Joined: 19 Nov 2007 Posts: 4383 Location: Lake Nacimiento
Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2023 1:52 pm Post subject:
Annihilator wrote:
lakersboy wrote:
Hanging from Rafters wrote:
If he had been selected #46 for free, or if the Lakers had bought #40 outright to have it in addition to #46 then yea…but to pay more than BAE money for MaxL (4m + 1m salary)…it doesn’t look like it made any sense to pay to move up 6 slots in the second round for MaxL. Again pay for MaxL and #46, or don’t pay and get similar looking talent at #46 makes sense. What was done tho isn’t something I can understand atm. Maybe it makes sense over time. Hope I’m wrong, but it looks like a useless waste of $4m to me.
I don’t care about the 4 mil spent because that’s other people’s money. I’m just glad they didn’t use assets to acquire the pick.
This is an excellent point. The Lakers are gambling with Lakers' Corportation profits and not future player assets (such as draft picks or next year's team personnel). There is very little potential loss to the Lakers in this process other than the risk that the face whenever they draft a second-round player.
Yeah, I hear people calling us "cheap" all the time yet we drop 4 million without giving up future assets for late draft potential and it's being used against them? I don't get it? The kid clearly has a ton of potential while being extremely raw so it's going to be a gamble regardless but I personally love the move and am happy the FO is putting so much stock into young talent. They obviously wont hit on them all but they've had a pretty terrific track record recently so i'm all for it plus it's awesome to root for some consistent actual Lakers grown talent again even if it's not Superstar level potential.
Who knows when or even if he will actually become a competent NBA level player but I doubt it will be less then 2 years which wouldn't be bad at all as long as he shows some progress along the way.
If he had been selected #46 for free, or if the Lakers had bought #40 outright to have it in addition to #46 then yea…but to pay more than BAE money for MaxL (4m + 1m salary)…it doesn’t look like it made any sense to pay to move up 6 slots in the second round for MaxL. Again pay for MaxL and #46, or don’t pay and get similar looking talent at #46 makes sense. What was done tho isn’t something I can understand atm. Maybe it makes sense over time. Hope I’m wrong, but it looks like a useless waste of $4m to me.
I don’t care about the 4 mil spent because that’s other people’s money. I’m just glad they didn’t use assets to acquire the pick.
This is an excellent point. The Lakers are gambling with Lakers' Corportation profits and not future player assets (such as draft picks or next year's team personnel). There is very little potential loss to the Lakers in this process other than the risk that the face whenever they draft a second-round player.
Yeah, I hear people calling us "cheap" all the time yet we drop 4 million without giving up future assets for late draft potential and it's being used against them? I don't get it? The kid clearly has a ton of potential while being extremely raw so it's going to be a gamble regardless but I personally love the move and am happy the FO is putting so much stock into young talent. They obviously wont hit on them all but they've had a pretty terrific track record recently so i'm all for it plus it's awesome to root for some consistent actual Lakers grown talent again even if it's not Superstar level potential.
Who knows when or even if he will actually become a competent NBA level player but I doubt it will be less then 2 years which wouldn't be bad at all as long as he shows some progress along the way.
The same people calling them cheap aren’t the same people giving an opinion about the 4m. I know people realize LG consists of many DIFFERENT people but even still, many respond as if it’s one person, strange indeed. They see an opinion from one person then read another from a different poster and respond as if it was the same person.
If the owners want to waste money it’s cool with me, they perhaps can afford it and maybe it feels like us wasting $4 dollars as average Joe’s so it may not be a big deal at all. My point is that it looks like a waste. Whatever narrative it is tried to be changed from or to…spending, cheap, assets, whatever…it looks likes a waste to me and I explained why I think so, others may feel different and that’s cool too. _________________ “When it looks as if it is a realistic possibility, I want to focus on winning a ship like it’s a goal that can’t be denied. I didn’t see that this off season.”
I love that they spent the $4M. With the league rules these days it is increasingly harder to impose our advantage of being a highly profitable major market team. We should be spending more on coaching, analytics, training, scouting, etc. than other teams. Using cash to move up and improve odds in the draft or get your guy?…Do it every year.
<snip>
The Lakers didn’t pay $4m and draft Max Lewis for the player that he is now. You are never doing that when you draft a 19 or 20 year old. They are drafting him for the player they believe he can become over the next 3 years. They are placing a bet both on Lewis and on themselves that their player development system can unlock his potential. He has a great set of physical tools and he showed in college that he can shoot. Sure, he didn’t exactly fork lightning in summer league, but neither did Max Christie last year and look at him now. Get back to me in 3 years as to whether acquiring Max Lewis was a good idea or not.
Well yes, it boils down to "trust them they're the experts" and hey, I have no issues with that, I don't have their eye for talent or ability.
As for Christie, I did see something even last summer league: it seemed most of his problems then (and through the year) were attributable to his puny body and lack of strength/bulk; however even in SL he showed defensive IQ, defensive length and good form on his shot. Yes ball-handling was an issue as well as penetration and finishing. I bet DB's game summaries from the 2022 summer leagues will attest to this.
Meanwhile I personally don't see such signs in Lewis - YET: his potential is more subtle (to my untrained eyes) than Christie's.
Off the top of my head, Lewis had some nice flashes of defense, some ability to attack close outs etc. Christie might be an optimistic comparison, it'll probably take longer than a year. Again the thing that would concern me the most is if he doesn't have the work ethic that Christie is known to have.
A good practice is to evaluate a player's pre-NBA film based on what they demonstrate their highest ceiling to be. For example, Lamelo Ball wasn't great overall but he had maybe 3 games in Australia where he looked like a star and the rest was mostly a struggle. The stuff Max has troubles with are rookie mistakes that the majority of even average players are able to iron out with time. Missing dunks, travels and unforced turnovers, not asserting himself offensively (as a guy who projects as a go-to scorer). At his best, he looked like a competent 3 level scorer in college. It's yet to be determined whether he develops into more of a Jordan Clarkson or Zach LaVine type of player but I think those are fair comps for his potential. _________________ It was reminiscent of one of those Most Interesting Man in the World advertisements: "I don't always shoot 6-for-28 from the field, but when I do, I become the youngest player in league history to score 28,000 career points."
Plus wasn’t the $4 mil from fiscal year 2022-2023? It was gone if they didn’t use it.
What? Lol. It wasn't gone, they pocket it if they didn't spend it
I’ll dumb it down, the opportunity to use it would be gone.
“When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser.”
--Anonymous
Also…the Lakers spent half the amount on the 35th pick for MaxC last year with a 2ndRRP to be determined later. I can see the point from others that they like it, just seems like a waste to spend twice as much for 40th as done for 35th plus the 2ndRP in the current draft for MaxL. I hope what it seems to me turns out wrong. Go Go Lewis!!! _________________ “When it looks as if it is a realistic possibility, I want to focus on winning a ship like it’s a goal that can’t be denied. I didn’t see that this off season.”
Plus wasn’t the $4 mil from fiscal year 2022-2023? It was gone if they didn’t use it.
What? Lol. It wasn't gone, they pocket it if they didn't spend it
I’ll dumb it down, the opportunity to use it would be gone.
“When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser.”
--Anonymous
Also…the Lakers spent half the amount on the 35th pick for MaxC last year with a 2ndRRP to be determined later. I can see the point from others that they like it, just seems like a waste to spend twice as much for 40th as done for 35th plus the 2ndRP in the current draft for MaxL. I hope what it seems to me turns out wrong. Go Go Lewis!!!
keep in mind 2 things: (1) by increasing the penalties for teams that overspend, the new CBA has made draft picks more valuable. The pick for Christie was acquired while the old CBA was in effect (2) this years draft was deeper than last years. I think most of the teams knew that the first 10 or so picks in the second round of this years draft would have been first round picks most other years. That also elevated the value of second round picks this year.
Tomorrow dudes deal finally applies to our cap sheet. After that we looking at roughly 1.5m in wiggle till the 165.3m tax line, with a 14th roster add necessary to make. That addition likely makes us a taxpayer this season, unless we offload 1m in salary. However to stay on the safe side anticipate we dump closer to 2m in net salary at the trade deadline, in case the “unlikely” incentives of DLo/Vando turn “likely” and add roughly 850k to our cap sheet as a result. _________________ Not familiar with the salary cap/CBA rules & how it impacts our Lakers?
#GetFamiliar by CLICKING HERE!
Tomorrow dudes deal finally applies to our cap sheet. After that we looking at roughly 1.5m in wiggle till the 165.3m tax line, with a 14th roster add necessary to make. That addition likely makes us a taxpayer this season, unless we offload 1m in salary. However to stay on the safe side anticipate we dump closer to 2m in net salary at the trade deadline, in case the “unlikely” incentives of DLo/Vando turn “likely” and add roughly 850k to our cap sheet as a result.
Seems like the thing to do would have been to have the contracts of Vinc/Dlo/AR/Rui somehow add up to save 600k collectively such that a 14th roster spot could be added for the 2.1m vet min without going over the tax. Rob may stick with 13 or add Cast from 2-way for back up C at 1.1m to duck the tax, or Maybe a vet min is added to go over the tax anyway.
The math by Rob seems strange to add up to be so close to avoiding the tax without allowing the vet min to fit inside the lux tax line.
The team is somewhat similar to what it was after the trades last year…maybe it’s enough without adding anyone.
Vinc replaced Shro
Cam replaced LWIV
Prin replaced TBjr
Hayes replaced Weny
Probably not…hope so tho. _________________ “When it looks as if it is a realistic possibility, I want to focus on winning a ship like it’s a goal that can’t be denied. I didn’t see that this off season.”
HFR: yeah, there seems to be a miscalculation somewhere, cause they would leak into the tax with a 14th roster add, unless they do some complex rope-a-dope with 10day contracts post Jan 5th only after rope-in-a-dope with a nonguaranteed deal & rostering them before cutting them till then. It’s either that or swapping out excessive salary for lesser (see Vando for minimum swap).
I do suspect they will go the nonguaranteed route, like converting Castleton from his two-way deal similar to what they did with Reaves prior, and then after previewing the early portion of the season, approach January with the decision to either guarantee Castleton (or whomever) and swap out salary via trade to get under the tax or drop the nonguaranteed deal and target 10dayers. Please refer to the Cap thread for more details on this rope-a-dope route in ducking the tax this year.
Btw no matter who we add to the roster as our 14th, whether that be a rookie like Castleton or a vet like Woods, that cap hit will be looked at as a proration of a 2+ seasoned vet @2m depending on when they make that addition during the season. The reason MaxL will be seen as a rookie min 1.1m cap hit is because he was drafted and as such isn’t an undrafted or veteran free agent that would trigger the 2+ seasoned cap hit towards tax math calculations. _________________ Not familiar with the salary cap/CBA rules & how it impacts our Lakers?
#GetFamiliar by CLICKING HERE!
After going back and eat cho ing his highlights from Summer league I’m surprised laker fans aren’t more excited about this kids potential. The game is clearly moving too fast for him at this point in his career but the skill and athleticism just jumps off the screen! His length & athleticism stood out on the defensive end as well.
Kid can get all the way to the run off one dribble from the 3 point line! He can create shots for himself and others. He’s my favorite young talent by far!
Joined: 20 Jul 2006 Posts: 8518 Location: Left coast
Posted: Tue Sep 26, 2023 6:18 pm Post subject:
DancingBarry wrote:
I love that they spent the $4M. With the league rules these days it is increasingly harder to impose our advantage of being a highly profitable major market team. We should be spending more on coaching, analytics, training, scouting, etc. than other teams. Using cash to move up and improve odds in the draft or get your guy?…Do it every year.
Agreed. Sometimes you may draft Robert Sacre or Isaac Bonga, but you hope every once in a while they may find an Austin Reaves or Ginobili, the way Denver found Jokic.
Joined: 20 Jul 2006 Posts: 8518 Location: Left coast
Posted: Tue Sep 26, 2023 6:43 pm Post subject:
PICKnPOP wrote:
https://youtu.be/Dk7UE2y5bvo?si=KEXYi1Z_N4JthDiT
After going back and eat cho ing his highlights from Summer league I’m surprised laker fans aren’t more excited about this kids potential. The game is clearly moving too fast for him at this point in his career but the skill and athleticism just jumps off the screen! His length & athleticism stood out on the defensive end as well.
Kid can get all the way to the run off one dribble from the 3 point line! He can create shots for himself and others. He’s my favorite young talent by far!
He definitely has athletic ability. I think I remember him blocking a couple of perimeter jump shots in SPL. I'm hoping like I always do that he can become a real player, but so far, his game was dysfunctional. Whatever you try to fix, something else comes up. He's young, raw, and needs plenty of refining. He'll need man weight and strength too.
If he shows up and begins significantly developing, he'll be among my favorite. I want to see what his bread and butter, go to, you can't stop me move is. I like guys who put in work and make me notice them, like Reaves and Christie. I'm hoping for Castleton, Hodge, and others, but whoever imposes his will on the coaching rotation and in the game becomes my favorite.
Hopefully Lewis can show flashes this year in the gleague. _________________ "He's a Zen master, so he can speak to you, and he doesn't need a microphone; you can hear him in your head, 'Ron, don't shoot, don't shoot.' Whatever, pow, three. I love the Zen, though."
After going back and eat cho ing his highlights from Summer league I’m surprised laker fans aren’t more excited about this kids potential. The game is clearly moving too fast for him at this point in his career but the skill and athleticism just jumps off the screen! His length & athleticism stood out on the defensive end as well.
Kid can get all the way to the run off one dribble from the 3 point line! He can create shots for himself and others. He’s my favorite young talent by far!
I like the comparison to Trey Murphy in New Orleans. It will be fun watching him develop.
I love that they spent the $4M. With the league rules these days it is increasingly harder to impose our advantage of being a highly profitable major market team. We should be spending more on coaching, analytics, training, scouting, etc. than other teams. Using cash to move up and improve odds in the draft or get your guy?…Do it every year.
Perhaps, some don't understand that spending cash in any transaction between teams doesn't effect the salary cap??? otherwise, I don't get why some don't like this move. This move has no downside to their basketball operation. I mean unless you're part of ownership group of course.
I don't see how anyone could doubt the scouting team at this point. If they see a move they like I'm not gonna question it. _________________ It was reminiscent of one of those Most Interesting Man in the World advertisements: "I don't always shoot 6-for-28 from the field, but when I do, I become the youngest player in league history to score 28,000 career points."
I'm expecting this year for Lewis is going to be about unlearning some of the poor technique and habits he has accumulated in college and replacing them with professional level ones. The Lakers are a top five player development organization, and if he puts in the work, he has a shot to be a real player. _________________ Austin Reaves keeps his game tight, like Kobe Bryant on game night.
Does he spend the whole year on the roster, or does he go up and down to the G League?
he looks like a g-leaguer right now. He's probably not going to crack
the rotation this year, let him develop in the g-league; maybe next
season he surprises us (one way or another). _________________ Lakers need to build a freaking team !
Yea our roster is super deep, even if he were NBA caliber he'd struggle to get minutes. But as is, he has a ways to go before even getting to NBA caliber. I'm not expecting to see much run out of him. I'm more hoping he shows growth next year in summer league
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