Lakers vs Nets games in China might get canceled (update: leaning towards letting Nets/Lakers play)
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cal1piggy
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 1:29 pm    Post subject:

alright maomao, i need to attend to some matters now.
nice chatting with you.
may catch you later as i have a couple more days of time to kill while sweating out the next move.

thanks!


thought some are going to say i am saying bye to myself
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drae
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 1:54 pm    Post subject:

eddiejonze wrote:
Anyone who is pro China and anti HK protesters needs to look up things like : "Tibet" and "Dalai Lama"...


Tibet is viewed as a separate country being oppressed by China. Hong Kong is a part of China so what's happening is a domestic matter.

How is this even relevant?
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drae
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 1:58 pm    Post subject:

*Looks at last 6 pages*

...

...

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LaLaLakeShow
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:03 pm    Post subject:

drae wrote:
eddiejonze wrote:
Anyone who is pro China and anti HK protesters needs to look up things like : "Tibet" and "Dalai Lama"...


Tibet is viewed as a separate country being oppressed by China. Hong Kong is a part of China so what's happening is a domestic matter.

How is this even relevant?


All of China’s history of abuse would be relevant, quite obviously
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drae
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:10 pm    Post subject:

LaLaLakeShow wrote:
drae wrote:
eddiejonze wrote:
Anyone who is pro China and anti HK protesters needs to look up things like : "Tibet" and "Dalai Lama"...


Tibet is viewed as a separate country being oppressed by China. Hong Kong is a part of China so what's happening is a domestic matter.

How is this even relevant?


All of China’s history of abuse would be relevant, quite obviously


For what?

Let's talk Hong Kong protests. Hong Kong protested an extradition bill that would allow China to extradite Hong Kong citizens to face trial in China. This is obviously not ideal and people took to the streets.

That bill was formally withdrawn last month. Case closed, the protestors won.

What Hong Kong protestors want now are things that obviously aren't going to happen. The 5 demands that keep circulating include the demand for genuine universal suffrage. China isn't going to spend the next decade implementing a system in Hong Kong that won't last 20 years and will result in a huge culture shock and more riots when Hong Kong is fully assimilated back into China.

They just won't do it.

And all these social rights activists who are calling for Hong Kong people to rise up will not be in Hong Kong when stuff really hits the fan.

Hong Kong people already won. China won't wind back it's gradual assimilation of one of their own regions into their own country. Hoping for anything else is a fantasy.

So how does human rights abuses even factor into this conversation?
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maomao
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:12 pm    Post subject:

LaLaLakeShow wrote:
drae wrote:
eddiejonze wrote:
Anyone who is pro China and anti HK protesters needs to look up things like : "Tibet" and "Dalai Lama"...


Tibet is viewed as a separate country being oppressed by China. Hong Kong is a part of China so what's happening is a domestic matter.

How is this even relevant?


All of China’s history of abuse would be relevant, quite obviously


China's history of getting abused is much longer unfortunately.
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maomao
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:19 pm    Post subject:

drae wrote:
LaLaLakeShow wrote:
drae wrote:
eddiejonze wrote:
Anyone who is pro China and anti HK protesters needs to look up things like : "Tibet" and "Dalai Lama"...


Tibet is viewed as a separate country being oppressed by China. Hong Kong is a part of China so what's happening is a domestic matter.

How is this even relevant?


All of China’s history of abuse would be relevant, quite obviously


For what?

Let's talk Hong Kong protests. Hong Kong protested an extradition bill that would allow China to extradite Hong Kong citizens to face trial in China. This is obviously not ideal and people took to the streets.

That bill was formally withdrawn last month. Case closed, the protestors won.

What Hong Kong protestors want now are things that obviously aren't going to happen. The 5 demands that keep circulating include the demand for genuine universal suffrage. China isn't going to spend the next decade implementing a system in Hong Kong that won't last 20 years and will result in a huge culture shock and more riots when Hong Kong is fully assimilated back into China.

They just won't do it.

And all these social rights activists who are calling for Hong Kong people to rise up will not be in Hong Kong when stuff really hits the fan.

Hong Kong people already won. China won't wind back it's gradual assimilation of one of their own regions into their own country. Hoping for anything else is a fantasy.

So how does human rights abuses even factor into this conversation?



Contrary to popular believe, the whole protest was not caused nor has anything to do with the Chinese government.

It's 100% to do with the incapable politicians and bureaucrats of hong kong. It's 100% to do with the social structure and education systems. It's 100% to do with fake news media that brainwashes people for political and social gains.

All in all, hong kong people is not good enough for this style of democracy. They are paying the price for it and the mainland Chinese and the government cares not one bit as they are readying Shenzhen to absorb investment money and talents from the chaos in Hong Kong
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drae
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:24 pm    Post subject:

maomao wrote:
They are paying the price for it and the mainland Chinese and the government cares not one bit as they are readying Shenzhen to absorb investment money and talents from the chaos in Hong Kong


For anyone who doesn't know, 30 years ago Shenzhen was a small rural village and has been transformed into the tech capital of China. Last year the village posted a higher GDP than Hong Kong for the first time. It was built 30 kms from Hong Kong for a reason, it ties Hong Kong increasingly to the mainland, it lessens the amount of financial clout Hong Kong has, and is generally one of the measures China built to aid the assimilation of Hong Kong into China.

As for whether they're good enough for that style of democracy, that's really a moot question. Hong Kong was never going to have that sort of democracy going forward so China has been gradually winding it back. They're not going to tolerate a democratic, autonomous region inside their country. Just won't happen.
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maomao
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:31 pm    Post subject:

drae wrote:
maomao wrote:
They are paying the price for it and the mainland Chinese and the government cares not one bit as they are readying Shenzhen to absorb investment money and talents from the chaos in Hong Kong


For anyone who doesn't know, 30 years ago Shenzhen was a small rural village and has been transformed into the tech capital of China. Last year the village posted a higher GDP than Hong Kong for the first time. It was built 30 kms from Hong Kong for a reason, it ties Hong Kong increasingly to the mainland, it lessens the amount of financial clout Hong Kong has, and is generally one of the measures China built to aid the assimilation of Hong Kong into China.

As for whether they're good enough for that style of democracy, that's really a moot question. Hong Kong was never going to have that sort of democracy going forward so China has been gradually winding it back. They're not going to tolerate a democratic, autonomous region inside their country. Just won't happen.


If it follows the basic law, then it's tolerated. They are free to do whatever they want as long as it follows the basic law. I'm not saying Macau is any more democratic, but it seems to work there. It's the people.
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epak
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:36 pm    Post subject:

^ You guys are bringing up some interesting points.
And I think it's valid for people to want more information and have conversation.

I dont think this situation can be simplified into one statement.
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drae
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:40 pm    Post subject:

Macau's just so different to Hong Kong. People keep wondering why Macau isn't protesting, but people say about half the people living in Macau were born in mainland China which would help. China keeps bussing mainland people into Hong Kong for a reason There's just a greater tolerance in general of the winding back of democratic tendencies and Chinese intervention (even from their army), they're so rich there that there's a greater risk reward (Hong Kong's economy has stagnated for a while). They're more insular so they're not having this continuous influx of western culture. They're just really different.

That's not to say the young people there aren't agitating, but right from the start Macau just seemed more accepting of their eventual destiny.

It might be the people, but ... yeah, just different.
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epak
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:42 pm    Post subject:

drae wrote:
Macau's just so different to Hong Kong. People keep wondering why Macau isn't protesting, but people say about half the people living in Macau were born in mainland China which would help. China keeps bussing mainland people into Hong Kong for a reason There's just a greater tolerance in general of the winding back of democratic tendencies and Chinese intervention (even from their army), they're so rich there that there's a greater risk reward (Hong Kong's economy has stagnated for a while). They're more insular so they're not having this continuous influx of western culture. They're just really different.

That's not to say the young people there aren't agitating, but right from the start Macau just seemed more accepting of their eventual destiny.

It might be the people, but ... yeah, just different.


Where does Taiwain fit into China's makeup?
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maomao
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:42 pm    Post subject:

one last piece of information, on why the Chinese are so upset about the tweet coming from an American.

You can find videos of protesters rallying with American flags and singing our national anthem.

If that's not enough, some Hong Kong politicians had lobbied the US congress (yes, you heard that right, tell me where else in the world that would not be treason. Hong Kong citizens apparently has more freedom than US citizens) to pass a bill that allows the US to intervene with Hong Kong affairs.
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drae
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:45 pm    Post subject:

epak wrote:

Where does Taiwain fit into China's makeup?


Oh that's actually pretty simple. Taiwan is the remains of the Republic of China. When the People's Republic of China rose up and beat down the Republic of China, the ROC fled across the water to Taiwan. The PRC couldn't chase them there and have been glaring at them angrily ever since
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maomao
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:46 pm    Post subject:

drae wrote:
Macau's just so different to Hong Kong. People keep wondering why Macau isn't protesting, but people say about half the people living in Macau were born in mainland China which would help. China keeps bussing mainland people into Hong Kong for a reason There's just a greater tolerance in general of the winding back of democratic tendencies and Chinese intervention (even from their army), they're so rich there that there's a greater risk reward (Hong Kong's economy has stagnated for a while). They're more insular so they're not having this continuous influx of western culture. They're just really different.

That's not to say the young people there aren't agitating, but right from the start Macau just seemed more accepting of their eventual destiny.

It might be the people, but ... yeah, just different.


get your facts straight please. Believe it or not, there are a number of Hong Kong anti China activists that are born in China, not Hong Kong.
I would say the only difference between Macau and Hong Kong is how the Portuguese handled the citizens vs how Britain did.

Macau citizens were given the right to live and work in Portugal if they choose to. The HK people should try to ask Britain for the same treatment.
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drae
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:49 pm    Post subject:

maomao wrote:
The HK people should try to ask Britain for the same treatment.


*Looks at Brexit*

I'm not sure that's very wise ...
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Huey Lewis & The News
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Location: So what's the uh...topic of discussion?

PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:56 pm    Post subject:

Runway8 wrote:
Usually LG doesn't allow political discord, right? Amazing this thread has lasted this long. I'd like it to last longer. So please remember to be respectful to each other. I venture to guess we have Chinese fans on this board, Americans with Chinese friends, and Americanized or ABC's with roots in both countries, so lets be understanding and respectful to each other. This is truly complicated, and especially complicated and sensitive for people with ties in both countries. It is not black or white for them.


It's really not that complicated. If you're licking the CCP's boots, you want outsiders to perceive the issue as a complicated one so as to discourage them from arriving from the most apparent conclusions too quickly.
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Last edited by Huey Lewis & The News on Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:58 pm; edited 1 time in total
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TDRock
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:58 pm    Post subject:

GAME QUESTION

So the next game is supposed to be another in China tomorrow at 4am again? Is it still happening? I’m not seeing that it’s televised anywhere...
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