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matrixskillz
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 Posted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:44 pm Post subject: |
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in terms of production, emmitt smith. in terms of talent, barry sanders. the man could move like nobody else i've ever seen at that position. was too young to watch jim brown or walter payton but old timers will probably say them.
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doughboy90650
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| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 1:11 pm Post subject: |
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| O-lines make a huge difference .... put Barry behind that Cowboy O -line and it's no telling what he would do. |
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Omar Little
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| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 2:07 pm Post subject: |
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| doughboy90650 wrote: | | O-lines make a huge difference .... put Barry behind that Cowboy O -line and it's no telling what he would do. |
Same with Payton.
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KobeBryantCliffordBrown
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| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 2:47 pm Post subject: |
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| 24 wrote: | | doughboy90650 wrote: | | O-lines make a huge difference .... put Barry behind that Cowboy O -line and it's no telling what he would do. |
Same with Payton. |
Those guys were better pure runners than E to be sure. But I'm not convinced that they would have necessarily done better with E's offensive line. E's skillset included an incredible way of being patient and letting his line set up the play, then at just the right moment, way later than other backs were ever able to do, hitting the exact right spot at exactly the right time. I just don't know enough about football to know if we could have for sure expected Barry and Walter to be able to do the same thing.
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Omar Little
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| Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 3:02 pm Post subject: |
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| KobeBryantCliffordBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | doughboy90650 wrote: | | O-lines make a huge difference .... put Barry behind that Cowboy O -line and it's no telling what he would do. |
Same with Payton. |
Those guys were better pure runners than E to be sure. But I'm not convinced that they would have necessarily done better with E's offensive line. E's skillset included an incredible way of being patient and letting his line set up the play, then at just the right moment, way later than other backs were ever able to do, hitting the exact right spot at exactly the right time. I just don't know enough about football to know if we could have for sure expected Barry and Walter to be able to do the same thing. |
Payton was THE master of timing, including his signature move, the stiff-legged shuffle step where he froze the immediate defender to allow the play to develop, then smoothly accelerated into the hole. He was also perhaps the best at finishing off a run. Unlike E though, he often had to create something with little or no holes created for him (unless you count letting the linemen and linebackers through to him a hole), so he had to simultaneously get out of his own backfield and read the field. Sanders did this as well, although he had a better line than Payton, as well as a ton more speed.
Payton was undersized, lacking in speed, and with a ridiculous lack of blocking. Add to that the bears had no real passing game, so the opponent knew it was coming, yet he still managed to do his thing. Amazing combination of conditioning, skill, feel, toughness, and will...
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ssiknick833
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| Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 8:14 pm Post subject: |
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OJ Simpson
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doughboy90650
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| Posted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 7:32 am Post subject: |
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| ssiknick833 wrote: | | OJ Simpson |
Known for slicing and dicing his way through opponents. He was actually a damn good back ..... |
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Chef Green
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| Posted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 3:48 pm Post subject: |
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Not #1, but I loved Marshall Faulk. Great moves, great hands, underrated pass blocker.
Best guy I've ever seen play was Walter Payton.
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Omar Little
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| Posted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 3:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Chef Green wrote: | Not #1, but I loved Marshall Faulk. Great moves, great hands, underrated pass blocker.
Best guy I've ever seen play was Walter Payton. |
Befitting a chef, you recognize quality of ingredients over flashy presentation...
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Socks
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| Posted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 4:24 pm Post subject: |
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I'm partial to Sweetness too. Loved watching him finish off runs popping his tacklers. And to watch him mix it up with the full package of elusiveness and gear shifting was just a joy.
They both had bad O-lines, but where I would put Payton above Sanders is that even with a bad O-line you could give it to him at the goal line and feel like he had the power to pound it in. Sanders was great, but not necessarily a guy you want pounding it in when you need one or two yards. |
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Omar Little
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| Posted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 4:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Socks wrote: | I'm partial to Sweetness too. Loved watching him finish off runs popping his tacklers. And to watch him mix it up with the full package of elusiveness and gear shifting was just a joy.
They both had bad O-lines, but where I would put Payton above Sanders is that even with a bad O-line you could give it to him at the goal line and feel like he had the power to pound it in. Sanders was great, but not necessarily a guy you want pounding it in when you need one or two yards. |
Sanders was positively the most elusive running back I've ever seen. But like you said, he didn't have that same desire in the trenches. Payton also made an art of that leap over the top. He may not have had elite speed, but he had hops to spare.
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LarryCoon
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| Posted: Mon Sep 14, 2009 6:34 pm Post subject: |
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| 24 wrote: | | Chef Green wrote: | Not #1, but I loved Marshall Faulk. Great moves, great hands, underrated pass blocker.
Best guy I've ever seen play was Walter Payton. |
Befitting a chef, you recognize quality of ingredients over flashy presentation... |
I've eaten his cooking. Don't let him kid you, he's ALL about flashy presentation. |
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LuxuryBrown
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| Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 11:23 am Post subject: |
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| Chef Green wrote: | Not #1, but I loved Marshall Faulk. Great moves, great hands, underrated pass blocker.
Best guy I've ever seen play was Walter Payton. |
Faulk was the greatest all around back ever:
Great Runner
Great Blocker
Great Receiver
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Omar Little
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| Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 11:33 am Post subject: |
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| LuxuryBrown wrote: | | Chef Green wrote: | Not #1, but I loved Marshall Faulk. Great moves, great hands, underrated pass blocker.
Best guy I've ever seen play was Walter Payton. |
Faulk was the greatest all around back ever:
Great Runner
Great Blocker
Great Receiver |
With all due respect to roger craig, thurman thomas, ladanian thomas, and marcus allen, not to mention payton (who was a better runner and blocker, and could easily have ammassed the receiving yards if he played in a system that threw him the ball)
BTW, Payton played QB one game, when the Bears were ravaged by injuries.
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LuxuryBrown
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| Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 12:17 pm Post subject: |
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| 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | Chef Green wrote: | Not #1, but I loved Marshall Faulk. Great moves, great hands, underrated pass blocker.
Best guy I've ever seen play was Walter Payton. |
Faulk was the greatest all around back ever:
Great Runner
Great Blocker
Great Receiver |
With all due respect to roger craig, thurman thomas, ladanian thomas, and marcus allen, not to mention payton (who was a better runner and blocker, and could easily have ammassed the receiving yards if he played in a system that threw him the ball)
BTW, Payton played QB one game, when the Bears were ravaged by injuries. |
Naw, dawg...the difference when Faulk lined up at WR...CORNERBACKS used to say he's basically a widout with a RB number on his jersey. None of those cats you mentioned ran routes as crisp as Faulk did. It was amazing watching him lineup as a WR and LOOK EXACTLY LIKE A WR as he ran his routes. Faulk could've played WR in the NFL as his MAIN position.
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Omar Little
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| Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 12:26 pm Post subject: |
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| LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | Chef Green wrote: | Not #1, but I loved Marshall Faulk. Great moves, great hands, underrated pass blocker.
Best guy I've ever seen play was Walter Payton. |
Faulk was the greatest all around back ever:
Great Runner
Great Blocker
Great Receiver |
With all due respect to roger craig, thurman thomas, ladanian thomas, and marcus allen, not to mention payton (who was a better runner and blocker, and could easily have ammassed the receiving yards if he played in a system that threw him the ball)
BTW, Payton played QB one game, when the Bears were ravaged by injuries. |
Naw, dawg...the difference when Faulk lined up at WR...CORNERBACKS used to say he's basically a widout with a RB number on his jersey. None of those cats you mentioned ran routes as crisp as Faulk did. It was amazing watching him lineup as a WR and LOOK EXACTLY LIKE A WR as he ran his routes. Faulk could've played WR in the NFL as his MAIN position. |
Really? You think guys with great hands, speed, and the quick, precise footwork necessary to be great running backs would have a problem running routes?
And yeah, that's why Faulk added up all the receiving yards. He often was a receiver in that offense.
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LuxuryBrown
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| Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 12:39 pm Post subject: |
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| 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | Chef Green wrote: | Not #1, but I loved Marshall Faulk. Great moves, great hands, underrated pass blocker.
Best guy I've ever seen play was Walter Payton. |
Faulk was the greatest all around back ever:
Great Runner
Great Blocker
Great Receiver |
With all due respect to roger craig, thurman thomas, ladanian thomas, and marcus allen, not to mention payton (who was a better runner and blocker, and could easily have ammassed the receiving yards if he played in a system that threw him the ball)
BTW, Payton played QB one game, when the Bears were ravaged by injuries. |
Naw, dawg...the difference when Faulk lined up at WR...CORNERBACKS used to say he's basically a widout with a RB number on his jersey. None of those cats you mentioned ran routes as crisp as Faulk did. It was amazing watching him lineup as a WR and LOOK EXACTLY LIKE A WR as he ran his routes. Faulk could've played WR in the NFL as his MAIN position. |
Really? You think guys with great hands, speed, and the quick, precise footwork necessary to be great running backs would have a problem running routes?
And yeah, that's why Faulk added up all the receiving yards. He often was a receiver in that offense. |
Running a route and running the rock are different. The cuts, change os pace/speed are different as well. Route running isn't an easy thing to pick up. The thing what set faulk apart from those other RBs you mentioned is that he ran routes like a WR, so it would seem that a transition to WR would be much easier for him than it would Roger Craig or even Larry centers, a helluva receiving RB in his own right.
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Omar Little
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Posts: 90307
Location: Formerly Known As 24
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| Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 1:15 pm Post subject: |
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| LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | Chef Green wrote: | Not #1, but I loved Marshall Faulk. Great moves, great hands, underrated pass blocker.
Best guy I've ever seen play was Walter Payton. |
Faulk was the greatest all around back ever:
Great Runner
Great Blocker
Great Receiver |
With all due respect to roger craig, thurman thomas, ladanian thomas, and marcus allen, not to mention payton (who was a better runner and blocker, and could easily have ammassed the receiving yards if he played in a system that threw him the ball)
BTW, Payton played QB one game, when the Bears were ravaged by injuries. |
Naw, dawg...the difference when Faulk lined up at WR...CORNERBACKS used to say he's basically a widout with a RB number on his jersey. None of those cats you mentioned ran routes as crisp as Faulk did. It was amazing watching him lineup as a WR and LOOK EXACTLY LIKE A WR as he ran his routes. Faulk could've played WR in the NFL as his MAIN position. |
Really? You think guys with great hands, speed, and the quick, precise footwork necessary to be great running backs would have a problem running routes?
And yeah, that's why Faulk added up all the receiving yards. He often was a receiver in that offense. |
Running a route and running the rock are different. The cuts, change os pace/speed are different as well. Route running isn't an easy thing to pick up. The thing what set faulk apart from those other RBs you mentioned is that he ran routes like a WR, so it would seem that a transition to WR would be much easier for him than it would Roger Craig or even Larry centers, a helluva receiving RB in his own right. |
Like I said, watch some Marcus Allen or Roger Craig, or even Thurman Thomas. Easily Faulk's equal, and Allen was a better runners to boot.
Marcus Allen may be the most underrated back of all time...
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“We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel |
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LuxuryBrown
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Joined: 09 Jun 2006
Posts: 17429
Location: Mackadocious, Ca.
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| Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 2:20 pm Post subject: |
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| 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | Chef Green wrote: | Not #1, but I loved Marshall Faulk. Great moves, great hands, underrated pass blocker.
Best guy I've ever seen play was Walter Payton. |
Faulk was the greatest all around back ever:
Great Runner
Great Blocker
Great Receiver |
With all due respect to roger craig, thurman thomas, ladanian thomas, and marcus allen, not to mention payton (who was a better runner and blocker, and could easily have ammassed the receiving yards if he played in a system that threw him the ball)
BTW, Payton played QB one game, when the Bears were ravaged by injuries. |
Naw, dawg...the difference when Faulk lined up at WR...CORNERBACKS used to say he's basically a widout with a RB number on his jersey. None of those cats you mentioned ran routes as crisp as Faulk did. It was amazing watching him lineup as a WR and LOOK EXACTLY LIKE A WR as he ran his routes. Faulk could've played WR in the NFL as his MAIN position. |
Really? You think guys with great hands, speed, and the quick, precise footwork necessary to be great running backs would have a problem running routes?
And yeah, that's why Faulk added up all the receiving yards. He often was a receiver in that offense. |
Running a route and running the rock are different. The cuts, change os pace/speed are different as well. Route running isn't an easy thing to pick up. The thing what set faulk apart from those other RBs you mentioned is that he ran routes like a WR, so it would seem that a transition to WR would be much easier for him than it would Roger Craig or even Larry centers, a helluva receiving RB in his own right. |
Like I said, watch some Marcus Allen or Roger Craig, or even Thurman Thomas. Easily Faulk's equal, and Allen was a better runners to boot.
Marcus Allen may be the most underrated back of all time... |
I've seen all of them play, and not one of them lines up at WR and runs routes better than Faulk. Marcus was probably the better thrower between Faulk and he, but Faulk would own him at the WR spot.
_________________
| Quote: | Smooth, but I move like an army / Bulletproof down in case brothas try to bomb me / Puttin' brothas to rest like Elliot Ness / Cuz I don't like stress
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Omar Little
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Joined: 02 May 2005
Posts: 90307
Location: Formerly Known As 24
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| Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 2:43 pm Post subject: |
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| LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | Chef Green wrote: | Not #1, but I loved Marshall Faulk. Great moves, great hands, underrated pass blocker.
Best guy I've ever seen play was Walter Payton. |
Faulk was the greatest all around back ever:
Great Runner
Great Blocker
Great Receiver |
With all due respect to roger craig, thurman thomas, ladanian thomas, and marcus allen, not to mention payton (who was a better runner and blocker, and could easily have ammassed the receiving yards if he played in a system that threw him the ball)
BTW, Payton played QB one game, when the Bears were ravaged by injuries. |
Naw, dawg...the difference when Faulk lined up at WR...CORNERBACKS used to say he's basically a widout with a RB number on his jersey. None of those cats you mentioned ran routes as crisp as Faulk did. It was amazing watching him lineup as a WR and LOOK EXACTLY LIKE A WR as he ran his routes. Faulk could've played WR in the NFL as his MAIN position. |
Really? You think guys with great hands, speed, and the quick, precise footwork necessary to be great running backs would have a problem running routes?
And yeah, that's why Faulk added up all the receiving yards. He often was a receiver in that offense. |
Running a route and running the rock are different. The cuts, change os pace/speed are different as well. Route running isn't an easy thing to pick up. The thing what set faulk apart from those other RBs you mentioned is that he ran routes like a WR, so it would seem that a transition to WR would be much easier for him than it would Roger Craig or even Larry centers, a helluva receiving RB in his own right. |
Like I said, watch some Marcus Allen or Roger Craig, or even Thurman Thomas. Easily Faulk's equal, and Allen was a better runners to boot.
Marcus Allen may be the most underrated back of all time... |
I've seen all of them play, and not one of them lines up at WR and runs routes better than Faulk. Marcus was probably the better thrower between Faulk and he, but Faulk would own him at the WR spot. |
Might be because none of them played in offensive systems that had them do that. MA revolutionized the idea of the RB as a pass receiver (at least more than the typical relief valve in the flat or screen pass recipient), and Craig carried on that legacy (Faulk benefitted greatly from this). It's a ridiculous notion that either couldn't line up at wide receiver and be a star. They didn't because they were RB's which is the harder of the two positions to be. I suspect most RB's with good hands could play WR, but very few WR's could be successful running backs.
Faulk just benefitted from advances in the game, advances pioneered by the other guys. Today, there's a ton of backs that are hybridized with the WR position in certain formations and plays. It wasn't that he had a unique and heretofore unseen skill set.
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“We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel |
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LuxuryBrown
Franchise Player
Joined: 09 Jun 2006
Posts: 17429
Location: Mackadocious, Ca.
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| Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 3:09 pm Post subject: |
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| 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | Chef Green wrote: | Not #1, but I loved Marshall Faulk. Great moves, great hands, underrated pass blocker.
Best guy I've ever seen play was Walter Payton. |
Faulk was the greatest all around back ever:
Great Runner
Great Blocker
Great Receiver |
With all due respect to roger craig, thurman thomas, ladanian thomas, and marcus allen, not to mention payton (who was a better runner and blocker, and could easily have ammassed the receiving yards if he played in a system that threw him the ball)
BTW, Payton played QB one game, when the Bears were ravaged by injuries. |
Naw, dawg...the difference when Faulk lined up at WR...CORNERBACKS used to say he's basically a widout with a RB number on his jersey. None of those cats you mentioned ran routes as crisp as Faulk did. It was amazing watching him lineup as a WR and LOOK EXACTLY LIKE A WR as he ran his routes. Faulk could've played WR in the NFL as his MAIN position. |
Really? You think guys with great hands, speed, and the quick, precise footwork necessary to be great running backs would have a problem running routes?
And yeah, that's why Faulk added up all the receiving yards. He often was a receiver in that offense. |
Running a route and running the rock are different. The cuts, change os pace/speed are different as well. Route running isn't an easy thing to pick up. The thing what set faulk apart from those other RBs you mentioned is that he ran routes like a WR, so it would seem that a transition to WR would be much easier for him than it would Roger Craig or even Larry centers, a helluva receiving RB in his own right. |
Like I said, watch some Marcus Allen or Roger Craig, or even Thurman Thomas. Easily Faulk's equal, and Allen was a better runners to boot.
Marcus Allen may be the most underrated back of all time... |
I've seen all of them play, and not one of them lines up at WR and runs routes better than Faulk. Marcus was probably the better thrower between Faulk and he, but Faulk would own him at the WR spot. |
Might be because none of them played in offensive systems that had them do that. MA revolutionized the idea of the RB as a pass receiver (at least more than the typical relief valve in the flat or screen pass recipient), and Craig carried on that legacy (Faulk benefitted greatly from this). It's a ridiculous notion that either couldn't line up at wide receiver and be a star. They didn't because they were RB's which is the harder of the two positions to be. I suspect most RB's with good hands could play WR, but very few WR's could be successful running backs.
Faulk just benefitted from advances in the game, advances pioneered by the other guys. Today, there's a ton of backs that are hybridized with the WR position in certain formations and plays. It wasn't that he had a unique and heretofore unseen skill set. |
System or not, If your eye isn't trained to be able to see how each player runs routes, out of the backfield or out of the X, Y or Z, then you're not gonna be able to notice the nuances of route running, therefore, you aren't gonna notice the differences in how those RBs run routes. Those of us that can do that - DBs especially - notice that Faulk's ability easily translates into WR. This isn't about who advanced the game, this is about who's the best RB that can line up at WR. That answer is Faulk.
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| Quote: | Smooth, but I move like an army / Bulletproof down in case brothas try to bomb me / Puttin' brothas to rest like Elliot Ness / Cuz I don't like stress
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Omar Little
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Joined: 02 May 2005
Posts: 90307
Location: Formerly Known As 24
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| Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 3:15 pm Post subject: |
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| LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | Chef Green wrote: | Not #1, but I loved Marshall Faulk. Great moves, great hands, underrated pass blocker.
Best guy I've ever seen play was Walter Payton. |
Faulk was the greatest all around back ever:
Great Runner
Great Blocker
Great Receiver |
With all due respect to roger craig, thurman thomas, ladanian thomas, and marcus allen, not to mention payton (who was a better runner and blocker, and could easily have ammassed the receiving yards if he played in a system that threw him the ball)
BTW, Payton played QB one game, when the Bears were ravaged by injuries. |
Naw, dawg...the difference when Faulk lined up at WR...CORNERBACKS used to say he's basically a widout with a RB number on his jersey. None of those cats you mentioned ran routes as crisp as Faulk did. It was amazing watching him lineup as a WR and LOOK EXACTLY LIKE A WR as he ran his routes. Faulk could've played WR in the NFL as his MAIN position. |
Really? You think guys with great hands, speed, and the quick, precise footwork necessary to be great running backs would have a problem running routes?
And yeah, that's why Faulk added up all the receiving yards. He often was a receiver in that offense. |
Running a route and running the rock are different. The cuts, change os pace/speed are different as well. Route running isn't an easy thing to pick up. The thing what set faulk apart from those other RBs you mentioned is that he ran routes like a WR, so it would seem that a transition to WR would be much easier for him than it would Roger Craig or even Larry centers, a helluva receiving RB in his own right. |
Like I said, watch some Marcus Allen or Roger Craig, or even Thurman Thomas. Easily Faulk's equal, and Allen was a better runners to boot.
Marcus Allen may be the most underrated back of all time... |
I've seen all of them play, and not one of them lines up at WR and runs routes better than Faulk. Marcus was probably the better thrower between Faulk and he, but Faulk would own him at the WR spot. |
Might be because none of them played in offensive systems that had them do that. MA revolutionized the idea of the RB as a pass receiver (at least more than the typical relief valve in the flat or screen pass recipient), and Craig carried on that legacy (Faulk benefitted greatly from this). It's a ridiculous notion that either couldn't line up at wide receiver and be a star. They didn't because they were RB's which is the harder of the two positions to be. I suspect most RB's with good hands could play WR, but very few WR's could be successful running backs.
Faulk just benefitted from advances in the game, advances pioneered by the other guys. Today, there's a ton of backs that are hybridized with the WR position in certain formations and plays. It wasn't that he had a unique and heretofore unseen skill set. |
System or not, If your eye isn't trained to be able to see how each player runs routes, out of the backfield or out of the X, Y or Z, then you're not gonna be able to notice the nuances of route running, therefore, you aren't gonna notice the differences in how those RBs run routes. Those of us that can do that - DBs especially - notice that Faulk's ability easily translates into WR. This isn't about who advanced the game, this is about who's the best RB that can line up at WR. That answer is Faulk. |
 I was a free safety. Try a new argument!
_________________
“We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel |
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LuxuryBrown
Franchise Player
Joined: 09 Jun 2006
Posts: 17429
Location: Mackadocious, Ca.
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| Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 3:24 pm Post subject: |
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| 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | Chef Green wrote: | Not #1, but I loved Marshall Faulk. Great moves, great hands, underrated pass blocker.
Best guy I've ever seen play was Walter Payton. |
Faulk was the greatest all around back ever:
Great Runner
Great Blocker
Great Receiver |
With all due respect to roger craig, thurman thomas, ladanian thomas, and marcus allen, not to mention payton (who was a better runner and blocker, and could easily have ammassed the receiving yards if he played in a system that threw him the ball)
BTW, Payton played QB one game, when the Bears were ravaged by injuries. |
Naw, dawg...the difference when Faulk lined up at WR...CORNERBACKS used to say he's basically a widout with a RB number on his jersey. None of those cats you mentioned ran routes as crisp as Faulk did. It was amazing watching him lineup as a WR and LOOK EXACTLY LIKE A WR as he ran his routes. Faulk could've played WR in the NFL as his MAIN position. |
Really? You think guys with great hands, speed, and the quick, precise footwork necessary to be great running backs would have a problem running routes?
And yeah, that's why Faulk added up all the receiving yards. He often was a receiver in that offense. |
Running a route and running the rock are different. The cuts, change os pace/speed are different as well. Route running isn't an easy thing to pick up. The thing what set faulk apart from those other RBs you mentioned is that he ran routes like a WR, so it would seem that a transition to WR would be much easier for him than it would Roger Craig or even Larry centers, a helluva receiving RB in his own right. |
Like I said, watch some Marcus Allen or Roger Craig, or even Thurman Thomas. Easily Faulk's equal, and Allen was a better runners to boot.
Marcus Allen may be the most underrated back of all time... |
I've seen all of them play, and not one of them lines up at WR and runs routes better than Faulk. Marcus was probably the better thrower between Faulk and he, but Faulk would own him at the WR spot. |
Might be because none of them played in offensive systems that had them do that. MA revolutionized the idea of the RB as a pass receiver (at least more than the typical relief valve in the flat or screen pass recipient), and Craig carried on that legacy (Faulk benefitted greatly from this). It's a ridiculous notion that either couldn't line up at wide receiver and be a star. They didn't because they were RB's which is the harder of the two positions to be. I suspect most RB's with good hands could play WR, but very few WR's could be successful running backs.
Faulk just benefitted from advances in the game, advances pioneered by the other guys. Today, there's a ton of backs that are hybridized with the WR position in certain formations and plays. It wasn't that he had a unique and heretofore unseen skill set. |
System or not, If your eye isn't trained to be able to see how each player runs routes, out of the backfield or out of the X, Y or Z, then you're not gonna be able to notice the nuances of route running, therefore, you aren't gonna notice the differences in how those RBs run routes. Those of us that can do that - DBs especially - notice that Faulk's ability easily translates into WR. This isn't about who advanced the game, this is about who's the best RB that can line up at WR. That answer is Faulk. |
I was a free safety. Try a new argument! |
And that means your eye is as good as Lawyer Milloy's? Try a MUCH better argument!
_________________
| Quote: | Smooth, but I move like an army / Bulletproof down in case brothas try to bomb me / Puttin' brothas to rest like Elliot Ness / Cuz I don't like stress
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Omar Little
Moderator
Joined: 02 May 2005
Posts: 90307
Location: Formerly Known As 24
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| Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 3:28 pm Post subject: |
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| LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | Chef Green wrote: | Not #1, but I loved Marshall Faulk. Great moves, great hands, underrated pass blocker.
Best guy I've ever seen play was Walter Payton. |
Faulk was the greatest all around back ever:
Great Runner
Great Blocker
Great Receiver |
With all due respect to roger craig, thurman thomas, ladanian thomas, and marcus allen, not to mention payton (who was a better runner and blocker, and could easily have ammassed the receiving yards if he played in a system that threw him the ball)
BTW, Payton played QB one game, when the Bears were ravaged by injuries. |
Naw, dawg...the difference when Faulk lined up at WR...CORNERBACKS used to say he's basically a widout with a RB number on his jersey. None of those cats you mentioned ran routes as crisp as Faulk did. It was amazing watching him lineup as a WR and LOOK EXACTLY LIKE A WR as he ran his routes. Faulk could've played WR in the NFL as his MAIN position. |
Really? You think guys with great hands, speed, and the quick, precise footwork necessary to be great running backs would have a problem running routes?
And yeah, that's why Faulk added up all the receiving yards. He often was a receiver in that offense. |
Running a route and running the rock are different. The cuts, change os pace/speed are different as well. Route running isn't an easy thing to pick up. The thing what set faulk apart from those other RBs you mentioned is that he ran routes like a WR, so it would seem that a transition to WR would be much easier for him than it would Roger Craig or even Larry centers, a helluva receiving RB in his own right. |
Like I said, watch some Marcus Allen or Roger Craig, or even Thurman Thomas. Easily Faulk's equal, and Allen was a better runners to boot.
Marcus Allen may be the most underrated back of all time... |
I've seen all of them play, and not one of them lines up at WR and runs routes better than Faulk. Marcus was probably the better thrower between Faulk and he, but Faulk would own him at the WR spot. |
Might be because none of them played in offensive systems that had them do that. MA revolutionized the idea of the RB as a pass receiver (at least more than the typical relief valve in the flat or screen pass recipient), and Craig carried on that legacy (Faulk benefitted greatly from this). It's a ridiculous notion that either couldn't line up at wide receiver and be a star. They didn't because they were RB's which is the harder of the two positions to be. I suspect most RB's with good hands could play WR, but very few WR's could be successful running backs.
Faulk just benefitted from advances in the game, advances pioneered by the other guys. Today, there's a ton of backs that are hybridized with the WR position in certain formations and plays. It wasn't that he had a unique and heretofore unseen skill set. |
System or not, If your eye isn't trained to be able to see how each player runs routes, out of the backfield or out of the X, Y or Z, then you're not gonna be able to notice the nuances of route running, therefore, you aren't gonna notice the differences in how those RBs run routes. Those of us that can do that - DBs especially - notice that Faulk's ability easily translates into WR. This isn't about who advanced the game, this is about who's the best RB that can line up at WR. That answer is Faulk. |
I was a free safety. Try a new argument! |
And that means your eye is as good as Lawyer Milloy's? Try a MUCH better argument! |
I've seen Lawyer Malloy, and you're no Lawyer Malloy...
(OK, I just wanted to use that line)
Malloy din't say anything about Faulk vs. Allen, or Craig, or Thomas, did he? So it could be true that if they lined up against him, he'd say the same thing, now couldn't it? Basic rules of evidence councilor...
_________________
“We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel |
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LuxuryBrown
Franchise Player
Joined: 09 Jun 2006
Posts: 17429
Location: Mackadocious, Ca.
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| Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 3:31 pm Post subject: |
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| 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | 24 wrote: | | LuxuryBrown wrote: | | Chef Green wrote: | Not #1, but I loved Marshall Faulk. Great moves, great hands, underrated pass blocker.
Best guy I've ever seen play was Walter Payton. |
Faulk was the greatest all around back ever:
Great Runner
Great Blocker
Great Receiver |
With all due respect to roger craig, thurman thomas, ladanian thomas, and marcus allen, not to mention payton (who was a better runner and blocker, and could easily have ammassed the receiving yards if he played in a system that threw him the ball)
BTW, Payton played QB one game, when the Bears were ravaged by injuries. |
Naw, dawg...the difference when Faulk lined up at WR...CORNERBACKS used to say he's basically a widout with a RB number on his jersey. None of those cats you mentioned ran routes as crisp as Faulk did. It was amazing watching him lineup as a WR and LOOK EXACTLY LIKE A WR as he ran his routes. Faulk could've played WR in the NFL as his MAIN position. |
Really? You think guys with great hands, speed, and the quick, precise footwork necessary to be great running backs would have a problem running routes?
And yeah, that's why Faulk added up all the receiving yards. He often was a receiver in that offense. |
Running a route and running the rock are different. The cuts, change os pace/speed are different as well. Route running isn't an easy thing to pick up. The thing what set faulk apart from those other RBs you mentioned is that he ran routes like a WR, so it would seem that a transition to WR would be much easier for him than it would Roger Craig or even Larry centers, a helluva receiving RB in his own right. |
Like I said, watch some Marcus Allen or Roger Craig, or even Thurman Thomas. Easily Faulk's equal, and Allen was a better runners to boot.
Marcus Allen may be the most underrated back of all time... |
I've seen all of them play, and not one of them lines up at WR and runs routes better than Faulk. Marcus was probably the better thrower between Faulk and he, but Faulk would own him at the WR spot. |
Might be because none of them played in offensive systems that had them do that. MA revolutionized the idea of the RB as a pass receiver (at least more than the typical relief valve in the flat or screen pass recipient), and Craig carried on that legacy (Faulk benefitted greatly from this). It's a ridiculous notion that either couldn't line up at wide receiver and be a star. They didn't because they were RB's which is the harder of the two positions to be. I suspect most RB's with good hands could play WR, but very few WR's could be successful running backs.
Faulk just benefitted from advances in the game, advances pioneered by the other guys. Today, there's a ton of backs that are hybridized with the WR position in certain formations and plays. It wasn't that he had a unique and heretofore unseen skill set. |
System or not, If your eye isn't trained to be able to see how each player runs routes, out of the backfield or out of the X, Y or Z, then you're not gonna be able to notice the nuances of route running, therefore, you aren't gonna notice the differences in how those RBs run routes. Those of us that can do that - DBs especially - notice that Faulk's ability easily translates into WR. This isn't about who advanced the game, this is about who's the best RB that can line up at WR. That answer is Faulk. |
I was a free safety. Try a new argument! |
And that means your eye is as good as Lawyer Milloy's? Try a MUCH better argument! |
I've seen Lawyer Malloy, and you're no Lawyer Malloy...
(OK, I just wanted to use that line)
Malloy din't say anything about Faulk vs. Allen, or Craig, or Thomas, did he? So it could be true that if they lined up against him, he'd say the same thing, now couldn't it? Basic rules of evidence councilor... |
And I never said Milloy said anything, I was just showing you that your eye for WRs isn't nearly as sharp as a pro's eye. What I DO know, is that Faulk got high praise from DBs about his WR skills, and I'm gonna take their word over the "Al Bundy of LG"! 
_________________
| Quote: | Smooth, but I move like an army / Bulletproof down in case brothas try to bomb me / Puttin' brothas to rest like Elliot Ness / Cuz I don't like stress
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