Roy Hibbert v. Oden (Bynum related)
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Mike@LG
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 9:10 am    Post subject:

ProjectAB wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Quote:
Brand succeeds because he can make them contested. Horford has no such ability.


Of course! Because Brand really came out of Duke with a midrange jumpshot!

http://www.ibiblio.org/craig/draft/1999_draft/Players/brand.html

Strengths: Hands, strength, surprising agility for size, ability to run the floor, power, shotblocking

Weaknesses: Questionable perimeter game and ballhandling, may be a tweener, potential weight problems, sometimes too passive, passing out of double teams

Almost sounds exactly like Horford, though, Brand is the far better athlete.


Brand averaged 20 and 10 right off the bat. Either he improved that much over the summer he declared, or more likely, that scouting report is off, as those early scouting reports often are.


He didn't have a midrange jumper AB. Even Boozer had a far more polished midrange jumper (it helped a lot that Boozer played SF in HS before gaining 40lbs.) but that doesn't mean he's as dominant a scorer as Brand.

Stoudemire didn't have one until '04/'05, but in the year prior, was still a 20.6ppg 9rpg player. Jumper helped him reach near 30 a game.

Eddy Curry averages about 20ppg and doesn't have a midrange jumpshot. That's all low block. Dwight Howard isn't too far behind.

It's not like Duncan even takes 5 jumpshots past 17' a game. Just hits a couple from that range, everything else is well within 14' from the hoop. 20ppg player? Yup.

Brand didn't really develop a midrange jumper until 2002.. and it was just a hint of a jumpshot. Yesteryear, he worked in it so much he was practically an MVP candidate and was fully confident in that shot.

Find another scouting report that says otherwise.
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Last edited by Mike@LG on Sun Apr 01, 2007 9:21 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 9:17 am    Post subject:

magic_bryant wrote:
Mike- You actually consider Brand a better athlete than Horford?

Gotta disagree.


I never said that. And. No way.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 9:18 am    Post subject:

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I don't consider 12-15 feet range, at least for a PF. For a center, it's nice, but for a PF, it's woefully inadequate


Kinda funny, considering that's really Brand's range where he's money and most times past that, he has to overextend himself on the shot to make it.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 9:35 am    Post subject:

It was kinda funny seeing Hibbert and Oden picking up fouls. Both of them don't know how to defend guys their own size. So they both helped take each other out. They were hardly a factor in the game.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 9:43 am    Post subject:

Honestly, I thought Hibbert looked better against Oden than the reverse. Oden did a better job of taking advantage when Hibbert was sitting out, but he performed absolutely miserably when Hibbert was in the game guarding him.

Oden should stay in another year. He needs polish. Hell, Hibbert should stay in another year as well.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 9:51 am    Post subject:

revgen wrote:
It was kinda funny seeing Hibbert and Oden picking up fouls. Both of them don't know how to defend guys their own size. So they both helped take each other out. They were hardly a factor in the game.


What was dissappointing was how softly the game was called. I've seen Butler play more physical than that.

Both had good games against each other. No one really had a dominating performance over the other.

However, in terms of NBA potential, who is more advanced by age? Oden was right there with Hibbert on everything, was he not? Not bad for a 19 year old kid compared to the 20-30lb. more taller, bigger, junior Georgetown Hibbert.

That is my point.

As for Hibbert, the biggest reason why I'm against his upside at the NBA level is because of his conditioning. Even 7'5" Ming, as skilled as he is, struggles around 30mpg despite all the NBA conditioning, and he's more athletic than Hibbert.

It would be far different if he had the conditioning of 7'4" Ralph Sampson, and even though he's bigger, Patrick O'Bryant and Saer Sene struggle with conditioning.

He may become a slightly better defender than Ming (Thankfully, Georgetown is about physical play) but when it comes to offensive talent, it doesn't help when he's getting rooted out by smaller players. At least I understood the excuse when Bynum got rooted out by smaller players, but no 3rd year college player should have that kind of trouble. The fact that Oden contested him quite well on jumphooks and pushed him farther than the deep position that Oden actually got spoke volumes for me in terms of talent, advanced skill by age, athleticism, etc.

Do I think Oden is ready for the NBA? Not anymore. Watch HS videos and he looked demoralizing. He dominated AAU and other "Exhibition" games with elite level talent by class. Granted, he gained weight in the offseason and that kind of made him look more mechanical, much in the same way Luc Richard Mbah A Moute muscled up about 20lbs. and has continual tendonitis and did play with the same energy and explosion he had all season.

However, I do think Oden should jump to the NBA. He's still the obvious #1 pick of the draft, and I think it would help him focus more. I don't think highly of Matta as a bigman coach, especially in comparison to Jim Calhoun of UConn. But, like Hibbert, Oden has to go to the right situation who can devote time for him. Oden is just more adaptable to NBA speed with his physical gifts and raw skill.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 10:10 am    Post subject:

I personally think Oden and Hibbert need to go into the NBA. Both of them need to get an idea of how to play guys their size and who are stronger. I don't think either of them can really do much more in college against the kind of players they play against.

One thing I like about Hibbert is that he showed a lot more patience and seemed to hold his balance better on his post moves. He looks smoother in this area than Oden.

Oden has a lot of speed and hops, but seems to be a little out of control sometimes. I surprised his shots went in despite this. A little more patience couldn't hurt.

Oden did outplay Hibbert on defense, as far as guarding anybody else besides the other big man.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 10:17 am    Post subject:

Quote:
One thing I like about Hibbert is that he showed a lot more patience and seemed to hold his balance better on his post moves. He looks smoother in this area than Oden.

Oden has a lot of speed and hops, but seems to be a little out of control sometimes. I surprised his shots went in despite this. A little more patience couldn't hurt.


That's the odd thing about Oden. Those shots have been dropping his entire career since he was 16. Apparently, it doesn't matter the size of the opponent to him, he'll still make it.

Hibbert has a stronger base. Well, he better. I think it's very clear why I'm high on the NCAA game considering how far Hibbert has progressed.

Quote:
Georgetown's Roy Hibbert was the last guy in the top 100. Jeff Green was in the top 75 and DaJuan Summers, who has shined of late for the Hoyas, was in the top 25 last year.


http://story.scout.com/a.z?s=176&p=2&c=630739
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 12:22 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
Quote:
Brand succeeds because he can make them contested. Horford has no such ability.


Of course! Because Brand really came out of Duke with a midrange jumpshot!

http://www.ibiblio.org/craig/draft/1999_draft/Players/brand.html

Strengths: Hands, strength, surprising agility for size, ability to run the floor, power, shotblocking

Weaknesses: Questionable perimeter game and ballhandling, may be a tweener, potential weight problems, sometimes too passive, passing out of double teams

Almost sounds exactly like Horford, though, Brand is the far better athlete.


Did you mean to say something else? If so, apologies.

Horford is a better athlete, IMO.

Horford is better laterally, up-and-down speed, better explosion. Brand has him beat in terms of overall strength.

Though, Brand is playing as a 6'8" player against men knocking him around, which could be reason for the disparity in perception on the hops.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 2:01 pm    Post subject:

^We'll just disagree. I think he's better all-way round.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 2:14 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
revgen wrote:
It was kinda funny seeing Hibbert and Oden picking up fouls. Both of them don't know how to defend guys their own size. So they both helped take each other out. They were hardly a factor in the game.


What was dissappointing was how softly the game was called. I've seen Butler play more physical than that.

Both had good games against each other. No one really had a dominating performance over the other.

However, in terms of NBA potential, who is more advanced by age? Oden was right there with Hibbert on everything, was he not? Not bad for a 19 year old kid compared to the 20-30lb. more taller, bigger, junior Georgetown Hibbert.

That is my point.

As for Hibbert, the biggest reason why I'm against his upside at the NBA level is because of his conditioning. Even 7'5" Ming, as skilled as he is, struggles around 30mpg despite all the NBA conditioning, and he's more athletic than Hibbert.

It would be far different if he had the conditioning of 7'4" Ralph Sampson, and even though he's bigger, Patrick O'Bryant and Saer Sene struggle with conditioning.

He may become a slightly better defender than Ming (Thankfully, Georgetown is about physical play) but when it comes to offensive talent, it doesn't help when he's getting rooted out by smaller players. At least I understood the excuse when Bynum got rooted out by smaller players, but no 3rd year college player should have that kind of trouble. The fact that Oden contested him quite well on jumphooks and pushed him farther than the deep position that Oden actually got spoke volumes for me in terms of talent, advanced skill by age, athleticism, etc.

Do I think Oden is ready for the NBA? Not anymore. Watch HS videos and he looked demoralizing. He dominated AAU and other "Exhibition" games with elite level talent by class. Granted, he gained weight in the offseason and that kind of made him look more mechanical, much in the same way Luc Richard Mbah A Moute muscled up about 20lbs. and has continual tendonitis and did play with the same energy and explosion he had all season.

However, I do think Oden should jump to the NBA. He's still the obvious #1 pick of the draft, and I think it would help him focus more. I don't think highly of Matta as a bigman coach, especially in comparison to Jim Calhoun of UConn. But, like Hibbert, Oden has to go to the right situation who can devote time for him. Oden is just more adaptable to NBA speed with his physical gifts and raw skill.


Oden didn't affect Hibbert's shots at all. Hibbert missed that one hook because Oden's teammates were surrounding him, and Hibbert had to rush it because he's been in the paint too long. From what I've seen, Oden needed slightly more help defending Hibbert than vice versa.

Also, keep in mind that Hibbert is only one year older than Oden. If Oden is 22 and 14(which I doubt), Hibbert is 20 and 10. More likely, it's 20 and 13 for Oden, and 18 and 10 for Hibbert.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 2:31 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
^We'll just disagree. I think he's better all-way round.


You're probably right, after thinking about it more. Brand is smaller, but does more with less. He uses his athleticism to play bigger than he is, whereas Horford is just a great athlete for his size.

Just a case of my overvaluing Horford's superior lateral quickness. 4s of today having great lateral quickness are an absolute must in today's NBA, where you see more and more the Shawn Marion/Diaw-type at PF.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 2:44 pm    Post subject:

Quote:
Oden didn't affect Hibbert's shots at all. Hibbert missed that one hook because Oden's teammates were surrounding him, and Hibbert had to rush it because he's been in the paint too long. From what I've seen, Oden needed slightly more help defending Hibbert than vice versa.

Also, keep in mind that Hibbert is only one year older than Oden. If Oden is 22 and 14(which I doubt), Hibbert is 20 and 10. More likely, it's 20 and 13 for Oden, and 18 and 10 for Hibbert.


Disagree. Oden affected Hibbert's shots. They weren't exactly calling 3 seconds all night.

1 year older than Oden. But 3 years of college and his conditioninng isn't even on par with Oden and the fact that frosh Oden was able to keep up with him, says a lot about how advanced Oden is.

You think Hibbert is a 20 10 player? I've got a Toyota with 110k miles I'd like to sell you for $10k.

I still think his best upside is current year Shaq. Same conditioning problems, still stronger than everyone. Limited post game.

Season Team G GS MPG FG% 3p% FT% OFF DEF RPG APG SPG BPG TO PF PPG
06-07 MIA 33 32 27.4 .578 .000 .440 2.4 4.7 7.1 2.1 0.2 1.3 2.27 3.50 16.9

Or let me guess, you're banking that Hibbert has a Kobe-esque work ethic as well.

I think it'll show how different the NBA game is compared to college, where Hibbert cannot just rely on absolute size anymore, and things like footwork, quickness, explosiveness, wingspan, etc. are all magnified.

Believe me. Amare, Dwight, Ming, and other centers would love to eat Hibbert for lunch.

What's the difference between Shaq and Alonzo Mourning?

Or better yet, Alonzo Mourning and Dikembe Mutombo?

Don't tell me it isn't much.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 3:23 pm    Post subject:

There was only one time they could have called three-second, and that was when Hibbert reposted and spun around Oden. However, even if they had called it, it would have been good team defense more than Oden. It was clear the Buckeyes were more leery of the entry pass into Hibbert than vice versa.

And I'm not banking on Hibbert having a Kobe-like work ethic at all. If he does, then I'd say that he has every chance to be as good as Oden, assuming that Oden maintain his current work rate right now.

I do know that Hibbert already has a stronger work ethic than Oden. His skill level shows that. And my projection is based on that current difference.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 3:38 pm    Post subject:

Hibbert with a better work ethic than Oden?


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 3:43 pm    Post subject:

Yes, show me an example of Oden's work ethic. Like someone said, why hasn't Oden worked on his left hand by now? Why is he still so raw? So far, he's gotten by on his natural(possibly roidal) talent.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 5:50 pm    Post subject:

ProjectAB wrote:
Yes, show me an example of Oden's work ethic. Like someone said, why hasn't Oden worked on his left hand by now? Why is he still so raw? So far, he's gotten by on his natural(possibly roidal) talent.


Are you joking?

Okay. As if 65% FT left handed isn't supposed to be convincing?

http://fantapedia.net/draftprospects

Quote:
* Greg Oden 7-0 265lbs - Ohio State
The most hyped up-and-comer since Lebron James. Very raw offensively, but a freakish athlete with great shot-blocking ability. Terrific work ethic. Reminds of David Robinson.


http://www.gregodenonline.com/greg-oden-biography.php

Quote:
Every year at every major high school AAU camp, there is a player that causes spectators, coaches and members of the media to beg the question, "Have you seen (insert breaking star's name here)?" In 2005 at the Peach Jam it was Greg Oden of Indiana. Drones of people flocked to the gym when the 6-11 center took to the floor. Once the ball was in the air and the game was on the clock, Greg Oden transformed from a quiet and humble 15 year old to one of the most dominating players in high school basketball. Since the Nike All American camp two weeks ago in Indianapolis and a 26 point, 12 rebound game in the Saturday session, college coaches from coast to coast have grabbed a chair to watch the big man in action. To Greg Oden, it's no big deal. "I try to just blank them out because I know if I paid any attention to them than I wouldn't play as good as I am playing now," Greg Oden said. "I realize this is the opportunity for me to play in front of college coaches. Hopefully they think about me when the time comes (to offer a scholarship). But right now, I'm just worried about high school." Several big time coaches all echoed the same thing about the David Robinson clone. "Greg Oden won't touch a college campus." That was the common thread between them all. Two NBA scouts caught glimpses of Greg Oden while the collegiate coaches can only sit back and hope. "There really isn't any interest right now (from schools) they've just sent me questionnaires. I haven't really thought about any schools right now," said Greg Oden, either playing down the new found attention or simply unfamiliar with the crazy game of recruiting. Greg Oden's coaches with Indiana Red said Greg Oden is just a normal kid living a normal 15 year old life. This new found fanfare is something that the new next big thing. "I'm really not that good. I need to get stronger and a lot of big men can shoot. I'm not that great at shooting," Greg Oden said. Greg Oden may not think of himself as a shooter but Greg Oden is one tough cookie inside the high percentage zone around the basket. Greg Oden displayed some of the best moves in the post out of any player at the Peach Jam, even Al Jefferson and LaMarcus Aldridge. "Greg Oden is a fantastic athlete that gets to the ground to the rim faster than most kids in high school basketball. Which is amazing for a kid his age," Rob Harrington, recruiting analyst of PrepStars.com, said. In one game, Greg Oden took the ball from the right block, took a pivot move to the top end of the key then with one jump went under the basket for the two hand reverse flush. Those same coaches and scouts that were oohing and awing over Greg Oden earlier could only watch with their mouths open. While the basketball nation looks for the next LeBron James in next year's draft, they may have to wait for a while for Greg Oden. Skills wise, there aren't many players around the understand the post game like Greg Oden does. And Greg Oden is 15.




http://www.zwire.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=18146785&BRD=1698&PAG=461&dept_id=21848&rfi=6

Quote:
Oden wasn't always the next big thing in basketball. He wasn't always good friends with Mike Conley Jr. There was a time, in fourth grade, when he was just an awkward little boy playing basketball simply because he was so big.
[b\He says it took "a long while" before he became a quality player. Years, actually. When he began playing in fourth grade, he was a disaster.
"It's embarrassing. I wasn't great at anything," Oden said. "I sat on the bench and wore my goggles.[/b] I had big, nasty Horace Grant goggles. His are beautiful, but mine were awful. Sometimes they didn't even fit on my face."
Oden met his future best friend, Mike Conley Jr., when his father and Olympic champion came to the family's home in Terre Haute, Ind. This was the summer before seventh grade, and Oden was beginning to show flashes of ability. He was still raw, but he at least knew how to use his size.

...
So, too, is being a 7-footer nowadays. No one makes fun of him anymore. Well, except for Conley. He gets away with a lot of things most other guys can't. Conley still pushes him and motivates him, even though Oden was the first one to develop enough work ethic to show up at 6 a.m. for shootarounds in high school. Conley had to follow Oden on that one. But Conley is still making Oden work for every compliment.
"I think he can be the most dominant player (in college basketball)," Conley said. "He's the first to tell you he has a lot of work to do. I want to say he will be the most skilled player and the most dominant player because his work ethic is so unreal, he always wants to get better, regardless of how well he's playing."

Memphis coach John Calipari couldn't stop gushing over Oden and Conley before the Tigers and Buckeyes met in the Elite Eight. Calipari was impressed with their ability, sure, but he was equally impressed with how they carried themselves.
Despite being in the center of the basketball universe, neither seems to shaken or to full of themselves. They're just teenagers having fun in the spotlight.
"They're good kids, good young men," Calipari said. "They just play ball. It's great to see. It's really great to see."


http://basketball-players.suite101.com/article.cfm/greg_oden_vs_kevin_durant

Quote:
# strengths: Combination of such size, strength, quickness, jumping ability and athleticism is extremely rare. Incredible defensive presence and shot blocking savvy. Great basketball IQ and lauded work ethic.
# weaknesses: Still unpolished offensively with back-to-the-basket. Offensive footwork needs refinement. Needs to learn how to finish plays after contact.


http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=odendurant/070126

Quote:
6. Work ethic
Oden wouldn't have been able to return so early – a month earlier than projected – and make such an impact right away without a lot of hard work during rehab.


http://www.hoopsvibe.com/nba/nba_draft/nba_draft_prospects/greg_oden-ar23664.html

Quote:
Greg Oden

10.7.2005 - Updated on 03.21.2007

Extremely naturally talented 7-foot man-child has an NBA body to go along with excellent athleticism and terrific defensive skills. His maturity, work ethic and attitude only increase his likelihood to reach his incredibly high ceiling. Will need to improve on his mechanical offensive skills, he doesn’t always show the nastiness to dominate his opponents. Has shown his potential in NCAA play so far after returning from an injury, but has done so inconsistently.


http://www.usatoday.com/sports/college/mensbasketball/south/2007-03-25-osu-oden_N.htm

Quote:
Oden missed the team's first seven games because of a right wrist injury that required surgery. He's only about 80% recovered, he said. Nevertheless, he's averaging 15.4 points and 9.5 rebounds a game. He has 100 blocked shots.

Before practices and after practices, Oden has worked with OSU assistant coach Alan Major to beef up his inside game. "He's there to stay with me," Oden said.

Major doesn't accept the credit, pointing out that Oden's work ethic is second to none.

"You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink," Major said. "He's a horse that loves to drink."


If enters the draft, he'll probably be the No. 1 pick, but he's reluctant because he's loving college life.


http://www.statenews.com/article.phtml?pk=39451

Quote:
MSU head coach Tom Izzo first saw Oden during an early-morning shootaround at Lawrence North (Ind.) High School.

"It was at 6 in the morning, and he was there," Izzo said. "That impressed me. The school he's from, the coaching staff, they've got about six coaches that spend so much time with their players, so he was very well-coached, very intelligent.

"I thought he had the work ethic, and then it didn't hurt that he was probably 6-foot-9 as a freshman and built better than most of us."

Oden's work ethic is evident in his free-throw shooting. The wrist surgery has forced Oden to shoot free throws with his left, non-dominant hand, yet he's shooting 61 percent from the line.


Izzo backed off his pursuit of Oden because the phenom seemed likely to spend only one year in college or jump straight from high school to the NBA. The Spartans have been bitten by the early-entry bug before — Marcus Taylor, Jason Richardson, Zach Randolph, Erazem Lorbek and Shannon Brown all bolted early and declared for the NBA Draft. Izzo raved about Oden's character, but admitted he was still wary.

"He used to swear to me that he was staying a minimum of two years, maybe more," Izzo said. "Yeah, right, you know?"

A new collective bargaining agreement forbids players from playing in the NBA until they are one year removed from high school, so Oden had little choice but to play college basketball. He committed to Ohio State and head coach Thad Matta.

"I probably screwed it up more than anything else," Izzo said. "Everybody thought he was going pro, and that rule changed. We had a shot, but he also wanted to play with Conley."


http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4155/is_20060210/ai_n16065482

Quote:
Everyone marvels at Oden's work ethic. He doesn't stand under the hoop and wait for a teammate to deliver the ball, then dunk the ball. He doesn't leave the gym after practice until he converts 80 percent of his free throws. As a junior, he worked on his passing skills. Last summer, he worked on improving his offensive skills 12 feet from the basket.

"He works on his game more than most big players I've seen," Coleman said. "Only Mourning played at his level of intensity in high school as a pure post player. He ranks with the top five or six big men ever to play in high school.

"But people get too hung up by thinking a kid will play the same way in the NBA as he does in high school. Oden has the knowledge and work ethic to get better. He has better footwork and touch around the basket than he had two years ago. He will get stronger. But will he be as dominant?


"What impresses people is how he attacks the backboard, how active he is on both ends of the court and how he challenges everything on the defensive end. He becomes better when challenged by another big man. What is toughest for him is he doesn't get to play against great players every night."


That's just the 1st 3 pages of a Google entry, skipping message boards and getting legit articles.
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Last edited by Mike@LG on Sun Apr 01, 2007 5:57 pm; edited 2 times in total
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 5:51 pm    Post subject:

ProjectAB wrote:
Yes, show me an example of Oden's work ethic. Like someone said, why hasn't Oden worked on his left hand by now? Why is he still so raw? So far, he's gotten by on his natural(possibly roidal) talent.


Perfect. Not only do I know you're biased, but don't even research the facts for yourself.

No wonder why I question what you see on the floor.

This will be my last response to you.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 8:43 pm    Post subject:

Odens pretty good but that doesn't make Hibert a stiff by comparison. Hibert should be middle round lottery like Boozer should have been,- too many reasons why not to take him rather than paying attention to his plusses. Oden is a given, no argument. Lakers won't get either.The person we should be interested in is Green who didn't have a good game and maybe we can sneak in and get him somehow.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 8:49 pm    Post subject:

Laker Lurker wrote:
Odens pretty good but that doesn't make Hibert a stiff by comparison. Hibert should be middle round lottery like Boozer should have been,- too many reasons why not to take him rather than paying attention to his plusses. Oden is a given, no argument. Lakers won't get either.The person we should be interested in is Green who didn't have a good game and maybe we can sneak in and get him somehow.


I don't know. Green looked pretty passive. I think there are already too many current Laker players like that.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 8:57 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
ProjectAB wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Quote:
Brand succeeds because he can make them contested. Horford has no such ability.


Of course! Because Brand really came out of Duke with a midrange jumpshot!

http://www.ibiblio.org/craig/draft/1999_draft/Players/brand.html

Strengths: Hands, strength, surprising agility for size, ability to run the floor, power, shotblocking

Weaknesses: Questionable perimeter game and ballhandling, may be a tweener, potential weight problems, sometimes too passive, passing out of double teams

Almost sounds exactly like Horford, though, Brand is the far better athlete.


Brand averaged 20 and 10 right off the bat. Either he improved that much over the summer he declared, or more likely, that scouting report is off, as those early scouting reports often are.


He didn't have a midrange jumper AB. Even Boozer had a far more polished midrange jumper (it helped a lot that Boozer played SF in HS before gaining 40lbs.) but that doesn't mean he's as dominant a scorer as Brand.

Stoudemire didn't have one until '04/'05, but in the year prior, was still a 20.6ppg 9rpg player. Jumper helped him reach near 30 a game.

Eddy Curry averages about 20ppg and doesn't have a midrange jumpshot. That's all low block. Dwight Howard isn't too far behind.

It's not like Duncan even takes 5 jumpshots past 17' a game. Just hits a couple from that range, everything else is well within 14' from the hoop. 20ppg player? Yup.

Brand didn't really develop a midrange jumper until 2002.. and it was just a hint of a jumpshot. Yesteryear, he worked in it so much he was practically an MVP candidate and was fully confident in that shot.

Find another scouting report that says otherwise.


Spot on mike. People are in for a surprise with Horford's offensive game.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 9:20 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
Laker Lurker wrote:
Odens pretty good but that doesn't make Hibert a stiff by comparison. Hibert should be middle round lottery like Boozer should have been,- too many reasons why not to take him rather than paying attention to his plusses. Oden is a given, no argument. Lakers won't get either.The person we should be interested in is Green who didn't have a good game and maybe we can sneak in and get him somehow.


I don't know. Green looked pretty passive. I think there are already too many current Laker players like that.


Yeah, I get you- just trying to find a diamond in the dirt. Lakers are actually pretty good right now so its time to start looking for the next Boozer, J Howard, Varejao or Barboza- there is really no harm in trying. Green looked pretty good before the last game and all those ennouncers, who know his game, were proping him. Brewer won't fall to lakers and Green at 6' 9" is a guy his coach felt could be put on conley Jr.- which is a pretty big prop by itself.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2007 9:28 pm    Post subject:

That's the thing. I don't think that Green is 6'9", and having watched other Georgetown games, he's not the type to really step up in terms of scoring.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2007 1:01 pm    Post subject:

In an article that displayed how tOSU game planned for Jeff Green, Hibbert drew praise from Oden:

Hibbert was still more productive than Green in fewer minutes, scoring 19 points on 9-for-13 shooting with six rebounds and one blocked shot.

Oden said he was impressed with the 7-foot-2 junior.

"He shot over me a bunch of times, so you saw what he can do," Oden said. "All I care about is we won. That's really all that matters."

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/ncaatourney07/columns/story?columnist=schlabach_mark&id=2820775
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2007 3:13 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
That's the thing. I don't think that Green is 6'9", and having watched other Georgetown games, he's not the type to really step up in terms of scoring.


Jeff Green reminds me a lot of Luke Walton but with more athleticism. He's a bit of a tweener, although he'll likely wind up at the 3 spot like Luke, he's got an iffy jumpshot, an average first step, and is a reluctant scorer. But he has a great feel for the game, is a "ball mover," and is a great passer for his size.

I feel like the Lakers already have those skills sets covered with Lamar and Luke.
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