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Aeneas Hunter
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2020 12:42 pm    Post subject:

loslakersss wrote:
There had been talks about them stealing on the road by having someone sit in the outfield and use a camera and then relay it to the bullpen. The person in the bullpen would either have their hand up on the fence or down to signal fastball/off speed. While this hasn't been confirmed to my knowledge, this is far from impossible.


It hasn't even been an accusation by anyone, including Mike Fiers. In fact, it doesn't make any sense. If someone in the outfield at Nationals Park had a camera and was relaying information to the Astros bullpen, it would be visible and obvious. The story that you are relating about the Giants involved a scheme at the Polo Grounds, not on the road. The key to the modern schemes is concealed cameras in your home park.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2020 6:41 pm    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
loslakersss wrote:
There had been talks about them stealing on the road by having someone sit in the outfield and use a camera and then relay it to the bullpen. The person in the bullpen would either have their hand up on the fence or down to signal fastball/off speed. While this hasn't been confirmed to my knowledge, this is far from impossible.


It hasn't even been an accusation by anyone, including Mike Fiers. In fact, it doesn't make any sense. If someone in the outfield at Nationals Park had a camera and was relaying information to the Astros bullpen, it would be visible and obvious. The story that you are relating about the Giants involved a scheme at the Polo Grounds, not on the road. The key to the modern schemes is concealed cameras in your home park.


Not that I think there's much to it, but there has been some accusations about this:

https://www.thescore.com/mlb/news/1880056
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2020 7:38 pm    Post subject:

oasisdude77 wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
loslakersss wrote:
There had been talks about them stealing on the road by having someone sit in the outfield and use a camera and then relay it to the bullpen. The person in the bullpen would either have their hand up on the fence or down to signal fastball/off speed. While this hasn't been confirmed to my knowledge, this is far from impossible.


It hasn't even been an accusation by anyone, including Mike Fiers. In fact, it doesn't make any sense. If someone in the outfield at Nationals Park had a camera and was relaying information to the Astros bullpen, it would be visible and obvious. The story that you are relating about the Giants involved a scheme at the Polo Grounds, not on the road. The key to the modern schemes is concealed cameras in your home park.


Not that I think there's much to it, but there has been some accusations about this:

https://www.thescore.com/mlb/news/1880056


Oh, there's a lot of scuttlebutt and gossip among players. Trevor Plouffe and Carson Smith never played for the Astros, so they know nothing. There are players from other teams talking about buzzers and stuff like that. We had the confetti thing, and the fake niece of Carlos Beltran. On the other hand, we had an actual investigation by MLB involving dozens of witnesses and thousands of e-mails and texts. The result of the investigation was bad enough, and it pisses me off that this was going on.

Anyway, most if not all teams have messed around with sign stealing over the years. I don't think anyone disputes that. The Astros cranked it up to 11 with the trash can tactic. That was the "innovation" that sets this apart (in addition to the fact that the dumbasses kept doing it after MLB announced a crackdown, which just makes me livid).

Think about the amount of time that passes between the time that the catcher gives the sign that the pitcher accepts and the time that the pitcher begins his motion. If there is a runner on base, there might be a delay, but generally speaking it is just a couple seconds, maybe five seconds top. In that amount of time, the guy watching the video would need to send the signal to the bullpen catcher, and the bullpen catcher would need to move his hand. That's possible. But then the batter would need to look at a catcher standing over three hundred feet away, focus on him, look back at the pitcher, focus on the pitcher, and then be ready to hit. That's not impossible, but it's not very practical. Furthermore, everyone can see the batter inexplicably looking at the bullpen just as the pitch is about to be thrown. This is the problem with these sorts of schemes.

That's why the trash can was so important. The batter could maintain focus on the pitcher and listen for the signal. This is why I say that the Astros cranked it up to 11. They deserve all of the contempt that they are receiving.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 01, 2020 9:24 am    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
You think Chirinos had a buzzer on his bat and that the Astros were stealing signs on the road? Okay, that crosses the line into silliness.

What are you, the sheriff of this thread?!
My god, every time someone posts something anti Astros you immediately show up to be the white knight defender... it’s not my fault that your terrible team had to cheat to win- sounds like you are in fact, the perfect fan for a team like the Astros.
For the next ten years or so, people or going to question everything about your terrible team, pitchers are going to bean the batters, fans in 29 stadiums are going to throw stuff at the visitors dugout... and that’s getting off light.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 01, 2020 9:37 am    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
oasisdude77 wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
loslakersss wrote:
There had been talks about them stealing on the road by having someone sit in the outfield and use a camera and then relay it to the bullpen. The person in the bullpen would either have their hand up on the fence or down to signal fastball/off speed. While this hasn't been confirmed to my knowledge, this is far from impossible.


It hasn't even been an accusation by anyone, including Mike Fiers. In fact, it doesn't make any sense. If someone in the outfield at Nationals Park had a camera and was relaying information to the Astros bullpen, it would be visible and obvious. The story that you are relating about the Giants involved a scheme at the Polo Grounds, not on the road. The key to the modern schemes is concealed cameras in your home park.


Not that I think there's much to it, but there has been some accusations about this:

https://www.thescore.com/mlb/news/1880056


Oh, there's a lot of scuttlebutt and gossip among players. Trevor Plouffe and Carson Smith never played for the Astros, so they know nothing. There are players from other teams talking about buzzers and stuff like that. We had the confetti thing, and the fake niece of Carlos Beltran. On the other hand, we had an actual investigation by MLB involving dozens of witnesses and thousands of e-mails and texts. The result of the investigation was bad enough, and it pisses me off that this was going on.

Anyway, most if not all teams have messed around with sign stealing over the years. I don't think anyone disputes that. The Astros cranked it up to 11 with the trash can tactic. That was the "innovation" that sets this apart (in addition to the fact that the dumbasses kept doing it after MLB announced a crackdown, which just makes me livid).

Think about the amount of time that passes between the time that the catcher gives the sign that the pitcher accepts and the time that the pitcher begins his motion. If there is a runner on base, there might be a delay, but generally speaking it is just a couple seconds, maybe five seconds top. In that amount of time, the guy watching the video would need to send the signal to the bullpen catcher, and the bullpen catcher would need to move his hand. That's possible. But then the batter would need to look at a catcher standing over three hundred feet away, focus on him, look back at the pitcher, focus on the pitcher, and then be ready to hit. That's not impossible, but it's not very practical. Furthermore, everyone can see the batter inexplicably looking at the bullpen just as the pitch is about to be thrown. This is the problem with these sorts of schemes.

That's why the trash can was so important. The batter could maintain focus on the pitcher and listen for the signal. This is why I say that the Astros cranked it up to 11. They deserve all of the contempt that they are receiving.


Peripheral vision is a thing. There is no need to focus on someone 300 feet away and then focus on the pitcher. \ / or | | would easy and simple to see with peripheral vision in a split second. Our eyes are also biologically predisposed to see motion so just see the motion of an arm or arms going up or down would be easy to detect.

Since they’ve already admitted to cheating at home, it’s perfectly reasonable to suspect anything from buzzers, to hand signals, to whistles, and anything else. As Orel H said, they weren’t just cheating the Dodgers, they were changing all the teams and some players lives with this scandal. And they are showing zero remorse, and even making jokes about it.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:13 am    Post subject:

eddiejonze wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
You think Chirinos had a buzzer on his bat and that the Astros were stealing signs on the road? Okay, that crosses the line into silliness.

What are you, the sheriff of this thread?!
My god, every time someone posts something anti Astros you immediately show up to be the white knight defender... it’s not my fault that your terrible team had to cheat to win- sounds like you are in fact, the perfect fan for a team like the Astros.
For the next ten years or so, people or going to question everything about your terrible team, pitchers are going to bean the batters, fans in 29 stadiums are going to throw stuff at the visitors dugout... and that’s getting off light.


Does it make you feel better to talk trash on a message board?
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 01, 2020 1:34 pm    Post subject:

Surfitall wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
oasisdude77 wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
loslakersss wrote:
There had been talks about them stealing on the road by having someone sit in the outfield and use a camera and then relay it to the bullpen. The person in the bullpen would either have their hand up on the fence or down to signal fastball/off speed. While this hasn't been confirmed to my knowledge, this is far from impossible.


It hasn't even been an accusation by anyone, including Mike Fiers. In fact, it doesn't make any sense. If someone in the outfield at Nationals Park had a camera and was relaying information to the Astros bullpen, it would be visible and obvious. The story that you are relating about the Giants involved a scheme at the Polo Grounds, not on the road. The key to the modern schemes is concealed cameras in your home park.


Not that I think there's much to it, but there has been some accusations about this:

https://www.thescore.com/mlb/news/1880056


Oh, there's a lot of scuttlebutt and gossip among players. Trevor Plouffe and Carson Smith never played for the Astros, so they know nothing. There are players from other teams talking about buzzers and stuff like that. We had the confetti thing, and the fake niece of Carlos Beltran. On the other hand, we had an actual investigation by MLB involving dozens of witnesses and thousands of e-mails and texts. The result of the investigation was bad enough, and it pisses me off that this was going on.

Anyway, most if not all teams have messed around with sign stealing over the years. I don't think anyone disputes that. The Astros cranked it up to 11 with the trash can tactic. That was the "innovation" that sets this apart (in addition to the fact that the dumbasses kept doing it after MLB announced a crackdown, which just makes me livid).

Think about the amount of time that passes between the time that the catcher gives the sign that the pitcher accepts and the time that the pitcher begins his motion. If there is a runner on base, there might be a delay, but generally speaking it is just a couple seconds, maybe five seconds top. In that amount of time, the guy watching the video would need to send the signal to the bullpen catcher, and the bullpen catcher would need to move his hand. That's possible. But then the batter would need to look at a catcher standing over three hundred feet away, focus on him, look back at the pitcher, focus on the pitcher, and then be ready to hit. That's not impossible, but it's not very practical. Furthermore, everyone can see the batter inexplicably looking at the bullpen just as the pitch is about to be thrown. This is the problem with these sorts of schemes.

That's why the trash can was so important. The batter could maintain focus on the pitcher and listen for the signal. This is why I say that the Astros cranked it up to 11. They deserve all of the contempt that they are receiving.


Peripheral vision is a thing. There is no need to focus on someone 300 feet away and then focus on the pitcher. \ / or | | would easy and simple to see with peripheral vision in a split second. Our eyes are also biologically predisposed to see motion so just see the motion of an arm or arms going up or down would be easy to detect.

Since they’ve already admitted to cheating at home, it’s perfectly reasonable to suspect anything from buzzers, to hand signals, to whistles, and anything else. As Orel H said, they weren’t just cheating the Dodgers, they were changing all the teams and some players lives with this scandal. And they are showing zero remorse, and even making jokes about it.


What's more reasonable is to assume that players who received immunity for coming clean would just come clean about everything.

I think they are showing zero remorse because this type of cheating is rampant throughout baseball, like the folks who broke the story noted.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 01, 2020 5:08 pm    Post subject:

Dreamshake wrote:
Surfitall wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
oasisdude77 wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
loslakersss wrote:
There had been talks about them stealing on the road by having someone sit in the outfield and use a camera and then relay it to the bullpen. The person in the bullpen would either have their hand up on the fence or down to signal fastball/off speed. While this hasn't been confirmed to my knowledge, this is far from impossible.


It hasn't even been an accusation by anyone, including Mike Fiers. In fact, it doesn't make any sense. If someone in the outfield at Nationals Park had a camera and was relaying information to the Astros bullpen, it would be visible and obvious. The story that you are relating about the Giants involved a scheme at the Polo Grounds, not on the road. The key to the modern schemes is concealed cameras in your home park.


Not that I think there's much to it, but there has been some accusations about this:

https://www.thescore.com/mlb/news/1880056


Oh, there's a lot of scuttlebutt and gossip among players. Trevor Plouffe and Carson Smith never played for the Astros, so they know nothing. There are players from other teams talking about buzzers and stuff like that. We had the confetti thing, and the fake niece of Carlos Beltran. On the other hand, we had an actual investigation by MLB involving dozens of witnesses and thousands of e-mails and texts. The result of the investigation was bad enough, and it pisses me off that this was going on.

Anyway, most if not all teams have messed around with sign stealing over the years. I don't think anyone disputes that. The Astros cranked it up to 11 with the trash can tactic. That was the "innovation" that sets this apart (in addition to the fact that the dumbasses kept doing it after MLB announced a crackdown, which just makes me livid).

Think about the amount of time that passes between the time that the catcher gives the sign that the pitcher accepts and the time that the pitcher begins his motion. If there is a runner on base, there might be a delay, but generally speaking it is just a couple seconds, maybe five seconds top. In that amount of time, the guy watching the video would need to send the signal to the bullpen catcher, and the bullpen catcher would need to move his hand. That's possible. But then the batter would need to look at a catcher standing over three hundred feet away, focus on him, look back at the pitcher, focus on the pitcher, and then be ready to hit. That's not impossible, but it's not very practical. Furthermore, everyone can see the batter inexplicably looking at the bullpen just as the pitch is about to be thrown. This is the problem with these sorts of schemes.

That's why the trash can was so important. The batter could maintain focus on the pitcher and listen for the signal. This is why I say that the Astros cranked it up to 11. They deserve all of the contempt that they are receiving.


Peripheral vision is a thing. There is no need to focus on someone 300 feet away and then focus on the pitcher. \ / or | | would easy and simple to see with peripheral vision in a split second. Our eyes are also biologically predisposed to see motion so just see the motion of an arm or arms going up or down would be easy to detect.

Since they’ve already admitted to cheating at home, it’s perfectly reasonable to suspect anything from buzzers, to hand signals, to whistles, and anything else. As Orel H said, they weren’t just cheating the Dodgers, they were changing all the teams and some players lives with this scandal. And they are showing zero remorse, and even making jokes about it.


What's more reasonable is to assume that players who received immunity for coming clean would just come clean about everything.

I think they are showing zero remorse because this type of cheating is rampant throughout baseball, like the folks who broke the story noted.


Funny how in 2017 only one team got caught, only one team appeared to be an extreme outlier when looking at change in isolated power vs. change in strikeout rate from 2016 to 2017. But everyone was doing it, right?

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/how-much-of-the-astros-legacy-is-now-in-doubt/
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 01, 2020 5:36 pm    Post subject:

Surfitall wrote:
Funny how in 2017 only one team got caught, only one team appeared to be an extreme outlier when looking at change in isolated power vs. change in strikeout rate from 2016 to 2017. But everyone was doing it, right?

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/how-much-of-the-astros-legacy-is-now-in-doubt/


Two teams got caught, actually. As for the stats, you can find different analyses. If you're looking to prove that the Astros gained a gigantic advantage, you compare 2016 to 2017 uncritically, which is what the 538 guy did. Others have compared 2017 road vs. home, or even better 2017 to 2018 and 2019. Those measures are relevant because the Astros did make a bunch of other changes going into 2017. By all accounts (other than silly internet scuttlebutt), the cheating scheme ended in 2018 because the Astros did not think it was still effective. Yet the Astros numbers remained greatly superior to 2016, and they won 107 games in 2019.

As I've said in a prior post, I'm not going to spend time in the weeds arguing about the stats. The Astros apparently believed that they were gaining an advantage, and cheaters don't get the benefit of the doubt. The extent of the advantage is debatable, but ultimately immaterial in my eyes.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 01, 2020 5:40 pm    Post subject:

Surfitall wrote:
Peripheral vision is a thing. There is no need to focus on someone 300 feet away and then focus on the pitcher. \ / or | | would easy and simple to see with peripheral vision in a split second. Our eyes are also biologically predisposed to see motion so just see the motion of an arm or arms going up or down would be easy to detect.


Peripheral vision on someone's hands 300+ feet away? I'll wait to hear some baseball player claim that he could really do that. Even better, I'll wait for someone to come up with a video of an Astros' bullpen catcher changing his hand positions on the wall with every pitch. Until then, this sounds more like wishful thinking from people who want to believe.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 01, 2020 7:21 pm    Post subject:

Surfitall wrote:
Funny how in 2017 only one team got caught, only one team appeared to be an extreme outlier when looking at change in isolated power vs. change in strikeout rate from 2016 to 2017. But everyone was doing it, right?

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/how-much-of-the-astros-legacy-is-now-in-doubt/


Multiple teams were caught. Then the league sent a memo to chill, the Astros didn’t, and one of their players went on record. So the league looked into them and the other team that had the manager that put the scheme together.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:07 am    Post subject:

With cheating as rampant and widespread in baseball as asserted by Dreamshake and AH, you’d think Cleveland’s Mike Clevinger would have been having conversations with Trevor Bauer about all the other teams that have been cheating too. I guess they just weren’t as tuned in to how corrupt MLB actually is.

Not A Surprise: Cleveland’s Mike Clevinger knew ‘Something was going on in Houston’ for Years.
https://tinyurl.com/vk9twc9

“When I said one thing about it in the media, they’re going around the clubhouse trying to say something about me in the media while they cheated the whole time is insane. Chest out, looking down upon other people when you know you’re in the worst scandal in baseball history? Insane.”
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 02, 2020 9:03 am    Post subject:

Okay, so Mike Clevinger is your bloodhound? If you hadn't read the article, you probably would have a hard time remembering who he is. This is just more silliness. There are always players who suspect the successful teams. That includes the Dodgers, by the way.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 02, 2020 9:24 am    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Okay, so Mike Clevinger is your bloodhound? If you hadn't read the article, you probably would have a hard time remembering who he is. This is just more silliness. There are always players who suspect the successful teams. That includes the Dodgers, by the way.


All I’m hearing from the two of you is everyone is doing it, therefore it wasn’t such a big deal, without a shred of evidence to back up those claims.

I’ve posted statistical analysis that is showing what an extreme outlier the *stros were in 2017 compared to their performance in 2016 which has gone uncontested, I’ve posted anecdotal reports from players who could tell something was up, and the responses are nothing but unsubstantiated whataboutism. Post something meaty that backs up your claims that this is nothing but jealous players and that cheating was widespread.

The only things that have been proven so far is that two teams cheated...the *stros and the RedS*x. May they forever be humiliated by their asterisks.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 02, 2020 9:39 am    Post subject:

Surfitall wrote:
All I’m hearing from the two of you is everyone is doing it, therefore it wasn’t such a big deal, without a shred of evidence to back up those claims.


No, you're not hearing that from me. You just want to hear it really, really badly. I get it now. You just want a strawman to argue with. Maybe DS will feel the urge to engage with you.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 02, 2020 11:36 am    Post subject:

eddiejonze wrote:
Robinson Chirinos video proof of buzzer and tape on bat in the WS:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zAIqyPIv-q8

They did it on the road too, folks...


WTF is that???
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 02, 2020 11:37 am    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Surfitall wrote:
All I’m hearing from the two of you is everyone is doing it, therefore it wasn’t such a big deal, without a shred of evidence to back up those claims.


No, you're not hearing that from me. You just want to hear it really, really badly. I get it now. You just want a strawman to argue with. Maybe DS will feel the urge to engage with you.


No need to be disengenuous.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 02, 2020 12:01 pm    Post subject:

Surfitall wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Surfitall wrote:
All I’m hearing from the two of you is everyone is doing it, therefore it wasn’t such a big deal, without a shred of evidence to back up those claims.


No, you're not hearing that from me. You just want to hear it really, really badly. I get it now. You just want a strawman to argue with. Maybe DS will feel the urge to engage with you.


No need to be disengenuous.


Nope, nice try, though. And I don't just mean your spelling.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 02, 2020 3:31 pm    Post subject:

Surfitall wrote:
All I’m hearing from the two of you is everyone is doing it, therefore it wasn’t such a big deal, without a shred of evidence to back up those claims.


Correction. What you heard from those who broke this story was everyone is doing it. Prior to the Astros getting caught the league thought the issue was huge enough to send a memo out to the entire league to chill. This was after catching the Yankees and Red Sox doing it (different scheme, but still using tech to cheat). There was enough evidence for MLB to punish those squads and tell the rest of the league to chill. What separates the Astros from those other examples is a player going on record. If that's the type of evidence you need then good luck.

But at the least, we can stop saying folks don't think it's a issue throughout the sport.

Surfitall wrote:
The only things that have been proven so far is that two teams cheated...the *stros and the RedS*x. May they forever be humiliated by their asterisks.


Using this specific scheme...that MLB only found out about because a player went on record...yes. Teams were punished for cheating in 2017 prior to the Astros, prior to MLB telling all teams to not cheat or face harsh penalties. But hey, I'm sure they would typically send a league wide warning for stuff hardly any teams are doing.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 02, 2020 7:25 pm    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Surfitall wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Surfitall wrote:
All I’m hearing from the two of you is everyone is doing it, therefore it wasn’t such a big deal, without a shred of evidence to back up those claims.


No, you're not hearing that from me. You just want to hear it really, really badly. I get it now. You just want a strawman to argue with. Maybe DS will feel the urge to engage with you.


No need to be disengenuous.


Nope, nice try, though. And I don't just mean your spelling.

My spelling aint so good, Mr. Aeneus Hunter.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:20 pm    Post subject:

eddiejonze wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Surfitall wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Surfitall wrote:
All I’m hearing from the two of you is everyone is doing it, therefore it wasn’t such a big deal, without a shred of evidence to back up those claims.


No, you're not hearing that from me. You just want to hear it really, really badly. I get it now. You just want a strawman to argue with. Maybe DS will feel the urge to engage with you.


No need to be disengenuous.


Nope, nice try, though. And I don't just mean your spelling.

My spelling aint so good, Mr. Aeneus Hunter.


The scary thing is that you probably think that was clever.
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 02, 2020 9:00 pm    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
eddiejonze wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Surfitall wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Surfitall wrote:
All I’m hearing from the two of you is everyone is doing it, therefore it wasn’t such a big deal, without a shred of evidence to back up those claims.


No, you're not hearing that from me. You just want to hear it really, really badly. I get it now. You just want a strawman to argue with. Maybe DS will feel the urge to engage with you.


No need to be disengenuous.


Nope, nice try, though. And I don't just mean your spelling.

My spelling aint so good, Mr. Aeneus Hunter.


The scary thing is that you probably think that was clever.

By using the word "aint"? You're right, I intentionally wrote "aint", instead of "isn't" to seem more like a man of the people.
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Whomever smelt it, dealt it.
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Ass cash or grass, Nobody rides for free.
-Mahatma Ghandi

Never gonna give you up, never gonna let you down
-Rick Astley
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PartyMan
Starting Rotation
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Joined: 29 Jan 2016
Posts: 948
Location: The Dark Side of the Moon

PostPosted: Sun Feb 02, 2020 10:30 pm    Post subject:

eddiejonze wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
eddiejonze wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Surfitall wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Surfitall wrote:
All I’m hearing from the two of you is everyone is doing it, therefore it wasn’t such a big deal, without a shred of evidence to back up those claims.


No, you're not hearing that from me. You just want to hear it really, really badly. I get it now. You just want a strawman to argue with. Maybe DS will feel the urge to engage with you.


No need to be disengenuous.


Nope, nice try, though. And I don't just mean your spelling.

My spelling aint so good, Mr. Aeneus Hunter.


The scary thing is that you probably think that was clever.

By using the word "aint"? You're right, I intentionally wrote "aint", instead of "isn't" to seem more like a man of the people.


My Party sucks Man. Meanwhile you are a dumbass.
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We pour this booze and we drink this booze because we think it's yummy. YUMMY! So over the tounge and down the throat to party in our tummys.
DOWN THE HOLA BITC*OLA!!!
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eddiejonze
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Joined: 19 Dec 2013
Posts: 5030

PostPosted: Mon Feb 03, 2020 12:08 am    Post subject:

PartyMan wrote:
eddiejonze wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
eddiejonze wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Surfitall wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Surfitall wrote:
All I’m hearing from the two of you is everyone is doing it, therefore it wasn’t such a big deal, without a shred of evidence to back up those claims.


No, you're not hearing that from me. You just want to hear it really, really badly. I get it now. You just want a strawman to argue with. Maybe DS will feel the urge to engage with you.


No need to be disengenuous.


Nope, nice try, though. And I don't just mean your spelling.

My spelling aint so good, Mr. Aeneus Hunter.


The scary thing is that you probably think that was clever.

By using the word "aint"? You're right, I intentionally wrote "aint", instead of "isn't" to seem more like a man of the people.


My Party sucks Man. Meanwhile you are a dumbass.

I'm not sure what this means, It's like hieroglyphics to me.
Let me try and figure it out:
A) "My party sucks man" as in your political party?
B) Something out of a John Waters movie?(but that is too risqué to type on LG)
C) You are definitely the burner screen name of one of the above posters
or
D) To tie this back to baseball this is one of the things the astros would yell from the dugout to let the batter know what pitch was comin down the pike?

Unclench, party man, unclench.
_________________
Whomever smelt it, dealt it.
-Nikola Tesla

Ass cash or grass, Nobody rides for free.
-Mahatma Ghandi

Never gonna give you up, never gonna let you down
-Rick Astley
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loslakersss
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Joined: 31 Dec 2008
Posts: 9351
Location: LA

PostPosted: Mon Feb 03, 2020 7:14 am    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
oasisdude77 wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
loslakersss wrote:
There had been talks about them stealing on the road by having someone sit in the outfield and use a camera and then relay it to the bullpen. The person in the bullpen would either have their hand up on the fence or down to signal fastball/off speed. While this hasn't been confirmed to my knowledge, this is far from impossible.


It hasn't even been an accusation by anyone, including Mike Fiers. In fact, it doesn't make any sense. If someone in the outfield at Nationals Park had a camera and was relaying information to the Astros bullpen, it would be visible and obvious. The story that you are relating about the Giants involved a scheme at the Polo Grounds, not on the road. The key to the modern schemes is concealed cameras in your home park.


Not that I think there's much to it, but there has been some accusations about this:

https://www.thescore.com/mlb/news/1880056


Oh, there's a lot of scuttlebutt and gossip among players. Trevor Plouffe and Carson Smith never played for the Astros, so they know nothing. There are players from other teams talking about buzzers and stuff like that. We had the confetti thing, and the fake niece of Carlos Beltran. On the other hand, we had an actual investigation by MLB involving dozens of witnesses and thousands of e-mails and texts. The result of the investigation was bad enough, and it pisses me off that this was going on.

Anyway, most if not all teams have messed around with sign stealing over the years. I don't think anyone disputes that. The Astros cranked it up to 11 with the trash can tactic. That was the "innovation" that sets this apart (in addition to the fact that the dumbasses kept doing it after MLB announced a crackdown, which just makes me livid).

Think about the amount of time that passes between the time that the catcher gives the sign that the pitcher accepts and the time that the pitcher begins his motion. If there is a runner on base, there might be a delay, but generally speaking it is just a couple seconds, maybe five seconds top. In that amount of time, the guy watching the video would need to send the signal to the bullpen catcher, and the bullpen catcher would need to move his hand. That's possible. But then the batter would need to look at a catcher standing over three hundred feet away, focus on him, look back at the pitcher, focus on the pitcher, and then be ready to hit. That's not impossible, but it's not very practical. Furthermore, everyone can see the batter inexplicably looking at the bullpen just as the pitch is about to be thrown. This is the problem with these sorts of schemes.

That's why the trash can was so important. The batter could maintain focus on the pitcher and listen for the signal. This is why I say that the Astros cranked it up to 11. They deserve all of the contempt that they are receiving.


The point was you can steal signs on the road. Now how improbable you think that is will vary from person to person. To definitively say that a team caught cheating at home didn't also find a way to do it on the road is dismissive, IMO. But to say that because they cheated doesn't mean they cheated everywhere either. Both possibilities exist and neither are that far fetched although I see you lean more skeptical on this which isn't wrong. I'm a bit less skeptical but that doesn't mean I believe they did it, only that if we find out it happened that I wont be surprised at all.
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