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1hu2ren3dui4 Franchise Player
Joined: 19 Jul 2002 Posts: 15403 Location: Oak Park
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:03 pm Post subject: Re: Bynum > Yao |
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Dreamshake wrote: | Buddha wrote: | Yes I said it. The only reason Yao scores more is because he gets more touches (and shoots better FT's). Otherwise Andrew does EVERYTHING better. EVERYTHING. Better rebounder, better defender (individual and team defender), shot blocker, passer, equal strength but better speed and stamina.
Had Andrew been drafted by an all-scrub team, he'd be putting up 20/10 by virtue of minutes and touches. Bynum > Yao already. |
Better rebounder and shotblocker, yes. Yao is better in every other facet. If the Lakers only wanted to win this year (i.e. I can see keeping Bynum for the long-term) then they would trade for Yao in a heartbeat. You can't run the offense through Bynum. Bynum is not a better passer. Etc....
But we are all entitled to our opinions.... |
good question. yao is a more polished player. however, what the lakers need is defense and toughness. for the purposes of this team, the mobility that bynum offers, coupled with the length and defensive presence may be more valuable to this particular laker team.
will be interesting to see how bynum plays against some of the stronger players in the league. _________________ -Most people learn by saying mother, numb, horse, angry... I learned mine by saying Lakers, add gas. - HRD. |
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Magics80sLakersGOAT Star Player
Joined: 20 Jul 2006 Posts: 2017
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:05 pm Post subject: Re: Bynum > Yao |
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Buddha wrote: | Dreamshake wrote: | Buddha wrote: | Yes I said it. The only reason Yao scores more is because he gets more touches (and shoots better FT's). Otherwise Andrew does EVERYTHING better. EVERYTHING. Better rebounder, better defender (individual and team defender), shot blocker, passer, equal strength but better speed and stamina.
Had Andrew been drafted by an all-scrub team, he'd be putting up 20/10 by virtue of minutes and touches. Bynum > Yao already. |
Better rebounder and shotblocker, yes. Yao is better in every other facet. If the Lakers only wanted to win this year (i.e. I can see keeping Bynum for the long-term) then they would trade for Yao in a heartbeat. You can't run the offense through Bynum. Bynum is not a better passer. Etc....
But we are all entitled to our opinions.... |
You can make an argument about the passing but that bolded part is just ridiculous. You can't anchor this type of defense with Yao. He's not quick enough and doesn't defend on the perimeter (e.g. Pick n Roll) well enough. Bynum is a better shot blocker and recover's on defense much better. Considering this season for the Lakers is gonna be all about defense, no way they take Yao over Bynum. |
Bynum at 21 is more of a presence than Yao will ever be.
I'd much rather have Bynum than Yao, heck I'd rather have alot of guys than Yao.
Overrrraaatttteedddd!!! _________________ Discoflux wrote:
If all we need is 10/10 at C, we don't even need bynum cos Mihm can pull that down.
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JUST-MING Retired Number
Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 43954
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:08 pm Post subject: |
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You guys need to calm down, Bynum and Yao Ming cancelled each other out tonight. |
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AIRiza Fan Starting Rotation
Joined: 29 Oct 2008 Posts: 284
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:08 pm Post subject: |
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Rick Fox has some serious man love for Trevor. |
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Hector the Pup Retired Number
Joined: 25 Jul 2002 Posts: 35946 Location: L.A.
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:09 pm Post subject: |
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I do agree with Rick and Norm about Bynum.
BUY A DAMN SUIT KID! YOU JUST GOT PAID!
FIND A TAILOR AND GET SOME BESPOKE SUITS ASAP. |
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ishi331 Star Player
Joined: 23 Feb 2006 Posts: 7258
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:09 pm Post subject: |
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Boston Sucks chants during postgame! ALL RIGHT! |
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AIRiza Fan Starting Rotation
Joined: 29 Oct 2008 Posts: 284
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:10 pm Post subject: |
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Hector the Pup wrote: | I do agree with Rick and Norm about Bynum.
BUY A DAMN SUIT KID! YOU JUST GOT PAID!
FIND A TAILOR AND GET SOME BESPOKE SUITS ASAP. |
Nah, he's too busy making it rain with his monay.
I kid. I had to. |
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Buddha Star Player
Joined: 28 May 2008 Posts: 2186
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:11 pm Post subject: |
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JUST-MING wrote: | You guys need to calm down, Bynum and Yao Ming cancelled each other out tonight. |
Not when you count team defense. _________________ I get up for everybody. I played my son today in the backyard and I didn't let him score." - Ron Artest |
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oldschool32 Franchise Player
Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 20032
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:11 pm Post subject: |
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10 blocked shots and 13 steals, nice team numbers _________________ "It's just a job. Grass grows, birds fly, waves pound the sand. I beat people up."-The Greatest |
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JUST-MING Retired Number
Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 43954
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:13 pm Post subject: |
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Buddha wrote: | JUST-MING wrote: | You guys need to calm down, Bynum and Yao Ming cancelled each other out tonight. |
Not when you count team defense. |
Kobe and Trevor played a huge role in shutting down both McGrady and Artest. Across the board, they negated each other. |
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Mation Star Player
Joined: 13 Oct 2006 Posts: 3614
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:13 pm Post subject: |
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Haha! Kobe's all smiles right now. |
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wolfpaclaker Retired Number
Joined: 29 May 2002 Posts: 58318
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:13 pm Post subject: |
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Quote: | He might help, actually, by taking minutes from Artest. I thought Artest started monopolizing the ball for Houston tonite, stagnating their offense. |
Bingo.
Exactly why some of us for years have been against Artest's presence on this team. The guy is a great talent, especially defensively. But offensively, Ron is one of the biggest black holes in the game.
Ron will shoot your team out of the game and stall the offense, without hesitation.
Don't think Artest is going to put Houston over the top - but they are a much better defensive and physical team with him.
On Yao vs Bynum.
I disagree with buddha. Bynum is not on Yao's level offensively. Andrew does not have a set of go to moves that are money. Yao does. Yao has faced double teams and being the focal point, and yet still been able to put his mark on games. I think Yao is a proven all-star, while Andrew is still developing into one.
Where I agree with buddha. Defensively, Andrew wipes the floor with Yao. He is much better at defending the paint, controlling the glass, challenging shots, keeping his man at a low FG%.
A case can be made for Andrew over Yao for this team only on defensive principals. Yao would make LA a much better offensive team, but we already have a guy like Gasol, who is extremely skilled in the post position. What LA needs is a guy that can defend, protect the paint, be a defensive presence inside. I think LA is a better defensive team with Bynum and Gasol than they would be with Yao and Gasol, meaning a case could be made that Bynum has more value to the Lakers with them already having so much offense.
That being said, right now Yao > Bynum. Sorry, I'm a huge Bynum fan, but he is not there yet. Impact wise? It's getting close though. With the way AB has been defending. |
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RG73 Franchise Player
Joined: 14 Jul 2001 Posts: 11508
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:14 pm Post subject: |
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Sister Golden Hair wrote: | RG73 wrote: | LakerEric wrote: | ROCKETS ABSOLUTELY NEED BATTIER TO COMPETE WITH L.A.!!!!!! |
Seriously? Battier isn't going to make an iota of difference. |
He might help, actually, by taking minutes from Artest. I thought Artest started monopolizing the ball for Houston tonite, stagnating their offense. Even when he scored it was off of bad shots/too much dribbling. They seemd to lose much of their flow. And when he does that, he especially takes away T-Mac's aggressivness.
Look for T-Mac to start complaining as the season goes on about how he's being de-emphasized in the offense.
That team has some nice pieces and nice hustle players. But somehow the pieces seem mismatched.
SGH |
In the big scheme of things, no, Battier isn't going to matter. That was a monumental dismantling there, part of which was a statement to a scrappy Rockets team that they're far from the Lakers caliber right now. Battier won't help with that.
In the smaller scheme, as in against other, merely mortal teams, yes, Battier will help for the reason you pointed out. But I have been pointing out every time someone has come in to tout the Rockets that Artest is prone to ball hogging, combined with low shooting percentage, which, when combined with the other brick layers (which includes Battier btw), will lead to epic bouts of masonry.
And Tmac looks like he's crawled into a shell, never to return. Their starting perimeter players were 6-31 combined. Again, I pointed this out in several threads--they will have many nights like that, especially since Tmac and Alston are barely 40% shooters and Artest is a 45% shooting knucklehead. If they figure that they key to perimeter success is getting Yao, Scola and Landry consistent touches, that might all improve.
But I'm still betting that if they skid and dip sub-.500, Ron starts flipping out and it's game over. |
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SladeRider Star Player
Joined: 12 Dec 2006 Posts: 2107
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:34 pm Post subject: |
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Bynum is perfect for this team, if people think he is better defensively then Yao then the Lakers would always take Bynum over Yao because they don't need another offensive weapon when they already have a big man that is a good offensive player in Pau. _________________ "This is a comptitive city. We're used to winning titles, not just winning games and being in the first round. We want to win championships. Now's the time.", "do something, and do it now."
- Kobe Bryant |
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Luca Brasi Star Player
Joined: 11 Jun 2005 Posts: 4207
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:35 pm Post subject: |
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honestly, when was the last time yao was non-factor when he played the lakers? even when he scored, they were difficult and contested jump hooks.
the job that andrew did on yao and kobe did on artest was phenomenal.
i don't know what was wrong with t-mac, he seemed to be going thru the motions. but there big 3 were really a non-factor. _________________ "i was born down in the valley where the sun refused to shine, but i'm climbin' up to the highlands, goin' to make that mountain mine" ~ Lakers, 2011 |
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Hector the Pup Retired Number
Joined: 25 Jul 2002 Posts: 35946 Location: L.A.
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:36 pm Post subject: |
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Tmac is far from healthy right now. There might be a mental component to it, but there are definitely some major physical issues.
He isn't the toughest guy in the world and he definitely can go into a shell when the pressure's on, but he is clearly nowhere near 100%. |
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ishi331 Star Player
Joined: 23 Feb 2006 Posts: 7258
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:38 pm Post subject: |
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I also liked how Kobe was trying to get Artest to go in a one-on-one competition with him and break their offensive plans. Guess who's gonna win in that? Kobeeeee. |
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Buddha Star Player
Joined: 28 May 2008 Posts: 2186
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:40 pm Post subject: |
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Hector the Pup wrote: | Tmac is far from healthy right now. There might be a mental component to it, but there are definitely some major physical issues.
He isn't the toughest guy in the world and he definitely can go into a shell when the pressure's on, but he is clearly nowhere near 100%. |
I think it's mental. His T-sack shriveled up after Kobe swatted his ball. _________________ I get up for everybody. I played my son today in the backyard and I didn't let him score." - Ron Artest |
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dawglaker Star Player
Joined: 06 Nov 2007 Posts: 1890 Location: reppin Garden Grove
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:40 pm Post subject: |
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Kobes not 100% either _________________ "I didn't mean to walk in the shower with him. Yeah, I walked in the shower. I'm not a homosexual, but Kobe - he had no clothes on." - Ron Artest |
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Luca Brasi Star Player
Joined: 11 Jun 2005 Posts: 4207
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:41 pm Post subject: |
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Hector the Pup wrote: | Tmac is far from healthy right now. There might be a mental component to it, but there are definitely some major physical issues.
He isn't the toughest guy in the world and he definitely can go into a shell when the pressure's on, but he is clearly nowhere near 100%. |
he did look gimpy out there. _________________ "i was born down in the valley where the sun refused to shine, but i'm climbin' up to the highlands, goin' to make that mountain mine" ~ Lakers, 2011 |
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KingKobe20 Franchise Player
Joined: 14 Jul 2006 Posts: 18577 Location: L.A County, 26 miles away from Staples Center
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:43 pm Post subject: |
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Were is the guy who said Sasha is like Luke Walton??????? |
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Texas_Pete Franchise Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 12822 Location: Somewhere watching a Laker game
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:46 pm Post subject: |
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Drew: +16
Yao: -10
Pau: +12
Scola: -16
Vlad: -7
Artest: -11
Kobe: +10
T-Miss: -6 (1-11 for 3 pts)
Fish: 0
Alston: -1
X-Factors: ALF
Ariza: +34
LO: +26
Farmar: +29
Dayum. Next!
SOURCE |
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JUST-MING Retired Number
Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 43954
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:47 pm Post subject: |
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Hector the Pup wrote: | Tmac is far from healthy right now. There might be a mental component to it, but there are definitely some major physical issues.
He isn't the toughest guy in the world and he definitely can go into a shell when the pressure's on, but he is clearly nowhere near 100%. |
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLYfplk2RZ4&fmt=18
Watch McGrady in the first 30 seconds of this "highlight" video. He got his ankles blown out.
Last edited by JUST-MING on Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:48 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Trevacious Star Player
Joined: 16 Dec 2004 Posts: 1833
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:47 pm Post subject: |
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Buddha wrote: |
I think it's mental. His T-sack shriveled up after Kobe swatted his ball. |
Right before McGrady could begin to feel too good about himself, after scoring on that long fadeway jumper off the turnover... *SWAT! SWISH! SWISH! SWISH!* |
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JM Star Player
Joined: 25 Jun 2005 Posts: 1281
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Posted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:51 pm Post subject: |
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AIRiza Fan wrote: | Rick Fox has some serious man love for Trevor. |
Trevor's game isn't really like Fox but he performs the same function of providing 'intangibles,' and I think that is what Fox admires. After all, he (Fox) sacrificed his 'total game' to become a featured role player (at his choice) with the Lakers. Fox was a tough opponent who played decent D and good team D. Trevor is a distruptor - like those guys who used to vex the Lakers on the road -the energy guys. |
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