Tyronn Lue celebrating as Lakers Head Coach (Update: NO DEAL!!! - pg.4)
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governator
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2020 8:15 am    Post subject:

Dr. Laker wrote:
Judah wrote:
CandyCanes wrote:
Judah wrote:
CandyCanes wrote:
lol. If he’d taken this job, he would have two championships with two franchises and would be on track for the Hall of Fame.

Ever heard of hindsight?


If you are currently unemployed and have been offered a prime job in a time sensitive scenario, you shouldn’t try to play hard ball for a better offer when there are other candidates.



He wasn't trying to get a "better" offer. He was trying to get a respectful offer. Do you seriously not understand the difference? Their offer was insulting. I challenge you to provide examples of championship coaches who were told that they weren't allowed to assemble their own coaching staff.


Pride and ego have cost many people great opportunities. At 43 & with 2 rings, he'd be in position to dictate terms on all of his future deals.

There are only 30 of those jobs in the world - having the Lakers job WITH LeBron & AD on the roster was a no-brainer. Take the freaking job and rob them on the contract extension.


how come having a championship in your resume makes a 3 year head coaching job insulting but assistant coaching job not?
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2020 9:34 am    Post subject:

governator wrote:
Dr. Laker wrote:
Judah wrote:
CandyCanes wrote:
Judah wrote:
CandyCanes wrote:
lol. If he’d taken this job, he would have two championships with two franchises and would be on track for the Hall of Fame.

Ever heard of hindsight?


If you are currently unemployed and have been offered a prime job in a time sensitive scenario, you shouldn’t try to play hard ball for a better offer when there are other candidates.



He wasn't trying to get a "better" offer. He was trying to get a respectful offer. Do you seriously not understand the difference? Their offer was insulting. I challenge you to provide examples of championship coaches who were told that they weren't allowed to assemble their own coaching staff.


Pride and ego have cost many people great opportunities. At 43 & with 2 rings, he'd be in position to dictate terms on all of his future deals.

There are only 30 of those jobs in the world - having the Lakers job WITH LeBron & AD on the roster was a no-brainer. Take the freaking job and rob them on the contract extension.


how come having a championship in your resume makes a 3 year head coaching job insulting but assistant coaching job not?


Ty Lue was trying to get revenge on the Lakers but that didn’t happen.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2020 9:36 am    Post subject:

I don't see how getting a 3 year offer is disrespectful. Thankfully for us, Ty Lue made a bad decision.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:45 am    Post subject:

danzag wrote:
I don't see how getting a 3 year offer is disrespectful. Thankfully for us, Ty Lue made a bad decision.


The years are below market value. Doc just got 5 from Philly. Donovan got 4 from Chicago. Steve Nash, who has no head coaching or assistant coaching experience, got 4. The Lakers haven’t explained why the 3 year thing was such a sticking point for them, so we can only conclude its was because they wanted to commit less money. I’m glad we ended up with Vogel and don’t think Lue would have been better in retrospect, but I’m still not a fan of letting non-salary cap money dictate decisions. It worked out this time, but more often than not it won’t.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:50 am    Post subject:

ocho wrote:
danzag wrote:
I don't see how getting a 3 year offer is disrespectful. Thankfully for us, Ty Lue made a bad decision.


The years are below market value. Doc just got 5 from Philly. Donovan got 4 from Chicago. Steve Nash, who has no head coaching or assistant coaching experience, got 4. The Lakers haven’t explained why the 3 year thing was such a sticking point for them, so we can only conclude its was because they wanted to commit less money. I’m glad we ended up with Vogel and don’t think Lue would have been better in retrospect, but I’m still not a fan of letting non-salary cap money dictate decisions. It worked out this time, but more often than not it won’t.


3 years coincide with LeBron's contract, I thought that was the explanation
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:51 am    Post subject:

governator wrote:
ocho wrote:
danzag wrote:
I don't see how getting a 3 year offer is disrespectful. Thankfully for us, Ty Lue made a bad decision.


The years are below market value. Doc just got 5 from Philly. Donovan got 4 from Chicago. Steve Nash, who has no head coaching or assistant coaching experience, got 4. The Lakers haven’t explained why the 3 year thing was such a sticking point for them, so we can only conclude its was because they wanted to commit less money. I’m glad we ended up with Vogel and don’t think Lue would have been better in retrospect, but I’m still not a fan of letting non-salary cap money dictate decisions. It worked out this time, but more often than not it won’t.


3 years coincide with LeBron's contract, I thought that was the explanation


I hadn’t seen that as an official explanation from the team. But why would that matter?
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2020 11:52 am    Post subject:

ocho wrote:
governator wrote:
ocho wrote:
danzag wrote:
I don't see how getting a 3 year offer is disrespectful. Thankfully for us, Ty Lue made a bad decision.


The years are below market value. Doc just got 5 from Philly. Donovan got 4 from Chicago. Steve Nash, who has no head coaching or assistant coaching experience, got 4. The Lakers haven’t explained why the 3 year thing was such a sticking point for them, so we can only conclude its was because they wanted to commit less money. I’m glad we ended up with Vogel and don’t think Lue would have been better in retrospect, but I’m still not a fan of letting non-salary cap money dictate decisions. It worked out this time, but more often than not it won’t.


3 years coincide with LeBron's contract, I thought that was the explanation


I hadn’t seen that as an official explanation from the team. But why would that matter?


why would it matter when it took an assistant Job?
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2020 11:57 am    Post subject:

Car54 wrote:
ocho wrote:
governator wrote:
ocho wrote:
danzag wrote:
I don't see how getting a 3 year offer is disrespectful. Thankfully for us, Ty Lue made a bad decision.


The years are below market value. Doc just got 5 from Philly. Donovan got 4 from Chicago. Steve Nash, who has no head coaching or assistant coaching experience, got 4. The Lakers haven’t explained why the 3 year thing was such a sticking point for them, so we can only conclude its was because they wanted to commit less money. I’m glad we ended up with Vogel and don’t think Lue would have been better in retrospect, but I’m still not a fan of letting non-salary cap money dictate decisions. It worked out this time, but more often than not it won’t.


3 years coincide with LeBron's contract, I thought that was the explanation


I hadn’t seen that as an official explanation from the team. But why would that matter?


why would it matter when it took an assistant Job?


Huh?
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2020 12:07 pm    Post subject:

ocho wrote:
Car54 wrote:
ocho wrote:
governator wrote:
ocho wrote:
danzag wrote:
I don't see how getting a 3 year offer is disrespectful. Thankfully for us, Ty Lue made a bad decision.


The years are below market value. Doc just got 5 from Philly. Donovan got 4 from Chicago. Steve Nash, who has no head coaching or assistant coaching experience, got 4. The Lakers haven’t explained why the 3 year thing was such a sticking point for them, so we can only conclude its was because they wanted to commit less money. I’m glad we ended up with Vogel and don’t think Lue would have been better in retrospect, but I’m still not a fan of letting non-salary cap money dictate decisions. It worked out this time, but more often than not it won’t.


3 years coincide with LeBron's contract, I thought that was the explanation


I hadn’t seen that as an official explanation from the team. But why would that matter?


why would it matter when it took an assistant Job?


Huh?


Why would getting only 3 years matter to Lue when he took an assistant job?
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2020 12:18 pm    Post subject:

Car54 wrote:
ocho wrote:
Car54 wrote:
ocho wrote:
governator wrote:
ocho wrote:
danzag wrote:
I don't see how getting a 3 year offer is disrespectful. Thankfully for us, Ty Lue made a bad decision.


The years are below market value. Doc just got 5 from Philly. Donovan got 4 from Chicago. Steve Nash, who has no head coaching or assistant coaching experience, got 4. The Lakers haven’t explained why the 3 year thing was such a sticking point for them, so we can only conclude its was because they wanted to commit less money. I’m glad we ended up with Vogel and don’t think Lue would have been better in retrospect, but I’m still not a fan of letting non-salary cap money dictate decisions. It worked out this time, but more often than not it won’t.


3 years coincide with LeBron's contract, I thought that was the explanation


I hadn’t seen that as an official explanation from the team. But why would that matter?


why would it matter when it took an assistant Job?


Huh?


Why would getting only 3 years matter to Lue when he took an assistant job?


Not sure if he’s addressed this himself but if I’m speculating I think perhaps he was insulted at a below market offer as a coach with championship pedigree and may have felt it reflected a lack of support from the organization. On top of that, he wasn’t getting the liberty to pick his staff which I believe every other coach in the league gets to do. Pelinka’s picks for his assistants turned out to be good choices, so it worked out. But these were unusual terms for a coaching candidate to accept. I’d be willing to bet he will be a HC next season on a deal that extends beyond 3 years. Vogel was a diminished commodity after his Orlando stint looking to get back into the HC game so he agreed to whatever we threw at him. Again, couldn’t have worked out better, but they went with their second choice for what appears to be purely financial reasons. It worked out great this time. Will it next time? Will financial concerns allow another team to steal Phil Handy because they’re offering him more money? We’ll have to wait and see.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2020 12:45 pm    Post subject:

governator wrote:
Dr. Laker wrote:
Judah wrote:
CandyCanes wrote:
Judah wrote:
CandyCanes wrote:
lol. If he’d taken this job, he would have two championships with two franchises and would be on track for the Hall of Fame.

Ever heard of hindsight?


If you are currently unemployed and have been offered a prime job in a time sensitive scenario, you shouldn’t try to play hard ball for a better offer when there are other candidates.



He wasn't trying to get a "better" offer. He was trying to get a respectful offer. Do you seriously not understand the difference? Their offer was insulting. I challenge you to provide examples of championship coaches who were told that they weren't allowed to assemble their own coaching staff.


Pride and ego have cost many people great opportunities. At 43 & with 2 rings, he'd be in position to dictate terms on all of his future deals.

There are only 30 of those jobs in the world - having the Lakers job WITH LeBron & AD on the roster was a no-brainer. Take the freaking job and rob them on the contract extension.


how come having a championship in your resume makes a 3 year head coaching job insulting but assistant coaching job not?


Because it'd be easier for him to move back into the HC position under the terms and with the team that he wants as an assistant coach. If he signs for below market rate for 3 years, he's stuck for those 3 years at below market rate unless he's fired. It's a no brainer 'IF" you're the type that's willing to bet on yourself. It's extremely probable that his next gig is going to land him 5 years/$25M at the baseline. I'm guessing it's going to be at least $6 annually.

I get why we offered what we offered and I get why Lue declined. When it's all said and done, it worked out for everyone.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2020 12:56 pm    Post subject:

governator wrote:
Dr. Laker wrote:
Judah wrote:
CandyCanes wrote:
Judah wrote:
CandyCanes wrote:
lol. If he’d taken this job, he would have two championships with two franchises and would be on track for the Hall of Fame.

Ever heard of hindsight?


If you are currently unemployed and have been offered a prime job in a time sensitive scenario, you shouldn’t try to play hard ball for a better offer when there are other candidates.



He wasn't trying to get a "better" offer. He was trying to get a respectful offer. Do you seriously not understand the difference? Their offer was insulting. I challenge you to provide examples of championship coaches who were told that they weren't allowed to assemble their own coaching staff.


Pride and ego have cost many people great opportunities. At 43 & with 2 rings, he'd be in position to dictate terms on all of his future deals.

There are only 30 of those jobs in the world - having the Lakers job WITH LeBron & AD on the roster was a no-brainer. Take the freaking job and rob them on the contract extension.


how come having a championship in your resume makes a 3 year head coaching job insulting but assistant coaching job not?

It's not like it's illogical that he decided to spend a year alongside a mentor and someone he trusted (Doc) and with a good, contending team, waiting it out for a year for a [hopefully] better opportunity. That's not difficult to wrap your mind around at all. It's better than just staying at home, especially if you're ready to get back to the game.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2020 12:58 pm    Post subject:

Lakers also gave Vogel only 3 years so now they're gonna have to pay up to extend him. They tried to save money and now they're gonna have to pay more but I don't think they'd mind since winning championship brings in plenty of dough.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 13, 2020 9:46 pm    Post subject:

Just heard Ty Lue is the new head coach of the clippers.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 13, 2020 9:49 pm    Post subject:

lakersfever714 wrote:
Lakers also gave Vogel only 3 years so now they're gonna have to pay up to extend him. They tried to save money and now they're gonna have to pay more but I don't think they'd mind since winning championship brings in plenty of dough.


He bet on himself and won big!
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2020 3:01 pm    Post subject:

AD23 wrote:
Just heard Ty Lue is the new head coach of the clippers.

And got a five year deal to boot. Laker fans clowned him all season for sitting out a year and waiting for a better offer

It worked out for him. He got a deal that's actually on par with the market. I'm hoping that the Lakers will give Vogel the kind of deal he deserves now that he's officially a championship coach.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2020 3:09 pm    Post subject:

Judah wrote:
AD23 wrote:
Just heard Ty Lue is the new head coach of the clippers.

And got a five year deal to boot. Laker fans clowned him all season for sitting out a year and waiting for a better offer

It worked out for him. He got a deal that's actually on par with the market. I'm hoping that the Lakers will give Vogel the kind of deal he deserves now that he's officially a championship coach.


Now that he's earned it, he deserves it. Earn first, deserve later. That is the way.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2020 4:42 pm    Post subject:

Lue had gotten sacked from Cavs. Not like he was a coach with pedigree like Phil Jackson who was a sure bet when Lakers hired him. After Brown, MDA, Byron Scott and Luke Walton, Lakers were right to be cautious in handing out only 3 year deal to Lue.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2020 6:25 pm    Post subject:

Ziggy wrote:
Judah wrote:
AD23 wrote:
Just heard Ty Lue is the new head coach of the clippers.

And got a five year deal to boot. Laker fans clowned him all season for sitting out a year and waiting for a better offer

It worked out for him. He got a deal that's actually on par with the market. I'm hoping that the Lakers will give Vogel the kind of deal he deserves now that he's officially a championship coach.


Now that he's earned it, he deserves it. Earn first, deserve later. That is the way.

If "earning it" means winning a championship, then Lue should've gotten a better offer. He had won a championship with LeBron too, no?
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2020 6:26 pm    Post subject:

saetarubia wrote:
Lue had gotten sacked from Cavs. Not like he was a coach with pedigree like Phil Jackson who was a sure bet when Lakers hired him. After Brown, MDA, Byron Scott and Luke Walton, Lakers were right to be cautious in handing out only 3 year deal to Lue.

Were they also right to not allow him to pick his own staff then?
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2020 5:06 am    Post subject:

Judah wrote:
saetarubia wrote:
Lue had gotten sacked from Cavs. Not like he was a coach with pedigree like Phil Jackson who was a sure bet when Lakers hired him. After Brown, MDA, Byron Scott and Luke Walton, Lakers were right to be cautious in handing out only 3 year deal to Lue.

Were they also right to not allow him to pick his own staff then?


Vogel had no issues with that and for all we know, Kidd might have made a positive impact as an assistant. We know Handy was a great hire. They let Luke choose his team and all he did was pick his Arizona buddies. Apparently, Magic and Pelinka wanted Luke to get some tactical guys in 2018-19, but Luke wouldn't drop his buddies.
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2020 11:41 am    Post subject:

saetarubia wrote:
Judah wrote:
saetarubia wrote:
Lue had gotten sacked from Cavs. Not like he was a coach with pedigree like Phil Jackson who was a sure bet when Lakers hired him. After Brown, MDA, Byron Scott and Luke Walton, Lakers were right to be cautious in handing out only 3 year deal to Lue.

Were they also right to not allow him to pick his own staff then?


Vogel had no issues with that and for all we know, Kidd might have made a positive impact as an assistant. We know Handy was a great hire. They let Luke choose his team and all he did was pick his Arizona buddies. Apparently, Magic and Pelinka wanted Luke to get some tactical guys in 2018-19, but Luke wouldn't drop his buddies.

None of which answers my question...

Ty Lue has won a championship as a coach. That's a fact. And that can't be discounted just because he coached LeBron, either. If it is, Vogel's championship means little as well since he also won his as LeBron's coach. Again, I'm happy with Vogel and believe the Lakers hit a homerun with him. I also think he's a better coach than Ty Lue is. But Ty Lue is still a good coach and the amount of vitriol that people have spewed in this thread about him has never made sense. The way the Lakers handled that coaching search was bizarre and embarrassing, even though they did end up with the right guy.

A lot of the replies in this thread shows that people on LG understand very little about how some of this stuff works. That's why the criticisms are so nonsensical.
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2020 2:47 pm    Post subject:

Judah wrote:
saetarubia wrote:
Judah wrote:
saetarubia wrote:
Lue had gotten sacked from Cavs. Not like he was a coach with pedigree like Phil Jackson who was a sure bet when Lakers hired him. After Brown, MDA, Byron Scott and Luke Walton, Lakers were right to be cautious in handing out only 3 year deal to Lue.

Were they also right to not allow him to pick his own staff then?


Vogel had no issues with that and for all we know, Kidd might have made a positive impact as an assistant. We know Handy was a great hire. They let Luke choose his team and all he did was pick his Arizona buddies. Apparently, Magic and Pelinka wanted Luke to get some tactical guys in 2018-19, but Luke wouldn't drop his buddies.

None of which answers my question...

Ty Lue has won a championship as a coach. That's a fact. And that can't be discounted just because he coached LeBron, either. If it is, Vogel's championship means little as well since he also won his as LeBron's coach. Again, I'm happy with Vogel and believe the Lakers hit a homerun with him. I also think he's a better coach than Ty Lue is. But Ty Lue is still a good coach and the amount of vitriol that people have spewed in this thread about him has never made sense. The way the Lakers handled that coaching search was bizarre and embarrassing, even though they did end up with the right guy.

A lot of the replies in this thread shows that people on LG understand very little about how some of this stuff works. That's why the criticisms are so nonsensical.


I don't think Ty Lue is a good coach. Blatt whom Bron couldn't stand had Cavs in the finals and took GSW to 6 games despite Kyrie and Love being injured. Lue just had both available next season. Vogel's defensive impact has been obvious on the Lakers this season. I didn't see any difference to that Cavs team from Bron/Blatt system other than having Irving and Love healthy. Vogel took Pacers to 7 games against Miami superteam. In game 7 Playoff P had his typical meltdown scoring only 7 points. Vogel is way more proven than Lue.

Lue's title is like the one Westhead won with Lakers. Once Westhead tried to implement his system, Magic found it silly and he was sacked. Lue got sacked from Cavs months after Bron left. Maybe Blatt would have won a championship too if Dellavedova wasn't his 2nd best player in NBA finals.
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:57 pm    Post subject:

Judah wrote:
saetarubia wrote:
Lue had gotten sacked from Cavs. Not like he was a coach with pedigree like Phil Jackson who was a sure bet when Lakers hired him. After Brown, MDA, Byron Scott and Luke Walton, Lakers were right to be cautious in handing out only 3 year deal to Lue.

Were they also right to not allow him to pick his own staff then?


Did Ty Lue hire Chauncey Billups, or did the FO bring him in?
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2020 10:18 pm    Post subject:

The fact that Doc got a new job as fast as he did vs someone like Lue taking as long as he did should tell you what tier he's perceived at. If any of the other coaches in the league with a championship got fired today they would immediately get a new job.

He won a Championship in his first year, but the people making decisions clearly don't have too high an opinion of him and as soon as LeBron left and the Cavs started the season poorly he got canned. The way he got the job and how things played out after the first year has really hurt him.

With the Lakers they clearly wanted to align Lue's deal with LeBron's deal.
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