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pjiddy
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 Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:16 pm Post subject: |
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| danzag wrote: | | I'm expecting Rob Pelinka as full-time PoBO, Mark Jackson as a coach and maxing out DeMarcus Cousins, so I don't get disappointed. |
So you'll be pumped when we sign Lue, only give DMC 20 million and the rest of the cap to KCP/Rondo? |
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Sentient Meat
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:19 pm Post subject: |
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I'm convinced some here would cede back the Louisiana Purchase to France if it meant we could have AD.
Because after all... he's a top five player. |
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SocalDevin
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:22 pm Post subject: |
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| LBJ23 wrote: | | SocalDevin wrote: | | Bard207 wrote: | | SocalDevin wrote: | Could we afford Tobias and another solid piece?.. In addition what other solid piece might we be able to pare with him realistically?
And would you guys be okay with it? |
What is the first year salary of Tobias in your scenario? |
I almost always defer to the collective expertise of LG in regards to salaries. I'm not qualified to say what's appropriate. If he's not a max guy he doesn't appear to be that far from being a piece that should be compensated as one. |
He will probably get a max with all the money that will be out there. We wouldn't have much to spend if we maxed him. We would have like 5 or 6 million left. Ballpark |
Gotcha.. Thanks.. That's about enough to acquire talent in the Reggie Bullock range. |
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Rek
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:25 pm Post subject: |
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| LBJ23 wrote: | | SocalDevin wrote: | | Bard207 wrote: | | SocalDevin wrote: | Could we afford Tobias and another solid piece?.. In addition what other solid piece might we be able to pare with him realistically?
And would you guys be okay with it? |
What is the first year salary of Tobias in your scenario? |
I almost always defer to the collective expertise of LG in regards to salaries (not implying it was suggested or anticipated here). I'm not qualified to say what's appropriate. If he's not a max guy he doesn't appear to be that far from being a piece that should be compensated as one. |
He will probably get a max with all the money that will be out there. We wouldn't have much to spend if we maxed him. We would have like 5 or 6 million left. Ballpark |
It's not even a question. All of these folks repeatedly suggesting that we'll somehow land any of the top free agents for a reduced amount allowing us to sign additional pieces need to understand it's not happening. It's merely a matter of how many teams with cap space available to sign how many players. Regardless of what any particular fan may think about a player like Tobias, he'll be getting max. I wouldn't be surprised to see a team throw max money at Vucevic. |
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CamReddish
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Joined: 23 Jun 2015
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:28 pm Post subject: |
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| SocalDevin wrote: | | LBJ23 wrote: | | SocalDevin wrote: | | Bard207 wrote: | | SocalDevin wrote: | Could we afford Tobias and another solid piece?.. In addition what other solid piece might we be able to pare with him realistically?
And would you guys be okay with it? |
What is the first year salary of Tobias in your scenario? |
I almost always defer to the collective expertise of LG in regards to salaries. I'm not qualified to say what's appropriate. If he's not a max guy he doesn't appear to be that far from being a piece that should be compensated as one. |
He will probably get a max with all the money that will be out there. We wouldn't have much to spend if we maxed him. We would have like 5 or 6 million left. Ballpark |
Gotcha.. Thanks.. That's about enough to acquire talent in the Reggie Bullock range. |
We can hold his bird rights if we sign any max this season except KD because KD has a max of around 38 million. RBs cap hold is a little over 4 million, so we can pay him more if we wanted.
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SocalDevin
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:30 pm Post subject: |
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| LBJ23 wrote: | | SocalDevin wrote: | | LBJ23 wrote: | | SocalDevin wrote: | | Bard207 wrote: | | SocalDevin wrote: | Could we afford Tobias and another solid piece?.. In addition what other solid piece might we be able to pare with him realistically?
And would you guys be okay with it? |
What is the first year salary of Tobias in your scenario? |
I almost always defer to the collective expertise of LG in regards to salaries. I'm not qualified to say what's appropriate. If he's not a max guy he doesn't appear to be that far from being a piece that should be compensated as one. |
He will probably get a max with all the money that will be out there. We wouldn't have much to spend if we maxed him. We would have like 5 or 6 million left. Ballpark |
Gotcha.. Thanks.. That's about enough to acquire talent in the Reggie Bullock range. |
We can hold his bird rights if we sign any max this season except KD because KD has a max of around 38 million. RBs cap hold is a little over 4 million, so we can pay him more if we wanted. |
Well, doesn't sound all that sexy. lol.. But it's not a terrible possible 1 of many worse case scenarios. |
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Baron Von Humongous
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:33 pm Post subject: |
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Please don't max Tobias Harris.
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SocalDevin
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | Please don't max Tobias Harris. |
What would you like to see done if we miss on the marquee free agents?
I'm not advocating for Harris btw.. just seems like a not so bad consolation if we can't get anything else. |
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Rek
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:36 pm Post subject: |
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| LBJ23 wrote: | | Dr. Laker wrote: | | epak wrote: | | Dr. Laker wrote: | | I am hoping for the Double Jeopardy win - Kawhi Leonard & Masai Ujiri. |
That would be pretty awesome.
Side: do you think BI will be better than Siakam at the same age? Siakam is already 25. BI turns 22 in September. |
At this point, I'm hoping BI can be healthy enough to be in the league at age 25.
BI has a different skillset and a bigger upside. Scoring wise, he's already ahead of Siakam. |
When you say scoring wise BI is already ahead, are you strictly basing it off PPG? Because that would be the only thing that makes it true. Siakam has a better 2 point percentage, 3 point percentage, free throw percentage, true shooting percentage.
PPG though, Ingram is better. |
Siakam is also playing in a better situation. Opposing defense have more to account for before they worry about keying in on him. BI basically just has Bron ahead of him in the pecking order. But, there's no questioning that Siakam is really good. Just not quite an apples for apples thing. |
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h2omike
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Rek wrote: | | LBJ23 wrote: | | Dr. Laker wrote: | | epak wrote: | | Dr. Laker wrote: | | I am hoping for the Double Jeopardy win - Kawhi Leonard & Masai Ujiri. |
That would be pretty awesome.
Side: do you think BI will be better than Siakam at the same age? Siakam is already 25. BI turns 22 in September. |
At this point, I'm hoping BI can be healthy enough to be in the league at age 25.
BI has a different skillset and a bigger upside. Scoring wise, he's already ahead of Siakam. |
When you say scoring wise BI is already ahead, are you strictly basing it off PPG? Because that would be the only thing that makes it true. Siakam has a better 2 point percentage, 3 point percentage, free throw percentage, true shooting percentage.
PPG though, Ingram is better. |
Siakam is also playing in a better situation. Opposing defense have more to account for before they worry about keying in on him. BI basically just has Bron ahead of him in the pecking order. But, there's no questioning that Siakam is really good. Just not quite an apples for apples thing. |
I think it might show the type of player Ingram could be in three years, espy if he fixes his shooting. |
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Sentient Meat
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:47 pm Post subject: |
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I'd trade Siakam for LBJ in a heartbeat.
You could play Ingram as the SF and Siakam as the PF.
Kuzma could take the sixth man role... and if he didn't want to do that you could trade him for a shooter or a center. |
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Joe Pesci
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Sentient Meat wrote: | I'm convinced some here would cede back the Louisiana Purchase to France if it meant we could have AD.
Because after all... he's a top five player. |
Not that it will happen, but, given the context of the current state of the franchise, if the Pelicans were willing, you'd be a damn fool not to take Davis for the youngsters.
I know you have your reasons (ie. lack of depth, AD injury concerns, lack of faith in AD's impact, fear of a bleak future), but the rewards far outweigh the risks.
Your problem is that you severely underrate Davis' impact on a winning team. I get it, he's played on sorry team's, so you've never seen him win consistently. I understand all of your points.
What you're not acknowledging is the sheer ineptitude of the Pelicans. Davis isn't a flawed player. He's just the best big in the game playing in an era that emphasizes wing play, and his entire organization from top to bottom has been as bad as it gets.
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BigGameHames
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Sentient Meat wrote: | I'd trade Siakam for LBJ in a heartbeat.
You could play Ingram as the SF and Siakam as the PF.
Kuzma could take the sixth man role... and if he didn't want to do that you could trade him for a shooter or a center. |
Please tell me you’re joking?! No sane basketball fan can possibly believe that. |
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Joe Pesci
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:55 pm Post subject: |
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Harris is going back to Phila for sure. They'll pay whatever it takes. Losing Harris would be a PR disaster. They won't let him walk.
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Sentient Meat
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Joe Pesci wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | I'm convinced some here would cede back the Louisiana Purchase to France if it meant we could have AD.
Because after all... he's a top five player. |
Not that it will happen, but, given the context of the current state of the franchise, if the Pelicans were willing, you'd be a damn fool not to take Davis for the youngsters.
I know you have your reasons (ie. lack of depth, AD injury concerns, lack of faith in AD's impact, fear of a bleak future), but the rewards far outweigh the risks.
Your problem is that you severely underrate Davis' impact on a winning team. I get it, he's played on sorry team's, so you've never seen him win consistently. I understand all of your points.
What you're not acknowledging is the sheer ineptitude of the Pelicans. Davis isn't a flawed player. He's just the best big in the game playing in an era that emphasizes wing play, and his entire organization from top to bottom has been as bad as it gets. |
If we trade two of the three core players... keeping Ingram preferably, I'd be fine with a trade for AD.
I just don't want to do BI/Zo/Kuz/#11 plus filler or more picks.
If I trusted the front office not to operate as a subsidiary of Klutch, I wouldn't be making such a stink right now.
A fair trade... I'm fine with...
A fire sale... I'm not.
You differ... I respect that... but until the trade is a fait accompli I will be banging my drum to keep the core.
Can we succeed with AD and LBJ plus some strategic signings... sure.
LBJ and AD have to play 75 plus games... players like Caruso or Moe need to flourish out of nowhere... we need to strike gold on at least one FA... someone who comes out of nowhere like DRose to have a comeback or career season.
It's not out of the realm of possibility to make a title run.
But then remember that two or three years from now... LBJ will probably be about as productive as a healthy Ingram or Kuzma... he'll still be a perfectly decent player but we will have 70 million tied up with those two... and do you trust our mainly Klutch lineup not to sign LBJ for a two year extension?
I don't.
I'd rather divest ourselves of LBJ and go a different route.
AD is fine... but I'd sign him in 2020.
Last edited by Sentient Meat on Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:58 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Dr. Laker
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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| LBJ23 wrote: | | Dr. Laker wrote: | | epak wrote: | | Dr. Laker wrote: | | I am hoping for the Double Jeopardy win - Kawhi Leonard & Masai Ujiri. |
That would be pretty awesome.
Side: do you think BI will be better than Siakam at the same age? Siakam is already 25. BI turns 22 in September. |
At this point, I'm hoping BI can be healthy enough to be in the league at age 25.
BI has a different skillset and a bigger upside. Scoring wise, he's already ahead of Siakam. |
When you say scoring wise BI is already ahead, are you strictly basing it off PPG? Because that would be the only thing that makes it true. Siakam has a better 2 point percentage, 3 point percentage, free throw percentage, true shooting percentage.
PPG though, Ingram is better. |
Siakam has developed a 3-pt. shot and has better %, but BI is a better and more dynamic scorer.
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Sentient Meat
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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| BigGameHames wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | I'd trade Siakam for LBJ in a heartbeat.
You could play Ingram as the SF and Siakam as the PF.
Kuzma could take the sixth man role... and if he didn't want to do that you could trade him for a shooter or a center. |
Please tell me you’re joking?! No sane basketball fan can possibly believe that. |
Next season LBJ will still be better.
I think in two or three years Siakam will surpass him. |
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Bard207
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:58 pm Post subject: |
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| SocalDevin wrote: | | Bard207 wrote: | | SocalDevin wrote: | Could we afford Tobias and another solid piece?.. In addition what other solid piece might we be able to pare with him realistically?
And would you guys be okay with it? |
What is the first year salary of Tobias in your scenario? |
I almost always defer to the collective expertise of LG in regards to salaries. I'm not qualified to say what's appropriate. If he's not a max guy he doesn't appear to be that far from being a piece that should be compensated as one. |
Here it is with four different salaries for Tobias. The first year cap hold/salary for the 2019 first at #11 would be just over $4 million.
Salary Cap.............................$109,000,000.....$109,000,000.....$109,000,000......$109,000,000
Salaries, Cap Holds & Deng....$73,664,836........$73,664,836.......$73,664,836........$73,664,836
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Available for Free Agency........$35,335,164.......$35,335,164........$35,335,164........$35,335,164
Available for Free Agency........$35,335,164.......$35,335,164........$35,335,164........$35,335,164
Harris 2019-20 Salary.............$32,700,000.......$30,000,000........$27,500,000........$25,000,000
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Left To Spend...........................$2,635,164.........$5,335,164..........$7,835,164........$10,335,164 |
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CamReddish
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 6:00 pm Post subject: |
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| Dr. Laker wrote: | | LBJ23 wrote: | | Dr. Laker wrote: | | epak wrote: | | Dr. Laker wrote: | | I am hoping for the Double Jeopardy win - Kawhi Leonard & Masai Ujiri. |
That would be pretty awesome.
Side: do you think BI will be better than Siakam at the same age? Siakam is already 25. BI turns 22 in September. |
At this point, I'm hoping BI can be healthy enough to be in the league at age 25.
BI has a different skillset and a bigger upside. Scoring wise, he's already ahead of Siakam. |
When you say scoring wise BI is already ahead, are you strictly basing it off PPG? Because that would be the only thing that makes it true. Siakam has a better 2 point percentage, 3 point percentage, free throw percentage, true shooting percentage.
PPG though, Ingram is better. |
Siakam has developed a 3-pt. shot and has better %, but BI is a better and more dynamic scorer. |
How though? Eye test? Siakam is better at scoring in every aspect.
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Baron Von Humongous
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 6:01 pm Post subject: |
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| SocalDevin wrote: | | Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | Please don't max Tobias Harris. |
What would you like to see done if we miss on the marquee free agents?
I'm not advocating for Harris btw.. just seems like a not so bad consolation if we can't get anything else. |
I think you're duplicating a skillset that Kuz will eventually be able to replicate at a cheaper price and that Kyle's growth will be directly stunted since he and Harris are both effectively mono-positional players. I think you could more than replicate Harris' production for 1/3rd of the price by signing a Morii twin to rotate with Kuzma.
Sadly I don't know where you get good middle class value this summer outside of some of the intriguing, under the radar RFAs. Noah Vonleh, Jeremy Lamb, DeMarre Carroll, Robin Lopez, and/or Patrick Beverley? Maintaining cap flexibility for a disgruntled player in 2020 who won't cost all the youth might be a better option than trading everyone not named Lebron for AD this sumner and I think would certainly be the wiser course of action than going all in on Harris as a second option. I might even take on the last year of Batum or Whiteside's contract for a draft pick rather than commit four years of max money to Harris.
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BigGameHames
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 6:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Sentient Meat wrote: | | BigGameHames wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | I'd trade Siakam for LBJ in a heartbeat.
You could play Ingram as the SF and Siakam as the PF.
Kuzma could take the sixth man role... and if he didn't want to do that you could trade him for a shooter or a center. |
Please tell me you’re joking?! No sane basketball fan can possibly believe that. |
Next season LBJ will still be better.
I think in two or three years Siakam will surpass him. |
Wow. |
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Baron Von Humongous
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 6:03 pm Post subject: |
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| Sentient Meat wrote: | | BigGameHames wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | I'd trade Siakam for LBJ in a heartbeat.
You could play Ingram as the SF and Siakam as the PF.
Kuzma could take the sixth man role... and if he didn't want to do that you could trade him for a shooter or a center. |
Please tell me you’re joking?! No sane basketball fan can possibly believe that. |
Next season LBJ will still be better.
I think in two or three years Siakam will surpass him. |
Lebron might be retired in three years, so...
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CamReddish
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 6:04 pm Post subject: |
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| Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | | BigGameHames wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | I'd trade Siakam for LBJ in a heartbeat.
You could play Ingram as the SF and Siakam as the PF.
Kuzma could take the sixth man role... and if he didn't want to do that you could trade him for a shooter or a center. |
Please tell me you’re joking?! No sane basketball fan can possibly believe that. |
Next season LBJ will still be better.
I think in two or three years Siakam will surpass him. |
Lebron might be retired in three years, so... |
Then Siakam will for sure be better in 3 years
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Sentient Meat
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Posts: 12978
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 6:04 pm Post subject: |
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| BigGameHames wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | | BigGameHames wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | I'd trade Siakam for LBJ in a heartbeat.
You could play Ingram as the SF and Siakam as the PF.
Kuzma could take the sixth man role... and if he didn't want to do that you could trade him for a shooter or a center. |
Please tell me you’re joking?! No sane basketball fan can possibly believe that. |
Next season LBJ will still be better.
I think in two or three years Siakam will surpass him. |
Wow. |
Siakam will never be LBJ... but he's trending at a future all star level.
I'm purely basing this on the ten year age gap.
Toronto is building their team around him... I don't think you can get him for anything other than an overpay.
You'd lose upfront, but you'd gain in having a very skilled lower maintenance player who has a lot of upside. |
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Sentient Meat
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| Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 6:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | | BigGameHames wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | I'd trade Siakam for LBJ in a heartbeat.
You could play Ingram as the SF and Siakam as the PF.
Kuzma could take the sixth man role... and if he didn't want to do that you could trade him for a shooter or a center. |
Please tell me you’re joking?! No sane basketball fan can possibly believe that. |
Next season LBJ will still be better.
I think in two or three years Siakam will surpass him. |
Lebron might be retired in three years, so... |
Do you have faith our "brain" trust with 67% Klutch clients doesn't sign LBJ to a hideous CP3/Wall like extension in three years?
I'm disappointed with you, Baron... lol |
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