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epak
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Joined: 30 Aug 2005
Posts: 34147
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 Posted: Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:40 pm Post subject: |
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| xэloЯRolex wrote: | | I don't understand why so many people here hate KCP, he's more than solid and i hope that we can keep him... |
I think many are pissed he didnt earn his last 2 paychecks.
And he seemed to not let us trade him last year.
Plus he's low bball iq.
His defense is overrated. He gets offball steals by jumping lanes but his on all defense is bad.
He probably got too much opportunities for out of timeout 3s, but I blame Luke for that. This guy is repped by Klutch, but his game is not clutch.
So yeah, I'd take him on a minimum. Forget using the room on him. Ok, maybe up to $3M at the most if we strike out with every FA. |
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LAL1947
Star Player
Joined: 26 Dec 2018
Posts: 1855
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| Posted: Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:42 pm Post subject: |
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| xэloЯRolex wrote: |
Who are better options than KCP for SG spot...and i mean realistic options who might take room exception, if we spend all our money on Kyrie, Kemba or D'Angelo...most names that people throw around are probably out of our reach, if KCP played for some other team and if he wasn't represented by Klutch, i think that he would also be too expensive for us if we are only left with room exception... |
Well, I'm not seeing many cheap 2-way options at SG, which is why I'd prefer not to sign D'lo for a max... and split the dollars instead. Kyrie is an offensive beast, so we could make an exception for him and look to get a length, defensive SG to compensate. Kemba is somewhere between those two, so I'm unsure with him. |
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TooMuchMajicBuss
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Joined: 17 Sep 2008
Posts: 21099
Location: In a white room, with black curtains near the station
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| Posted: Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:43 pm Post subject: |
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| epak wrote: | | xэloЯRolex wrote: | | I don't understand why so many people here hate KCP, he's more than solid and i hope that we can keep him... |
I think many are pissed he didnt earn his last 2 paychecks.
And he seemed to not let us trade him last year.
Plus he's low bball iq.
His defense is overrated. He gets offball steals by jumping lanes but his on all defense is bad.
He probably got too much opportunities for out of timeout 3s, but I blame Luke for that. This guy is repped by Klutch, but his game is not clutch.
So yeah, I'd take him on a minimum. Forget using the room on him. Ok, maybe up to $3M at the most if we strike out with every FA. |
That about sums it up perfectly on KCP
Last edited by TooMuchMajicBuss on Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:45 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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LAL1947
Star Player
Joined: 26 Dec 2018
Posts: 1855
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| Posted: Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:44 pm Post subject: |
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| epak wrote: | | xэloЯRolex wrote: | | I don't understand why so many people here hate KCP, he's more than solid and i hope that we can keep him... |
I think many are pissed he didnt earn his last 2 paychecks.
And he seemed to not let us trade him last year.
Plus he's low bball iq.
His defense is overrated. He gets offball steals by jumping lanes but his on all defense is bad.
He probably got too much opportunities for out of timeout 3s, but I blame Luke for that. This guy is repped by Klutch, but his game is not clutch.
So yeah, I'd take him on a minimum. Forget using the room on him. Ok, maybe up to $3M at the most if we strike out with every FA. |
This. I'm cool with him being a back-up SG, but not a starter. |
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Claysmokepot
Rookie
Joined: 11 Jul 2018
Posts: 15
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| Posted: Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:50 pm Post subject: |
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| epak wrote: | https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2019/03/hoops-rumors-glossary-non-bird-rights-3.html
| Quote: | | The cap hold for a Non-Bird player is 120% of his previous salary, unless the previous salary was the minimum. In that case, the cap hold is equivalent to the two-year veteran’s minimum salary, which in 2019/20 projects to be worth $1,618,486. If a Non-Bird free agent only has one year of NBA experience, his cap hold is equivalent to the one-year veteran’s minimum salary. |
Simple. KCPs cap hold would be 120% x $12M. And they can go over the cap after counting the 120% x $12M. It does NOT mean his entire salary is not counted.
Hope that clears it up for you, Clay. |
KCp has spent 2 consecutive seasons without being traded on the Lakers. Therefore he has “early bird rights”.
Lakers can renounce him, which removes his cap hold.
Later, after signing the remainder of the cap for whomever is signed, Lakers can sign him by going over the cap with his “non-bird rights”
Hope that clears things up for you. |
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epak
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Joined: 30 Aug 2005
Posts: 34147
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| Posted: Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:55 pm Post subject: |
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The quote tells you the new cap hold. 
NVM. Yes, let's sign kcp for $15M. Great plan. I'm on board. |
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xэloЯRolex
Sixth Man
Joined: 24 Jun 2019
Posts: 51
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| Posted: Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:59 pm Post subject: |
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| LAL1947 wrote: | | epak wrote: | | xэloЯRolex wrote: | | I don't understand why so many people here hate KCP, he's more than solid and i hope that we can keep him... |
I think many are pissed he didnt earn his last 2 paychecks.
And he seemed to not let us trade him last year.
Plus he's low bball iq.
His defense is overrated. He gets offball steals by jumping lanes but his on all defense is bad.
He probably got too much opportunities for out of timeout 3s, but I blame Luke for that. This guy is repped by Klutch, but his game is not clutch.
So yeah, I'd take him on a minimum. Forget using the room on him. Ok, maybe up to $3M at the most if we strike out with every FA. |
This. I'm cool with him being a back-up SG, but not a starter. |
I think that if he was on some other team, and if people saw his numbers and some highlights and some full games here and there, the overall opinion would be much different...maybe i'm wrong, but more than often we tend to overrate our young players and underrate our role players, and at the same time we tend to overrate role players on other teams...
| LAL1947 wrote: | | xэloЯRolex wrote: |
Who are better options than KCP for SG spot...and i mean realistic options who might take room exception, if we spend all our money on Kyrie, Kemba or D'Angelo...most names that people throw around are probably out of our reach, if KCP played for some other team and if he wasn't represented by Klutch, i think that he would also be too expensive for us if we are only left with room exception... |
Well, I'm not seeing many cheap 2-way options at SG, which is why I'd prefer not to sign D'lo for a max... and split the dollars instead. Kyrie is an offensive beast, so we could make an exception for him and look to get a length, defensive SG to compensate. Kemba is somewhere between those two, so I'm unsure with him. |
For me it's just getting one of these five players (Kyrie, Kawhi, Jimmy, Kemba or D'Angelo) and after that whatever comes our way...i would love to keep KCP, McGee and Rondo and i think that we'll sign Melo, Korver and J.R.Smith...maybe we can get Ariza and Noel for cheap to add in the mix...but as long as we have Lebron, AD and 3rd max, i'm not too worried about other guys... |
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epak
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Joined: 30 Aug 2005
Posts: 34147
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| Posted: Wed Jun 26, 2019 11:01 pm Post subject: |
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Yes. If he was on say Detroit.
And there was some YouTube video out there calling him the Steph Curry stopper and we all get bamboozled into thinking he's some elite defender, we'd probably want him on our team for the room. |
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Ziggy
Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Feb 2005
Posts: 12737
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| Posted: Wed Jun 26, 2019 11:04 pm Post subject: |
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| Claysmokepot wrote: | | epak wrote: | https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2019/03/hoops-rumors-glossary-non-bird-rights-3.html
| Quote: | | The cap hold for a Non-Bird player is 120% of his previous salary, unless the previous salary was the minimum. In that case, the cap hold is equivalent to the two-year veteran’s minimum salary, which in 2019/20 projects to be worth $1,618,486. If a Non-Bird free agent only has one year of NBA experience, his cap hold is equivalent to the one-year veteran’s minimum salary. |
Simple. KCPs cap hold would be 120% x $12M. And they can go over the cap after counting the 120% x $12M. It does NOT mean his entire salary is not counted.
Hope that clears it up for you, Clay. |
KCp has spent 2 consecutive seasons without being traded on the Lakers. Therefore he has “early bird rights”.
Lakers can renounce him, which removes his cap hold.
Later, after signing the remainder of the cap for whomever is signed, Lakers can sign him by going over the cap with his “non-bird rights”
Hope that clears things up for you. |
Something seems off about this. It seems the non-bird exception functions pretty much identical to a player with bird rights, but without the burden of a cap hold. That seems like an obvious loophole.
How can you renounce a player, relieving you of their caphold, and then sign them when you're over the cap? |
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LakerMindLA
Star Player
Joined: 26 Dec 2008
Posts: 5344
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| Posted: Wed Jun 26, 2019 11:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Claysmokepot wrote: | | epak wrote: | https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2019/03/hoops-rumors-glossary-non-bird-rights-3.html
| Quote: | | The cap hold for a Non-Bird player is 120% of his previous salary, unless the previous salary was the minimum. In that case, the cap hold is equivalent to the two-year veteran’s minimum salary, which in 2019/20 projects to be worth $1,618,486. If a Non-Bird free agent only has one year of NBA experience, his cap hold is equivalent to the one-year veteran’s minimum salary. |
Simple. KCPs cap hold would be 120% x $12M. And they can go over the cap after counting the 120% x $12M. It does NOT mean his entire salary is not counted.
Hope that clears it up for you, Clay. |
KCp has spent 2 consecutive seasons without being traded on the Lakers. Therefore he has “early bird rights”.
Lakers can renounce him, which removes his cap hold.
Later, after signing the remainder of the cap for whomever is signed, Lakers can sign him by going over the cap with his “non-bird rights”
Hope that clears things up for you. |
Stop speeding false information.
Once Lakers renounce him and use their cap-space, they could only resign at the vet min or room exception. |
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epak
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Joined: 30 Aug 2005
Posts: 34147
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| Posted: Wed Jun 26, 2019 11:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Ziggy wrote: | | Claysmokepot wrote: | | epak wrote: | https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2019/03/hoops-rumors-glossary-non-bird-rights-3.html
| Quote: | | The cap hold for a Non-Bird player is 120% of his previous salary, unless the previous salary was the minimum. In that case, the cap hold is equivalent to the two-year veteran’s minimum salary, which in 2019/20 projects to be worth $1,618,486. If a Non-Bird free agent only has one year of NBA experience, his cap hold is equivalent to the one-year veteran’s minimum salary. |
Simple. KCPs cap hold would be 120% x $12M. And they can go over the cap after counting the 120% x $12M. It does NOT mean his entire salary is not counted.
Hope that clears it up for you, Clay. |
KCp has spent 2 consecutive seasons without being traded on the Lakers. Therefore he has “early bird rights”.
Lakers can renounce him, which removes his cap hold.
Later, after signing the remainder of the cap for whomever is signed, Lakers can sign him by going over the cap with his “non-bird rights”
Hope that clears things up for you. |
Something seems off about this. It seems the non-bird exception functions pretty much identical to a player with bird rights, but without the burden of a cap hold. That seems like an obvious loophole.
How can you renounce a player, relieving you of their caphold, and then sign them when you're over the cap? |
He's ignoring the new cap hold. But let's play along.  |
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Ziggy
Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Feb 2005
Posts: 12737
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| Posted: Wed Jun 26, 2019 11:17 pm Post subject: |
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| epak wrote: | | Ziggy wrote: | | Claysmokepot wrote: | | epak wrote: | https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2019/03/hoops-rumors-glossary-non-bird-rights-3.html
| Quote: | | The cap hold for a Non-Bird player is 120% of his previous salary, unless the previous salary was the minimum. In that case, the cap hold is equivalent to the two-year veteran’s minimum salary, which in 2019/20 projects to be worth $1,618,486. If a Non-Bird free agent only has one year of NBA experience, his cap hold is equivalent to the one-year veteran’s minimum salary. |
Simple. KCPs cap hold would be 120% x $12M. And they can go over the cap after counting the 120% x $12M. It does NOT mean his entire salary is not counted.
Hope that clears it up for you, Clay. |
KCp has spent 2 consecutive seasons without being traded on the Lakers. Therefore he has “early bird rights”.
Lakers can renounce him, which removes his cap hold.
Later, after signing the remainder of the cap for whomever is signed, Lakers can sign him by going over the cap with his “non-bird rights”
Hope that clears things up for you. |
Something seems off about this. It seems the non-bird exception functions pretty much identical to a player with bird rights, but without the burden of a cap hold. That seems like an obvious loophole.
How can you renounce a player, relieving you of their caphold, and then sign them when you're over the cap? |
He's ignoring the new cap hold. But let's play along. |
Teams would be renouncing all of their players every year if they could pull that off |
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Inspector Gadget
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Joined: 18 Apr 2016
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mhan00
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Joined: 13 Apr 2001
Posts: 32076
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| Posted: Thu Jul 25, 2019 11:28 am Post subject: |
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| Inspector Gadget wrote: | https://mobile.twitter.com/LakeShowWorld/status/1153388547501694976
I gotta say I’m excited to see what KCP does this year, Luke didn’t use him correctly, I still have hope he can turn into a real solid basketball player. |
If his past two years with us are any indication, he will be horrible when the games actually matter and then suddenly come alive and knock down shots when they don’t. I hope like crazy he shoots like he did to end the season, but I made that same mistake last season and he laid a huge egg. I’m not optimistic, but if he does somehow show he can play, then that would be huge for us. |
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Inspector Gadget
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Joined: 18 Apr 2016
Posts: 46873
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| Posted: Thu Jul 25, 2019 11:40 am Post subject: |
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| mhan00 wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | https://mobile.twitter.com/LakeShowWorld/status/1153388547501694976
I gotta say I’m excited to see what KCP does this year, Luke didn’t use him correctly, I still have hope he can turn into a real solid basketball player. |
If his past two years with us are any indication, he will be horrible when the games actually matter and then suddenly come alive and knock down shots when they don’t. I hope like crazy he shoots like he did to end the season, but I made that same mistake last season and he laid a huge egg. I’m not optimistic, but if he does somehow show he can play, then that would be huge for us. |
There is less pressure on him this year, the last 2 years he was asked to score, this year he will be more relaxed and play his game when it comes to him... I know what you mean and i have also been frustrated with him but Luke was a huge problem when it came to handling players so hopefully Vogel can let KCP play his role. |
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DLaker
Star Player
Joined: 14 Jul 2005
Posts: 1539
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| Posted: Thu Jul 25, 2019 3:00 pm Post subject: |
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| Inspector Gadget wrote: | https://mobile.twitter.com/LakeShowWorld/status/1153388547501694976
I gotta say I’m excited to see what KCP does this year, Luke didn’t use him correctly, I still have hope he can turn into a real solid basketball player. |
I still have hope on KCP. He is only 26 and I know he can be a pest on D and he has the motor just watching him play. Work with Lethal shooter last year and you can see how much he improve on the FT line. With the new coach and hopefully a more define role on the court. He is no play maker (Luke system  ), so he does not need to bring the rock just need to run the wings and finish. I am hoping for a much better season for KCP. He has the skills to make it happen. Fingers crossed. |
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SuperboyReformed
Star Player
Joined: 07 Oct 2012
Posts: 4083
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| Posted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 7:52 pm Post subject: |
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| epak wrote: | Yes. If he was on say Detroit.
And there was some YouTube video out there calling him the Steph Curry stopper and we all get bamboozled into thinking he's some elite defender, we'd probably want him on our team for the room. |
i dont think people actually watch this guy. he plays good d. he played better d than ANYONE on our team last year and he still gets blasted for it. unreasonable hate on this guy, he does everything well. he will be very good this year because the team will be good. nobody watches him trust me.. all people notice is when he misses 3 pointers. similar thing happened when we had nick young, JC, Lou...just hate for no reason, these are good players. |
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LonzoLegend2
Starting Rotation
Joined: 05 Aug 2017
Posts: 680
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| Posted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 8:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Redundant and waste of roster space after the Green, Cook, Daniels signing. |
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twisted
Star Player
Joined: 09 Jun 2012
Posts: 1265
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| Posted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 9:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Claysmokepot wrote: | | epak wrote: | | Claysmokepot wrote: | | 22 wrote: | | KeepItRealOrElse wrote: | | why am I in this thread |
I’m only here because anything higher than the vet minimum is an absurd price for KCP |
If he gets a 1 year deal and doesn’t affect the cap why do you care |
Anything higher than a vet min would affect the cap.
His cap hold is ~$15M. So they need to renounce him and have him sign the vet min. Which I don't believe he will as he prob gets part of a mle from someone else. Or perhaps us  |
They can renounce and then use non-bird rights on him |
No they can't. What you are renouncing is your rights to the player. You free up cap hold space but obv give up the rights. You can't get it back otherwise what is the purpose of renouncing player rights?
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“God knew they couldn’t be on this Earth without each other. He had to bring them home to have them together.” – Vanessa Bryant |
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twisted
Star Player
Joined: 09 Jun 2012
Posts: 1265
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| Posted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 9:07 pm Post subject: |
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| SuperboyReformed wrote: | | epak wrote: | Yes. If he was on say Detroit.
And there was some YouTube video out there calling him the Steph Curry stopper and we all get bamboozled into thinking he's some elite defender, we'd probably want him on our team for the room. |
i dont think people actually watch this guy. he plays good d. he played better d than ANYONE on our team last year and he still gets blasted for it. unreasonable hate on this guy, he does everything well. he will be very good this year because the team will be good. nobody watches him trust me.. all people notice is when he misses 3 pointers. similar thing happened when we had nick young, JC, Lou...just hate for no reason, these are good players. |
I've watched him and my impression is that he was bad but acceptable on D. I hated every time someone got past him and he would just stand around, no contest no second effort. On O he has good skills and range but horrible shot selection.
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“God knew they couldn’t be on this Earth without each other. He had to bring them home to have them together.” – Vanessa Bryant |
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waterman40
Star Player
Joined: 17 Jun 2003
Posts: 6292
Location: Central Coast
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| Posted: Sat Jul 27, 2019 4:59 am Post subject: |
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I wonder with that crowded backcourt, if KCP gets used more at backup SF this year?
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pio2u
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Joined: 26 Dec 2012
Posts: 54694
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| Posted: Sat Jul 27, 2019 5:03 am Post subject: |
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| waterman40 wrote: | | I wonder with that crowded backcourt, if KCP gets used more at backup SF this year? |
Pretty sure he & Danny Green will see some minutes at SF. |
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Hero Ball
Star Player
Joined: 26 May 2015
Posts: 4403
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| Posted: Sat Jul 27, 2019 5:19 am Post subject: |
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| twisted wrote: | | SuperboyReformed wrote: | | epak wrote: | Yes. If he was on say Detroit.
And there was some YouTube video out there calling him the Steph Curry stopper and we all get bamboozled into thinking he's some elite defender, we'd probably want him on our team for the room. |
i dont think people actually watch this guy. he plays good d. he played better d than ANYONE on our team last year and he still gets blasted for it. unreasonable hate on this guy, he does everything well. he will be very good this year because the team will be good. nobody watches him trust me.. all people notice is when he misses 3 pointers. similar thing happened when we had nick young, JC, Lou...just hate for no reason, these are good players. |
I've watched him and my impression is that he was bad but acceptable on D. I hated every time someone got past him and he would just stand around, no contest no second effort. On O he has good skills and range but horrible shot selection. |
I think Vogel will show some spine and confront players not showing up on the defensive end.
We will be primarily be a defensive team under Vogel. |
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Lucky_Shot
Star Player
Joined: 10 Jan 2016
Posts: 5168
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| Posted: Sat Jul 27, 2019 5:30 am Post subject: |
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| pio2u wrote: | | waterman40 wrote: | | I wonder with that crowded backcourt, if KCP gets used more at backup SF this year? |
Pretty sure he & Danny Green will see some minutes at SF. |
Yeah, we will go small at the forward positions (especially at SF) a lot this year since we are a heavy guard team similar to Houston. |
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RI Laker
Star Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2005
Posts: 7199
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| Posted: Sat Jul 27, 2019 6:03 am Post subject: |
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| Maybe we will be lucky and get the KCP that played once his travel restrictions were lifted. He was actually played great for that stretch. |
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