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AFireInside619
Franchise Player
Joined: 11 Dec 2015
Posts: 11447
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 Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 7:35 am Post subject: |
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| MJST wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: | | Good. Outside of LeBron, it's been a bad idea anyway. |
This
| pio2u wrote: | NBA Insiders PRAYING Star Free Agents will follow PG13's Lead and Ignore Lakers.
...............FIXED |
We're not a threat.
They're praying we don't get a competent FO and continue to take 1 step forward and 3 steps back so they can fleece us of our talent because they know the FO is obsessed with this "Second max will make us finals contenders again" noise. |
I’m not happy with all the front office has done, but you have to admit if they got Lebron, then the next season they got Kawhi, and then put together a solid roster, then Magic got the job done. |
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yinoma2001
Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
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| Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 7:39 am Post subject: |
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| AFireInside619 wrote: | | MJST wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: | | Good. Outside of LeBron, it's been a bad idea anyway. |
This
| pio2u wrote: | NBA Insiders PRAYING Star Free Agents will follow PG13's Lead and Ignore Lakers.
...............FIXED |
We're not a threat.
They're praying we don't get a competent FO and continue to take 1 step forward and 3 steps back so they can fleece us of our talent because they know the FO is obsessed with this "Second max will make us finals contenders again" noise. |
I’m not happy with all the front office has done, but you have to admit if they got Lebron, then the next season they got Kawhi, and then put together a solid roster, then Magic got the job done. |
This is the crazy thing though.
I think this FO did poorly this year.
However, I still think they have a shot at getting a 2nd all star and having a rejuvenated LBJ/YUTES going into next season.
The hope as fans is that this FO corrects some of its mistakes and bolsters some of the clear weaknesses in the organization.
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From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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MustardJam
Starting Rotation
Joined: 13 Feb 2019
Posts: 226
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| Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 7:46 am Post subject: |
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| AFireInside619 wrote: | | MJST wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: | | Good. Outside of LeBron, it's been a bad idea anyway. |
This
| pio2u wrote: | NBA Insiders PRAYING Star Free Agents will follow PG13's Lead and Ignore Lakers.
...............FIXED |
We're not a threat.
They're praying we don't get a competent FO and continue to take 1 step forward and 3 steps back so they can fleece us of our talent because they know the FO is obsessed with this "Second max will make us finals contenders again" noise. |
I’m not happy with all the front office has done, but you have to admit if they got Lebron, then the next season they got Kawhi, and then put together a solid roster, then Magic got the job done. |
Of course but that's a big if. What happens most likely is they sign some dude that is barely an all-star (like Kemba or Butler which neither may be all-stars in the West) and then they go on to win just enough games to make it into the playoffs and into the second round. Magic proceeds to act like he saved this team and Pelinka is going to tell a story the length of the Bible about how they brought this team out of the ditch. Then, Lebron will get old and we will have some maybe all-star level guy into his 30s making a max salary. Our young core is also probably gone now because they sure as hell don't want to play for an organization that disrespected them.
Welcome to the 2021 Los Angeles Hornets. |
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troy
Star Player
Joined: 30 Jan 2013
Posts: 4975
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| Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 10:02 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Quote: | | For us, it's Finals or failure. |
I get this, but this mindset is also a problem. In today's NBA, given the new salary cap rules, it's harder to just get to the Finals from a position of failure (which we are in right now). It has to be incremental and the best teams right now have shown that by creating a culture that has staying power. I posted the thread noting that LBJ/KL have played about the same number of games this year.
The huge difference? Toronto has a lasting culture that might not be a Finals/fail mindset, but they are always in the hunt even if their best player is out with injury.
Lakers need to build that kind of foundation. |
No, it's not a problem. You're speaking of the normal components any team needs to be successful. I'm speaking of players that join teams that are only committed to making the playoffs, and nothing more.
My question to you, how many NBA Championships have the Thunder, Blazers, and Clippers won, and are any of these teams prepped to win one in the next 3 years?
Now, after you answer that, answer this...how many Finals have the Lakers won, and are we prepped to win one in the next 3 years.
There you have the difference between a bridesmaid team and a Finals or Bust team |
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yinoma2001
Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
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| Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 10:21 am Post subject: |
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| troy wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | Quote: | | For us, it's Finals or failure. |
I get this, but this mindset is also a problem. In today's NBA, given the new salary cap rules, it's harder to just get to the Finals from a position of failure (which we are in right now). It has to be incremental and the best teams right now have shown that by creating a culture that has staying power. I posted the thread noting that LBJ/KL have played about the same number of games this year.
The huge difference? Toronto has a lasting culture that might not be a Finals/fail mindset, but they are always in the hunt even if their best player is out with injury.
Lakers need to build that kind of foundation. |
No, it's not a problem. You're speaking of the normal components any team needs to be successful. I'm speaking of players that join teams that are only committed to making the playoffs, and nothing more.
My question to you, how many NBA Championships have the Thunder, Blazers, and Clippers won, and are any of these teams prepped to win one in the next 3 years?
Now, after you answer that, answer this...how many Finals have the Lakers won, and are we prepped to win one in the next 3 years.
There you have the difference between a bridesmaid team and a Finals or Bust team |
But the Warriors were created internally, had stable ownership/leadership, and then used drafting AND FA to build a dynasty.
We want to go from 6 consecutive lotteries to a Final.
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vanexelent
Retired Number
Joined: 17 May 2005
Posts: 30081
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| Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 10:23 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: |
But the Warriors were created internally, had stable ownership/leadership, and then used drafting AND FA to build a dynasty.
We want to go from 6 consecutive lotteries to a Final. |
When you have Lebron and 1 other star, that isn't too far off from reality. (See Cavs 2010-2014) |
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yinoma2001
Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
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| Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 10:26 am Post subject: |
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| vanexelent wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: |
But the Warriors were created internally, had stable ownership/leadership, and then used drafting AND FA to build a dynasty.
We want to go from 6 consecutive lotteries to a Final. |
When you have Lebron and 1 other star, that isn't too far off from reality. (See Cavs 2010-2014) |
We have too much tumult in ownership, FO, and probably coaching. We have had so many 1 year players the past 6 years, there is no set Lakers "culture." Our longest tenured Laker is BI, who is 21 years old and is in his 3rd year.
If you have a 27-30 year old LBJ, sure. But not a 34 year old one.
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From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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vanexelent
Retired Number
Joined: 17 May 2005
Posts: 30081
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| Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 10:37 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | vanexelent wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: |
But the Warriors were created internally, had stable ownership/leadership, and then used drafting AND FA to build a dynasty.
We want to go from 6 consecutive lotteries to a Final. |
When you have Lebron and 1 other star, that isn't too far off from reality. (See Cavs 2010-2014) |
We have too much tumult in ownership, FO, and probably coaching. We have had so many 1 year players the past 6 years, there is no set Lakers "culture." Our longest tenured Laker is BI, who is 21 years old and is in his 3rd year.
If you have a 27-30 year old LBJ, sure. But not a 34 year old one. |
Lebron can still get it done with proper help. The year before he came back to the Cavs, they had 12 players who were either Rookies or had been in the league for just 2 years (including Kyrie).
From 2012 to 2015, the had 5 different head coaches.
We can right this ship. |
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yinoma2001
Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
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| Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 10:43 am Post subject: |
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| vanexelent wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | vanexelent wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: |
But the Warriors were created internally, had stable ownership/leadership, and then used drafting AND FA to build a dynasty.
We want to go from 6 consecutive lotteries to a Final. |
When you have Lebron and 1 other star, that isn't too far off from reality. (See Cavs 2010-2014) |
We have too much tumult in ownership, FO, and probably coaching. We have had so many 1 year players the past 6 years, there is no set Lakers "culture." Our longest tenured Laker is BI, who is 21 years old and is in his 3rd year.
If you have a 27-30 year old LBJ, sure. But not a 34 year old one. |
Lebron can still get it done with proper help. The year before he came back to the Cavs, they had 12 players who were either Rookies or had been in the league for just 2 years (including Kyrie).
From 2012 to 2015, the had 5 different head coaches.
We can right this ship. |
We can. But again, it'll be a 34-36 year old LBJ, probably a new coach, maybe new GM. Then we have the kids who will start being extension eligible.
It's a vastly different landscape, particularly in the WC, than when a 29-30 year old LBJ joined two all stars (Love/Kyrie) in 2014-18.
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From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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vanexelent
Retired Number
Joined: 17 May 2005
Posts: 30081
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| Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 10:55 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | vanexelent wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | vanexelent wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: |
But the Warriors were created internally, had stable ownership/leadership, and then used drafting AND FA to build a dynasty.
We want to go from 6 consecutive lotteries to a Final. |
When you have Lebron and 1 other star, that isn't too far off from reality. (See Cavs 2010-2014) |
We have too much tumult in ownership, FO, and probably coaching. We have had so many 1 year players the past 6 years, there is no set Lakers "culture." Our longest tenured Laker is BI, who is 21 years old and is in his 3rd year.
If you have a 27-30 year old LBJ, sure. But not a 34 year old one. |
Lebron can still get it done with proper help. The year before he came back to the Cavs, they had 12 players who were either Rookies or had been in the league for just 2 years (including Kyrie).
From 2012 to 2015, the had 5 different head coaches.
We can right this ship. |
We can. But again, it'll be a 34-36 year old LBJ, probably a new coach, maybe new GM. Then we have the kids who will start being extension eligible.
It's a vastly different landscape, particularly in the WC, than when a 29-30 year old LBJ joined two all stars (Love/Kyrie) in 2014-18. |
More difficult, yes. But, no impossible. I don't think our "culture" really matters much, as long as we have a coach that has control of the team and a system that people buy into. Even if that system is "Plays well with Lebron". We need a defensive stopper in the middle and outside shooting. That's pretty much it. |
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troy
Star Player
Joined: 30 Jan 2013
Posts: 4975
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| Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 11:39 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | troy wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | Quote: | | For us, it's Finals or failure. |
I get this, but this mindset is also a problem. In today's NBA, given the new salary cap rules, it's harder to just get to the Finals from a position of failure (which we are in right now). It has to be incremental and the best teams right now have shown that by creating a culture that has staying power. I posted the thread noting that LBJ/KL have played about the same number of games this year.
The huge difference? Toronto has a lasting culture that might not be a Finals/fail mindset, but they are always in the hunt even if their best player is out with injury.
Lakers need to build that kind of foundation. |
No, it's not a problem. You're speaking of the normal components any team needs to be successful. I'm speaking of players that join teams that are only committed to making the playoffs, and nothing more.
My question to you, how many NBA Championships have the Thunder, Blazers, and Clippers won, and are any of these teams prepped to win one in the next 3 years?
Now, after you answer that, answer this...how many Finals have the Lakers won, and are we prepped to win one in the next 3 years.
There you have the difference between a bridesmaid team and a Finals or Bust team |
But the Warriors were created internally, had stable ownership/leadership, and then used drafting AND FA to build a dynasty.
We want to go from 6 consecutive lotteries to a Final. |
If you have advocated for trading the young core for AD, then you have answered your own question. |
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yinoma2001
Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
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| Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 11:42 am Post subject: |
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| troy wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | troy wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | Quote: | | For us, it's Finals or failure. |
I get this, but this mindset is also a problem. In today's NBA, given the new salary cap rules, it's harder to just get to the Finals from a position of failure (which we are in right now). It has to be incremental and the best teams right now have shown that by creating a culture that has staying power. I posted the thread noting that LBJ/KL have played about the same number of games this year.
The huge difference? Toronto has a lasting culture that might not be a Finals/fail mindset, but they are always in the hunt even if their best player is out with injury.
Lakers need to build that kind of foundation. |
No, it's not a problem. You're speaking of the normal components any team needs to be successful. I'm speaking of players that join teams that are only committed to making the playoffs, and nothing more.
My question to you, how many NBA Championships have the Thunder, Blazers, and Clippers won, and are any of these teams prepped to win one in the next 3 years?
Now, after you answer that, answer this...how many Finals have the Lakers won, and are we prepped to win one in the next 3 years.
There you have the difference between a bridesmaid team and a Finals or Bust team |
But the Warriors were created internally, had stable ownership/leadership, and then used drafting AND FA to build a dynasty.
We want to go from 6 consecutive lotteries to a Final. |
If you have advocated for trading the young core for AD, then you have answered your own question. |
I've been clear on what I wanted.
My preference has always been to add a 2nd max and keep the YUTES. And if a trade that is too good to pass up arises, then you decide then.
I do think AD is a top 7 level player, but the reported Godfather offer was too much.
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From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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€H£M£$TR¥
Star Player
Joined: 03 Apr 2017
Posts: 3782
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| Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 4:08 pm Post subject: |
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I believe these insiders are anonymous because they are speculators. This is something I can do as well:
Kawhi or Kyrie is signing with us.
AD is a Laker by trade deadline next season.
NBA realizes Zion in a Lakers jersey is a revenue generator, and gifts us the #1 overall...
We will have the YUTES, Bron, K/K, AD, and Zion wearing P&G as champions when the vision is 2020.
Speculation is fun
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DEAR BASKETBALL |
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trablos
Star Player
Joined: 10 May 2017
Posts: 3020
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| Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 5:18 pm Post subject: |
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| LBJ and the core is the least of my worries. I'm not sure how much we can expect to replicate the Cavs success even if we hit all our goals for building the roster. The west is just a bloodbath and nothing like getting out of the East, and we are extremely fortunate to have gotten to the finals 7 times in the last two decades. |
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venturalakersfan
Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001
Posts: 144462
Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 5:26 pm Post subject: |
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| troy wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | Quote: | | For us, it's Finals or failure. |
I get this, but this mindset is also a problem. In today's NBA, given the new salary cap rules, it's harder to just get to the Finals from a position of failure (which we are in right now). It has to be incremental and the best teams right now have shown that by creating a culture that has staying power. I posted the thread noting that LBJ/KL have played about the same number of games this year.
The huge difference? Toronto has a lasting culture that might not be a Finals/fail mindset, but they are always in the hunt even if their best player is out with injury.
Lakers need to build that kind of foundation. |
No, it's not a problem. You're speaking of the normal components any team needs to be successful. I'm speaking of players that join teams that are only committed to making the playoffs, and nothing more.
My question to you, how many NBA Championships have the Thunder, Blazers, and Clippers won, and are any of these teams prepped to win one in the next 3 years?
Now, after you answer that, answer this...how many Finals have the Lakers won, and are we prepped to win one in the next 3 years.
There you have the difference between a bridesmaid team and a Finals or Bust team |
I don’t think that any of the teams you mentioned are ready to win a title in the next 3 seasons. One of them does have a member of their FO who knows how to achieve that.
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RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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999
Franchise Player
Joined: 19 Oct 2006
Posts: 20266
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| Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 5:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Mike@LG wrote: | | Good. Outside of LeBron, it's been a bad idea anyway. |
My only hope to get magic fired is that he doesn’t get anyone in off season |
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Staccatos
Star Player
Joined: 16 Jul 2002
Posts: 2416
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 8:38 am Post subject: |
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| 999 wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: | | Good. Outside of LeBron, it's been a bad idea anyway. |
My only hope to get magic fired is that he doesn’t get anyone in off season |
Perhaps you should be a "fan" of another team. |
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Mamba Mentality
Star Player
Joined: 04 May 2017
Posts: 3078
Location: The Left Coast
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 8:39 am Post subject: |
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| Staccatos wrote: | | 999 wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: | | Good. Outside of LeBron, it's been a bad idea anyway. |
My only hope to get magic fired is that he doesn’t get anyone in off season |
Perhaps you should be a "fan" of another team. |
I don't THINK he'll get a big timer again, but I sure HOPE so.
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“You can't be held captive by the fear of failure or the fear of what people may say.” - Kobe Bryant |
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venturalakersfan
Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001
Posts: 144462
Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 8:42 am Post subject: |
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| Staccatos wrote: | | 999 wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: | | Good. Outside of LeBron, it's been a bad idea anyway. |
My only hope to get magic fired is that he doesn’t get anyone in off season |
Perhaps you should be a "fan" of another team. |
Because he sees that Magic is in over his head?
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RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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Staccatos
Star Player
Joined: 16 Jul 2002
Posts: 2416
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 9:06 am Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | Staccatos wrote: | | 999 wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: | | Good. Outside of LeBron, it's been a bad idea anyway. |
My only hope to get magic fired is that he doesn’t get anyone in off season |
Perhaps you should be a "fan" of another team. |
Because he sees that Magic is in over his head? |
Perhaps Magic isn't making all the best choices but the phrase "Cutting off the nose to spite the face" comes to mind in the poster's desire for free agency failure. |
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ringfinger
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Joined: 08 Oct 2013
Posts: 29418
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 10:22 am Post subject: |
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I would have excused the FA miss, if Maginka hadn’t mortgaged future pieces for it. You cant guarantee to hit in free agency, so there is some risk built in there.
But if you clear the decks to bring in the big guns, and fail to bring in the big guns, well, then that’s on you, IMO. |
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splashmtn
Star Player
Joined: 30 Aug 2016
Posts: 3961
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| Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 6:15 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | AFireInside619 wrote: | | MJST wrote: | | Mike@LG wrote: | | Good. Outside of LeBron, it's been a bad idea anyway. |
This
| pio2u wrote: | NBA Insiders PRAYING Star Free Agents will follow PG13's Lead and Ignore Lakers.
...............FIXED |
We're not a threat.
They're praying we don't get a competent FO and continue to take 1 step forward and 3 steps back so they can fleece us of our talent because they know the FO is obsessed with this "Second max will make us finals contenders again" noise. |
I’m not happy with all the front office has done, but you have to admit if they got Lebron, then the next season they got Kawhi, and then put together a solid roster, then Magic got the job done. |
This is the crazy thing though.
I think this FO did poorly this year.
However, I still think they have a shot at getting a 2nd all star and having a rejuvenated LBJ/YUTES going into next season.
The hope as fans is that this FO corrects some of its mistakes and bolsters some of the clear weaknesses in the organization. |
the FO didnt make many mistakes. thats the false narrative that has been paraded around because we were so injured this season.
The FO did what they said they were going to do. save that cap space for another superstar because they know 1 super star and a bunch of good role guys wont cut it in this era where you have teams with multiple stars.
we are star chasing for a reason thats what i need my fellow LGers and laker's fans to remember. we're not chasing stars for the fun of it. we know there is no way on earth you beat gstate or a healthy houston team, nor a healthy philly, boston team with 1 superstar and a bunch of solid role guys. aint going to happen.
we're not trying to get better in that manner. we're just not. what we want is at minimum 2 superstars to build around. then you will start to see what this FO is all about in regards to how they would put a real team together. not a one year team. that was darn near a fantasy basketball stuff. that wasnt real and it was never intended to be so. |
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yinoma2001
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Joined: 19 Jun 2010
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| Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 6:19 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | the FO didnt make many mistakes. thats the false narrative that has been paraded around because we were so injured this season. |
 You keep saying this trope even though I showed you an example of team where its best player Kahwi played around the same number of games as LBJ, and their other top player (Lowry) missed a bunch of games too. They didn't have 3 #2 picks, and 30m in cap space to spend this past summer either.
Injuries are part of the game. There is no reason, if we didn't spend the nearly 30m in puntable cap space better, that we could be in the playoffs.
| Quote: | | The FO did what they said they were going to do. save that cap space for another superstar because they know 1 super star and a bunch of good role guys wont cut it in this era where you have teams with multiple stars. |
You are literally agreeing then that the role players we got with 28m didn't cut it.
We still can right the ship, but it absolutely didn't reach port this year. Be objective and stop making excuses. Toronto and other teams didn't.
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vanexelent
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Joined: 17 May 2005
Posts: 30081
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| Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 6:55 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: |
You keep saying this trope even though I showed you an example of team where its best player Kahwi played around the same number of games as LBJ, and their other top player (Lowry) missed a bunch of games too. They didn't have 3 #2 picks, and 30m in cap space to spend this past summer either.
Injuries are part of the game. There is no reason, if we didn't spend the nearly 30m in puntable cap space better, that we could be in the playoffs.
. |
Which FA's from last off-season would you have gone after instead of who we did, that would be willing to do a 1-year deal? Aside from lets say Brooke Lopez and JJ Redick, I don't see anyone who would really have made this team better and those two aren't pushing us into contention.
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/23921959/nba-free-agency-every-new-deal-contract-extensions |
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yinoma2001
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Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
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| Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 7:01 am Post subject: |
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| vanexelent wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: |
You keep saying this trope even though I showed you an example of team where its best player Kahwi played around the same number of games as LBJ, and their other top player (Lowry) missed a bunch of games too. They didn't have 3 #2 picks, and 30m in cap space to spend this past summer either.
Injuries are part of the game. There is no reason, if we didn't spend the nearly 30m in puntable cap space better, that we could be in the playoffs.
. |
Which FA's from last off-season would you have gone after instead of who we did, that would be willing to do a 1-year deal? Aside from lets say Brooke Lopez and JJ Redick, I don't see anyone who would really have made this team better and those two aren't pushing us into contention.
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/23921959/nba-free-agency-every-new-deal-contract-extensions |
I've covered this elsewhere. But can we agree spending 28m on KCP/Lance/Rondo/Beez was not even close to an optimal use of that cap space?
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