(YOUTH) Kuzma & Ingram & Lonzo & Hart Apprecition Thread
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VicXLakers
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:56 pm    Post subject:

pio2u wrote:
chantruong wrote:
Soon to include Svi and Moe and.....BONGA


Soon as in 2-3 years


more trade bait for some mercenary
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2018 11:24 pm    Post subject:

LakerSD wrote:
We need these guys to consistently bring it

To win consistently, yes, we do. But that's youth for you. 2 steps forward, 1 step back.

I was watching BI take a bunch of midrange jumpers tonight and initially thinking "why is he doing that? He needs to learn to stop taking those." But then I thought, he is learning. He may be learning when/when not to take those shots, or how/how not to take those shots, and he may be wrong a lot, but he has to learn by doing. All our young guys need to keep working, and keep making mistakes. Only then will they start to learn how to play the right way consistently.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 12:12 am    Post subject:

Always happy to see anybody on the young core play well, especially when they all do.

Kuzma had a great all around game on both ends when we needed it.
Ingram took much better shots tonight and was disruptive on D.
Lonzo is an incredible defender and looks like he will finally scratch the surface of his scoring potential.
Hart getting back to what he was doing earlier in the season.

Only complaint is Moe not getting real minutes. He should be given a chance to showcase what he can do instead of these 1 min stints. Not fair for his development.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 3:12 am    Post subject:

My initial reaction was to joke around about our dudes being traded, but this is a great thread idea. Too many threads about what we’ve lost or what we could have had. But these kids are good. Can’t wait until they are in their 4th & 5th seasons like those players who are no longer here.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 3:31 am    Post subject:

They're going to figure it out. Let's go, kids.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 3:36 am    Post subject:

Did you say yoots?
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 5:25 am    Post subject: Re: (YOUTH) Kuzma & Ingram & Lonzo & Hart Apprecition Thread

Lonzo-Lite wrote:
Feels like this board is always taking sides when we don’t have to especially between Kuz and BI. They may not be the #2 option some have hoped but they’re both Lakers and tonight both had good games.

Kuzma = 15 points 12 rebounds 6 assists +13

Ingram = 19 points 4 rebounds 4 assists +9

edit

Nice game from Lonzo and Hart as well. Lonzo 10 points 5 steals, Hart made some key buckets during the run to help get the lead up.



Thx for this thread. It seems that many on this board just want to dump on anyone of those guys depending on the poster. I for one am happy to root for their success.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 6:01 am    Post subject:

Sentient Meat wrote:
drae wrote:
The whole young core was fantastic. Normally 1 or 2 play well, but it seemed like everybody played well this game. I don't want to trade the core for AD, I'm pretty attached to them and trading for AD would require most of the core

Best game from Kuzma for ... a while now. He hasn't been playing well lately


AD tonight 41 pts 9 Rebounds 2 assists 4 blocks... guarded 1 position
The core... 44 Pts 17 Rebounds 14 assists 6 steals... guarded 3 positions

As great as AD is... he can only guard one player... Pelicans lost... we won... we have the better record.

And our core will eventually produce 50 points a night, while AD will usually score no more than 30.


Take step back.

Think about what you just typed

and let it sink in.


It takes 4 players (the young core) to equate what Anthony Davis (one player) can do by himself.



This reminds me of the 2000s Portalnd vs Lakers Western Conference series. We had Shaq while Portland had Sabonis, R. Wallace, Brian Grant, J. O'neal and Schrempf.


You take a bona fide Super Star talent over quantity everytime.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 6:09 am    Post subject:

LakerLand247 wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
drae wrote:
The whole young core was fantastic. Normally 1 or 2 play well, but it seemed like everybody played well this game. I don't want to trade the core for AD, I'm pretty attached to them and trading for AD would require most of the core

Best game from Kuzma for ... a while now. He hasn't been playing well lately


AD tonight 41 pts 9 Rebounds 2 assists 4 blocks... guarded 1 position
The core... 44 Pts 17 Rebounds 14 assists 6 steals... guarded 3 positions

As great as AD is... he can only guard one player... Pelicans lost... we won... we have the better record.

And our core will eventually produce 50 points a night, while AD will usually score no more than 30.


Take step back.

Think about what you just typed

and let it sink in.


It takes 4 players (the young core) to equate what Anthony Davis (one player) can do by himself.



This reminds me of the 2000s Portalnd vs Lakers Western Conference series. We had Shaq while Portland had Sabonis, R. Wallace, Brian Grant, J. O'neal and Schrempf.


You take a bona fide Super Star talent over quantity everytime.


And that's all she wrote
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 6:36 am    Post subject:

LakerLand247 wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
drae wrote:
The whole young core was fantastic. Normally 1 or 2 play well, but it seemed like everybody played well this game. I don't want to trade the core for AD, I'm pretty attached to them and trading for AD would require most of the core

Best game from Kuzma for ... a while now. He hasn't been playing well lately


AD tonight 41 pts 9 Rebounds 2 assists 4 blocks... guarded 1 position
The core... 44 Pts 17 Rebounds 14 assists 6 steals... guarded 3 positions

As great as AD is... he can only guard one player... Pelicans lost... we won... we have the better record.

And our core will eventually produce 50 points a night, while AD will usually score no more than 30.


Take step back.

Think about what you just typed

and let it sink in.


It takes 4 players (the young core) to equate what Anthony Davis (one player) can do by himself.



This reminds me of the 2000s Portalnd vs Lakers Western Conference series. We had Shaq while Portland had Sabonis, R. Wallace, Brian Grant, J. O'neal and Schrempf.


You take a bona fide Super Star talent over quantity everytime.


Yup.

Quote:
Phil Jackson, recalled the time Dr. Buss convinced Kobe Bryant to stay with the franchise in the fall of 2007.

"During one of those meetings, Dr. Buss said, 'Kobe, if I had a diamond of great value, four or five carats, would I give up that diamond for four diamonds of one carat? No. There's no equal value for you. A trade would not net what you bring to this team,' " Jackson said.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 8:04 am    Post subject:

LakerLand247 wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
drae wrote:
The whole young core was fantastic. Normally 1 or 2 play well, but it seemed like everybody played well this game. I don't want to trade the core for AD, I'm pretty attached to them and trading for AD would require most of the core

Best game from Kuzma for ... a while now. He hasn't been playing well lately


AD tonight 41 pts 9 Rebounds 2 assists 4 blocks... guarded 1 position
The core... 44 Pts 17 Rebounds 14 assists 6 steals... guarded 3 positions

As great as AD is... he can only guard one player... Pelicans lost... we won... we have the better record.

And our core will eventually produce 50 points a night, while AD will usually score no more than 30.


Take step back.

Think about what you just typed

and let it sink in.


It takes 4 players (the young core) to equate what Anthony Davis (one player) can do by himself.



This reminds me of the 2000s Portalnd vs Lakers Western Conference series. We had Shaq while Portland had Sabonis, R. Wallace, Brian Grant, J. O'neal and Schrempf.


You take a bona fide Super Star talent over quantity everytime.


I knew exactly what I was writing... and I knew AD had a huge game.

That is about as good a game as AD can have. Maybe 15 rebounds here and there. And they still lost.

He has only made the playoffs twice in six years... doesn't look good for them this year... and they exited in the first and second round when he did make the playoffs.

LBJ is getting old... he's still the best player... but this cannot last forever... he has to rest and save energy to beat teams in the fourth.

Of course at least LBJ can beat teams by himself... AD clearly can't... and Julius, Mirotic, Jrue Holiday aren't chopped liver.

When Shaq came into the league... Orlando went from 21 wins to 41 wins.
In four years he was playing in the conference championship where it look Jordan to eliminate him.

When Kareem came into the league... Milwaukee went from 27 to 56 wins.
By the following year... Milwaukee won their only title.

When LBJ came into the league... Cleveland doubled their win total... going from 17 to 35 wins. By his third season it went to 50 games...By his four year he made the finals. LBJ made the finals with Varejao... Drew Gooden... Larry Hughes... Ilgauskas!

When Magic came into the league... we went from 47 to 60 wins... a much harder achievement to make a good team great... than a bad team respectable. As a rookie, he took over for Kareem when he was hurt and led us to a championship... scoring 42, rebounding 15, with 7 assists.

AD is a great player, but he is not in the same league as these four superstars. When he entered the league... the Pelicans went from 21 wins to 27 wins. The biggest thing that changed was their team name.

Fast forward 7 years... and he still can't dominate himself. He's a top 5 guy... but he's no LBJ.

Do I want him? Yes.

But the reason I intentionally pointed out the core's numbers compared to Davis... is that he can have the best game of his season... and he can't produce what the core can night in and night out... and he can't provide quality defense on three guys... he can't provide insurance against three people getting injured... he can't provide 18 fouls.

Our core at its peak should provide up to 50 to 60 points... 20 rebounds... 15 to 20 assists nightly... More if you throw in Hart and draft picks.

Not even Chamberlain can put up those numbers.

But as I said... AD hasn't moved the needle like other superstars.

Do I want him in free agency? Absolutely... but not for three or four of the core.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 9:08 am    Post subject:

Sentient Meat wrote:
LakerLand247 wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
drae wrote:
The whole young core was fantastic. Normally 1 or 2 play well, but it seemed like everybody played well this game. I don't want to trade the core for AD, I'm pretty attached to them and trading for AD would require most of the core

Best game from Kuzma for ... a while now. He hasn't been playing well lately


AD tonight 41 pts 9 Rebounds 2 assists 4 blocks... guarded 1 position
The core... 44 Pts 17 Rebounds 14 assists 6 steals... guarded 3 positions

As great as AD is... he can only guard one player... Pelicans lost... we won... we have the better record.

And our core will eventually produce 50 points a night, while AD will usually score no more than 30.


Take step back.

Think about what you just typed

and let it sink in.


It takes 4 players (the young core) to equate what Anthony Davis (one player) can do by himself.



This reminds me of the 2000s Portalnd vs Lakers Western Conference series. We had Shaq while Portland had Sabonis, R. Wallace, Brian Grant, J. O'neal and Schrempf.


You take a bona fide Super Star talent over quantity everytime.


I knew exactly what I was writing... and I knew AD had a huge game.

That is about as good a game as AD can have. Maybe 15 rebounds here and there. And they still lost.

He has only made the playoffs twice in six years... doesn't look good for them this year... and they exited in the first and second round when he did make the playoffs.

LBJ is getting old... he's still the best player... but this cannot last forever... he has to rest and save energy to beat teams in the fourth.

Of course at least LBJ can beat teams by himself... AD clearly can't... and Julius, Mirotic, Jrue Holiday aren't chopped liver.

When Shaq came into the league... Orlando went from 21 wins to 41 wins.
In four years he was playing in the conference championship where it look Jordan to eliminate him.

When Kareem came into the league... Milwaukee went from 27 to 56 wins.
By the following year... Milwaukee won their only title.

When LBJ came into the league... Cleveland doubled their win total... going from 17 to 35 wins. By his third season it went to 50 games...By his four year he made the finals. LBJ made the finals with Varejao... Drew Gooden... Larry Hughes... Ilgauskas!

When Magic came into the league... we went from 47 to 60 wins... a much harder achievement to make a good team great... than a bad team respectable. As a rookie, he took over for Kareem when he was hurt and led us to a championship... scoring 42, rebounding 15, with 7 assists.

AD is a great player, but he is not in the same league as these four superstars. When he entered the league... the Pelicans went from 21 wins to 27 wins. The biggest thing that changed was their team name.

Fast forward 7 years... and he still can't dominate himself. He's a top 5 guy... but he's no LBJ.

Do I want him? Yes.

But the reason I intentionally pointed out the core's numbers compared to Davis... is that he can have the best game of his season... and he can't produce what the core can night in and night out... and he can't provide quality defense on three guys... he can't provide insurance against three people getting injured... he can't provide 18 fouls.

Our core at its peak should provide up to 50 to 60 points... 20 rebounds... 15 to 20 assists nightly... More if you throw in Hart and draft picks.

Not even Chamberlain can put up those numbers.

But as I said... AD hasn't moved the needle like other superstars.

Do I want him in free agency? Absolutely... but not for three or four of the core.


Thanks for the wiki report.

Your argument was the production of 4 players versus 1 player. Ask any GM in the league if they'd trade those players for AD and I'd wager they all do ( maybe except for Ainge.)

If you add an average player to AD than it would trump your young core in terms of production stats. Going to reiterate this again you take a Bona-Fide Superstar in Anthony Davis over a bunch of okay players. Yes, AD may not be an all-time great but he is a top 5 player today. Also you already have generational talent in Lebron right now.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 9:23 am    Post subject:

Lebron+ AD and weak depth doesn't get you anywhere. That's why FO wants to get a max FA first. And ZO and BI are not close to their ceiling yet.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 9:26 am    Post subject:

Don’t get me wrong, I love our youth but I’d trade them all in a heartbeat for a superstar. Hell I’d trade both our lottery plyers for some other team’s lottery players like Philly, Dallas.

Hope our young core continues to succeed. They’ll either be keepers or be enough to raise their trade value to trade for another star.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 9:43 am    Post subject:

LakerLand247 wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
LakerLand247 wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
drae wrote:
The whole young core was fantastic. Normally 1 or 2 play well, but it seemed like everybody played well this game. I don't want to trade the core for AD, I'm pretty attached to them and trading for AD would require most of the core

Best game from Kuzma for ... a while now. He hasn't been playing well lately


AD tonight 41 pts 9 Rebounds 2 assists 4 blocks... guarded 1 position
The core... 44 Pts 17 Rebounds 14 assists 6 steals... guarded 3 positions

As great as AD is... he can only guard one player... Pelicans lost... we won... we have the better record.

And our core will eventually produce 50 points a night, while AD will usually score no more than 30.


Take step back.

Think about what you just typed

and let it sink in.


It takes 4 players (the young core) to equate what Anthony Davis (one player) can do by himself.



This reminds me of the 2000s Portalnd vs Lakers Western Conference series. We had Shaq while Portland had Sabonis, R. Wallace, Brian Grant, J. O'neal and Schrempf.


You take a bona fide Super Star talent over quantity everytime.


I knew exactly what I was writing... and I knew AD had a huge game.

That is about as good a game as AD can have. Maybe 15 rebounds here and there. And they still lost.

He has only made the playoffs twice in six years... doesn't look good for them this year... and they exited in the first and second round when he did make the playoffs.

LBJ is getting old... he's still the best player... but this cannot last forever... he has to rest and save energy to beat teams in the fourth.

Of course at least LBJ can beat teams by himself... AD clearly can't... and Julius, Mirotic, Jrue Holiday aren't chopped liver.

When Shaq came into the league... Orlando went from 21 wins to 41 wins.
In four years he was playing in the conference championship where it look Jordan to eliminate him.

When Kareem came into the league... Milwaukee went from 27 to 56 wins.
By the following year... Milwaukee won their only title.

When LBJ came into the league... Cleveland doubled their win total... going from 17 to 35 wins. By his third season it went to 50 games...By his four year he made the finals. LBJ made the finals with Varejao... Drew Gooden... Larry Hughes... Ilgauskas!

When Magic came into the league... we went from 47 to 60 wins... a much harder achievement to make a good team great... than a bad team respectable. As a rookie, he took over for Kareem when he was hurt and led us to a championship... scoring 42, rebounding 15, with 7 assists.

AD is a great player, but he is not in the same league as these four superstars. When he entered the league... the Pelicans went from 21 wins to 27 wins. The biggest thing that changed was their team name.

Fast forward 7 years... and he still can't dominate himself. He's a top 5 guy... but he's no LBJ.

Do I want him? Yes.

But the reason I intentionally pointed out the core's numbers compared to Davis... is that he can have the best game of his season... and he can't produce what the core can night in and night out... and he can't provide quality defense on three guys... he can't provide insurance against three people getting injured... he can't provide 18 fouls.

Our core at its peak should provide up to 50 to 60 points... 20 rebounds... 15 to 20 assists nightly... More if you throw in Hart and draft picks.

Not even Chamberlain can put up those numbers.

But as I said... AD hasn't moved the needle like other superstars.

Do I want him in free agency? Absolutely... but not for three or four of the core.


Thanks for the wiki report.

Your argument was the production of 4 players versus 1 player. Ask any GM in the league if they'd trade those players for AD and I'd wager they all do ( maybe except for Ainge.)

If you add an average player to AD than it would trump your young core in terms of production stats. Going to reiterate this again you take a Bona-Fide Superstar in Anthony Davis over a bunch of okay players. Yes, AD may not be an all-time great but he is a top 5 player today. Also you already have generational talent in Lebron right now.


Wiki report?... I lived through all these eras and watched them happen.

AD is good but in your analogy you used Shaq who actually changed teams.

Btw... the 21 games to 27 games comparison isn't even right.

New Orleans won 21 games in a shortened 66 game season... so they would have won even more that year.

So Davis had zero net effect on the team when he entered the league.

Shaq was the superstar in your example... and he did have an effect.
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Aeneas Hunter
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 9:47 am    Post subject:

Sentient Meat wrote:
Our core at its peak should provide up to 50 to 60 points... 20 rebounds... 15 to 20 assists nightly... More if you throw in Hart and draft picks.


How about 103 points, 43 rebounds, and 19 assists? That’s the Cleveland Cavaliers.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 9:50 am    Post subject:

I’ll appreciate when they become league average freethrow shooters ..
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 9:57 am    Post subject:

What I liked the most was the aggression level. I can live with off games if they're being aggressive and playing with confidence. I don't really worry about Kuz and Hart in that department, but BI and Zo have games where you forget they're on the floor. Last night they made their presence felt. Hopefully they start having more games like that than not.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 10:14 am    Post subject:

Also some of you guys might not know what an appreciation thread is. We have a free agency/trade thread where you can share your ideas.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 10:19 am    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
Our core at its peak should provide up to 50 to 60 points... 20 rebounds... 15 to 20 assists nightly... More if you throw in Hart and draft picks.


How about 103 points, 43 rebounds, and 19 assists? That’s the Cleveland Cavaliers.


I'm talking about BI, Zo, Kuzma producing that nightly. You are talking about an entire team... including LBJ's production which was 111 pts last year.

The 3 minimum signings we will sign in place with will be lucky to put up 30 points per game.

Can we win it all with AD/KD/LBJ + scrubs?

Sure, possible... if LBJ shows zero drop off... if AD never gets hurt... if we keep Bonga and Svi and they turn into solid rotation players.

I don't deny those three are that great.

But before you condemn my thoughts... actually take the time and write out a depth chart with those three.

It might be a splash of cold reality in your face.

I'm not talking about pipe dreams where Rondo and McGee play for minimum contracts... I'm talking about the realistic quality you get at a minimum contract level...

Ask yourself this... if signing quality minimum contract players is so easy... why don't we sign ourselves a rebounder and shooter right now... and trade them for Zubac?

Because it's not easy.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 10:26 am    Post subject:

We have a big issue with them (except for Hart it seems), it's how they play on the road, the difference with home games is brutal...

Ingram
Home: NETRTG +5.9
Road: NETRTG : -1.9

Ball
Home: NETRTG +2.3
Road: NETRTG : -10.2

Kuzma
Home: NETRTG +5.2
Road: NETRTG : -4.9
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Ziggy
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 11:59 am    Post subject:

durden-tyler wrote:
We have a big issue with them (except for Hart it seems), it's how they play on the road, the difference with home games is brutal...

Ingram
Home: NETRTG +5.9
Road: NETRTG : -1.9

Ball
Home: NETRTG +2.3
Road: NETRTG : -10.2

Kuzma
Home: NETRTG +5.2
Road: NETRTG : -4.9


Those numbers look pretty bad. I think it's kind of a theme with young players though. They aren't as familiar with the various environments around the league. Lonzo has only played 36 road games his entire career and Kuzma 49.
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tox
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 12:09 pm    Post subject:

durden-tyler wrote:
We have a big issue with them (except for Hart it seems), it's how they play on the road, the difference with home games is brutal...

Ingram
Home: NETRTG +5.9
Road: NETRTG : -1.9

Ball
Home: NETRTG +2.3
Road: NETRTG : -10.2

Kuzma
Home: NETRTG +5.2
Road: NETRTG : -4.9

Nice catch
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 12:12 pm    Post subject:

durden-tyler wrote:
We have a big issue with them (except for Hart it seems), it's how they play on the road, the difference with home games is brutal...

Ingram
Home: NETRTG +5.9
Road: NETRTG : -1.9

Ball
Home: NETRTG +2.3
Road: NETRTG : -10.2

Kuzma
Home: NETRTG +5.2
Road: NETRTG : -4.9


I think this is super encouraging.

You'd worry more if they always played mediocre... but if they can play well under certain conditions... they can eventually reproduce that performance on the road.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 2:12 pm    Post subject:

Jesusdelonla wrote:
Did we trade them for AD?
.else lock this thread


damn dawg why you gotta always be so grumpy lol
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