Gasol has. The way he can see a play develop before it actually develops. Rare bigman talent to have, and he has it. Gotta keep him fresh all season at 20-22 mpg, and peaking in playoff Gasol form.


He was finding guys. Even when the Clippers didn't make mistakes. I think the only passing we didn't see from him last night was the short-roll passing and the full-court outlets. I am really, really curious to see the combos with LeBron/AD on the move.

And, yes, I want him doing some of that Rondo work with the second units. We got some great cutters and can make teams pay.

There are passers and there are next level passers. You can't teach the next level. Magic was a next level passer, of course, but the team playing around him also became really good passers. With LeBron AND Gasol in the mix, I'll be really curious to see who it rubs off on. These guys have great court vision but also make the right pass and the extra pass -- that's what we should see rubbing off on people. And, really, if it doesn't you might stick out a little on this team if you aren't doing that. It's going to be fun to watch.
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2020 12:08 pm    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:


THT - His confidence is sky high. He is taking open shots without hesitation and creating some stuff off the dribble that is scary good. Wonder what happens when teams start to respect him and focus on him defensively. I don't know if it's hot shooting or he really is this good a shooter now, but if he can make those spot up 3s on kick outs, this guy will get major minutes this season.


Yeah, that's hard to tell. He had some big G-League moments where you could tell he was just hot. He's so young, though, I'm optimistic he's just improving his consistency.

Quote:
I do think the amount of trust Frank has shown in him, is pretty cool.


Credit to Frank, for sure. Especially finding him a little run in the middle of the playoffs. But really, credit THT. If you are balling day after day in practice, you force a coach's hand.

Laker scouts and development staff kicking some ass. Even with Magic pissing away some talent around the edges on this team, we still were able to come up with Caruso, Kuz and THT with just a late first rounder and bought middle of the second pick.
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2020 12:21 pm    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:


Trez - One of the differences I notice immediately. Vs Dwight/McGee. When he sets a pick up high, he is a lot better at being able to catch the ball on the move, and then dribble a bit before taking a shot attempt. He is both a target for some at the rim action and some on the move dribble action. The Lakers have more flex with their options now, with this play. They almost never went to Dwight/McGee on the move, and instead waited for when they were at the rim. With both Trez and Gasol, you can trust them with the ball a bit earlier on the move after setting a screen. This gives your offense more unpredictability and harder to defend.


We couldn't take advantage of our height mismatches in the playoffs and our vertical spacing with McGee and Howard. That made it even more difficult to use them as they clogged the paint for LeBron on O and were liabilities at times on D despite the size. That kind of sealed their fate.

Both of the new bigs can at least provide some O when you give them the ball. Trezz on iso or on the move like you mention. Gasol in the high post and the trigger man. They don't become liabilities on offense anywhere near our previous bigs. The key is the D. Can we keep them from getting played off the floor? I think Vogel experimenting with zone early in the season is telling us that he wants to see if he can keep these bigs in the game when teams might be picking on them. Hard to predict trends after two games against one opponent, but it makes sense tactically.
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2020 3:35 pm    Post subject:

Great Game. I can see THT becoming a vital part of the team. That could mean decisions down the road on KK. But if he continues to progress, you aren't going to be able to deny him. I see him as a capable 2/3 defender. He reminds me a lot of Iggy. The way his body moves, etc. That's who I'd compare him to. Could be a good one.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 6:38 am    Post subject:

Threads like this after games is what makes it fun to come to the site

Look forward to another year, I think we are in for another long season with hurdles, but I think we have the pieces to overcome it all again.
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governator
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 6:58 am    Post subject:

DB addressing all concerns - big thumbs up!
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Startrout
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 9:17 am    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:
Threads like this after games is what makes it fun to come to the site

Look forward to another year, I think we are in for another long season with hurdles, but I think we have the pieces to overcome it all again.


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A Mad Chinaman
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 11:41 pm    Post subject:

DancingBarry wrote:
wolfpaclaker wrote:
Gasol - Lakers can run the offense through him. A lot different than Dwight or McGee, this is more like a restricted minutes Jokic. He posts up, then will find an open shooter like THT or KCP. He can set a pick, set up to pop or stop mid roll catch and pass. If you cut, he finds you. Kuzma is a guy that should get minutes with Gasol, I agree. One of the suggestions I had in the T&R thread from previous game, we maybe take Gasol out early (6 min) and bring him back for a run with the 2nd unit. It is like Rondo IQ there. I'm telling you. You can not teach what Marc Gasol has. The way he can see a play develop before it actually develops. Rare bigman talent to have, and he has it. Gotta keep him fresh all season at 20-22 mpg, and peaking in playoff Gasol form.
He was finding guys. Even when the Clippers didn't make mistakes. I think the only passing we didn't see from him last night was the short-roll passing and the full-court outlets. I am really, really curious to see the combos with LeBron/AD on the move.

And, yes, I want him doing some of that Rondo work with the second units. We got some great cutters and can make teams pay.

There are passers and there are next level passers. You can't teach the next level. Magic was a next level passer, of course, but the team playing around him also became really good passers. With LeBron AND Gasol in the mix, I'll be really curious to see who it rubs off on. These guys have great court vision but also make the right pass and the extra pass -- that's what we should see rubbing off on people. And, really, if it doesn't you might stick out a little on this team if you aren't doing that. It's going to be fun to watch.
Accurate assessment of Gasol. Instead of Playoff Rondo making those fantastic passes, it will be Gasol.

Given that 2 of our shotblockers (JaVale and Dwight) are gone, it will be fascinating the type of defense is being played when Gasol is in the game
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 11:44 pm    Post subject:

DancingBarry wrote:
wolfpaclaker wrote:
THT - His confidence is sky high. He is taking open shots without hesitation and creating some stuff off the dribble that is scary good. Wonder what happens when teams start to respect him and focus on him defensively. I don't know if it's hot shooting or he really is this good a shooter now, but if he can make those spot up 3s on kick outs, this guy will get major minutes this season.
Yeah, that's hard to tell. He had some big G-League moments where you could tell he was just hot. He's so young, though, I'm optimistic he's just improving his consistency.
Quote:
I do think the amount of trust Frank has shown in him, is pretty cool.
Credit to Frank, for sure. Especially finding him a little run in the middle of the playoffs. But really, credit THT. If you are balling day after day in practice, you force a coach's hand.

Laker scouts and development staff kicking some ass. Even with Magic pissing away some talent around the edges on this team, we still were able to come up with Caruso, Kuz and THT with just a late first rounder and bought middle of the second pick.
As stated by Big Game and Fish, once TNT are on the opposing team's scouting report - how will he adapt and develop counters to his present moves
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A Mad Chinaman
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 11:52 pm    Post subject:

DancingBarry wrote:
wolfpaclaker wrote:
Trez - One of the differences I notice immediately. Vs Dwight/McGee. When he sets a pick up high, he is a lot better at being able to catch the ball on the move, and then dribble a bit before taking a shot attempt. He is both a target for some at the rim action and some on the move dribble action. The Lakers have more flex with their options now, with this play. They almost never went to Dwight/McGee on the move, and instead waited for when they were at the rim. With both Trez and Gasol, you can trust them with the ball a bit earlier on the move after setting a screen. This gives your offense more unpredictability and harder to defend.
We couldn't take advantage of our height mismatches in the playoffs and our vertical spacing with McGee and Howard. That made it even more difficult to use them as they clogged the paint for LeBron on O and were liabilities at times on D despite the size. That kind of sealed their fate.

Both of the new bigs can at least provide some O when you give them the ball. Trezz on iso or on the move like you mention. Gasol in the high post and the trigger man. They don't become liabilities on offense anywhere near our previous bigs. The key is the D. Can we keep them from getting played off the floor? I think Vogel experimenting with zone early in the season is telling us that he wants to see if he can keep these bigs in the game when teams might be picking on them. Hard to predict trends after two games against one opponent, but it makes sense tactically.
With Gasol being a legimiate offense threat - opposing centers like Joker has to work on D.

Maybe Trez's motor will result in him beating his defender when transitioning to offense - ala The Mail Man (Karl Malone)!!
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DancingBarry
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 16, 2020 1:29 pm    Post subject:

^ I wonder what the data shows for how much Gasol moves on the court. I bet it's not a lot despite being a threat offensively.
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