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epic_
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:19 pm    Post subject:

Listening to Manfred's press conference right now, he sounds sincere.
Tough position to be in.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:42 pm    Post subject:

Bet you Lebron is commenting on it now cause he's a yankee fan- Judge just came out and now says vacate the title....

Aaron Judge, the rightful 2017 AL MVP.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:47 pm    Post subject:

eddiejonze wrote:
Bet you Lebron is commenting on it now cause he's a yankee fan- Judge just came out and now says vacate the title....

Aaron Judge, the rightful 2017 AL MVP.


Oh come on man...or he's an ultra competitor and this Ass-tros bs spits in the face of what that's all about.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:06 pm    Post subject:

jonnybravo wrote:
eddiejonze wrote:
Bet you Lebron is commenting on it now cause he's a yankee fan- Judge just came out and now says vacate the title....

Aaron Judge, the rightful 2017 AL MVP.


Oh come on man...or he's an ultra competitor and this Ass-tros bs spits in the face of what that's all about.

You're probably right

but lebron is still a Yankee fan, so there.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:20 pm    Post subject:

eddiejonze wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
eddiejonze wrote:
Bet you Lebron is commenting on it now cause he's a yankee fan- Judge just came out and now says vacate the title....

Aaron Judge, the rightful 2017 AL MVP.


Oh come on man...or he's an ultra competitor and this Ass-tros bs spits in the face of what that's all about.

You're probably right

but lebron is still a Yankee fan, so there.


He may. I thought he was 50/50 on the Yanks and hometown Indians, who lost to the Trashtros in the 2018 playoffs.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:26 pm    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
Manfred is terrible for baseball. The sport that he is overseeing is suffering a slow death, and he is making it worse.


Sure. I've only been hearing about the slow death of baseball since the 1970s.


Baseball was the #1 sport in America in the 1970's. It is now #3 and fading. The gap between the NBA and MLB is widening with each passing year. Baseball is not attracting new fans, and by and large it's a sport with an old following. I'm not saying it's at risk of becoming the NHL, but that's what I mean by "slow death."


Naw. MLB blows away the NBA. The NFL has become the top league, but MLB hasn't declined at all. Here are MLB's revenues through 2018:

https://www.statista.com/statistics/193466/total-league-revenue-of-the-mlb-since-2005/

It was $10.3B in 2018 and $10.7B in 2019. The NBA is around $8B in the current bubble.


I started watching MLB and NFL in the 80's....back then you could say MLB was still America's pastime....that isn't even close anymore. NFL has left the MLB in its wake. NBA started going international in the late 80's and you could argue they have more of an international presence than the MLB, especially when you consider the NBA has a foothold in places like China versus the MLB which has little to no presence there.


Last edited by lakersken80 on Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:28 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:28 pm    Post subject:

epic_ wrote:
eddiejonze wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
eddiejonze wrote:
Bet you Lebron is commenting on it now cause he's a yankee fan- Judge just came out and now says vacate the title....

Aaron Judge, the rightful 2017 AL MVP.


Oh come on man...or he's an ultra competitor and this Ass-tros bs spits in the face of what that's all about.

You're probably right

but lebron is still a Yankee fan, so there.


He may. I thought he was 50/50 on the Yanks and hometown Indians, who lost to the Trashtros in the 2018 playoffs.


Trashtros, that the same team as Asterixos?
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:33 pm    Post subject:

Rob Manfred said they were at a stalement in the investigation. He said they couldn't get anywhere in the investigation w/o giving a blanket immunity to all players.

So basically, mlb has no facts on this other than player testimony. Think about that.

The players testify to what they want to testify to. They all tell him that they cheated in 2017, some in 2018 and then they stopped. Now this becomes fact.

Now, all the players are pointing to the Manfred report as fact. But, Manfred just said that they had nothing aside from player testimony. So basically, player testimony now becomes fact.

Players now say, Manfred did a thorough investigation and found no evidence. No, Manfred just said, they did a thorough investigation initially and found no evidence UNTIL they offered immunity to the players to talk.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:38 pm    Post subject:

LongBeachPoly wrote:
Rob Manfred said they were at a stalement in the investigation. He said they couldn't get anywhere in the investigation w/o giving a blanket immunity to all players.

So basically, mlb has no facts on this other than player testimony. Think about that.

The players testify to what they want to testify to. They all tell him that they cheated in 2017, some in 2018 and then they stopped. Now this becomes fact.

Now, all the players are pointing to the Manfred report as fact. But, Manfred just said that they had nothing aside from player testimony. So basically, player testimony now becomes fact.

Players now say, Manfred did a thorough investigation and found no evidence. No, Manfred just said, they did a thorough investigation initially and found no evidence UNTIL they offered immunity to the players to talk.


Hey guys, make sure we only talk about 2017 and the trashcans. That was pretty inefficient and we dropped it, so lets only talk about that. Make sure you guys dont talk about the buzzer ok? Alright, good. Lets go talk to the commish.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:40 pm    Post subject:

epic_ wrote:
LongBeachPoly wrote:
Rob Manfred said they were at a stalement in the investigation. He said they couldn't get anywhere in the investigation w/o giving a blanket immunity to all players.

So basically, mlb has no facts on this other than player testimony. Think about that.

The players testify to what they want to testify to. They all tell him that they cheated in 2017, some in 2018 and then they stopped. Now this becomes fact.

Now, all the players are pointing to the Manfred report as fact. But, Manfred just said that they had nothing aside from player testimony. So basically, player testimony now becomes fact.

Players now say, Manfred did a thorough investigation and found no evidence. No, Manfred just said, they did a thorough investigation initially and found no evidence UNTIL they offered immunity to the players to talk.


Hey guys, make sure we only talk about 2017 and the trashcans. That was pretty inefficient and we dropped it, so lets only talk about that. Make sure you guys dont talk about the buzzer ok? Alright, good. Lets go talk to the commish.


Yup. Since Mike Fiers outed them w/ 2017 and the trash cans, they knew they couldn't deny that. So, they copped to that. But, since mlb has nothing else on them, there's no need for them to divulge anything else.

And so now, this becomes fact that they didn't cheat in 2018 or 2019. Very slick.

Yeah, the commish telling us he found no evidence w/ buzzers and him telling us that they wouldn't have gotten anywhere in the investigation w/o player testimony.....

Something doesn't add up boys....

--------------

Manfred just said going forward, he'd have to think long and hard before offering player immunity again. But then he also said this investigation wouldn't have gone anywhere had he not offered player immunity. What am I missing?
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:57 pm    Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
Manfred is terrible for baseball. The sport that he is overseeing is suffering a slow death, and he is making it worse.


Sure. I've only been hearing about the slow death of baseball since the 1970s.


Baseball was the #1 sport in America in the 1970's. It is now #3 and fading. The gap between the NBA and MLB is widening with each passing year. Baseball is not attracting new fans, and by and large it's a sport with an old following. I'm not saying it's at risk of becoming the NHL, but that's what I mean by "slow death."


Naw. MLB blows away the NBA. The NFL has become the top league, but MLB hasn't declined at all. Here are MLB's revenues through 2018:

https://www.statista.com/statistics/193466/total-league-revenue-of-the-mlb-since-2005/

It was $10.3B in 2018 and $10.7B in 2019. The NBA is around $8B in the current bubble.


I started watching MLB and NFL in the 80's....back then you could say MLB was still America's pastime....that isn't even close anymore. NFL has left the MLB in its wake. NBA started going international in the late 80's and you could argue they have more of an international presence than the MLB, especially when you consider the NBA has a foothold in places like China versus the MLB which has little to no presence there.


The NFL is riding high, without a doubt. That’s largely the result of the rise of TV sports. Football is a superior TV product. David Stern did a marvelous job of promoting the NBA internationally. However, MLB still outstrips the NBA even with the overseas revenue. Basketball may very well pass baseball on a global basis, notwithstanding the popularity of baseball in Japan, Korea, Latin America, and the like. But the Euro and Asian leagues are not the NBA.

Anyway, my point is that baseball just keeps rolling along, notwithstanding the increased interest in other sports. When I first became a baseball fan around 1970, average attendance at a baseball game was around 15,000. George Steinbrenner bought the Yankees for under $10M.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2020 6:35 pm    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
Manfred is terrible for baseball. The sport that he is overseeing is suffering a slow death, and he is making it worse.


Sure. I've only been hearing about the slow death of baseball since the 1970s.


Baseball was the #1 sport in America in the 1970's. It is now #3 and fading. The gap between the NBA and MLB is widening with each passing year. Baseball is not attracting new fans, and by and large it's a sport with an old following. I'm not saying it's at risk of becoming the NHL, but that's what I mean by "slow death."


Naw. MLB blows away the NBA. The NFL has become the top league, but MLB hasn't declined at all. Here are MLB's revenues through 2018:

https://www.statista.com/statistics/193466/total-league-revenue-of-the-mlb-since-2005/

It was $10.3B in 2018 and $10.7B in 2019. The NBA is around $8B in the current bubble.


I started watching MLB and NFL in the 80's....back then you could say MLB was still America's pastime....that isn't even close anymore. NFL has left the MLB in its wake. NBA started going international in the late 80's and you could argue they have more of an international presence than the MLB, especially when you consider the NBA has a foothold in places like China versus the MLB which has little to no presence there.


The NFL is riding high, without a doubt. That’s largely the result of the rise of TV sports. Football is a superior TV product. David Stern did a marvelous job of promoting the NBA internationally. However, MLB still outstrips the NBA even with the overseas revenue. Basketball may very well pass baseball on a global basis, notwithstanding the popularity of baseball in Japan, Korea, Latin America, and the like. But the Euro and Asian leagues are not the NBA.

Anyway, my point is that baseball just keeps rolling along, notwithstanding the increased interest in other sports. When I first became a baseball fan around 1970, average attendance at a baseball game was around 15,000. George Steinbrenner bought the Yankees for under $10M.


Agree, baseball is strong but there are some troublesome signs. 1. Average attendance has steadily declined over the last several years. 2. Revenue has also declined even if it is historically high. 3. MLB has one of the stronger labor unions and a work stoppage is possible at the next CBA.

That’s why Manfred can’t mess this up. Today was a good step.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2020 6:58 pm    Post subject:

^^^^

There are troublesome signs for all of the leagues. NFL attendance hit a 15 year low last season, though the TV ratings were good. NBA attendance has been flat, but the TV ratings are down. This gets into a different subject: whether the combination of cord cutting, demographic changes, and sheer overload will burst the bubble that the sports leagues have enjoyed. You would think that it must happen sooner or later, but so far, it hasn't.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2020 7:17 pm    Post subject:

MLB attendance has been losing a few %'s every year for the last 10. NBA attendance is anywhere between 90-100% capacity. There's really not much left for it to go with regards to gate $.

The next TV deals for the respective leagues are going to be really interesting. We're at this weird inflection point where people are cutting the cord en masse. I NEVER thought I'd cut the cord entirely but I finally did just this month. Feels great. If Spectrum Sportsnet had a package for just Dodgers/Lakers, I'm ALL over that.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2020 7:18 pm    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
^^^^

There are troublesome signs for all of the leagues. NFL attendance hit a 15 year low last season, though the TV ratings were good. NBA attendance has been flat, but the TV ratings are down. This gets into a different subject: whether the combination of cord cutting, demographic changes, and sheer overload will burst the bubble that the sports leagues have enjoyed. You would think that it must happen sooner or later, but so far, it hasn't.


I always thought baseball with its pace or football with its violent nature would be the first to go with generational shifts but as you note not yet.

Soccer, to me, has always been the sport best positioned to survive over the long term.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2020 8:25 pm    Post subject:

strong9 wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
^^^^

There are troublesome signs for all of the leagues. NFL attendance hit a 15 year low last season, though the TV ratings were good. NBA attendance has been flat, but the TV ratings are down. This gets into a different subject: whether the combination of cord cutting, demographic changes, and sheer overload will burst the bubble that the sports leagues have enjoyed. You would think that it must happen sooner or later, but so far, it hasn't.


I always thought baseball with its pace or football with its violent nature would be the first to go with generational shifts but as you note not yet.

Soccer, to me, has always been the sport best positioned to survive over the long term.


Soccer managed to get a foothold into the American sports landscape. Even though its not as big as baseball, basketball or football here they have their own dedicated fans and growing. All this after previous generations said it would never work. It really depends on the changing tastes of the upcoming generations of sports fans.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2020 10:27 pm    Post subject:

Soccer has several huge advantages that the other pro sports cannot match. A soccer match will be over in two hours, except for the occasional cup match that goes to extra time and penalties. There are no commercials except at half time, and no stoppages except for injuries, substitutions and the like. The fan culture is different from other US sports, so if you want a communal experience (singing with one of the supporter groups or marching en masse to the stadium), you can do it. It's like college sports in that respect.

It's already bigger than a lot of people think. It isn't just MLS, and it isn't just the EPL and the Euro leagues. Liga MX is bigger than any of those. Combined, soccer is probably bigger than ice hockey right now.

I used to think that baseball would decline for the very reasons that soccer is rising. The games are too long, and MLB seems unable to do anything about it. There are constant commercial breaks. There are long stretches where nothing much is happening. Watching a game is a fairly passive experience, even compared to basketball and football.

But it never happened. Yes, baseball is down from its peak attendance, but the peak was pretty dang high. I thought that baseball would suffer when my generation got old, but the younger generations are taking their kids to the ballpark. Baseball just keeps rolling along.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2020 10:50 pm    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Soccer has several huge advantages that the other pro sports cannot match. A soccer match will be over in two hours, except for the occasional cup match that goes to extra time and penalties. There are no commercials except at half time, and no stoppages except for injuries, substitutions and the like. The fan culture is different from other US sports, so if you want a communal experience (singing with one of the supporter groups or marching en masse to the stadium), you can do it. It's like college sports in that respect.

It's already bigger than a lot of people think. It isn't just MLS, and it isn't just the EPL and the Euro leagues. Liga MX is bigger than any of those. Combined, soccer is probably bigger than ice hockey right now.

I used to think that baseball would decline for the very reasons that soccer is rising. The games are too long, and MLB seems unable to do anything about it. There are constant commercial breaks. There are long stretches where nothing much is happening. Watching a game is a fairly passive experience, even compared to basketball and football.

But it never happened. Yes, baseball is down from its peak attendance, but the peak was pretty dang high. I thought that baseball would suffer when my generation got old, but the younger generations are taking their kids to the ballpark. Baseball just keeps rolling along.


I'm talking about mainly the MLS, but thanks to satellite and cable TV, people who love soccer get to watch soccer around the world, which is another reason why the sport has grown in this country. This is why I say soccer was able to thrive in this country despite people saying it would never work because of previous experiments like the NASL. You didn't have access to world soccer at your fingertips back in those days.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2020 11:56 pm    Post subject:

I agree that soccer is going to pass the NHL in the USA at some point. Which is a shame, because I love hockey and think it's a fantastic sport, but that's just me. As for baseball, I don't think it's attracting new fans very well. The league is awash in cash though, and I've mentioned that before. As AH points out, it's not necessarily the revenues that would worry me, as the commish or if I were interested in the long-term health of my sport. "Slow death" was the wrong phrasing by me. Baseball will always be around. But I do worry that it's going to settle in as the #3 sport here, and that the NBA will clearly be #2 soon, if it isn't already.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2020 6:46 am    Post subject:

LongBeachPoly wrote:
Rob Manfred said they were at a stalement in the investigation. He said they couldn't get anywhere in the investigation w/o giving a blanket immunity to all players.

So basically, mlb has no facts on this other than player testimony. Think about that.

The players testify to what they want to testify to. They all tell him that they cheated in 2017, some in 2018 and then they stopped. Now this becomes fact.

Now, all the players are pointing to the Manfred report as fact. But, Manfred just said that they had nothing aside from player testimony. So basically, player testimony now becomes fact.

Players now say, Manfred did a thorough investigation and found no evidence. No, Manfred just said, they did a thorough investigation initially and found no evidence UNTIL they offered immunity to the players to talk.


Once they gave players immunity, they had all of their phone records, texts, etc. Covering all three years. He had no case without player testimony (starting with Fiers) but to imply that’s all they had is kinda misleading.

They investigated all three seasons and didn’t find foul play in all of them. This also coincides with MLB doing a better job of adding preventive measures in later years, which he also noted (Aeneas Hunter has noted these multiple times).
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:58 am    Post subject:

Wore a houston asterisks shirt to the gym today. Pretty much got universal approval from everyone there. I've never seen sports fans agree so much on something(outside of houston fans).
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2020 9:06 am    Post subject:

nickuku wrote:
Wore a houston asterisks shirt to the gym today. Pretty much got universal approval from everyone there. I've never seen sports fans agree so much on something(outside of houston fans).


It's nuts dude, there are fans of 29 other teams and since this is an LA Lakers site, probably more Dodgers fans than anything but you wouldn't know it from this goofy thread- Two butthurt Lastro's fans defending and defending and defending for like, the last 25 pages (look it up, it's NUTS).
I live in LA and for goofballs that don't live here- LA has people from your hometown-FACT.
People come from everywhere to be employed in the entertainment industry on some level- the ones I know that are from Houston have accepted defeat- it's only the asshats that live in their houston bubble that think this will somehow blow over...
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2020 9:51 am    Post subject:

eddiejonze wrote:
nickuku wrote:
Wore a houston asterisks shirt to the gym today. Pretty much got universal approval from everyone there. I've never seen sports fans agree so much on something(outside of houston fans).


It's nuts dude, there are fans of 29 other teams and since this is an LA Lakers site, probably more Dodgers fans than anything but you wouldn't know it from this goofy thread- Two butthurt Lastro's fans defending and defending and defending for like, the last 25 pages (look it up, it's NUTS).
I live in LA and for goofballs that don't live here- LA has people from your hometown-FACT.
People come from everywhere to be employed in the entertainment industry on some level- the ones I know that are from Houston have accepted defeat- it's only the asshats that live in their houston bubble that think this will somehow blow over...


Yup. You'd have to be an ass at this point to defend them in any way.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2020 10:45 am    Post subject:

Dreamshake wrote:
LongBeachPoly wrote:
Rob Manfred said they were at a stalement in the investigation. He said they couldn't get anywhere in the investigation w/o giving a blanket immunity to all players.

So basically, mlb has no facts on this other than player testimony. Think about that.

The players testify to what they want to testify to. They all tell him that they cheated in 2017, some in 2018 and then they stopped. Now this becomes fact.

Now, all the players are pointing to the Manfred report as fact. But, Manfred just said that they had nothing aside from player testimony. So basically, player testimony now becomes fact.

Players now say, Manfred did a thorough investigation and found no evidence. No, Manfred just said, they did a thorough investigation initially and found no evidence UNTIL they offered immunity to the players to talk.


Once they gave players immunity, they had all of their phone records, texts, etc. Covering all three years. He had no case without player testimony (starting with Fiers) but to imply that’s all they had is kinda misleading.

They investigated all three seasons and didn’t find foul play in all of them. This also coincides with MLB doing a better job of adding preventive measures in later years, which he also noted (Aeneas Hunter has noted these multiple times).


How can it be misleading when you are quoting Rob Manfred's EXACT words?
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2020 10:52 am    Post subject:

nickuku wrote:
eddiejonze wrote:
nickuku wrote:
Wore a houston asterisks shirt to the gym today. Pretty much got universal approval from everyone there. I've never seen sports fans agree so much on something(outside of houston fans).


It's nuts dude, there are fans of 29 other teams and since this is an LA Lakers site, probably more Dodgers fans than anything but you wouldn't know it from this goofy thread- Two butthurt Lastro's fans defending and defending and defending for like, the last 25 pages (look it up, it's NUTS).
I live in LA and for goofballs that don't live here- LA has people from your hometown-FACT.
People come from everywhere to be employed in the entertainment industry on some level- the ones I know that are from Houston have accepted defeat- it's only the asshats that live in their houston bubble that think this will somehow blow over...


Yup. You'd have to be an ass at this point to defend them in any way.


Yup. The thing I don't get is, why come here day after day only to continue to butt heads with an entire fanbase? What's the point? I understand disagreeing here and there. But, when you disagree with an entire fanbase on pretty much every point, what's the value in the discussion?
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