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ChickenStu
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 4:34 am    Post subject:

^
They chose to insanely overpay a gadget player. Good for him.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 5:00 am    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
^
They chose to insanely overpay a gadget player. Good for him.


Yup.

And they chose to pay Winston $1.1M n somehow he and his agent agreed that was fair compensation.

I’m thinking Winston and his agent shopped his services around the league and even with the impressive resume posted by Adkindo, the most he could get is a 1 yr $1.1M deal....

Quote:

- 5 Star Recruit
- Heisman Trophy
- National Championship Trophy
- has completed 1,563 passes for 19,737 yards, 121 TD's and 88 Interceptions on a 61+% completion rate during his 5 years in the NFL
- 2019 - Led NFL in Passing Yards


Yup, all of that was worth 1 yr $1.1M in 2020...
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 8:50 am    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
adkindo wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
It’s official, Winston is a Saint.


Saw a tweet a couple days ago that pointed out Winston has more completions to Saints players in his career than Taysom Hill has had in his career.


Right now I would take Hill over Winston, hopefully Payton can work his magic.


The same Taysom Hill that was a low 3 Star recruit, played 5 years of college football, and his stats are a fraction of the once 5 Star Recruit Winston's stats in 2 years of college....also minus the Heisman Trophy and National Championship Trophy? The same 30 year old Taysom Hill that has completed 6 passes for 119 yards, 0 TD's and 1 Interception on a 46% completion rate in 3 years in the NFL compared to a 26 year old Winston who has completed 1,563 passes for 19,737 yards, 121 TD's and 88 Interceptions on a 61+% completion rate during his 5 years in the NFL?

The only person that would make that claim is a Saints homer or someone with illogical blind faith. Also, this claim by Winston about getting some great QB teaching beyond Bruce Arians is laughable. Let's compare the QB magic.....

Payton
1997 - QB Coach - Ty Detmer
1998 - QB Coach - Bobby Hoying
1999 - QB Coach - Kent Graham
2000 - 2002 - OC - Kerry Collins
2003 - QB Coach - Quincy Carter
2004 - QB Coach - Vinny Testaverde
2005 - QB Coach - Drew Bledsoe
2006 - Head Coach - Drew Brees (who was already a fairly established QB)

Bruce Arians

1998 - 2000 - QB Coach - Peyton Manning (Rookie)
2001 - 2003 - OC - Tim Couch (last time they made playoffs)
2004 - 2011 - OC - Ben Roethlisberger (Rookie)
2012 - OC/HC - Andrew Luck (Rookie)
2013 - 2017 - HC - Carson Palmer
2019 - HC - Winston - Led NFL is Passing Yards

Who has the QB magic?


Lets be real to, Teddy Bridgewater was a good QB who minimized turnovers when he led the Vikings to the playoffs - the Saints/Brees injury let him showcase his knee was healthy and he can still start in the NFL. I liked the idea behind the choice by Winston, I hope he can gather help from Saints core, because it essentially seems his problem isn't the physical talent, its decision making.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 10:41 am    Post subject:

LongBeachPoly wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
^
They chose to insanely overpay a gadget player. Good for him.


Yup.

And they chose to pay Winston $1.1M n somehow he and his agent agreed that was fair compensation.

I’m thinking Winston and his agent shopped his services around the league and even with the impressive resume posted by Adkindo, the most he could get is a 1 yr $1.1M deal....

Quote:

- 5 Star Recruit
- Heisman Trophy
- National Championship Trophy
- has completed 1,563 passes for 19,737 yards, 121 TD's and 88 Interceptions on a 61+% completion rate during his 5 years in the NFL
- 2019 - Led NFL in Passing Yards


Yup, all of that was worth 1 yr $1.1M in 2020...


Reportedly Pittsburgh offered Winston more money but he chose to sign with Payton and NO.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 10:53 am    Post subject:

LongBeachPoly wrote:
adkindo wrote:
LongBeachPoly wrote:
adkindo wrote:

The same Taysom Hill that was a low 3 Star recruit, played 5 years of college football, and his stats are a fraction of the once 5 Star Recruit Winston's stats in 2 years of college....also minus the Heisman Trophy and National Championship Trophy?

The same 30 year old Taysom Hill that has completed 6 passes for 119 yards, 0 TD's and 1 Interception on a 46% completion rate in 3 years in the NFL compared to a 26 year old Winston who has completed 1,563 passes for 19,737 yards, 121 TD's and 88 Interceptions on a 61+% completion rate during his 5 years in the NFL?

The only person that would make that claim is a Saints homer or someone with illogical blind faith.



The same Taysom Hill whom the Saints gave a 2 yr $21M deal to vs. 1 yr $1.1M for Winston, despite everything you just wrote above....


I do not get the point of your statement....are you claiming that you believe Taysom Hill is as good or talented QB as Winston? If that is your suggestion, that is a weird way to say it.....but what is your basis?


It’s not a statement. These are facts.

Taysom Hill got 2 yrs $21M

Winston got 1 yr $1.1M

You can look it up if you don’t believe me. It’s true.


I wouldn’t look at it that way, Hill has an established role on a contending team. Winston was a player who hasn’t stepped up to what people expected of him. Hill is more valuable to the Saints at this point. If Brees stays healthy, then Hill will continue to be more valuable. Bridgewater didn’t draw interest until Brees was hurt, I expect it to be the same for Winston. Though if the season is expanded I wouldn’t mind seeing Drew sit a game or two.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 11:27 am    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
LongBeachPoly wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
^
They chose to insanely overpay a gadget player. Good for him.


Yup.

And they chose to pay Winston $1.1M n somehow he and his agent agreed that was fair compensation.

I’m thinking Winston and his agent shopped his services around the league and even with the impressive resume posted by Adkindo, the most he could get is a 1 yr $1.1M deal....

Quote:

- 5 Star Recruit
- Heisman Trophy
- National Championship Trophy
- has completed 1,563 passes for 19,737 yards, 121 TD's and 88 Interceptions on a 61+% completion rate during his 5 years in the NFL
- 2019 - Led NFL in Passing Yards


Yup, all of that was worth 1 yr $1.1M in 2020...


Reportedly Pittsburgh offered Winston more money but he chose to sign with Payton and NO.


Be careful about using “reported” offers to establish a player’s market value

Quote:

Steelers never made an offer to Jameis Winston or any veteran quarterback, says GM Kevin Colbert

Jameis Winston, after a month on the open market, signed a one-year deal with the Saints. But prior to Winston officially joining the Saints, reports had surfaced about Winston turning down a more lucrative offer from the Steelers, a team that has question marks at the quarterback position behind starter Ben Roethlisberger. On Wednesday, Steelers general manager Kevin Colbert set the record straight on the team's reported offer to Winston.

"We're always gonna watch what's out there," Colbert said on 93.7 The Fan. "It's my job to evaluate any position, any player that happens to be available. And we do that. But I can honestly say that we absolutely made no negotiation or any offer to any veteran quarterback."

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ChickenStu
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 4:04 pm    Post subject:

If Brees goes down, I'd be shocked if Hill became the starting QB.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 5:32 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
If Brees goes down, I'd be shocked if Hill became the starting QB.


All the more reason why it’s confounding that Winston and his agent could only command a $1.1M deal...
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 5:52 pm    Post subject:

LongBeachPoly wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
If Brees goes down, I'd be shocked if Hill became the starting QB.


All the more reason why it’s confounding that Winston and his agent could only command a $1.1M deal...


I'm sure he turned down more money elsewhere. But it's a good decision on his part. There's a chance he gets the keys to the Saints kingdom next year.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 6:13 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
LongBeachPoly wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
If Brees goes down, I'd be shocked if Hill became the starting QB.


All the more reason why it’s confounding that Winston and his agent could only command a $1.1M deal...


I'm sure he turned down more money elsewhere. But it's a good decision on his part. There's a chance he gets the keys to the Saints kingdom next year.


Why leave money on the table.

If Hill is not the backup QB that means NO has no backup QB going into the season.

The Raiders paid Mariota $8M to be their backup QB?

NO paid Bridgewater $7.25M last yr to be the backup QB?

In 2018, NO traded for Bridgewater and paid him $5M to be their backup. So NO pays for a backup.

Yet, Winston and his agent, with all the accomplishments listed above, could only get NO to pony up $1.1M?

Quote:
On March 15, 2019, Bridgewater signed a one-year, $7.25 million fully guaranteed contract with the Saints.


Quote:
On August 29, 2018, the Jets traded Bridgewater and a 2019 sixth-round draft pick to the New Orleans Saints for a 2019 third-round draft pick.


Quote:
So, basically, the Saints may be paying $5 million and a third round pick to have Bridgewater as a backup for one season whether he plays or not.


Last edited by LongBeachPoly on Thu Apr 30, 2020 6:20 pm; edited 2 times in total
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 6:18 pm    Post subject:

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2020/04/30/von-miller-cleared-from-covid-19/

Quote:
Von Miller cleared from COVID-19

Broncos edge rusher Von Miller announced two weeks ago he had tested positive for COVID-19, days after coming down with symptoms.

On Thursday night, Miller tweeted he is recovered.

“Got my results back,” Miller wrote. “I’m ‘negative’ for COVID-19.”

The only other active NFL player to reveal a positive diagnosis is Rams center Brian Allen. Saints coach Sean Payton also has recovered from COVID-19.

Miller’s positive test was a concern because of his asthma. He uses a nebulizer before strenuous activity.

Now, Miller can return to training for the 2020 season. He already has called winning defensive player of the year and leading the league in sacks as “attainable.”
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 6:25 pm    Post subject:

LongBeachPoly wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
LongBeachPoly wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
If Brees goes down, I'd be shocked if Hill became the starting QB.


All the more reason why it’s confounding that Winston and his agent could only command a $1.1M deal...


I'm sure he turned down more money elsewhere. But it's a good decision on his part. There's a chance he gets the keys to the Saints kingdom next year.


Why leave money on the table.

If Hill is not the backup QB that means NO has no backup QB going into the season.

The Raiders paid Mariota $8M to be their backup QB?

NO paid Bridgewater $7.25M last yr to be the backup QB?

In 2018, NO traded for Bridgewater and paid him $5M to be their backup. So NO pays for a backup.

Yet, Winston and his agent, with all the accomplishments listed above, could only get NO to pony up $1.1M?

Quote:
On March 15, 2019, Bridgewater signed a one-year, $7.25 million fully guaranteed contract with the Saints.


Quote:
On August 29, 2018, the Jets traded Bridgewater and a 2019 sixth-round draft pick to the New Orleans Saints for a 2019 third-round draft pick.


Quote:
So, basically, the Saints may be paying $5 million and a third round pick to have Bridgewater as a backup for one season whether he plays or not.


I just think he's thinking about his next move. There's a lot of upside to getting in that QB room and trying to impress Payton, and to be a part of that winning culture. If he wasn't going to get a starting job elsewhere anyway, he might be better off passing up a bit more money for the chance that he could be in a great situation next year. He's already banked $46MM in career earnings. If someone was offering him $20+MM or something, sure, you have to take that. But I think he and his agent must feel like the upside of being on this particular team and taking less money is worth more than taking a bit more from another team.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 7:30 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
LongBeachPoly wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
LongBeachPoly wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
If Brees goes down, I'd be shocked if Hill became the starting QB.


All the more reason why it’s confounding that Winston and his agent could only command a $1.1M deal...


I'm sure he turned down more money elsewhere. But it's a good decision on his part. There's a chance he gets the keys to the Saints kingdom next year.


Why leave money on the table.

If Hill is not the backup QB that means NO has no backup QB going into the season.

The Raiders paid Mariota $8M to be their backup QB?

NO paid Bridgewater $7.25M last yr to be the backup QB?

In 2018, NO traded for Bridgewater and paid him $5M to be their backup. So NO pays for a backup.

Yet, Winston and his agent, with all the accomplishments listed above, could only get NO to pony up $1.1M?

Quote:
On March 15, 2019, Bridgewater signed a one-year, $7.25 million fully guaranteed contract with the Saints.


Quote:
On August 29, 2018, the Jets traded Bridgewater and a 2019 sixth-round draft pick to the New Orleans Saints for a 2019 third-round draft pick.


Quote:
So, basically, the Saints may be paying $5 million and a third round pick to have Bridgewater as a backup for one season whether he plays or not.


I just think he's thinking about his next move. There's a lot of upside to getting in that QB room and trying to impress Payton, and to be a part of that winning culture. If he wasn't going to get a starting job elsewhere anyway, he might be better off passing up a bit more money for the chance that he could be in a great situation next year. He's already banked $46MM in career earnings. If someone was offering him $20+MM or something, sure, you have to take that. But I think he and his agent must feel like the upside of being on this particular team and taking less money is worth more than taking a bit more from another team.


I get that. I just don’t get why they could only get $1.1M from NO.

If it’s true that Hill is not a viable backup option for them.

And last 2 years they paid for Bridgewater to be a backup for them, why wouldn’t they pay this year? I mean, Brees keeps getting older and older...

That’s what I don’t understand.

How did Winston go into negotiations with NO to be their backup, the replacement for Bridgewater, and only get$1.1M?
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 7:31 pm    Post subject:

...

Last edited by LongBeachPoly on Thu Apr 30, 2020 7:34 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 7:32 pm    Post subject:

LongBeachPoly wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
If Brees goes down, I'd be shocked if Hill became the starting QB.


All the more reason why it’s confounding that Winston and his agent could only command a $1.1M deal...


He's never had a great rep, always had character concerns. I'm rooting for him because he is a great talent. He is most definitely starting over Hill if Brees goes down.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 7:37 pm    Post subject:

panamaniac wrote:
LongBeachPoly wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
If Brees goes down, I'd be shocked if Hill became the starting QB.


All the more reason why it’s confounding that Winston and his agent could only command a $1.1M deal...


He's never had a great rep, always had character concerns. I'm rooting for him because he is a great talent. He is most definitely starting over Hill if Brees goes down.


So a team w SB aspirations, is bringing in someone with character concerns and pays him the vet min of $1.1M to be their primary backup to Drew Brees?

This is after paying Bridgewater $12M+ the last 2 years to be their primary backup.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 8:46 pm    Post subject:

^
I mean, his team went 8-8 last season. Yes, he's a turnover machine, but he's clearly a high-end backup at worst. That kind of arm talent is rare. If Brees went down, I suspect that they would handle Winston with kid gloves, similar to what they did with Bridgewater for his first few starts. And maybe the lasik surgery helps him. Maybe it doesn't. But Teddy kept the ship afloat when Brees went out. I think Winston is capable of doing that as well.

As for how Chase Daniel can keep getting paid, and as for how Mariota got as much as he did from the Raiders, it's not my fault that teams continue to mismanage lol.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 8:50 pm    Post subject:

I guess Bridgewater wants to start, which it looks like he'll be doing in Carolina. Having a NFL style hard cap makes it unpractical to pay a 2nd string QB that kind of money for too long, so it makes sense for the Saints to want to cut cost there. I think Winston wants to play for a winning organization and hopefully build his rep back up.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 9:37 pm    Post subject:

panamaniac wrote:
I guess Bridgewater wants to start, which it looks like he'll be doing in Carolina. Having a NFL style hard cap makes it unpractical to pay a 2nd string QB that kind of money for too long, so it makes sense for the Saints to want to cut cost there. I think Winston wants to play for a winning organization and hopefully build his rep back up.


Yes, Teddy will start for the Panthers this season. Perhaps if it goes terribly, they will move on from him after this season and either draft a QB high next year, or dip back into the free agent market for another bridge starter. Or maybe it goes really well and he shows he can be a good starter, and they keep it going. They still figure to be a pretty bad team this season; even though I loved their draft, the defense was barren, and the rookies are going to need some time.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 9:47 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
As for how Chase Daniel can keep getting paid, and as for how Mariota got as much as he did from the Raiders, it's not my fault that teams continue to mismanage lol.


But it says something if all these “lesser” QBs are getting paid EXCEPT Winston.

Hill, who you call a gadget QB got “insanely” overpaid by NO
Mariota got overpaid by Raiders
Bridgewater got paid by NO as well

Only one who can’t get paid is Winston. The dude who’s “clearly a high-end backup at worst. That kind of arm talent is rare” can only manage to get a 1 yr $1.1M deal.

What am I missing?

If all these other underwhelming QBs can get paid, what is Winston and his agent doing wrong? Why can posters on here see his enormous talent yet he and his agent can’t get NFL teams to pay him for his talent?

What am I missing?

Is he represented by Richard Sherman?

How did NO get a high end backup w rare arm talent for $1.1M?
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 30, 2020 10:28 pm    Post subject:

^
I've already gone over why I think that is. Not going to go over it again.
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PostPosted: Fri May 01, 2020 4:29 am    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
^
I've already gone over why I think that is. Not going to go over it again.


Not really.

You explained why you think he joined NO.

You haven’t explained why NO this yr is only willing to spend $1.1M on their primary backup QB when they’ve spent way more on Bridgewater in the past.

What was NO’s plan if Winston didn’t accept? Roll with no backup QB?

Afterall, you said Hill definitely wasn’t backup material.

So if Winston doesn’t accept they just go into the season with no backup QB?

The same team that traded a 3rd to get Bridgewater and made him the highest paid backup last yr, was going to roll into the season w/o a backup QB?

And Winston, knowing he was going to be NO’s main backup QB, knowing how much they value a backup QB, seeing how much they paid Bridgewater the last 2 yrs, being as talented as he is, can only get them to pay him the vet min?

I don’t think you’ve explained how he can ONLY get $1.1M out of NO...

You did explain why he’s willing to only take $1.1M from NO, but I want to know why he could only get that much from NO and also why was NO so sure that they can play hardball with Winston and it’ll work?

You said you’re sure Winston turned down more money elsewhere.

So let’s recap:

1) NO needs a backup QB cuz Brees is 40+ and Hill is definitely not backup material

2) NO has paid Bridgewater big time $$ the last 2 yrs to backup Brees

3) Winston is extremely talented (a rare talent)

4) NO knows that Winston has been offered more money elsewhere

5) NO just got done giving their “gadget” QB (who can’t in no circumstances backup Brees) an “insanely” amount of money...

6) NO in pursuing Winston, and in a market where other lesser backups r getting paid ridiculous amounts of $$$, decide to lowball him. The absolute lowest that they can go ($1.1M vet min) - the same that NE offered Brian Hoyer

7) And somehow, miraculously, Winston accepts. Not only does he accept, but he’s not offended by the offer and is happy to play for Brian Hoyer money....

Think about it. Dude couldn’t even get $1.2M. They gave him the ABSOLUTE min that they can give him. Not $1 more than the ABSOLUTE min...

How do you walk into negotiations, be as talented as Winston is, knowing that NO needs a primary backup as badly as they do, and “negotiate” for the ABSOLUTE min??

How did the negotiations go?

NO: Look, we know you’re as good as Bridgewater. We know we paid Bridgewater big $$$. We know you’ve been offered more money elsewhere. We know we don’t currently have a backup QB. We know we just paid our gadget QB $21M. Look, you know how negotiations go. Don’t get offended. We start with a lowball offer, you counter with a much higher number and we meet somewhere in the middle, sounds good? OK, so we’ll start. How about the vet min, $1.1M, Brian Hoyer money???

Winston: DEAL!!!

Quote:
Once the Saints finalize the deal with Winston, he'll compete with Hill for the No. 2 job. Given the financial commitment the Saints just gave Hill, it appears to be a lock Hill will be the backup signal caller to Brees (Hill has a base salary over $10 million for 2021).

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/taysom-hill-not-surprised-the-saints-are-expected-to-sign-quarterback-jameis-winston/



Quote:
Learning opportunity aside, the deal is significantly below market, even for a backup quarterback.

https://nypost.com/2020/04/29/jameis-winston-inks-paltry-1-million-contract-with-saints/

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PostPosted: Fri May 01, 2020 6:57 am    Post subject:

LongBeachPoly wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
LongBeachPoly wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
LongBeachPoly wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
If Brees goes down, I'd be shocked if Hill became the starting QB.


All the more reason why it’s confounding that Winston and his agent could only command a $1.1M deal...


I'm sure he turned down more money elsewhere. But it's a good decision on his part. There's a chance he gets the keys to the Saints kingdom next year.


Why leave money on the table.

If Hill is not the backup QB that means NO has no backup QB going into the season.

The Raiders paid Mariota $8M to be their backup QB?

NO paid Bridgewater $7.25M last yr to be the backup QB?

In 2018, NO traded for Bridgewater and paid him $5M to be their backup. So NO pays for a backup.

Yet, Winston and his agent, with all the accomplishments listed above, could only get NO to pony up $1.1M?

Quote:
On March 15, 2019, Bridgewater signed a one-year, $7.25 million fully guaranteed contract with the Saints.


Quote:
On August 29, 2018, the Jets traded Bridgewater and a 2019 sixth-round draft pick to the New Orleans Saints for a 2019 third-round draft pick.


Quote:
So, basically, the Saints may be paying $5 million and a third round pick to have Bridgewater as a backup for one season whether he plays or not.


I just think he's thinking about his next move. There's a lot of upside to getting in that QB room and trying to impress Payton, and to be a part of that winning culture. If he wasn't going to get a starting job elsewhere anyway, he might be better off passing up a bit more money for the chance that he could be in a great situation next year. He's already banked $46MM in career earnings. If someone was offering him $20+MM or something, sure, you have to take that. But I think he and his agent must feel like the upside of being on this particular team and taking less money is worth more than taking a bit more from another team.


I get that. I just don’t get why they could only get $1.1M from NO.

If it’s true that Hill is not a viable backup option for them.

And last 2 years they paid for Bridgewater to be a backup for them, why wouldn’t they pay this year? I mean, Brees keeps getting older and older...

That’s what I don’t understand.

How did Winston go into negotiations with NO to be their backup, the replacement for Bridgewater, and only get$1.1M?


Because Hill is a viable backup and Winston is basically paying his tuition to learn how to be part of a team and what it takes to win. It is all on him, he has to learn humility and to put the team ahead of himself. Can he? I don’t know, but if he doesn’t, his time in NO will be short. Brees might retire but he isn’t leaving NO and what he means to that city is staggering. Whoever replaces him will have big shoes to fill, not on the field but off of it. Bridgewater wasn’t that player, we will see if Winston is.
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PostPosted: Fri May 01, 2020 10:21 am    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
Because Hill is a viable backup and Winston is basically paying his tuition to learn how to be part of a team and what it takes to win.


That's not what we're being told though. We're being told that Hill is only a gadget player that under no circumstances can be the backup for Brees.

We're being told that Winston is as good of a backup as Bridgewater was. That he is a rare talent. We're being told that Winston was signed to be the backup to Brees this year. That's an extremely important position for a team with SB aspirations and a 40+ yr old starting QB.

We're being told that despite paying lots of money to Bridgewater the last 2 years to back up Brees, this year they decided they were only going to spend the vet min of $1.1M on a backup. And somehow, they found someone as good as Bridgewater and that dude somehow accepted their offer!
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PostPosted: Fri May 01, 2020 11:14 am    Post subject:

I’m not sure who is telling you that but it isn’t the Saints. If Hill was 25 instead of 30 he would be the heir apparent. But he is 30 and they are giving Winston a shot to potentially be that.
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