Worldwide Coronavirus Thread (US death toll over 200,000)
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jodeke
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2020 12:43 pm    Post subject:

FernieBee wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
The economic pain is just beginning.


I sure wouldn't mind getting some more stimulus money...soon.



See if you're eligible.

Stimulus check IRS qualifications: Are you eligible for the next round of payments?

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2020 2:57 am    Post subject:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7130453/

Influenza and Obesity: it's odd relationship and lessons for the Covid 19 pandemic.

Get some exercise folks
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ChefLinda
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2020 5:16 am    Post subject:

Washington Post: New Trump pandemic adviser pushes controversial ‘herd immunity’ strategy, worrying public health officials

Quote:
One of President Trump’s top medical advisers is urging the White House to embrace a controversial “herd immunity” strategy to combat the pandemic, which would entail allowing the coronavirus to spread through most of the population to quickly build resistance to the virus, while taking steps to protect those in nursing homes and other vulnerable populations, according to five people familiar with the discussions.

The administration has already begun to implement some policies along these lines, according to current and former officials as well as experts, particularly with regard to testing.


Quote:
With a population of 328 million in the United States, it may require 2.13 million deaths to reach a 65 percent threshold of herd immunity, assuming the virus has a 1 percent fatality rate, according to an analysis by The Washington Post.


Needless to say this is appalling, vile and disgraceful. Instead of following the models of other countries who have gotten the virus under control, they intentionally choose a plan that would inflict maximum pain and death to 2 million Americans and their families, not to mention the thousands of people who would be infected but survive and have life long secondary health issues. And these would become pre-existing conditions that Trump administration is already trying to destroy in court through abolishment of the ACA. Cruelty is the point.
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Hector the Pup
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2020 7:08 am    Post subject:

ChefLinda wrote:
Washington Post: New Trump pandemic adviser pushes controversial ‘herd immunity’ strategy, worrying public health officials

Quote:
One of President Trump’s top medical advisers is urging the White House to embrace a controversial “herd immunity” strategy to combat the pandemic, which would entail allowing the coronavirus to spread through most of the population to quickly build resistance to the virus, while taking steps to protect those in nursing homes and other vulnerable populations, according to five people familiar with the discussions.

The administration has already begun to implement some policies along these lines, according to current and former officials as well as experts, particularly with regard to testing.


Quote:
With a population of 328 million in the United States, it may require 2.13 million deaths to reach a 65 percent threshold of herd immunity, assuming the virus has a 1 percent fatality rate, according to an analysis by The Washington Post.


Needless to say this is appalling, vile and disgraceful. Instead of following the models of other countries who have gotten the virus under control, they intentionally choose a plan that would inflict maximum pain and death to 2 million Americans and their families, not to mention the thousands of people who would be infected but survive and have life long secondary health issues. And these would become pre-existing conditions that Trump administration is already trying to destroy in court through abolishment of the ACA. Cruelty is the point.


We're screwed. Herd immunity, contact tracing, the curve... they have all become buzzwords. Up next, measurements will be based on belief.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2020 7:38 am    Post subject:

Trump is more dangerous than COVID-19. Stupidity should be reclassified as an illness and the number 25 comes to mind.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2020 1:35 pm    Post subject:

Quote:
How Colleges Are Blaming Their Students for Coronavirus Outbreaks

“Last night, a large group of first-year students selfishly jeopardized the very thing that so many of you claim to want,” one administrator wrote.

By SHANNON PALUS
AUG 31, 2020
4:43 PM

Colleges across America have logged more than 26,000 confirmed cases of COVID-19 since March, according to the New York Times, which is pulling together university-specific data in the absence of a more formal database. The Times notes that this number is likely on the low side—“with no national tracking system, colleges are making their own rules for how to tally cases”—and that most of these cases have been reported since late July.

With no national strategy to fight the coronavirus, colleges have been left to make their own rules on if and how to reopen and what steps to take once an outbreak occurs. And the outbreaks—they are certainly occurring. Which means colleges are also needing to figure something else out: where to place the blame. The answer is often, as experts predicted, on the students. Here’s why there have been outbreaks on college campuses, according to school administrators:

Students going to bars. The campus with the most coronavirus cases as of Monday is the University of Alabama at Birmingham (972 cases). “We remain satisfied that the precautions implemented prior to the resumption of classes—including masking, distancing, and a blend of in-person and remote instruction—are appropriate and effective,” Ricky Friend, the dean of the College of Community Health Sciences at UA, said in a statement published Friday concerning the three-school system of UAB, University of Alabama (in Tuscaloosa), and the University of Alabama in Huntsville. In-person classes are still in session, but school officials at UA specifically, which has logged 568 cases, did ask the mayor of Tuscaloosa to close bars, which he did for a two-week period, starting Aug. 24.

Students holding parties. After an outbreak of more than 100 positive cases at SUNY Oneonta in upstate New York, five students “have been suspended for holding parties against the college policy,” said SUNY Chancellor Jim Malatras in a statement sent out by Gov. Andrew Cuomo’s press office. “Three organizations, campus organizations, have been suspended and we’re going to be tough not because we want to ruin their fun, but this is a different time and this goes to what other campuses have been doing.” The campus is going virtual for two weeks, the statement also notes, and Cuomo is deploying a “SWAT team” which includes 71 contact tracers.

...

We are simply in a pandemic. After logging 263 positive tests in one week, East Carolina University switched to an online semester. Before the uptick, interim chancellor Ron Mitchelson had scolded some students for being “unmasked“ and “irresponsible.” But in an Aug. 23 statement, his messaging shifted to acknowledge the larger reality this semester exists within. He said in a video statement to the community: “The decision to pivot in large part was the disease. It’s a horrible pandemic that we face. We couldn’t stand by any longer.”

And there it is: an actual change in infrastructure that takes into account the fact that we are living in a pandemic. It’s probably the only chance colleges have to get out of this mess.


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angrypuppy
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2020 1:49 pm    Post subject:

FernieBee wrote:
Quote:
How Colleges Are Blaming Their Students for Coronavirus Outbreaks

“Last night, a large group of first-year students selfishly jeopardized the very thing that so many of you claim to want,” one administrator wrote.

By SHANNON PALUS
AUG 31, 2020
4:43 PM

Colleges across America have logged more than 26,000 confirmed cases of COVID-19 since March, according to the New York Times, which is pulling together university-specific data in the absence of a more formal database. The Times notes that this number is likely on the low side—“with no national tracking system, colleges are making their own rules for how to tally cases”—and that most of these cases have been reported since late July.

With no national strategy to fight the coronavirus, colleges have been left to make their own rules on if and how to reopen and what steps to take once an outbreak occurs. And the outbreaks—they are certainly occurring. Which means colleges are also needing to figure something else out: where to place the blame. The answer is often, as experts predicted, on the students. Here’s why there have been outbreaks on college campuses, according to school administrators:

Students going to bars. The campus with the most coronavirus cases as of Monday is the University of Alabama at Birmingham (972 cases). “We remain satisfied that the precautions implemented prior to the resumption of classes—including masking, distancing, and a blend of in-person and remote instruction—are appropriate and effective,” Ricky Friend, the dean of the College of Community Health Sciences at UA, said in a statement published Friday concerning the three-school system of UAB, University of Alabama (in Tuscaloosa), and the University of Alabama in Huntsville. In-person classes are still in session, but school officials at UA specifically, which has logged 568 cases, did ask the mayor of Tuscaloosa to close bars, which he did for a two-week period, starting Aug. 24.

Students holding parties. After an outbreak of more than 100 positive cases at SUNY Oneonta in upstate New York, five students “have been suspended for holding parties against the college policy,” said SUNY Chancellor Jim Malatras in a statement sent out by Gov. Andrew Cuomo’s press office. “Three organizations, campus organizations, have been suspended and we’re going to be tough not because we want to ruin their fun, but this is a different time and this goes to what other campuses have been doing.” The campus is going virtual for two weeks, the statement also notes, and Cuomo is deploying a “SWAT team” which includes 71 contact tracers.

...

We are simply in a pandemic. After logging 263 positive tests in one week, East Carolina University switched to an online semester. Before the uptick, interim chancellor Ron Mitchelson had scolded some students for being “unmasked“ and “irresponsible.” But in an Aug. 23 statement, his messaging shifted to acknowledge the larger reality this semester exists within. He said in a video statement to the community: “The decision to pivot in large part was the disease. It’s a horrible pandemic that we face. We couldn’t stand by any longer.”

And there it is: an actual change in infrastructure that takes into account the fact that we are living in a pandemic. It’s probably the only chance colleges have to get out of this mess.


Slate



If the students are breaking the code of conduct then they certainly deserve blame. It happened on the Purdue campus last week, when 36 students were suspended after being busted at a party. They weren't wearing masks or observing social distancing rules.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2020 6:06 pm    Post subject:

Code:

California Covid Deaths for August 31, 2020
-----------------------------------------------

11,373,305 Tests Performed
   11,373,305 Results Rec'd (0 PENDING)
     704,085 POSITIVE (+4,176)
   10,669,220 NEGATIVE


Day.......#..Day........#..Day........#..Day........#..Day........#..Day.......#
2/26/2020 0  4/01/2020 21  5/01/2020 91  6/01/2020 38  7/01/2020 110 8/01/2020 219
2/27/2020 0  4/02/2020 32  5/02/2020 98  6/02/2020 35  7/02/2020 73  8/02/2020 132
2/28/2020 0  4/03/2020 34  5/03/2020 44  6/03/2020 75  7/03/2020 100 8/03/2020 32
2/29/2020 0  4/04/2020 39  5/04/2020 39  6/04/2020 61  7/04/2020 50  8/04/2020 113
3/01/2020 0  4/05/2020 43  5/05/2020 63  6/05/2020 63  7/05/2020 18  8/05/2020 202
3/02/2020 0  4/06/2020 24  5/06/2020 95  6/06/2020 74  7/06/2020 6   8/06/2020 166
3/03/2020 0  4/07/2020 31  5/07/2020 92  6/07/2020 67  7/07/2020 111 8/07/2020 142
3/04/2020 1  4/08/2020 68  5/08/2020 81  6/08/2020 27  7/08/2020 114 8/08/2020 178
3/05/2020 0  4/09/2020 50  5/09/2020 93  6/09/2020 44  7/09/2020 149 8/09/2020 104
3/06/2020 0  4/10/2020 49  5/10/2020 67  6/10/2020 79  7/10/2020 140 8/10/2020 66
3/07/2020 0  4/11/2020 68  5/11/2020 25  6/11/2020 105 7/11/2020 94  8/11/2020 109
3/08/2020 0  4/12/2020 42  5/12/2020 77  6/12/2020 62  7/12/2020 72  8/12/2020 180
3/09/2020 0  4/13/2020 36  5/13/2020 87  6/13/2020 46  7/13/2020 23  8/13/2020 160
3/10/2020 1  4/14/2020 71  5/14/2020 98  6/14/2020 74  7/14/2020 47  8/14/2020 188
3/12/2020 4  4/15/2020 63  5/15/2020 76  6/15/2020 26  7/15/2020 140 8/15/2020 151
3/13/2020 0  4/16/2020 69  5/16/2020 96  6/16/2020 32  7/16/2020 118 8/16/2020 77
3/14/2020 1  4/17/2020 95  5/17/2020 57  6/17/2020 87  7/17/2020 130 8/17/2020 18
3/15/2020 0  4/18/2020 87  5/18/2020 41  6/18/2020 82  7/18/2020 120 8/18/2020 100
3/16/2020 1  4/19/2020 94  5/19/2020 32  6/19/2020 70  7/19/2020 90  8/19/2020 181 
3/17/2020 5  4/20/2020 42  5/20/2020 102 6/20/2020 64  7/20/2020 9   8/20/2020 163
3/18/2020 2  4/21/2020 60  5/21/2020 106 6/21/2020 71  7/21/2020 61  8/21/2020 135
3/19/2020 3  4/22/2020 86  5/22/2020 88  6/22/2020 20  7/22/2020 115 8/22/2020 167
3/20/2020 3  4/23/2020 115 5/23/2020 78  6/23/2020 65  7/23/2020 157 8/23/2020 146
3/21/2020 4  4/24/2020 93  5/24/2020 66  6/24/2020 52  7/24/2020 159 8/24/2020 18
3/22/2020 4  4/25/2020 89  5/25/2020 21  6/25/2020 101 7/25/2020 151 8/25/2020 105
3/23/2020 0  4/26/2020 59  5/26/2020 19  6/26/2020 79  7/26/2020 79  8/26/2020 150
3/24/2020 13 4/27/2020 45  5/27/2020 70  6/27/2020 60  7/27/2020 29  8/27/2020 143
3/25/2020 13 4/28/2020 54  5/28/2020 89  6/28/2020 33  7/28/2020 73  8/28/2020 140 
3/26/2020 12 4/29/2020 78  5/29/2020 95  6/29/2020 31  7/29/2020 197 8/29/2020 144
3/27/2020 13 4/30/2020 95  5/30/2020 88  6/30/2020 44  7/30/2020 194 8/30/2020 71
3/28/2020 23               5/31/2020 57                7/31/2020 96  8/31/2020 28
3/30/2020 34
3/31/2020 15

.....TOTAL 12,933

------Source
https://www.cdph.ca.gov/Programs/OPA/Pages/NR20-214.aspx#
------Tableau
https://update.covid19.ca.gov/


Last edited by JerryWest_44 on Fri Sep 04, 2020 2:17 pm; edited 1 time in total
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tox
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 1:19 am    Post subject:

angrypuppy wrote:

If the students are breaking the code of conduct then they certainly deserve blame. It happened on the Purdue campus last week, when 36 students were suspended after being busted at a party. They weren't wearing masks or observing social distancing rules.

They're kids. They're already being asked to waste a year of their youth (of college, no less!) for the altruism of not propagating a disease for more vulnerable populations. Of course, some are not going to socially distance. Opening up colleges just makes it easier for them to get together in big groups.

Administrators knew all this and still opened up colleges, because what this is really about is $$$ and we all know it. Open up colleges, blame students for the obviously foreseeable consequences, and possibly switch to an online model later while cashing in that sweet, sweet tuition money.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 4:41 am    Post subject:

tox wrote:
angrypuppy wrote:

If the students are breaking the code of conduct then they certainly deserve blame. It happened on the Purdue campus last week, when 36 students were suspended after being busted at a party. They weren't wearing masks or observing social distancing rules.

They're kids. They're already being asked to waste a year of their youth (of college, no less!) for the altruism of not propagating a disease for more vulnerable populations. Of course, some are not going to socially distance. Opening up colleges just makes it easier for them to get together in big groups.

Administrators knew all this and still opened up colleges, because what this is really about is $$$ and we all know it. Open up colleges, blame students for the obviously foreseeable consequences, and possibly switch to an online model later while cashing in that sweet, sweet tuition money.



And I suppose you'll defend the colleges when they either significantly raise tuition or simply fold? Your picture that all colleges are greedy and have Ivy League endowments, or that they can simply flip a switch and fire everyone, including tenured professors. Higher education doesn't work that way. The only solution is to either go completely online, or attempt to experiment with a model that has live instruction for non-lecture hall classes and online, the latter as a substitute for lecture halls or as a backup.

That's what Purdue is attempting to accomplish. They've ordered and cut miles of plexiglass to separate the older, vulnerable faculty and have monitors who, if they see someone without a mask, ask them to comply immediately.

The "they're just kids" excuse doesn't fly. They're old enough to know better which is why they have the right to vote and the obligation to serve in the armed services during times of conflict. They're also educated and bright enough to understand that they will be suspended for endangering the lives of others. After all, isn't that the point of wearing a face mask, to show that you respect the health of those around you?
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:33 am    Post subject:

angrypuppy wrote:
tox wrote:
angrypuppy wrote:

If the students are breaking the code of conduct then they certainly deserve blame. It happened on the Purdue campus last week, when 36 students were suspended after being busted at a party. They weren't wearing masks or observing social distancing rules.

They're kids. They're already being asked to waste a year of their youth (of college, no less!) for the altruism of not propagating a disease for more vulnerable populations. Of course, some are not going to socially distance. Opening up colleges just makes it easier for them to get together in big groups.

Administrators knew all this and still opened up colleges, because what this is really about is $$$ and we all know it. Open up colleges, blame students for the obviously foreseeable consequences, and possibly switch to an online model later while cashing in that sweet, sweet tuition money.



And I suppose you'll defend the colleges when they either significantly raise tuition or simply fold? Your picture that all colleges are greedy and have Ivy League endowments, or that they can simply flip a switch and fire everyone, including tenured professors. Higher education doesn't work that way. The only solution is to either go completely online, or attempt to experiment with a model that has live instruction for non-lecture hall classes and online, the latter as a substitute for lecture halls or as a backup.

That's what Purdue is attempting to accomplish. They've ordered and cut miles of plexiglass to separate the older, vulnerable faculty and have monitors who, if they see someone without a mask, ask them to comply immediately.

The "they're just kids" excuse doesn't fly. They're old enough to know better which is why they have the right to vote and the obligation to serve in the armed services during times of conflict. They're also educated and bright enough to understand that they will be suspended for endangering the lives of others. After all, isn't that the point of wearing a face mask, to show that you respect the health of those around you?


You completely lost me in that last paragraph. College kids, like any other kids, are for the most part complete idiots, and their collective IQ drops in relation to crowd size. That has always been the case and it will remain the case until the end of time.
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angrypuppy
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:14 am    Post subject:

Hector the Pup wrote:
angrypuppy wrote:
tox wrote:
angrypuppy wrote:

If the students are breaking the code of conduct then they certainly deserve blame. It happened on the Purdue campus last week, when 36 students were suspended after being busted at a party. They weren't wearing masks or observing social distancing rules.

They're kids. They're already being asked to waste a year of their youth (of college, no less!) for the altruism of not propagating a disease for more vulnerable populations. Of course, some are not going to socially distance. Opening up colleges just makes it easier for them to get together in big groups.

Administrators knew all this and still opened up colleges, because what this is really about is $$$ and we all know it. Open up colleges, blame students for the obviously foreseeable consequences, and possibly switch to an online model later while cashing in that sweet, sweet tuition money.



And I suppose you'll defend the colleges when they either significantly raise tuition or simply fold? Your picture that all colleges are greedy and have Ivy League endowments, or that they can simply flip a switch and fire everyone, including tenured professors. Higher education doesn't work that way. The only solution is to either go completely online, or attempt to experiment with a model that has live instruction for non-lecture hall classes and online, the latter as a substitute for lecture halls or as a backup.

That's what Purdue is attempting to accomplish. They've ordered and cut miles of plexiglass to separate the older, vulnerable faculty and have monitors who, if they see someone without a mask, ask them to comply immediately.

The "they're just kids" excuse doesn't fly. They're old enough to know better which is why they have the right to vote and the obligation to serve in the armed services during times of conflict. They're also educated and bright enough to understand that they will be suspended for endangering the lives of others. After all, isn't that the point of wearing a face mask, to show that you respect the health of those around you?


You completely lost me in that last paragraph. College kids, like any other kids, are for the most part complete idiots, and their collective IQ drops in relation to crowd size. That has always been the case and it will remain the case until the end of time.



Since the US population large the collective IQ must be tiny since you maintain they are inversely proportional. Thus no one should be expected wear masks and everyone college age should be excused from wearing masks in public. Got it.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:34 am    Post subject:

angrypuppy wrote:
Hector the Pup wrote:
angrypuppy wrote:
tox wrote:
angrypuppy wrote:

If the students are breaking the code of conduct then they certainly deserve blame. It happened on the Purdue campus last week, when 36 students were suspended after being busted at a party. They weren't wearing masks or observing social distancing rules.

They're kids. They're already being asked to waste a year of their youth (of college, no less!) for the altruism of not propagating a disease for more vulnerable populations. Of course, some are not going to socially distance. Opening up colleges just makes it easier for them to get together in big groups.

Administrators knew all this and still opened up colleges, because what this is really about is $$$ and we all know it. Open up colleges, blame students for the obviously foreseeable consequences, and possibly switch to an online model later while cashing in that sweet, sweet tuition money.



And I suppose you'll defend the colleges when they either significantly raise tuition or simply fold? Your picture that all colleges are greedy and have Ivy League endowments, or that they can simply flip a switch and fire everyone, including tenured professors. Higher education doesn't work that way. The only solution is to either go completely online, or attempt to experiment with a model that has live instruction for non-lecture hall classes and online, the latter as a substitute for lecture halls or as a backup.

That's what Purdue is attempting to accomplish. They've ordered and cut miles of plexiglass to separate the older, vulnerable faculty and have monitors who, if they see someone without a mask, ask them to comply immediately.

The "they're just kids" excuse doesn't fly. They're old enough to know better which is why they have the right to vote and the obligation to serve in the armed services during times of conflict. They're also educated and bright enough to understand that they will be suspended for endangering the lives of others. After all, isn't that the point of wearing a face mask, to show that you respect the health of those around you?


You completely lost me in that last paragraph. College kids, like any other kids, are for the most part complete idiots, and their collective IQ drops in relation to crowd size. That has always been the case and it will remain the case until the end of time.



Since the US population large the collective IQ must be tiny since you maintain they are inversely proportional. Thus no one should be expected wear masks and everyone college age should be excused from wearing masks in public. Got it.


Not at all. I just prefer plans based on reality rather than ideals. Kids are not adults. College kids are not adults. Put a large group of them together and they're going to party. It's what they do.
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angrypuppy
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:37 am    Post subject:

Hector the Pup wrote:
angrypuppy wrote:
Hector the Pup wrote:
angrypuppy wrote:
tox wrote:
angrypuppy wrote:

If the students are breaking the code of conduct then they certainly deserve blame. It happened on the Purdue campus last week, when 36 students were suspended after being busted at a party. They weren't wearing masks or observing social distancing rules.

They're kids. They're already being asked to waste a year of their youth (of college, no less!) for the altruism of not propagating a disease for more vulnerable populations. Of course, some are not going to socially distance. Opening up colleges just makes it easier for them to get together in big groups.

Administrators knew all this and still opened up colleges, because what this is really about is $$$ and we all know it. Open up colleges, blame students for the obviously foreseeable consequences, and possibly switch to an online model later while cashing in that sweet, sweet tuition money.



And I suppose you'll defend the colleges when they either significantly raise tuition or simply fold? Your picture that all colleges are greedy and have Ivy League endowments, or that they can simply flip a switch and fire everyone, including tenured professors. Higher education doesn't work that way. The only solution is to either go completely online, or attempt to experiment with a model that has live instruction for non-lecture hall classes and online, the latter as a substitute for lecture halls or as a backup.

That's what Purdue is attempting to accomplish. They've ordered and cut miles of plexiglass to separate the older, vulnerable faculty and have monitors who, if they see someone without a mask, ask them to comply immediately.

The "they're just kids" excuse doesn't fly. They're old enough to know better which is why they have the right to vote and the obligation to serve in the armed services during times of conflict. They're also educated and bright enough to understand that they will be suspended for endangering the lives of others. After all, isn't that the point of wearing a face mask, to show that you respect the health of those around you?


You completely lost me in that last paragraph. College kids, like any other kids, are for the most part complete idiots, and their collective IQ drops in relation to crowd size. That has always been the case and it will remain the case until the end of time.



Since the US population large the collective IQ must be tiny since you maintain they are inversely proportional. Thus no one should be expected wear masks and everyone college age should be excused from wearing masks in public. Got it.


Not at all. I just prefer plans based on reality rather than ideals. Kids are not adults. College kids are not adults. Put a large group of them together and they're going to party. It's what they do.



And your plan is?
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:50 am    Post subject:

It's going to sound crazy, but here it is.

Shut everything down. Now. Get the virus under control and don't open back up until it is. Not until people are tired of being under lockdown, not until your local businesses start hurting and for damn sure not until some politicians think it looks bad. Lock down until it's under control.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:00 am    Post subject:

Hector the Pup wrote:
It's going to sound crazy, but here it is.

Shut everything down. Now. Get the virus under control and don't open back up until it is. Not until people are tired of being under lockdown, not until your local businesses start hurting and for damn sure not until some politicians think it looks bad. Lock down until it's under control.



Most colleges are hanging on by a thread financially. That means far more tuition for parents (as if education isn't already unaffordable for many) and far more tax dollars to keep the public schools open, and accepting the failure of many private colleges. Well, I guess you could call shutting down everything a plan.

Alternatively you could plan to keep the school open by testing the incoming students over the summer and not allowing those infected in until they clear. And you could demand testing of the students when the reach the campus. While you're at it, you could purchase plexiglass, cut it and install it to protect the more vulnerable, older faculty. And you could then test all workers, students and faculty on an ongoing basis, and demand that they wear masks and maintain social distancing.

But you maintain that wouldn't work. Well here are the preliminary results at Purdue University, which implemented the plan I briefly outlined:

https://protect.purdue.edu/dashboard/

Note that the early spike was from the incoming students, and that the trend is downward now. The infected students are quarantined and will take classes online. The trend is now downward because they are now resorting to random testing, and testing of students who show symptoms.

Also note that infection rates are much lower than the city of West Lafayette and Tippecanoe County, which is where Purdue is located.

Now what were you saying about plans grounded in reality?
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:09 am    Post subject:

angrypuppy wrote:
Hector the Pup wrote:
It's going to sound crazy, but here it is.

Shut everything down. Now. Get the virus under control and don't open back up until it is. Not until people are tired of being under lockdown, not until your local businesses start hurting and for damn sure not until some politicians think it looks bad. Lock down until it's under control.



Most colleges are hanging on by a thread financially. That means far more tuition for parents (as if education isn't already unaffordable for many) and far more tax dollars to keep the public schools open, and accepting the failure of many private colleges. Well, I guess you could call shutting down everything a plan.

Alternatively you could plan to keep the school open by testing the incoming students over the summer and not allowing those infected in until they clear. And you could demand testing of the students when the reach the campus. While you're at it, you could purchase plexiglass, cut it and install it to protect the more vulnerable, older faculty. And you could then test all workers, students and faculty on an ongoing basis, and demand that they wear masks and maintain social distancing.

But you maintain that wouldn't work. Well here are the preliminary results at Purdue University, which implemented the plan I briefly outlined:

https://protect.purdue.edu/dashboard/

Note that the early spike was from the incoming students, and that the trend is downward now. The infected students are quarantined and will take classes online. The trend is now downward because they are now resorting to random testing, and testing of students who show symptoms.

Also note that infection rates are much lower than the city of West Lafayette and Tippecanoe County, which is where Purdue is located.

Now what were you saying about plans grounded in reality?


Then it's simple. Just have every college do that. I look forward to seeing the complete list of schools that have, because I'm sure that you just randomly picked one out of a very long list of those that have. There's no way you picked a complete outlier and held that up as your sole point of reference.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:19 am    Post subject:

Hector the Pup wrote:
angrypuppy wrote:
Hector the Pup wrote:
It's going to sound crazy, but here it is.

Shut everything down. Now. Get the virus under control and don't open back up until it is. Not until people are tired of being under lockdown, not until your local businesses start hurting and for damn sure not until some politicians think it looks bad. Lock down until it's under control.



Most colleges are hanging on by a thread financially. That means far more tuition for parents (as if education isn't already unaffordable for many) and far more tax dollars to keep the public schools open, and accepting the failure of many private colleges. Well, I guess you could call shutting down everything a plan.

Alternatively you could plan to keep the school open by testing the incoming students over the summer and not allowing those infected in until they clear. And you could demand testing of the students when the reach the campus. While you're at it, you could purchase plexiglass, cut it and install it to protect the more vulnerable, older faculty. And you could then test all workers, students and faculty on an ongoing basis, and demand that they wear masks and maintain social distancing.

But you maintain that wouldn't work. Well here are the preliminary results at Purdue University, which implemented the plan I briefly outlined:

https://protect.purdue.edu/dashboard/

Note that the early spike was from the incoming students, and that the trend is downward now. The infected students are quarantined and will take classes online. The trend is now downward because they are now resorting to random testing, and testing of students who show symptoms.

Also note that infection rates are much lower than the city of West Lafayette and Tippecanoe County, which is where Purdue is located.

Now what were you saying about plans grounded in reality?


Then it's simple. Just have every college do that. I look forward to seeing the complete list of schools that have, because I'm sure that you just randomly picked one out of a very long list of those that have. There's no way you picked a complete outlier and held that up as your sole point of reference.



I picked one that showed early leadership, as Purdue was in the news for its planning. Many criticized Purdue's decision, but I am a firm believer that college-age kids are gaseous entities; they can fill the vacuum of high expectations. You just have to remember that you have to enforce rules, which means suspensions for non-compliance, set up a monitoring visible monitoring system, and communicate the expectations to the students in a positive manner ("Protect Purdue"). There will be idiots who will not comply, but setting the social norms early means that you can keep the wishy-washy kids from following the idiots.

I honestly don't know if it will work, but I do admire the planning and the goal. And it is sad that other colleges are reactive rather than proactive. It doesn't have to be that way Hector.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 11:39 am    Post subject:

It's almost like the Trump administration doesn't really care if we live or die. Trump's fragile ego, racism and ignorance comes first and our lives don't even make the top ten:

Washington Post: U.S. says it won’t join WHO-linked effort to develop, distribute coronavirus vaccine

Quote:
The Trump administration said it will not join a global effort to develop, manufacture and equitably distribute a coronavirus vaccine, in part because the World Health Organization is involved, a decision that could shape the course of the pandemic and the country’s role in health diplomacy.

More than 170 countries are in talks to participate in the Covid-19 Vaccines Global Access (Covax) Facility, which aims to speed vaccine development and secure doses for all countries and distribute them to the most high-risk segment of each population.

The plan, which is co-led by the WHO, the Coalition for Epidemic Preparedness Innovations and Gavi, the vaccine alliance, was of interest to some members of the Trump administration and is backed by traditional U.S. allies, including Japan, Germany and the European Commission, the executive arm of the European Union.

But the United States will not participate, in part because the White House does not want to work with the WHO, which President Trump has criticized over what he characterized as its “China-centric” response to the pandemic.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 12:42 pm    Post subject:

Trump blames the WHO (and China) for his inept response to the pandemic in the US.

He's an idiot...and a racist.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 4:13 pm    Post subject:

ChefLinda wrote:
It's almost like the Trump administration doesn't really care if we live or die. Trump's fragile ego, racism and ignorance comes first and our lives don't even make the top ten:

Washington Post: U.S. says it won’t join WHO-linked effort to develop, distribute coronavirus vaccine

Quote:
The Trump administration said it will not join a global effort to develop, manufacture and equitably distribute a coronavirus vaccine, in part because the World Health Organization is involved, a decision that could shape the course of the pandemic and the country’s role in health diplomacy.

More than 170 countries are in talks to participate in the Covid-19 Vaccines Global Access (Covax) Facility, which aims to speed vaccine development and secure doses for all countries and distribute them to the most high-risk segment of each population.

The plan, which is co-led by the WHO, the Coalition for Epidemic Preparedness Innovations and Gavi, the vaccine alliance, was of interest to some members of the Trump administration and is backed by traditional U.S. allies, including Japan, Germany and the European Commission, the executive arm of the European Union.

But the United States will not participate, in part because the White House does not want to work with the WHO, which President Trump has criticized over what he characterized as its “China-centric” response to the pandemic.



PLEASE EVERYONE VOTE IN NOVEMBER. STOP THIS ORANGE FACE MANIAC ONCE AND FOR ALL. MAY ALL THE GOP THAT SUPPORTED HIM, FACE THEY'RE MAKER IN HELL.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2020 1:40 pm    Post subject:

Quote:
Up to 35 percent of Big Ten athletes who had Covid-19 now show signs of inflammation of the heart muscle, a top Penn State doctor says, reigniting the debate over the safety of playing sports during the pandemic.


Quote:
"When we looked at our COVID-positive athletes, whether they were symptomatic or not, 30 to roughly 35 percent of their heart muscles are inflamed...and we really just don't know what to do with it right now It's still very early in the infection. Some of that has led to the Pac-12 and the Big Ten's decision to sort of put a hiatus on what's happening." Sebastianelli said.


https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/03/health/penn-state-big-10-myocarditis-covid-spt-trnd/index.html

And in a separate study:
Quote:
A known issue. 100 adult cohort study from Germany in July revealed ~75% had pericarditis or myocarditis in "recovered" COVID19.

Outcomes of Cardiovascular Magnetic Resonance Imaging in Patients Recently Recovered From COVID-19 https://ja.ma/3bt8Hx5

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2020 1:47 pm    Post subject:

angrypuppy wrote:
FernieBee wrote:
Quote:
How Colleges Are Blaming Their Students for Coronavirus Outbreaks

“Last night, a large group of first-year students selfishly jeopardized the very thing that so many of you claim to want,” one administrator wrote.

By SHANNON PALUS
AUG 31, 2020
4:43 PM

Colleges across America have logged more than 26,000 confirmed cases of COVID-19 since March, according to the New York Times, which is pulling together university-specific data in the absence of a more formal database. The Times notes that this number is likely on the low side—“with no national tracking system, colleges are making their own rules for how to tally cases”—and that most of these cases have been reported since late July.

With no national strategy to fight the coronavirus, colleges have been left to make their own rules on if and how to reopen and what steps to take once an outbreak occurs. And the outbreaks—they are certainly occurring. Which means colleges are also needing to figure something else out: where to place the blame. The answer is often, as experts predicted, on the students. Here’s why there have been outbreaks on college campuses, according to school administrators:

Students going to bars. The campus with the most coronavirus cases as of Monday is the University of Alabama at Birmingham (972 cases). “We remain satisfied that the precautions implemented prior to the resumption of classes—including masking, distancing, and a blend of in-person and remote instruction—are appropriate and effective,” Ricky Friend, the dean of the College of Community Health Sciences at UA, said in a statement published Friday concerning the three-school system of UAB, University of Alabama (in Tuscaloosa), and the University of Alabama in Huntsville. In-person classes are still in session, but school officials at UA specifically, which has logged 568 cases, did ask the mayor of Tuscaloosa to close bars, which he did for a two-week period, starting Aug. 24.

Students holding parties. After an outbreak of more than 100 positive cases at SUNY Oneonta in upstate New York, five students “have been suspended for holding parties against the college policy,” said SUNY Chancellor Jim Malatras in a statement sent out by Gov. Andrew Cuomo’s press office. “Three organizations, campus organizations, have been suspended and we’re going to be tough not because we want to ruin their fun, but this is a different time and this goes to what other campuses have been doing.” The campus is going virtual for two weeks, the statement also notes, and Cuomo is deploying a “SWAT team” which includes 71 contact tracers.

...

We are simply in a pandemic. After logging 263 positive tests in one week, East Carolina University switched to an online semester. Before the uptick, interim chancellor Ron Mitchelson had scolded some students for being “unmasked“ and “irresponsible.” But in an Aug. 23 statement, his messaging shifted to acknowledge the larger reality this semester exists within. He said in a video statement to the community: “The decision to pivot in large part was the disease. It’s a horrible pandemic that we face. We couldn’t stand by any longer.”

And there it is: an actual change in infrastructure that takes into account the fact that we are living in a pandemic. It’s probably the only chance colleges have to get out of this mess.


Slate



If the students are breaking the code of conduct then they certainly deserve blame. It happened on the Purdue campus last week, when 36 students were suspended after being busted at a party. They weren't wearing masks or observing social distancing rules.


This is one of the main issues I had with students returning to college campuses. Trusting a bunch of 18-22 year olds in campus housing etc. to socially distance and avoid any kind of congregation to socialize wass doomed from moment one.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:50 pm    Post subject:

Hector the Pup wrote:
It's going to sound crazy, but here it is.

Shut everything down. Now. Get the virus under control and don't open back up until it is. Not until people are tired of being under lockdown, not until your local businesses start hurting and for damn sure not until some politicians think it looks bad. Lock down until it's under control.


I said this 10 million times in this thread during the first lockdown. Always got the same rebuttal. "It's either lives or $, and both cause pain for Americans". To which I replied. The Federal Government has to step up. I don't want to hear about debt and the deficit. We own the vast majority of our debt. We print our own money. And deficit spending has been a part of our economic system long before COVID. Actually we used deficit spending for alot less important things than financially saving Americans through a pandemic.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2020 5:11 pm    Post subject:

While many colleges didn't plan, I believe that any criticism should be more nuanced. If you feel that certain people cannot help but congregate, the question becomes whether you'd rather see them out in the wild (hometown or city) or a structured environment where they are required to wear masks and undergo quarantine. In other words, for those of you who think certain kids are beyond control, do you honestly believe those kids are better off outside a controlled campus environment?
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