I just think alot of people are overreacting yes what he did was wrong but like i said he did a mistake and hes paying for it.. hes been upset since the incident and he wants people to understand what he did was wrong and he wants people to forgive him. lets give him a chance.
I just think alot of people are overreacting yes what he did was wrong but like i said he did a mistake and hes paying for it.. hes been upset since the incident and he wants people to understand what he did was wrong and he wants people to forgive him. lets give him a chance.
people already understand that GARBAGE is racist. NOT wrong...but racist. You cant expect to say:"50 yrs ago we would have had you upside down with a fork up your ass" , and expect it to be funny .
Whats the problem? i understand he used racial slurs but like George Lopez said his lack of experience caught up with his blow-up. the dude sounds very up-set i think we should cut him some slack he did a mistake obviously we have all gone through the samethings which is make mistakes as we all "human-beings" do.
Yeah, especially if it's true that the guy(s) in the audience were using racial slurs as well. Most people would've blown up in Richards position under those circumstances as well.
Interesting how the video was only started once he started going off; you don't get to hear what set him off in the first place, to give it context. Still a real bonehead move regardless, but like the weak video for the UCLA taser incident (dude, bum-rush yourself to the front so you can actually film something!), without the full context, it looks worse than it may have been...
Either way, that was one of the weakest handling of hecklers I've ever seen. I watched Chapelle just demolish a heckler at a show once (in fact, it was really funny because the guy was heckling his opening act, and the opener went off on him pretty good, but then told the guy that if you try that crap on Chapelle when he comes out, he is going to publicly destroy you--"Dave's a cold blooded killer with hecklers"...which is exactly what happened).
Tony, do you remember any of what Chapelle said to him?
Nothing specific, just that it was a verbal rape; I mean it came fast and furious, and the crowd was going nuts, so Dave fed off that, and just decimated the guy. Oh, he did say after he was done thrashing the guy that he gave someone a heart attack in Cincinnati once at a club (a heckler he was retorting to). That's how crazy Chappelle is with hecklers.
Joined: 31 Jul 2004 Posts: 14226 Location: city of angels
Posted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 12:48 am Post subject:
If you make your living in the public eye, it works both ways. He made a lot of money through the Seinfeld series. It also openned a lot of doors for him. Those doors will be slamming shut now. He's going to have to make public apologies. He's going to be spending most of the rest of his life having to prove he isn't a racsist. Whatever he does, there will be doors that are permanently closed to him. Some will never forgive him. _________________ "Darkness cannot drive out darkness. Only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate. Only love can do that." ~~Martin Luther King Jr.~~
Am I the only one who thinks that Kramer melting down and dropping N-Bombs on stage sounds like a horrible Seinfeld episode? One of those that ends with an angry mob chasing Jerry and friends down the street.
I mean, Kramer dropped N***** on people to their face. Not whispered behind their backs, or told a racy joke. He looked people in the eye and yelled N***** over and over. Then, just for good measure, he referenced pitchforks and what "we" would do to "you".
How the Hell does that "happen" to someone. It can't just happen. You can't just melt down or get nervous. Dude has some problems, and using offensive words is just the tip of the iceberg.
Am I the only one who thinks that Kramer melting down and dropping N-Bombs on stage sounds like a horrible Seinfeld episode? One of those that ends with an angry mob chasing Jerry and friends down the street.
I mean, Kramer dropped N***** on people to their face. Not whispered behind their backs, or told a racy joke. He looked people in the eye and yelled N***** over and over. Then, just for good measure, he referenced pitchforks and what "we" would do to "you".
How the Hell does that "happen" to someone. It can't just happen. You can't just melt down or get nervous. Dude has some problems, and using offensive words is just the tip of the iceberg.
It does sound like an episode straight from the show.
I like how that one guy called him out at the end as being washed up and Richards was like "ah man he has me there." Dude sounds racist to the bone referring to himself as the White Man, you never hear people talk like that these days. Maybe he was just trying to be too funny but he surely let out some of his real emotions. Anyways, I'll still keep watching Seinfeld, the funniest show ever.
Joined: 31 Jul 2004 Posts: 14226 Location: city of angels
Posted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 6:59 am Post subject:
It was clear the man was trying to get under his skin. It is clearly obvious how he responded was wrong. After listening to a recording, it appears he has some mental problems. If he explodes like that, he needs help. He should see a psychiatrist. Several things might be suspected. Is there substance abuse? Is there post-traumatic stress? What trigggered the outburst? We have no way of knowing. He does seem to need professional help. If someone who doesn't normally act the way he did starts to do something very uncharacteristic, he may have a physical or mental problem. If it was determined he had cancer in his brain, would we be so quick to judge? He did apologize, which is a first step. I hope he seeks professional help. His career is ruined. He needs to find out why he snapped, because it can't happen again. _________________ "Darkness cannot drive out darkness. Only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate. Only love can do that." ~~Martin Luther King Jr.~~
It was clear the man was trying to get under his skin. It is clearly obvious how he responded was wrong. After listening to a recording, it appears he has some mental problems. If he explodes like that, he needs help. He should see a psychiatrist. Several things might be suspected. Is there substance abuse? Is there post-traumatic stress? What trigggered the outburst? We have no way of knowing. He does seem to need professional help. If someone who doesn't normally act the way he did starts to do something very uncharacteristic, he may have a physical or mental problem. If it was determined he had cancer in his brain, would we be so quick to judge? He did apologize, which is a first step. I hope he seeks professional help. His career is ruined. He needs to find out why he snapped, because it can't happen again.
I think he is just racist.
Everyone has some built in sterotypes that come from growing up in certain environments, but as we grow we learn that most of those sterotypes were/are just silly phobias for the most part.
Being a racist is different you genuinely feel that you are superior because of your race. When he said:
"That is what happens when you talk to a whiteman" he went way beyond the line. _________________ "I was laying myself on the line by saying, if this doesn't work in three to four years, if we're not back on the top then I will step down because that means I have failed,"
Jim Buss (2013)
I stayed up last night to watch the apologize. Im not sure what to make of it...The was entire thing was odd. The audience, (some at least) were laughing, he spoke of the "force", which kinda reminded me of star wars..
If anything ,I got the impression that he was reaching for words to alleviate the issue. As far as believing him....Im not sure.
F that! Cut him some slack my ass. Im tired of celebrities getting special treatment. Hes, or at least, was a star. He should know the type of business hes in. Cameras are ALWAYS on. Hes a comedian...he should know that dumbasses will always be out to try and throw him off during his performance .
I understand we ALL have our days but to reference lynching ....cmon
Sure, we live in world were being politically correct has gone overboard...but LYNCHING?
^^yep, thats the piece that put it over the top. the N word was one thing. and like you guys have said. I was willing to cut him some slack. because you could tell it was a blow up situation. now granted when people blow up. they usually say what they feel and always thought about you, someone else, or a particual situation. so for him to say "i'm not a racist". thats a lie. now maybe he doesn't want to be and he is a closet racist. perhaps he didn't even notice it. Because he's never had to deal with it. now its time to deal with it and try to overcome it. its racisim embedded in our minds on both sides black and white. Embedded, meaning you dont even notice it. until a situation presents itself.
The only slack I can cut the guy is for him to actually make serious effort to get help with his problem. because it is a problem ladies and gents. you dont blurt out Lynching. Just like you dont blurt out Human Ovens, when talking about Jewish people. I would never say that. i dont care how mad i got. I might fist fight(which is like a last resort for me), before I say something like that.
It was clear the man was trying to get under his skin. It is clearly obvious how he responded was wrong. After listening to a recording, it appears he has some mental problems. If he explodes like that, he needs help. He should see a psychiatrist. Several things might be suspected. Is there substance abuse? Is there post-traumatic stress? What trigggered the outburst? We have no way of knowing. He does seem to need professional help. If someone who doesn't normally act the way he did starts to do something very uncharacteristic, he may have a physical or mental problem. If it was determined he had cancer in his brain, would we be so quick to judge? He did apologize, which is a first step. I hope he seeks professional help. His career is ruined. He needs to find out why he snapped, because it can't happen again.
^as i stated in my last replay. the man needs help. no doubt about it. But you say if he had cancer in his brain would i feel differently? NO. because once again. just because you have cancer in your brain that doesn't mean you blurt out stuff that wasn't somewhere on your mind. it had to be somewhere. maybe he had control of it up until the other evening. but now the cats out the bag.
Joined: 03 Nov 2005 Posts: 28461 Location: Chillin on the Delaware.. from the Jersey Side
Posted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 11:09 am Post subject:
angel wrote:
It was clear the man was trying to get under his skin. It is clearly obvious how he responded was wrong. After listening to a recording, it appears he has some mental problems. If he explodes like that, he needs help. He should see a psychiatrist. Several things might be suspected. Is there substance abuse? Is there post-traumatic stress? What trigggered the outburst? We have no way of knowing. He does seem to need professional help. If someone who doesn't normally act the way he did starts to do something very uncharacteristic, he may have a physical or mental problem. If it was determined he had cancer in his brain, would we be so quick to judge? He did apologize, which is a first step. I hope he seeks professional help. His career is ruined. He needs to find out why he snapped, because it can't happen again.
Name one stand up comic that doesn't get heckled... it's part of the job... it's almost expected. He was way way way out of line... don't make excuse for him. Just let him go the way of Jimmy The Greek.....
Side note... The club (I believe the Laugh Factory) where all this went down, has given Richards a life-time ban....
Last edited by TACH on Tue Nov 21, 2006 2:13 pm; edited 1 time in total
It was clear the man was trying to get under his skin. It is clearly obvious how he responded was wrong. After listening to a recording, it appears he has some mental problems. If he explodes like that, he needs help. He should see a psychiatrist. Several things might be suspected. Is there substance abuse? Is there post-traumatic stress? What trigggered the outburst? We have no way of knowing. He does seem to need professional help. If someone who doesn't normally act the way he did starts to do something very uncharacteristic, he may have a physical or mental problem. If it was determined he had cancer in his brain, would we be so quick to judge? He did apologize, which is a first step. I hope he seeks professional help. His career is ruined. He needs to find out why he snapped, because it can't happen again.
Name one stand up comic that doesn't get heckled... it's part of the job... it's almost expected. He was way way way outline... don't make excuse for him. Just let him go the way of Jimmy The Greek.....
Side note... The club (I believe the Laugh Factory) where all this went down, has given Richards a life-time ban....
What Jimmy the Greek said wasnt half as bad as this.
Sadly racism still exists everywhere you go. People are just extremely politically correct. Our neighboorhoods are still segregated with people referring to areas as "Ghetto" all the time.
We still have a long way to go.
The movie Crash explains this perfectly. _________________ "I was laying myself on the line by saying, if this doesn't work in three to four years, if we're not back on the top then I will step down because that means I have failed,"
Jim Buss (2013)
Joined: 31 Jan 2002 Posts: 6879 Location: Los Angeles/Barcelona
Posted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 12:06 pm Post subject:
I don't think Kramer is racist. I think he was put in a tough position... who knows what he's going through in life, and he wanted to hurt the heckler and hit him hard, and those were the words he chose to use. I suppose it's like if a person lost his mother at a young age and someone were to insult his mother. Of course that is terrible and is not within the acceptable limits of "counter-heckling," but in any case I don't think the guy is a racist.
Real racists manifest themselves in other ways in my experience. I've seen true racism manifest itself in the strangest ways. It's hardly ever like this.
You could argue that he has some latent racism that kind of spilled out all at once, but I would be inclined to say that EVERYONE in the U.S. has tons of latent racism inside of them. I feel bad for the guy actually since he made such a fool of himself. I'm sure he feels like the worst person in the world right now.
By the way I'm Korean and I try to see things from all angles. I've learned to separate true racism from other things having grown up in Los Angeles as well as being like the only Korean living in Spain.
Some things are true racism, some things are releases of latent racism, and some things are just to hurt the other person... some things are nothing.
For me, if those black guys used racial slurs against him, I think it definitely does matter. At that point it's really not about race for Kramer, but rather it's trying to hurt the other person as much as possible. Obviously he chose the stupid route, but hey, doesn't mean he's racist.
Here in Spain, sometimes I get called "chino" and I'm not chinese. The people aren't necessarily racist but sometimes people do it just to f with you, which is fine, but I usually make a fool of them by either saying they're fat, ugly, have shabby clothes, that they're poor, or whatever. I've told someone to get legal residence in the country first before they start calling me stuff, which was probably based on their skin color and how they looked. It's not like it's any of my business, but if I'm getting bothered in public, I'm going to bother back.
OK, I will assume that these guys in the crowd used racial slurs too (which might not even be the case, but just assuming). If they were white hecklers and the comedian went off by calling them honky crackers or whatever... he'd look pretty ignorant, but I don't think there would be as much outrage. So let's try to put things in perspective.
Joined: 03 Nov 2005 Posts: 28461 Location: Chillin on the Delaware.. from the Jersey Side
Posted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 1:58 pm Post subject:
Kobe>T-mac wrote:
TACH wrote:
angel wrote:
It was clear the man was trying to get under his skin. It is clearly obvious how he responded was wrong. After listening to a recording, it appears he has some mental problems. If he explodes like that, he needs help. He should see a psychiatrist. Several things might be suspected. Is there substance abuse? Is there post-traumatic stress? What trigggered the outburst? We have no way of knowing. He does seem to need professional help. If someone who doesn't normally act the way he did starts to do something very uncharacteristic, he may have a physical or mental problem. If it was determined he had cancer in his brain, would we be so quick to judge? He did apologize, which is a first step. I hope he seeks professional help. His career is ruined. He needs to find out why he snapped, because it can't happen again.
Name one stand up comic that doesn't get heckled... it's part of the job... it's almost expected. He was way way way outline... don't make excuse for him. Just let him go the way of Jimmy The Greek.....
Side note... The club (I believe the Laugh Factory) where all this went down, has given Richards a life-time ban....
What Jimmy the Greek said wasnt half as bad as this.
Sadly racism still exists everywhere you go. People are just extremely politically correct. Our neighboorhoods are still segregated with people referring to areas as "Ghetto" all the time.
We still have a long way to go.
The movie Crash explains this perfectly.
All true,.. I was just referring to what became of him (The Greek) after he was fired from CBS Sports...
Joined: 03 Nov 2005 Posts: 28461 Location: Chillin on the Delaware.. from the Jersey Side
Posted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 2:12 pm Post subject:
methdxman wrote:
I don't think Kramer is racist. I think he was put in a tough position... who knows what he's going through in life, and he wanted to hurt the heckler and hit him hard, and those were the words he chose to use. I suppose it's like if a person lost his mother at a young age and someone were to insult his mother. Of course that is terrible and is not within the acceptable limits of "counter-heckling," but in any case I don't think the guy is a racist.
Real racists manifest themselves in other ways in my experience. I've seen true racism manifest itself in the strangest ways. It's hardly ever like this.
You could argue that he has some latent racism that kind of spilled out all at once, but I would be inclined to say that EVERYONE in the U.S. has tons of latent racism inside of them. I feel bad for the guy actually since he made such a fool of himself. I'm sure he feels like the worst person in the world right now.
By the way I'm Korean and I try to see things from all angles. I've learned to separate true racism from other things having grown up in Los Angeles as well as being like the only Korean living in Spain.
Some things are true racism, some things are releases of latent racism, and some things are just to hurt the other person... some things are nothing.
For me, if those black guys used racial slurs against him, I think it definitely does matter. At that point it's really not about race for Kramer, but rather it's trying to hurt the other person as much as possible. Obviously he chose the stupid route, but hey, doesn't mean he's racist.
Here in Spain, sometimes I get called "chino" and I'm not chinese. The people aren't necessarily racist but sometimes people do it just to f with you, which is fine, but I usually make a fool of them by either saying they're fat, ugly, have shabby clothes, that they're poor, or whatever. I've told someone to get legal residence in the country first before they start calling me stuff, which was probably based on their skin color and how they looked. It's not like it's any of my business, but if I'm getting bothered in public, I'm going to bother back.
OK, I will assume that these guys in the crowd used racial slurs too (which might not even be the case, but just assuming). If they were white hecklers and the comedian went off by calling them honky crackers or whatever... he'd look pretty ignorant, but I don't think there would be as much outrage. So let's try to put things in perspective.
An idiot? Yes. Racist? I don't think so.
I'm not buying that... this guy is a stand up comic... heckler come with the territory. I'm sure this is not the first time he was heckled, and it definitely won't be the last. Also, what set Kramer off was that one of the guys yelled "You not funny", not a racial slur.... something that can be heard nightly in just about every comedy club. After Kramer dropped the N-Bomb, you can hear, from the video, somebody yell 'white cracka' (it's unclear from the video who yelled it, not sure if it was the guys that initially set Kramer off)...
If he simply dropped the N-Word,... I might be incline to side with you... but this was rant where he repeatedly used different slurs over a good period of time. Like I said,.. let this man go the way of Jimmy The Greek.....
It was clear the man was trying to get under his skin. It is clearly obvious how he responded was wrong. After listening to a recording, it appears he has some mental problems. If he explodes like that, he needs help. He should see a psychiatrist. Several things might be suspected. Is there substance abuse? Is there post-traumatic stress? What trigggered the outburst? We have no way of knowing. He does seem to need professional help. If someone who doesn't normally act the way he did starts to do something very uncharacteristic, he may have a physical or mental problem. If it was determined he had cancer in his brain, would we be so quick to judge? He did apologize, which is a first step. I hope he seeks professional help. His career is ruined. He needs to find out why he snapped, because it can't happen again.
Name one stand up comic that doesn't get heckled... it's part of the job... it's almost expected. He was way way way outline... don't make excuse for him. Just let him go the way of Jimmy The Greek.....
Side note... The club (I believe the Laugh Factory) where all this went down, has given Richards a life-time ban....
What Jimmy the Greek said wasnt half as bad as this.
Sadly racism still exists everywhere you go. People are just extremely politically correct. Our neighboorhoods are still segregated with people referring to areas as "Ghetto" all the time.
We still have a long way to go.
The movie Crash explains this perfectly.
All true,.. I was just referring to what became of him (The Greek) after he was fired from CBS Sports...
I actually think Jimmy the Greek got a bum deal. As did Steve Lyons, but this outburst is unexcusable. _________________ "I was laying myself on the line by saying, if this doesn't work in three to four years, if we're not back on the top then I will step down because that means I have failed,"
Jim Buss (2013)
ya know...there's no excuse for what he did...but good for him for owning up to it.
the guy seems genuinely shaken and ashamed for what he did. at least he took full responsibility for it. contrast that with mel gibson who simply blamed the booze. or mark foley for blaming the booze.
richards didn't blame anyone but himself and it looks like he really just snapped and lost it. _________________ 14-5-3-12
Joined: 03 Nov 2005 Posts: 28461 Location: Chillin on the Delaware.. from the Jersey Side
Posted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 3:25 pm Post subject:
Kobe>T-mac wrote:
TACH wrote:
Kobe>T-mac wrote:
TACH wrote:
angel wrote:
It was clear the man was trying to get under his skin. It is clearly obvious how he responded was wrong. After listening to a recording, it appears he has some mental problems. If he explodes like that, he needs help. He should see a psychiatrist. Several things might be suspected. Is there substance abuse? Is there post-traumatic stress? What trigggered the outburst? We have no way of knowing. He does seem to need professional help. If someone who doesn't normally act the way he did starts to do something very uncharacteristic, he may have a physical or mental problem. If it was determined he had cancer in his brain, would we be so quick to judge? He did apologize, which is a first step. I hope he seeks professional help. His career is ruined. He needs to find out why he snapped, because it can't happen again.
Name one stand up comic that doesn't get heckled... it's part of the job... it's almost expected. He was way way way outline... don't make excuse for him. Just let him go the way of Jimmy The Greek.....
Side note... The club (I believe the Laugh Factory) where all this went down, has given Richards a life-time ban....
What Jimmy the Greek said wasnt half as bad as this.
Sadly racism still exists everywhere you go. People are just extremely politically correct. Our neighboorhoods are still segregated with people referring to areas as "Ghetto" all the time.
We still have a long way to go.
The movie Crash explains this perfectly.
All true,.. I was just referring to what became of him (The Greek) after he was fired from CBS Sports...
I actually think Jimmy the Greek got a bum deal. As did Steve Lyons, but this outburst is unexcusable.
Eh there was this blind item years ago about about an actor on a famous TV sitcom that people would be surprised to find out is a racist. A lot of people thought Matt LeBlanc but now I think its Michael Richards.
That being said I don't think he was sincere at all however I don't care either. It wouldn't stop me either way from watching Seinfeld.
In the end it won't damage his career he really doesn't have one and can live comfortably off the Seinfeld royalties for the rest of his life.
It does however damage his reputation and he probably lost tons of fans as a result.
I don't think Kramer is racist. I think he was put in a tough position... who knows what he's going through in life, and he wanted to hurt the heckler and hit him hard, and those were the words he chose to use. I suppose it's like if a person lost his mother at a young age and someone were to insult his mother. Of course that is terrible and is not within the acceptable limits of "counter-heckling," but in any case I don't think the guy is a racist.
Real racists manifest themselves in other ways in my experience. I've seen true racism manifest itself in the strangest ways. It's hardly ever like this.
I really believe you are on the money.
Truly harmful people like "racists", work in far more insiduous and damaging ways.
Kramer went of his rocker (due to any number of personal circumstances, problems, mental, etc.), and in this particular instance, tried to inflict maximum damage to his target, in this case a black man(men?).
You get that bloodlust rage for your target and you try to kill they guy verbally and that's what happens. What's the result? He nuked himself.
If anyone of us truly went into a fit of rage (and I mean true state of rage, where you temporarily do not care or think of boundries), what kind of verbal barrage could you architect about:
Arabs
Chinese
Blacks
Mexicans
Iranians
etc.?
I think we call could think of truly shocking and evil comments. Doesn't mean we mean it, but we do know the material...
The word, "Racist" is thrown around too loosely. Save it for those that are plotting, acting and "conspiring" in evil ways to set back or harm others.
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It does sound like an episode straight from the show.
