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Jesusdelonla
Franchise Player
Joined: 24 Jan 2018
Posts: 15430
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 Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:20 am Post subject: |
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| Sentient Meat wrote: | LeBron 34
Ingram 21
LeBron 35
Ingram 22
LeBron 36
Ingram 23
LeBron 37
Ingram 24
LeBron 38
Ingram 25
LeBron 39
Ingram 26
This is the fundamental problem with those saying... Ingram doesn't fit... trade him.
What year is the tipping point? Year 3, Year 4?
If you think he's just not good... or he'll never be more than average... sure you trade him or don't re-sign him.
If you think he's good though, you try to keep him.
If he asks for too much money commensurate with his skill level... you let him go.
If he's willing to work with you... you keep him.
So many variables to work out, yet many of you don't seem to think them through. |
this is Lebron's team and everybody should be looked with him as main guy and trying to win championships with him as centerpiece.
not hoping for a 21year old to become an all star someday. you can see players breakout in 3rd year but you still have BI playing iso ball and sucking at it |
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Sentient Meat
Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014
Posts: 12978
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:27 am Post subject: |
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| Jesusdelonla wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | LeBron 34
Ingram 21
LeBron 35
Ingram 22
LeBron 36
Ingram 23
LeBron 37
Ingram 24
LeBron 38
Ingram 25
LeBron 39
Ingram 26
This is the fundamental problem with those saying... Ingram doesn't fit... trade him.
What year is the tipping point? Year 3, Year 4?
If you think he's just not good... or he'll never be more than average... sure you trade him or don't re-sign him.
If you think he's good though, you try to keep him.
If he asks for too much money commensurate with his skill level... you let him go.
If he's willing to work with you... you keep him.
So many variables to work out, yet many of you don't seem to think them through. |
this is Lebron's team and everybody should be looked with him as main guy and trying to win championships with him as centerpiece.
not hoping for a 21year old to become an all star someday. you can see players breakout in 3rd year but you still have BI playing iso ball and sucking at it |
It's like you post without reading or trying to understand the post you are responding to half the time. |
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Jesusdelonla
Franchise Player
Joined: 24 Jan 2018
Posts: 15430
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:29 am Post subject: |
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| Sentient Meat wrote: |
It's like you post without reading or trying to understand the post you are responding to half the time. |
not really. the lakers need to win now with Lebron and not hope for some 21 year old kid to be a side kick some day. |
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Sentient Meat
Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014
Posts: 12978
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:34 am Post subject: |
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| Jesusdelonla wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: |
It's like you post without reading or trying to understand the post you are responding to half the time. |
not really. the lakers need to win now with Lebron and not hope for some 21 year old kid to be a side kick some day. |
The point of my post was that if you can keep him for a reasonable price, you use him until he's capable of taking over. Not saying he will be near LBJ's level but if he develops, you have a nice quality player to take his place.
If LBJ was young, then sure... no need to keep him.
But the decline could be next year... could be in three years... and even if you aren't high on Ingram, his talent doesn't grow on trees.
Most still consider him an appropriate #2 pick even if during a weak draft. |
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adkindo
Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 40345
Location: Dirty South
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:34 am Post subject: |
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| Jesusdelonla wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: |
It's like you post without reading or trying to understand the post you are responding to half the time. |
not really. the lakers need to win now with Lebron and not hope for some 21 year old kid to be a side kick some day. |
sounds similar to what the Pelicans said when they moved Buddy Hield for Cousins.....now Cousins is gone, and Buddy Hield would be the perfect player for that roster. Twolves could not be patient either....and gave up players they would probably love to have now for Butler who is no longer around. |
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Sentient Meat
Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014
Posts: 12978
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:37 am Post subject: |
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| adkindo wrote: | | Jesusdelonla wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: |
It's like you post without reading or trying to understand the post you are responding to half the time. |
not really. the lakers need to win now with Lebron and not hope for some 21 year old kid to be a side kick some day. |
sounds similar to what the Pelicans said when they moved Buddy Hield for Cousins.....now Cousins is gone, and Buddy Hield would be the perfect player for that roster. Twolves could not be patient either....and gave up players they would probably love to have now for Butler who is no longer around. |
I love Buddy Hield, and wanted him when he was considered a disappointment.
I'm very worried we'll toss Svi in as filler for someone and make the same mistake.
That shooting talent is rare, even if the player isn't a super athlete. |
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Jesusdelonla
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Joined: 24 Jan 2018
Posts: 15430
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:41 am Post subject: |
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| adkindo wrote: | | Jesusdelonla wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: |
It's like you post without reading or trying to understand the post you are responding to half the time. |
not really. the lakers need to win now with Lebron and not hope for some 21 year old kid to be a side kick some day. |
sounds similar to what the Pelicans said when they moved Buddy Hield for Cousins.....now Cousins is gone, and Buddy Hield would be the perfect player for that roster. Twolves could not be patient either....and gave up players they would probably love to have now for Butler who is no longer around. |
in the 3rd year you can see buddy hield breaking out. not so much with Ingram(per me). same old iso plays and bad shot selections.
Also on the trade part, they gave up in the 1st year and we are in year 3 of the brandon ingram. by now we should see some improvements but its the same iso, dribble dribble and bad shot selection |
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Sentient Meat
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Joined: 04 Jul 2014
Posts: 12978
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:45 am Post subject: |
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| Jesusdelonla wrote: | | adkindo wrote: | | Jesusdelonla wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: |
It's like you post without reading or trying to understand the post you are responding to half the time. |
not really. the lakers need to win now with Lebron and not hope for some 21 year old kid to be a side kick some day. |
sounds similar to what the Pelicans said when they moved Buddy Hield for Cousins.....now Cousins is gone, and Buddy Hield would be the perfect player for that roster. Twolves could not be patient either....and gave up players they would probably love to have now for Butler who is no longer around. |
in the 3rd year you can see buddy hield breaking out. not so much with Ingram(per me). same old iso plays and bad shot selections.
Also on the trade part, they gave up in the 1st year and we are in year 3 of the brandon ingram. by now we should see some improvements but its the same iso, dribble dribble and bad shot selection |
Buddy Hield didn't break out until the last 20 games of his third season during which he still averaged less than Ingram last year when Buddy was 23 and Ingram was 20.
Ingram is adjusting to playing new positions, had a suspension, and people were writing him off after ten games.
The Ingram advocates aren't saying he's been good enough... they are saying give the kid a chance and let's see what develops.
Last edited by Sentient Meat on Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:45 am; edited 1 time in total |
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adkindo
Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 40345
Location: Dirty South
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:45 am Post subject: |
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| Jesusdelonla wrote: | | adkindo wrote: | | Jesusdelonla wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: |
It's like you post without reading or trying to understand the post you are responding to half the time. |
not really. the lakers need to win now with Lebron and not hope for some 21 year old kid to be a side kick some day. |
sounds similar to what the Pelicans said when they moved Buddy Hield for Cousins.....now Cousins is gone, and Buddy Hield would be the perfect player for that roster. Twolves could not be patient either....and gave up players they would probably love to have now for Butler who is no longer around. |
in the 3rd year you can see buddy hield breaking out. not so much with Ingram(per me). same old iso plays and bad shot selections.
Also on the trade part, they gave up in the 1st year and we are in year 3 of the brandon ingram. by now we should see some improvements but its the same iso, dribble dribble and bad shot selection |
I am not saying we can't move the young players....but Ingram is down the list a ways for me in regards to young players we should consider moving while they have some level of value. |
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BigGameHames
Star Player
Joined: 24 May 2015
Posts: 7982
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:45 am Post subject: |
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| Jesusdelonla wrote: | | adkindo wrote: | | Jesusdelonla wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: |
It's like you post without reading or trying to understand the post you are responding to half the time. |
not really. the lakers need to win now with Lebron and not hope for some 21 year old kid to be a side kick some day. |
sounds similar to what the Pelicans said when they moved Buddy Hield for Cousins.....now Cousins is gone, and Buddy Hield would be the perfect player for that roster. Twolves could not be patient either....and gave up players they would probably love to have now for Butler who is no longer around. |
in the 3rd year you can see buddy hield breaking out. not so much with Ingram(per me). same old iso plays and bad shot selections.
Also on the trade part, they gave up in the 1st year and we are in year 3 of the brandon ingram. by now we should see some improvements but its the same iso, dribble dribble and bad shot selection |
Yea it’s very frustrating. His defense has improved a good amount but the effort is still inconsistent. |
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Jesusdelonla
Franchise Player
Joined: 24 Jan 2018
Posts: 15430
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:54 am Post subject: |
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| Sentient Meat wrote: | | Jesusdelonla wrote: | | adkindo wrote: | | Jesusdelonla wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: |
It's like you post without reading or trying to understand the post you are responding to half the time. |
not really. the lakers need to win now with Lebron and not hope for some 21 year old kid to be a side kick some day. |
sounds similar to what the Pelicans said when they moved Buddy Hield for Cousins.....now Cousins is gone, and Buddy Hield would be the perfect player for that roster. Twolves could not be patient either....and gave up players they would probably love to have now for Butler who is no longer around. |
in the 3rd year you can see buddy hield breaking out. not so much with Ingram(per me). same old iso plays and bad shot selections.
Also on the trade part, they gave up in the 1st year and we are in year 3 of the brandon ingram. by now we should see some improvements but its the same iso, dribble dribble and bad shot selection |
Buddy Hield didn't break out until the last 20 games of his third season during which he still averaged less than Ingram last year when Buddy was 23 and Ingram was 20.
Ingram is adjusting to playing new positions, had a suspension, and people were writing him off after ten games.
The Ingram advocates aren't saying he's been good enough... they are saying give the kid a chance and let's see what develops. |
buddy hield is from the same draft as Brandon Ingram. 
he is in his 3rd year. he is averaging 31mins 19.2/5.5/2.6 with 48.5% and 44.3% from 3pt line. thats breaking out.
while Ingram is 31.3 mins 15.2/4.3/2.3 with 45% and 30.4% from the 3pt line |
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Ziggy
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Joined: 10 Feb 2005
Posts: 12717
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:59 am Post subject: |
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I didn't have an issue with Luke moving Randle to the bench because I thought he was just coaching him and I thought it did ultimately make him a better player. The same treatment needs to be given to Ingram. I think the only reason he hasn't made the move yet is because Magic wouldn't approve. Ingram has way too long of a leash for my taste.
I blame our coaching staff with his slow development more than anything. He made a cross country tour with different trainers over the summer. This organization hasn't made in-house player development a priority imo. Just building a new training facility isn't enough. You need to fill it with personnel. |
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Sentient Meat
Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014
Posts: 12978
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:02 am Post subject: |
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| Jesusdelonla wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | | Jesusdelonla wrote: | | adkindo wrote: | | Jesusdelonla wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: |
It's like you post without reading or trying to understand the post you are responding to half the time. |
not really. the lakers need to win now with Lebron and not hope for some 21 year old kid to be a side kick some day. |
sounds similar to what the Pelicans said when they moved Buddy Hield for Cousins.....now Cousins is gone, and Buddy Hield would be the perfect player for that roster. Twolves could not be patient either....and gave up players they would probably love to have now for Butler who is no longer around. |
in the 3rd year you can see buddy hield breaking out. not so much with Ingram(per me). same old iso plays and bad shot selections.
Also on the trade part, they gave up in the 1st year and we are in year 3 of the brandon ingram. by now we should see some improvements but its the same iso, dribble dribble and bad shot selection |
Buddy Hield didn't break out until the last 20 games of his third season during which he still averaged less than Ingram last year when Buddy was 23 and Ingram was 20.
Ingram is adjusting to playing new positions, had a suspension, and people were writing him off after ten games.
The Ingram advocates aren't saying he's been good enough... they are saying give the kid a chance and let's see what develops. |
buddy hield is from the same draft as Brandon Ingram.
he is in his 3rd year. he is averaging 31mins 19.2/5.5/2.6 with 48.5% and 44.3% from 3pt line. thats breaking out.
while Ingram is 31.3 mins 15.2/4.3/2.3 with 45% and 30.4% from the 3pt line |
You are right as I read the line for his second team as a separate year.
But then the age is even more pronounced.
Ingram is 21 and Buddy is 25.
He's 25 and Ingram is 21. |
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Jesusdelonla
Franchise Player
Joined: 24 Jan 2018
Posts: 15430
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:14 am Post subject: |
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| Sentient Meat wrote: | | Jesusdelonla wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | | Jesusdelonla wrote: | | adkindo wrote: | | Jesusdelonla wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: |
It's like you post without reading or trying to understand the post you are responding to half the time. |
not really. the lakers need to win now with Lebron and not hope for some 21 year old kid to be a side kick some day. |
sounds similar to what the Pelicans said when they moved Buddy Hield for Cousins.....now Cousins is gone, and Buddy Hield would be the perfect player for that roster. Twolves could not be patient either....and gave up players they would probably love to have now for Butler who is no longer around. |
in the 3rd year you can see buddy hield breaking out. not so much with Ingram(per me). same old iso plays and bad shot selections.
Also on the trade part, they gave up in the 1st year and we are in year 3 of the brandon ingram. by now we should see some improvements but its the same iso, dribble dribble and bad shot selection |
Buddy Hield didn't break out until the last 20 games of his third season during which he still averaged less than Ingram last year when Buddy was 23 and Ingram was 20.
Ingram is adjusting to playing new positions, had a suspension, and people were writing him off after ten games.
The Ingram advocates aren't saying he's been good enough... they are saying give the kid a chance and let's see what develops. |
buddy hield is from the same draft as Brandon Ingram.
he is in his 3rd year. he is averaging 31mins 19.2/5.5/2.6 with 48.5% and 44.3% from 3pt line. thats breaking out.
while Ingram is 31.3 mins 15.2/4.3/2.3 with 45% and 30.4% from the 3pt line |
You are right as I read the line for his second team as a separate year.
But then the age is even more pronounced.
Ingram is 21 and Buddy is 25.
He's 25 and Ingram is 21. |
Meh same years in the league, but no matter what I say u have a reason ready for it.
Haven't seen glimpses of any dynamic play from BI other then pounding the rock |
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CRoost
Star Player
Joined: 21 Mar 2017
Posts: 4798
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:57 am Post subject: |
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| Jesusdelonla wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | | Jesusdelonla wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | | Jesusdelonla wrote: | | adkindo wrote: | | Jesusdelonla wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: |
It's like you post without reading or trying to understand the post you are responding to half the time. |
not really. the lakers need to win now with Lebron and not hope for some 21 year old kid to be a side kick some day. |
sounds similar to what the Pelicans said when they moved Buddy Hield for Cousins.....now Cousins is gone, and Buddy Hield would be the perfect player for that roster. Twolves could not be patient either....and gave up players they would probably love to have now for Butler who is no longer around. |
in the 3rd year you can see buddy hield breaking out. not so much with Ingram(per me). same old iso plays and bad shot selections.
Also on the trade part, they gave up in the 1st year and we are in year 3 of the brandon ingram. by now we should see some improvements but its the same iso, dribble dribble and bad shot selection |
Buddy Hield didn't break out until the last 20 games of his third season during which he still averaged less than Ingram last year when Buddy was 23 and Ingram was 20.
Ingram is adjusting to playing new positions, had a suspension, and people were writing him off after ten games.
The Ingram advocates aren't saying he's been good enough... they are saying give the kid a chance and let's see what develops. |
buddy hield is from the same draft as Brandon Ingram.
he is in his 3rd year. he is averaging 31mins 19.2/5.5/2.6 with 48.5% and 44.3% from 3pt line. thats breaking out.
while Ingram is 31.3 mins 15.2/4.3/2.3 with 45% and 30.4% from the 3pt line |
You are right as I read the line for his second team as a separate year.
But then the age is even more pronounced.
Ingram is 21 and Buddy is 25.
He's 25 and Ingram is 21. |
Meh same years in the league, but no matter what I say u have a reason ready for it.
Haven't seen glimpses of any dynamic play from BI other then pounding the rock |
Lol . Who are hitting their primes at 21? |
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Jesusdelonla
Franchise Player
Joined: 24 Jan 2018
Posts: 15430
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:06 am Post subject: |
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| CRoost wrote: |
Lol . Who are hitting their primes at 21? |
Lol. who said anything about prime @21? showing glimpse is being in prime? |
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Hellspawn
Starting Rotation
Joined: 26 Nov 2008
Posts: 193
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:07 am Post subject: |
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| trade. value. |
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Sentient Meat
Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014
Posts: 12978
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 1:28 pm Post subject: |
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| Jesusdelonla wrote: | | CRoost wrote: |
Lol . Who are hitting their primes at 21? |
Lol. who said anything about prime @21? showing glimpse is being in prime? |
Ingram at 20 scoring 26 against Embiid and Simmons
Scoring 32 against KD and the Warriors
Scoring 26 against LBJ and Conference champion Cavs
Scoring 26 against Aldridge and the Spurs
Buddy scored more than that only once against the Clippers last year.
Sure, Buddy's playing better than Ingram this year... but if we are talking glimpses... Ingram's provided more glimpses.
What he lacks is consistency.
If Ingram scores 32 tonight... I'm not going say... oh... look he's changed, he's turned a corner... he needs to do this with regularity.
He needs to score 15 to 20 points with good efficiency for five games in a row... then maybe have an off day... then put together another long streak.
Buddy is almost four years older and BI had more big games when he was 20.
All I'm saying is we should be patient. |
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The Juggernaut
Star Player
Joined: 24 Aug 2017
Posts: 4572
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 4:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Yes Ingram should come off the bench. The numbers support it and it’s easily visible to anyone not wearing Ingram tinted glasses |
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VicXLakers
Franchise Player
Joined: 08 Feb 2006
Posts: 11823
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 4:44 pm Post subject: |
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| no...he's needed for the defense...eos |
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Darth Los Angeles
Star Player
Joined: 06 Dec 2011
Posts: 2181
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:07 pm Post subject: |
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No... He's best suited being traded.
_________________
“There are no limits. There are plateaus, but you must not stay there, you must go beyond them. If it kills you, it kills you. A man must constantly exceed his level.” ―Bruce Lee |
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VicXLakers
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Joined: 08 Feb 2006
Posts: 11823
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:15 pm Post subject: |
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| it's about the defense... |
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PauPau
Starting Rotation
Joined: 12 Jul 2018
Posts: 844
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Ziggy wrote: | I didn't have an issue with Luke moving Randle to the bench because I thought he was just coaching him and I thought it did ultimately make him a better player. The same treatment needs to be given to Ingram. I think the only reason he hasn't made the move yet is because Magic wouldn't approve. Ingram has way too long of a leash for my taste.
I blame our coaching staff with his slow development more than anything. He made a cross country tour with different trainers over the summer. This organization hasn't made in-house player development a priority imo. Just building a new training facility isn't enough. You need to fill it with personnel. |
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Ziggy
Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Feb 2005
Posts: 12717
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 9:53 am Post subject: |
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| PauPau wrote: | | Ziggy wrote: | I didn't have an issue with Luke moving Randle to the bench because I thought he was just coaching him and I thought it did ultimately make him a better player. The same treatment needs to be given to Ingram. I think the only reason he hasn't made the move yet is because Magic wouldn't approve. Ingram has way too long of a leash for my taste.
I blame our coaching staff with his slow development more than anything. He made a cross country tour with different trainers over the summer. This organization hasn't made in-house player development a priority imo. Just building a new training facility isn't enough. You need to fill it with personnel. |
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Good discussion. Thanks for your valuable contribution. |
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st8ktacos
Starting Rotation
Joined: 30 Oct 2015
Posts: 253
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2018 10:08 am Post subject: |
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| Ingram is a beast. A poor man's KD. He can literally get any shot he wants at any time. He just needs better coaching in terms of shot selection and obviously the stronger he gets the more dominant he will become. The kid is 21. Maybe some of you old heads have forgotten how young 21 actually is. He is nowhere near his potential right now. |
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