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LakersMD
Star Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2003
Posts: 8015
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 Posted: Sat Apr 11, 2009 1:07 pm Post subject: |
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Move Walton back into the starting lineup, because he's better in the halfcourt style that the first unit tends to play, and because he'll have 2 bigs behind him to bail him out defensively. Shooting is a wash between Ariza and Walton.
Move Ariza back to the same 2nd unit with Odom that was killing teams at the beginning of the season with pressure defense and transition offense.
Use Sasha at the 2 and Kobe at the 3 more often. That may mean Phil has to limit Walton's minutes, but so be it.
Do not go to the sideline pick and roll so early in the fourth quarter. It's too easy to defend with a zone, and especially when Kobe is a reluctant passer.
This team won't win the title until they realize that their biggest advantage is their size in the paint. Two shots between Bynum and Gasol in the fourth quarter is inexcusable. |
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ocho
Retired Number
Joined: 24 May 2005
Posts: 53939
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| Posted: Sat Apr 11, 2009 1:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | "Nate McMillan knows how to defend Kobe after dealing with him in the summer," said our substitute coach Kurt Rambis in the Times. "He was going to converge on him and make it very difficult for Kobe to get into those high-quality environments. Kobe had hit those long shots in the past, but there were times I just felt that we should have gotten better shots." |
In other words, Nate knows what the rest of the league knows and what every fan watching at home knows.
In the last 3 minutes of the game, Kobe will look to take every shot and our offense becomes completely predictable. If he's having a cold night, he will not adjust his game, and he will continue to brick contested double team 3 pointers from 5 feet beyond the arc.
I don't know why a team with such a potent offense decides to completely scrap it when the game matters most in favor of an offense that is dependent on one player going against 5. Crunch time is when we need triangle execution the most, not [DELETED] measuring contests. And this isn't just to blame Kobe. The coaching staff clearly condones this strategy. All it does is make our game plan completely predictable and bogged down.
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knhellesky
Star Player
Joined: 03 Mar 2009
Posts: 1527
Location: Big Red Country
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| Posted: Sat Apr 11, 2009 2:11 pm Post subject: |
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| ocho wrote: | | Quote: | | "Nate McMillan knows how to defend Kobe after dealing with him in the summer," said our substitute coach Kurt Rambis in the Times. "He was going to converge on him and make it very difficult for Kobe to get into those high-quality environments. Kobe had hit those long shots in the past, but there were times I just felt that we should have gotten better shots." |
In other words, Nate knows what the rest of the league knows and what every fan watching at home knows.
In the last 3 minutes of the game, Kobe will look to take every shot and our offense becomes completely predictable. If he's having a cold night, he will not adjust his game, and he will continue to brick contested double team 3 pointers from 5 feet beyond the arc.
I don't know why a team with such a potent offense decides to completely scrap it when the game matters most in favor of an offense that is dependent on one player going against 5. Crunch time is when we need triangle execution the most, not [DELETED] measuring contests. And this isn't just to blame Kobe. The coaching staff clearly condones this strategy. All it does is make our game plan completely predictable and bogged down. |
I agree.
Kobe says that he trusts his team mates; but he seemed determined (at least on this game) to take all the shots despite knowing that the other team will key on him to force his shots. |
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ocho
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Posts: 53939
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| Posted: Sat Apr 11, 2009 2:13 pm Post subject: |
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| knhellesky wrote: |
I agree.
Kobe says that he trusts his team mates; but he seemed determined (at least on this game) to take all the shots despite knowing that the other team will key on him to force his shots. |
And its not like he had the hot hand. He had the cold hand, and passed up the other players who were hot.
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Klone_dd
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Joined: 11 Mar 2002
Posts: 7330
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| Posted: Sat Apr 11, 2009 3:04 pm Post subject: |
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| Tick wrote: | | Klone_dd wrote: | | Tick wrote: | | 4) I didn't like his Time Out or final play. I know Kobe took the heat for missing a 3 pointer to tie the game, but since that play came right after Rambis's timeout, there is nobody on this planet that can convince me it wasn't a play Rambis drew up. |
Sure, like Kobe never breaks away from running the offense. 
There was plenty of time left on the clock when Kobe took that ill-advised shot with multiple hands in his face. The ball was given to him to make a play. It wasn't like Rambis told Kobe to jack it up as soon as he got it and you can't prove otherwise.
Kobe didn't play it very smart. Let him take some blame. He can deal with it. |
Again, it came right after a time out. Kobe can take the blame for missing the shot of course, but why did Rambis draw up that play? |
Do you really think that was the play Rambis designed? To have Kobe throw up a contested 3 with plenty of time to make a play? If anything, the play was designed to get Kobe the ball, which, of course, is where you want it. From that point on, it was all on Kobe to decide.
Rambis's comment afterwards: "Kobe had hit those long shots in the past, but there were times I just felt that we should have gotten better shots." |
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Tick
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Joined: 21 Apr 2006
Posts: 14967
Location: Raleigh, NC
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| Posted: Sat Apr 11, 2009 3:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Klone_dd wrote: | | Tick wrote: | | Klone_dd wrote: | | Tick wrote: | | 4) I didn't like his Time Out or final play. I know Kobe took the heat for missing a 3 pointer to tie the game, but since that play came right after Rambis's timeout, there is nobody on this planet that can convince me it wasn't a play Rambis drew up. |
Sure, like Kobe never breaks away from running the offense.
There was plenty of time left on the clock when Kobe took that ill-advised shot with multiple hands in his face. The ball was given to him to make a play. It wasn't like Rambis told Kobe to jack it up as soon as he got it and you can't prove otherwise.
Kobe didn't play it very smart. Let him take some blame. He can deal with it. |
Again, it came right after a time out. Kobe can take the blame for missing the shot of course, but why did Rambis draw up that play? |
Do you really think that was the play Rambis designed? To have Kobe throw up a contested 3 with plenty of time to make a play? If anything, the play was designed to get Kobe the ball, which, of course, is where you want it. From that point on, it was all on Kobe to decide.
Rambis's comment afterwards: "Kobe had hit those long shots in the past, but there were times I just felt that we should have gotten better shots." |
So what was the point of the timeout Kurt? |
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PopcornMachine
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Joined: 19 Apr 2001
Posts: 10566
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| Posted: Sat Apr 11, 2009 7:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Tick wrote: | | Klone_dd wrote: | | Tick wrote: | | Klone_dd wrote: | | Tick wrote: | | 4) I didn't like his Time Out or final play. I know Kobe took the heat for missing a 3 pointer to tie the game, but since that play came right after Rambis's timeout, there is nobody on this planet that can convince me it wasn't a play Rambis drew up. |
Sure, like Kobe never breaks away from running the offense.
There was plenty of time left on the clock when Kobe took that ill-advised shot with multiple hands in his face. The ball was given to him to make a play. It wasn't like Rambis told Kobe to jack it up as soon as he got it and you can't prove otherwise.
Kobe didn't play it very smart. Let him take some blame. He can deal with it. |
Again, it came right after a time out. Kobe can take the blame for missing the shot of course, but why did Rambis draw up that play? |
Do you really think that was the play Rambis designed? To have Kobe throw up a contested 3 with plenty of time to make a play? If anything, the play was designed to get Kobe the ball, which, of course, is where you want it. From that point on, it was all on Kobe to decide.
Rambis's comment afterwards: "Kobe had hit those long shots in the past, but there were times I just felt that we should have gotten better shots." |
So what was the point of the timeout Kurt? |
[sarcasm]Of course you're right. He called a time out, so they did exactly what he said. No question about it. I mean, there has never been a case of a team totally screwing up the coach's designed play after a time out.
Kobe in particular has NEVER done anything like that.
So it just can't happen. I think it's part of Einstein's law of relativity or something.[/sarcasm]
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Addicus
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Joined: 02 Sep 2005
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| Posted: Sat Apr 11, 2009 7:24 pm Post subject: |
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I didn't like the execution for the last minute and a half.
What really set that up though was the refs calling nothing for the Lakers in the 4th. Once again the officals were bullied by the crowd in the raucous arenas.
I just want the NBA to have games called the same on both ends all the time. Then the players decide the game.
Yes this goes for what happened Thursday at the Staples Center also in the last 5 minutes. Difference on Thursday is they called everything on everyone.
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Tony Almeida
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Joined: 05 Jan 2006
Posts: 12072
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| Posted: Sat Apr 11, 2009 8:21 pm Post subject: |
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| ocho wrote: | | knhellesky wrote: |
I agree.
Kobe says that he trusts his team mates; but he seemed determined (at least on this game) to take all the shots despite knowing that the other team will key on him to force his shots. |
And its not like he had the hot hand. He had the cold hand, and passed up the other players who were hot. |
Kobe came in at the 8:37 mark in the 4th, and had Bynum/Odom/Walton/Brown in the game with him --
Bynum missed a shot, Walton turned it over twice, and Brown made a shot before Kobe took his first shot (which he made).
At this point, Gasol and Ariza are in for Walton and Bynum.
Kobe makes another shot, but misses the next one.
Fisher subs in for Brown. Lineup is now Fisher/Kobe/Ariza/Odom/Gasol
Odom plays a little bit of volleyball at the hoop before finally tipping it in. Kobe scores on an and-1 layup (hits the FT). Kobe then goes to the line and hits two more free throws.
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We're now at the 3 minute mark of the game, still down 1. Kobe was not cold at this point -- 3-4 from the field since entering the game, 3-3 from the line.
There really wasn't a hot hand at this point outside of Kobe either --
Fisher was 1-6 (0-1) from three at this point. Ariza 2-4 (0-1 from three), in addition to several times where he hesitated to take the shot. One made jumper in the first half, the other make was a layup early in the third. Odom was 1-4 (had missed a jumper, a layup, and a tip, before converting on the tip in). Gasol had just checked in and had not taken a shot (he was 2-3 in the third, one make was off an oop dunk, another off a jumper set up by Kobe).
With all that said, I would have liked to see Kobe mix it up a bit more than he did, and done so by trying to involve Pau more. Not because Kobe was cold or Pau was imposing his will on the Blazers, but just to have more balance. And regardless of the numbers at this point, I always place more trust in the proven players who you rely on to come through.
As far as offense from the 3 minute mark until the end, I don't think the fault is all of Rambis for coaching, or Kobe for decision making, or Gasol for aggression, etc.. The team clearly did not execute (e.g. Fisher clanked a three that we're used to seeing him knock down) on the offensive end, but it should be noted that despite Kobe coming in and playing pretty well on offense to start the 4th, they were still losing by 1 before Kobe started clanking. Why? Defense. Some of which yes, Kobe definitely was responsible for. Just look at what the Blazers did on the offensive end before Kobe started clanking --
Oden hits 2 FTs. Outlaw misses 2 FTs. Roy makes a jumper. Fernandez misses a 3. Outlaw hits 2 FTs. Outlaw turns it over. Blake makes a jumper. Roy hits 2 FTs. Roy hits a jumper.
To summarize, out of the 9 possessions after Kobe came in, and before he started clanking, the Blazers scored on 6 of them. That's tough to overcome on the road, especially when the opposition is getting to the line, and the Lakers are in the penalty early on.
Now, as far as Kobe's play after the 3 minute mark. Four misses and a bad turnover. I didn't have any issue with three of the shots, one was a wide open mid range shot, the next was a three that I thought he had measured up well and was going to hit (he was 3-4 from three before this attempt), and the last shot didn't matter as the game was over. Now, the three out of the timeout was terrible. Doesn't really matter whether that was a set play, I think he could have done better than a quick launch from that distance. That was just a bad force as he can have that shot whenever he wants, and if that's really what he felt was best, he could have tried to measure it up before taking the shot, e.g. shots against the Rockets/Spurs, as there was more than enough time on the shot clock.
Though, all things considered, I'm not upset with this game. Second night of B2B, at the Rose Garden, and lopsided officiating (more than usual)? Not bad at all. This game was a lot more respectable than the blowout the last time they played, and that's encouraging heading into the playoffs especially when you consider that it was only Bynum's second game back. Just his presence on defense will be huge boost to this team once he gets his timing back.
Last edited by Tony Almeida on Sat Apr 11, 2009 9:25 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Tony Almeida
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| Posted: Sat Apr 11, 2009 9:14 pm Post subject: |
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Oh, and of course, as always, great job and thanks, DB!  |
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knhellesky
Star Player
Joined: 03 Mar 2009
Posts: 1527
Location: Big Red Country
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| Posted: Sat Apr 11, 2009 11:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Tony Almeida wrote: | | Oh, and of course, as always, great job and thanks, DB! |
+1  |
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DancingBarry
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Joined: 07 Sep 2001
Posts: 40216
Location: O.C.
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| Posted: Sun Apr 12, 2009 12:22 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
With all that said, I would have liked to see Kobe mix it up a bit more than he did, and done so by trying to involve Pau more. Not because Kobe was cold or Pau was imposing his will on the Blazers, but just to have more balance. And regardless of the numbers at this point, I always place more trust in the proven players who you rely on to come through.
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Agree. There's nothing wrong with the high screen attack. It's our bread and butter like most teams, but there are so many instances of us trying to continue to use it again and again the same way until it becomes increasingly less effective. Mix it up. Call for Pau to get the ball on the block and go to work. He's a proven All Star and our No. 2. If we keep throwing overhand rights instead of mixing a left in, an opponent will get better at blocking the right.
| Quote: |
Oden hits 2 FTs. Outlaw misses 2 FTs. Roy makes a jumper. Fernandez misses a 3. Outlaw hits 2 FTs. Outlaw turns it over. Blake makes a jumper. Roy hits 2 FTs. Roy hits a jumper.
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When we got into the penalty early in the fourth...I thought that was probably going to be all she wrote for us. We hung in there better than I expected, but we paid the price at the line in that quarter.
| Quote: |
Though, all things considered, I'm not upset with this game. Second night of B2B, at the Rose Garden, and lopsided officiating (more than usual)? Not bad at all. This game was a lot more respectable than the blowout the last time they played, and that's encouraging heading into the playoffs especially when you consider that it was only Bynum's second game back. Just his presence on defense will be huge boost to this team once he gets his timing back. |
I think our bigs ran out of gas in the second half. That hurt us. In the playoffs we will have rest between games and that shouldn't happen. Plus, I already know what Phil is thinking when watching our execution down the stretch of this game...he's said it before several times this season after this type of ending... that there are other ways to get ball penetration besides that high screen attack. They will have a more varied attack in crunch time if we face them again. |
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Arizona
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Joined: 11 Oct 2007
Posts: 3177
Location: PHX
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| Posted: Sun Apr 12, 2009 12:39 am Post subject: |
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| Tick wrote: | | Klone_dd wrote: | | Tick wrote: | | 4) I didn't like his Time Out or final play. I know Kobe took the heat for missing a 3 pointer to tie the game, but since that play came right after Rambis's timeout, there is nobody on this planet that can convince me it wasn't a play Rambis drew up. |
Sure, like Kobe never breaks away from running the offense.
There was plenty of time left on the clock when Kobe took that ill-advised shot with multiple hands in his face. The ball was given to him to make a play. It wasn't like Rambis told Kobe to jack it up as soon as he got it and you can't prove otherwise.
Kobe didn't play it very smart. Let him take some blame. He can deal with it. |
Again, it came right after a time out. Kobe can take the blame for missing the shot of course, but why did Rambis draw up that play? |
The obvious answer is that he didn't.  You're apparently the only one who can't see it.
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BigE32
Star Player
Joined: 25 Jun 2005
Posts: 8518
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| Posted: Sun Apr 12, 2009 6:10 am Post subject: |
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| LakerLanny wrote: | It's become mental now for the Lakers at Portland.
It is the one place I think they go to not expecting to win. And Portland knows it, is always up for the game and matches up with the Lakers very very well.
Thankfully, Portland hasn't figured out how to beat the Lakers in LA or we would have a real problem on our hands.
Suffice to say, that is a team I would just as soon we miss in the playoffs. |
I agree that I want to avoid them entirely if possible. They match up extremely well with us and I don't want to face them because they play much better against us as opposed to the other WC playoff teams. Thanks as always, DB. |
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Addicus
Star Player
Joined: 02 Sep 2005
Posts: 9642
Location: Dave's Pimp Palace
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| Posted: Sun Apr 12, 2009 9:47 am Post subject: |
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1. Portland is great against us at Home. On the road they are not nearly the Supermen they pretend to be in the Rose Garden. A lot of things happen up there. Plus we actually have close games against them. At Staples we tend to run them over all the time. Look at their record. 41 or so home games and 51 total wins. That's a lot of road losses and to some extent home losses to teams they aren't extremely hyped to see, like the Lakers.
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2. Kurt Rambis clearly did not call that nasty 3 Kobe jacked up. The whole team looked at Kobe like wtf was that. Kobe just decided to play hero and the miss hurt more than a make would have helped. That was a desperate frustration shot by Kobe.
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3. I want Portland in the playoffs. We've been dashing their dreams on our way to championships for the last 30 years. Why change the formula now?
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