OFFICIAL 2018-2019 FREE AGENCY/TRADE THREAD (Available 2019 FAs & LAL Cap Space, p.1)
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drae
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 12:10 am    Post subject:

CandyCanes wrote:
LandsbergerRules wrote:
I'm not surprised MVP-level guys with tons of postseason success (KD and Kawhi) don't want to play 2nd fiddle to Lebron. Jimmy Butler has a similar mindset, but he's a non-MVP caliber player who just thinks he's on that level.


Paul George too. But he has no problem playing next to Westbrook, a lesser player than LeBron who is even more ball dominant. It's really bizarre.


Paul George seemed annoyed the Lakers wouldn't trade for him, TBH
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 12:48 am    Post subject:

activeverb wrote:
However, nothing in Durant's comments suggested to me that he would be opposed to playing with Lebron himself.


Quote:
"It depends on what kind of player you are," Durant told Bleacher Report, which published its story early Wednesday. "If you're Kyle Korver, then it makes sense. Because Kyle Korver in Atlanta was the bulk of the offense, and he's not a No. 1 option at all, not even close. So his talents benefit more from a guy who can pass and penetrate and get him open."


He says if you're a Kyle Korver type, then it makes sense because he's not a no. 1 option at all, not even close.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 1:36 am    Post subject:

some people would say KD is not a no.1 option in Oakland either
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 1:37 am    Post subject:

He’ll be here next summer.
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drae
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 1:44 am    Post subject:

LongBeachPoly wrote:
activeverb wrote:
However, nothing in Durant's comments suggested to me that he would be opposed to playing with Lebron himself.


Quote:
"It depends on what kind of player you are," Durant told Bleacher Report, which published its story early Wednesday. "If you're Kyle Korver, then it makes sense. Because Kyle Korver in Atlanta was the bulk of the offense, and he's not a No. 1 option at all, not even close. So his talents benefit more from a guy who can pass and penetrate and get him open."


He says if you're a Kyle Korver type, then it makes sense because he's not a no. 1 option at all, not even close.


What Durant said was ""LeBron is a player that needs to play with guys that already know how they play the game -- and shooters." Kyle Korver is an example of the latter, he discounts Kawhi because he's a younger player developing skills. Durant however fits into the former, a player who already knows how they play the game. Durant never discounted himself from someone unwilling to play with Lebron.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 2:04 am    Post subject:

drae wrote:
LongBeachPoly wrote:
activeverb wrote:
However, nothing in Durant's comments suggested to me that he would be opposed to playing with Lebron himself.


Quote:
"It depends on what kind of player you are," Durant told Bleacher Report, which published its story early Wednesday. "If you're Kyle Korver, then it makes sense. Because Kyle Korver in Atlanta was the bulk of the offense, and he's not a No. 1 option at all, not even close. So his talents benefit more from a guy who can pass and penetrate and get him open."


He says if you're a Kyle Korver type, then it makes sense because he's not a no. 1 option at all, not even close.


What Durant said was ""LeBron is a player that needs to play with guys that already know how they play the game -- and shooters." Kyle Korver is an example of the latter, he discounts Kawhi because he's a younger player developing skills. Durant however fits into the former, a player who already knows how they play the game. Durant never discounted himself from someone unwilling to play with Lebron.



I agree with you. I read the whole interview. The Kyle Korver remark was only one of several he made.

Overall, I'd summarize Durant's take as: "A young superstar, who wants to make his own name and run the show, isn't an ideal teammate for Lebron. His partner in crime should be an established veteran star, with nothing to prove, who has already figured out the game and knows how to shoot."

And to me that's kind of a no-duh. If you talking about a GOAT-level guy, they all work best with a #2 guy who's very good, and whose game is in sync with theirs, but isn't hankering for the spotlight. I think that's true of Lebron, MJ, Shaq, and Kobe. All of them wanted a star who would know their place, which is why Kobe was happier with Gasol than he was with Shaq. Alphas collide.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 4:22 am    Post subject:

Quote:


@LakerFilmRoom
Lonzo - Hart - LeBron - Kuzma - McGee = +9.1 Net Rating (58 mins)
Lonzo - Hart - LeBron - Kuzma - Chandler = +36.9 Net Rating (24 mins)

Those are the two best Net Ratings of any Lakers lineup that's played at least that many minutes.


Now imagine Beal in place of Hart
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 4:23 am    Post subject:

drae wrote:
LongBeachPoly wrote:
activeverb wrote:
However, nothing in Durant's comments suggested to me that he would be opposed to playing with Lebron himself.


Quote:
"It depends on what kind of player you are," Durant told Bleacher Report, which published its story early Wednesday. "If you're Kyle Korver, then it makes sense. Because Kyle Korver in Atlanta was the bulk of the offense, and he's not a No. 1 option at all, not even close. So his talents benefit more from a guy who can pass and penetrate and get him open."


He says if you're a Kyle Korver type, then it makes sense because he's not a no. 1 option at all, not even close.


What Durant said was ""LeBron is a player that needs to play with guys that already know how they play the game -- and shooters." Kyle Korver is an example of the latter, he discounts Kawhi because he's a younger player developing skills. Durant however fits into the former, a player who already knows how they play the game. Durant never discounted himself from someone unwilling to play with Lebron.


How are you going to correct a quote? You’re just adding another quote to what he said.

Here’s another quote:

Quote:
Established players who have the capability to adjust and mold their games will fare the best, Durant said.

"Kevin Love, he had to totally change his game to fit, to be a shooter. Which, I think, he deserves way more credit for switching his game. Bosh, same way," Durant said of Chris Bosh, James' former teammate with the Miami Heat.


I mean it’s up for interpretation whether he refers to himself or not. But to say nothing he says suggests that he’s referring to himself is just reading the article in the MOST POSITIVE light for the Lakers.

If he truly was intending to sign w/ the Lakers and play next to LeBron, what would be his motivation for these quotes? It doesn’t seem to fit. At the least, it’s odd.

If I had to pick on whether this article gives me more or less confidence that he’s coming here, I’d say less.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 4:30 am    Post subject:

Megaton wrote:
OCLakeShow wrote:
Thomas Bryant 16-9 today (5-8 FG, 1-2 3s, 5-5 FT).

I will never for the life of me understand why Maginka let him go and kept Zubac instead...


As far as I’m concerned, they did him a favor. Luke wasn’t giving him much if any playing time. Likely wasn’t going to this year so he did Bryant a solid.


If that's really the case, this team needs to stop doing "favors" for players they invested a draft pick/roster spot/development time on.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 4:44 am    Post subject:

LKA wrote:
He’ll be here next summer.


After this article I doubt it

It read like a low key attack piece. Thats why Bosh and Luke had to defend him. Sounds like he is trying to undermind LBJ not join him.

But Durant does make some good points maybe Beal wouldn't be a bad trade when you think about it. But its a tough decision to make
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 5:05 am    Post subject:

This is just my own late-night exercise here where I'm taking a look at five non-star players, guys who are expirings and who wouldn't mess with our summer plans to sign a max player. These 5 guys should be available before the trade deadline, and I do my best to offer up realistic proposals.

Jeremy Lin, Hawks
I admit that I was hesitant to name him due to the unreasonable Lin stans during his previous tour of duty here, but in 19 minutes a game, Lin is putting up a strong .509/.413/.841 line (.646 TS %), with per-36 averages of 21.4/6.1/4.5. He's outperforming his career numbers in many respects, so there is likely to be a regression coming, but if he stays healthy, he offers playmaking and shooting that would be welcome off the bench, and he can play off-ball and could play in lineups with either Lonzo or Rondo. The good thing is that, even with his salary just under $13.8MM, we could send out a package of Lance/Beasley plus filler like Zubac/Caruso, and still keep KCP. The Hawks would do well to just get a 2nd round pick back for him, and since we don't have our 2019 2nd, perhaps a 2020 2nd will do the trick, especially since they would also save money in the deal. He could be a passable version of Spencer Dinwiddie, but at a substantially lower cost to acquire, since the Nets could be looking for a 1st rounder for him, given his extremely low cap hold for an acquiring team.

Spencer Dinwiddie, Nets
That's what you call a segue, folks. The Nets could keep him, but there's a solid chance that they trade him because it may not make sense for them to pay both he and Dlo next summer, not when they are also developing Caris LeVert, who will be back. I mentioned Lin's numbers, but in more playing time (28.5 minutes per), Dinwiddie is shooting .463/.359/.769, for a .591 TS %. Like Lin, he's averaging 6 assists per 36 mins, and he turns the ball over much less than Lin. He isn't as good of a rebounder, though, even though he offers more size. In any case, the allure of Dinwiddie is that his cap hold is just under $1.7MM next summer. So a team could acquire him and use up its cap space, then re-sign him to a bigger deal. Ask yourself this: would the Lakers' 2019 1st round pick be as likely to help the Lakers over the next 4 seasons as Dinwiddie would be? I think the answer is probably no, and considering that the cost of the 1st round pick will be in a similar ballpark to Dinwiddie's cap hold, I think there's an argument to be made that trading the pick for him is fair (you could have Zubac as the necessary filler for salary), although they will have to pay Dinwiddie more than the cost of a 1st round pick in real dollars, of course, especially over 3-4 years. However, in terms of team-building, you can get him on your squad and use that $1.688MM figure as a cheap placeholder. The Lakers may not want to do this because they may be saving that 1st round pick for a much bigger trade, though, and I certainly understand that rationale. And hey, if he could be had for two 2nd round picks or even Svi and a 2nd, I'm all in. Maybe even for two future 2nd's and Svi. I think having Dinwiddie's cap hold so low during the summer would be that valuable. He's a nice player, and he would also give you flexibility once acquired. (In other words, he gives you cover if either Lonzo or Rondo is traded this year before the deadline, or if Rondo moves on as a free agent next summer.)

Jeremy Lamb, Hornets
Even if the Hornets fell out of the race, I don't think it seems likely that Kemba Walker will be traded. However, if they did fall out of it, it would make sense for them to move the expiring Lamb. Lamb has been consistently good for the past couple of seasons, and while I'd be shocked if the Hornets could get a 1st for him, they could probably get a couple of 2nd's or one 2nd and a young player who was perhaps recently a 2nd rounder. To that end, perhaps a Lance/Svi/future 2nd round pick would work for them. They could even sub Beasley in for Lance and save a little bit more money, if they wanted to.

Terrence Ross, Magic
The career .373 shooter from 3-point range is at .406 this year, and he also shoots FT's very well. In short, he would be an upgrade on KCP. Since I believe the Magic will end up trading Vucevic, that would make them fall out of the race, so there's no reason to keep the expiring Ross. KCP and a future 2nd for Ross and Jarell Martin (so that they save a little bit of money) works, and if KCP doesn't want to waive his no-trade, you could go the Lance/Beasley route instead.

Trevor Ariza, Suns
I tend to think he's a bit overrated on LG, but the bottom line is that he would help us off the bench if he were acquired. Obviously, it would be ideal if he were simply bought out, but I think he will have more value than that and that the Suns can actually get something for him. (Besides, if we got a second Suns player via buyout, it might look bad for James Jones.) Perhaps KCP and a future 2nd works here. They get a look at a younger wing for the rest of the year, and get a pick out of it too.

OK, now feel free to pick this apart as you wish.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 5:32 am    Post subject:

First, thanks ChickenStu for the time you take to expose your opinion, we may have different views of the players you're talking about, but when someone takes the time to put well written posts on this forum, it increases IMO the overall value of LG, so you've got my and-1.

I'm still not convince players like Ross, Ariza or Lamb are more valuable than KCP, so I'm not sold on giving up assets to get them.
Lin and Dinwiddie are more interesting prospects, but even if they are expiring, I have my doubts 1) their respective teams want to trade them and 2) we can have them without giving too much...
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 5:36 am    Post subject:

LeBron and KD are good friends, I'm pretty sure the goal is NOT to undermind him...
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 5:38 am    Post subject:

Bill Plasche talking ish to Durant on TV last night, heard Shannon too... what are they doing?
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 5:41 am    Post subject:

durden-tyler wrote:
First, thanks ChickenStu for the time you take to expose your opinion, we may have different views of the players you're talking about, but when someone takes the time to put well written posts on this forum, it increases IMO the overall value of LG, so you've got my and-1.

I'm still not convince players like Ross, Ariza or Lamb are more valuable than KCP, so I'm not sold on giving up assets to get them.
Lin and Dinwiddie are more interesting prospects, but even if they are expiring, I have my doubts 1) their respective teams want to trade them and 2) we can have them without giving too much...


Thanks for the nice words. Ross' appeal would be that he is clearly a better 3-point shooter than KCP is, and even if you think his mark this year will regress to his mean, it's still a lot better than KCP's career mark. And Lamb is an unquestionably better player than KCP is. I won't argue with you much if you think Ariza isn't much of an upgrade on KCP, especially the KCP we saw last season. (But this isn't last season, of course.) As for Lin, unless they see him as a very valuable mentor for Trae, I don't know why they wouldn't take back a 2nd rounder for him. Dinwiddie is an interesting case for the Nets. They could very well decide to keep him and pay him, also pay Dlo, and then eventually trade someone down the line. And I completely get why we probably wouldn't want to give up a 1st for him, even though I think it's not illogical to do so. But yeah, if he could be had for Svi/2nd's, I'd be all over that. It's that cap hold that is so crucial, while having Bird rights on him. And he was born in LA and went to Taft High school.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 5:50 am    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
Thanks for the nice words. Ross' appeal would be that he is clearly a better 3-point shooter than KCP is, and even if you think his mark this year will regress to his mean, it's still a lot better than KCP's career mark. And Lamb is an unquestionably better player than KCP is. I won't argue with you much if you think Ariza isn't much of an upgrade on KCP, especially the KCP we saw last season. (But this isn't last season, of course.) As for Lin, unless they see him as a very valuable mentor for Trae, I don't know why they wouldn't take back a 2nd rounder for him. Dinwiddie is an interesting case for the Nets. They could very well decide to keep him and pay him, also pay Dlo, and then eventually trade someone down the line. And I completely get why we probably wouldn't want to give up a 1st for him, even though I think it's not illogical to do so. But yeah, if he could be had for Svi/2nd's, I'd be all over that. It's that cap hold that is so crucial, while having Bird rights on him. And he was born in LA and went to Taft High school.


Wow, I was wayyy off about Lamb...
https://stats.nba.com/vs/#!/?PlayerID=203087&VsPlayerID=203484&Season=2018-19&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&PerMode=Per36
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 6:01 am    Post subject:

Too bad PG13 didn’t sign with us. We would have been the championship favourite this year by now if he did.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 7:13 am    Post subject:

Question for the cap experts:
If we sign a non-KD max next year, could we then trade Ingram/Wagner/1st pick for Beal? Would that work salary wise? If not, is there any way it can work by adding more salary from the Lakers’ side not including Lonzo? Thanks in advance.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 7:24 am    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
durden-tyler wrote:
First, thanks ChickenStu for the time you take to expose your opinion, we may have different views of the players you're talking about, but when someone takes the time to put well written posts on this forum, it increases IMO the overall value of LG, so you've got my and-1.

I'm still not convince players like Ross, Ariza or Lamb are more valuable than KCP, so I'm not sold on giving up assets to get them.
Lin and Dinwiddie are more interesting prospects, but even if they are expiring, I have my doubts 1) their respective teams want to trade them and 2) we can have them without giving too much...


Thanks for the nice words. Ross' appeal would be that he is clearly a better 3-point shooter than KCP is, and even if you think his mark this year will regress to his mean, it's still a lot better than KCP's career mark. And Lamb is an unquestionably better player than KCP is. I won't argue with you much if you think Ariza isn't much of an upgrade on KCP, especially the KCP we saw last season. (But this isn't last season, of course.) As for Lin, unless they see him as a very valuable mentor for Trae, I don't know why they wouldn't take back a 2nd rounder for him. Dinwiddie is an interesting case for the Nets. They could very well decide to keep him and pay him, also pay Dlo, and then eventually trade someone down the line. And I completely get why we probably wouldn't want to give up a 1st for him, even though I think it's not illogical to do so. But yeah, if he could be had for Svi/2nd's, I'd be all over that. It's that cap hold that is so crucial, while having Bird rights on him. And he was born in LA and went to Taft High school.


The reason I favor Ariza over KCP is b/c he guarded 4 positions in the playoffs last year. He was on Steph/KD/Klay at various times and did a great job.

KCP is really limited to guards, and even bigger guards like DRoz routinely kill him. Absent the Klutch connection, KCP would easily be on the trading block (and not getting $30m over 2 years from the Lakers).
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 7:25 am    Post subject:

Intlakeshow wrote:
Question for the cap experts:
If we sign a non-KD max next year, could we then trade Ingram/Wagner/1st pick for Beal? Would that work salary wise? If not, is there any way it can work by adding more salary from the Lakers’ side not including Lonzo? Thanks in advance.


No. Unless KD is taking a massive paycut, like almost 18m paycut which he won't and shouldn't.

Edit: I misread. I thought you were talking about KD taking a non-max. Regardless, even with a 7-9 year max, we wouldn't have enough salary to match Beal.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 7:29 am    Post subject:

Intlakeshow wrote:
Question for the cap experts:
If we sign a non-KD max next year, could we then trade Ingram/Wagner/1st pick for Beal? Would that work salary wise? If not, is there any way it can work by adding more salary from the Lakers’ side not including Lonzo? Thanks in advance.


$37,430,000......LeBron James (1)
$32,700,000......Kawhi Leonard (2)
$27,093,019......Bradley Beal (3)
$8,719,320........Lonzo Ball (4)
$1,974,600........Kyle Kuzma (5)
$1,934,160........Josh Hart (6)
$1,550,000........Sviatoslav Mykhailiuk (7)
$1,416,852........Isaac Bonga (8)
$897,158...........Min Salary (9)
$897,158...........Min Salary (10)
$897,158...........Min Salary (11)
$897,158...........Min Salary (12)

$4,992,994........Luol Deng (1 year $14,977,482 Stretched over 3 Years)

$121,399,577... Total
$109,000,000... 2019 hard cap

$12,399,577... Over
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 7:30 am    Post subject:

Intlakeshow wrote:
Question for the cap experts:
If we sign a non-KD max next year, could we then trade Ingram/Wagner/1st pick for Beal? Would that work salary wise? If not, is there any way it can work by adding more salary from the Lakers’ side not including Lonzo? Thanks in advance.

That would be well short since Beal makes $27M next season. The Lakers would need ro add about $12-13M in additional outgoing salary to make salaries match.

You know who's a free agent with a low cap hold and can be re-signed above the cap? Zu! Zubac could be re-signed to a 1-year, $12-13M deal next summer and used to balance salaries in a hypothetical Beal trade.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 7:58 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Intlakeshow wrote:
Question for the cap experts:
If we sign a non-KD max next year, could we then trade Ingram/Wagner/1st pick for Beal? Would that work salary wise? If not, is there any way it can work by adding more salary from the Lakers’ side not including Lonzo? Thanks in advance.


No. Unless KD is taking a massive paycut, like almost 18m paycut which he won't and shouldn't.

Edit: I misread. I thought you were talking about KD taking a non-max. Regardless, even with a 7-9 year max, we wouldn't have enough salary to match Beal.

Zu re-signed and traded next winter.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 7:58 am    Post subject:

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Intlakeshow wrote:
Question for the cap experts:
If we sign a non-KD max next year, could we then trade Ingram/Wagner/1st pick for Beal? Would that work salary wise? If not, is there any way it can work by adding more salary from the Lakers’ side not including Lonzo? Thanks in advance.


No. Unless KD is taking a massive paycut, like almost 18m paycut which he won't and shouldn't.

Edit: I misread. I thought you were talking about KD taking a non-max. Regardless, even with a 7-9 year max, we wouldn't have enough salary to match Beal.

Zu re-signed and traded next winter.


Zub somewhere in a room smiling.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 8:05 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Intlakeshow wrote:
Question for the cap experts:
If we sign a non-KD max next year, could we then trade Ingram/Wagner/1st pick for Beal? Would that work salary wise? If not, is there any way it can work by adding more salary from the Lakers’ side not including Lonzo? Thanks in advance.


No. Unless KD is taking a massive paycut, like almost 18m paycut which he won't and shouldn't.

Edit: I misread. I thought you were talking about KD taking a non-max. Regardless, even with a 7-9 year max, we wouldn't have enough salary to match Beal.

Zu re-signed and traded next winter.


Zub somewhere in a room smiling.

It all makes sense now, doesn't it?
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