OFFICIAL LONZO BALL THREAD
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saetarubia
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 11:12 am    Post subject:

ZO will be fine as long as there are no serious health concerns. Already got defense and play making figured out. Think he can be 36-37% 3P shooter too soon enough. Like his corrected form and he's putting in the work. NO will have an exciting team when Zion is back.
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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 11:23 am    Post subject:

Did his ankles disintegrate on him?
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cencio_999
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2019 1:46 am    Post subject:

Never been a fan of him, but it's sad to see a young player plagued by injuries.
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JerryWest_44
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2019 1:49 pm    Post subject:

cencio_999 wrote:
OCWA wrote:
JerryWest_44 wrote:
LakerLogic wrote:
LakersMD wrote:
LakersMD wrote:
Benched in the fourth quarter again.


Apparently he’s hurt (again).


Groin injury. Hate to say it but his peak is probably Rubio if he's lucky.



All the data is in .... as the #2 pick Lonzo is a bust


I would consider Darko Milicic ,Hasheem Thabeet and Derrick Williams as busts at #2. Lonzo's numbers are 10/6/6 for his 3 years and he came out of college as a guard that wasn't expected to be a scorer. I don't see that as a bust, especially considering his defensive prowess. Not becoming a superstar doesn't equate to a bust. Not able to stay in the league equates to a bust (See above players). Of course if he only plays 3 years because of a serious injury then maybe the label will fit


I agree that technically he's not a bust, but he's clearly underachieving compared to the hype sorrounding him at the beginning and to some of the other 2017 draftees (tatum, fox, mitchell, markkanen,)



as a #2 he's a bust (w/ emphasis on #2).
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OCWA
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 9:20 am    Post subject:

JerryWest_44 wrote:
cencio_999 wrote:
OCWA wrote:
JerryWest_44 wrote:
LakerLogic wrote:
LakersMD wrote:
LakersMD wrote:
Benched in the fourth quarter again.


Apparently he’s hurt (again).


Groin injury. Hate to say it but his peak is probably Rubio if he's lucky.



All the data is in .... as the #2 pick Lonzo is a bust


I would consider Darko Milicic ,Hasheem Thabeet and Derrick Williams as busts at #2. Lonzo's numbers are 10/6/6 for his 3 years and he came out of college as a guard that wasn't expected to be a scorer. I don't see that as a bust, especially considering his defensive prowess. Not becoming a superstar doesn't equate to a bust. Not able to stay in the league equates to a bust (See above players). Of course if he only plays 3 years because of a serious injury then maybe the label will fit


I agree that technically he's not a bust, but he's clearly underachieving compared to the hype sorrounding him at the beginning and to some of the other 2017 draftees (tatum, fox, mitchell, markkanen,)



as a #2 he's a bust (w/ emphasis on #2).


After the #1 pick it's pretty much a crap shoot. Numbers wise I think the #2 pick actually has a lower percentage of stars than some lower picks. That being said, I recently saw a redraft on some website and Zo was still in the top 6. Not a bust at all. Actually kind of typical.
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Kobesystem
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2019 8:04 am    Post subject:

Looking back.

I think many folks should admit that they were blinded and biased towards the hometown kid...
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2019 8:42 am    Post subject:

Kobesystem wrote:
Looking back.

I think many folks should admit that they were blinded and biased towards the hometown kid...


I gotta admit, I'm one of them.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2019 8:44 am    Post subject:

Kobesystem wrote:
Looking back.

I think many folks should admit that they were blinded and biased towards the hometown kid...


#1 being the dumbass who didn’t even work Tatum out. Our drafting was pretty good prior to the Magic/Pelinka era. Maybe it’s a good thing that we traded our future picks away.
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george w kush
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2019 10:17 am    Post subject:

Always knew this guy was overrated. Can't shoot, cant hit free throws and struggles to make layups in traffic. Very good on defense however.
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Luminous8
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2019 10:41 am    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
Kobesystem wrote:
Looking back.

I think many folks should admit that they were blinded and biased towards the hometown kid...


#1 being the dumbass who didn’t even work Tatum out. Our drafting was pretty good prior to the Magic/Pelinka era. Maybe it’s a good thing that we traded our future picks away.


Magic is the one who made the Zo call iirc when the staff wanted Fox. The staff also wanted Mitchell Robinson and Magic was the one who made the Wagner call. He was hyped on Mo from the combine one year before if memory serves me correctly.
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Laker_Dynasty_01
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2019 2:44 pm    Post subject:

Luminous8 wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Kobesystem wrote:
Looking back.

I think many folks should admit that they were blinded and biased towards the hometown kid...


#1 being the dumbass who didn’t even work Tatum out. Our drafting was pretty good prior to the Magic/Pelinka era. Maybe it’s a good thing that we traded our future picks away.


Magic is the one who made the Zo call iirc when the staff wanted Fox. The staff also wanted Mitchell Robinson and Magic was the one who made the Wagner call. He was hyped on Mo from the combine one year before if memory serves me correctly.


Heard the Lakers were looking to trade down for the Kings' #5 and #10, but were rebuffed.

Would've been a bit crowded...Nance, Randle, Ingram, Kuzma, Tatum all divvying up 96 minutes, maybe 110 if you count the few token minutes they'd play at C. And then adding LeBron? Tatum's already shown he can regress when his role is reduced, see last season.

Trading down to #4 would've been ideal, would've probably kept Tatum from Boston, (bleep) ing all over Ainge's plans.
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defense
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2019 6:27 pm    Post subject:

Lol Ventura really hates magic
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venturalakersfan
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2019 10:46 pm    Post subject:

defense wrote:
Lol Ventura really hates magic


No, he just sucked as an exec. Do you disagree? Don’t be timid.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2019 11:17 pm    Post subject:

Still a mental/confidence thing with the kid. As much as I think he has the tools to be a special player, it looks like the mental/confidence part just isn't there. No dog in him. I sort of feel bad for the kid.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2019 11:22 pm    Post subject:

Magic may have acted the fool many times, but Jim Buss was a pox onto our franchise.

Case in point...the coach he hired (Mike Brown) thought our roster was best suited to run the Princeton Offense. Probably shouldn't have gone all out to get Steve Nash if that was the plan, but whatever...

When the Princeton doesn't yield immediate results, what is Jim's solution? To go and hire a guy who runs the polar opposite of the offense we had worked on all summer, and install that during the season. Barnes and Sessions had left because Brown slowed down the offense too much for their liking, ironically they would have flourished under MDA. But as of November 11, 2012, our roster wasn't geared for the run-n-gun, PnR-centric offense.

There was another coach considering the job after a face-to-face meeting, but Jim hurriedly hired MDA over the phone while Pringles was sitting(laying?) in a NY hospital bed hopped up on painkillers. He literally wasn't going anywhere, and didn't even join the team until a week later. But those Lakers were Jim's baby, and MDA's codeine-induced enthusiasm won Jim over, especially contrasted with Phil's pooh-poohing of our Finals prospects vs Miami in the interview. Sometimes honesty isn't the best policy.

MDA cratered Gasol's trade value and started 12-20, forcing Kobe to take it upon himself to drag that carcass of a team to the playoffs. We all know the rest.
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MJST
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 1:34 am    Post subject:

Laker_Dynasty_01 wrote:
Magic may have acted the fool many times, but Jim Buss was a pox onto our franchise.

Case in point...the coach he hired (Mike Brown) thought our roster was best suited to run the Princeton Offense.


No, the offense Mike Brown had us running was the Spurs twin tower offense.

It was Kobe that went to Mike Brown the next off-season and recommended the Princeton Offense as he wanted something a bit closer to the triangle, and that it'd be easier for him and Pau. Thus, Mike Brown obliged, and put together a staff to accommodate that.
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Laker_Dynasty_01
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 3:11 am    Post subject:

MJST wrote:
Laker_Dynasty_01 wrote:
Magic may have acted the fool many times, but Jim Buss was a pox onto our franchise.

Case in point...the coach he hired (Mike Brown) thought our roster was best suited to run the Princeton Offense.


No, the offense Mike Brown had us running was the Spurs twin tower offense.

It was Kobe that went to Mike Brown the next off-season and recommended the Princeton Offense as he wanted something a bit closer to the triangle, and that it'd be easier for him and Pau. Thus, Mike Brown obliged, and put together a staff to accommodate that.


Ah yes, that lockout season we did run the Twin Tower offense, but if Mike Brown obliged Kobe the following year and our FO went along with it, that was on them for shifting our offense from one extreme to the other just months later.

If they obliged Kobe once, why not stay consistent and take the next logical step, and return to the system that three of their five starters had won a ring with? Better than telling Pau to stand in the corner and shoot 3s...

Both Twin Tower and Princeton offenses rely on the bigs to make most of the plays/reads, and diminish the on-ball roles of the guards. This changed the type of players who wanted to stay/sign here, leaving us the antithesis of the prototypical MDA team. It was like a college football coach who specializes in the 3-4 defense showing up after signing day and taking over for a coach who ran a 4-2-5 for years.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 8:56 am    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
defense wrote:
Lol Ventura really hates magic


No, he just sucked as an exec. Do you disagree? Don’t be timid.


I just wish you judged Jim with the same level of critique. Considering Magic's primary job while here was cleaning up the mistakes of his predecessor.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 11:07 am    Post subject:

Luminous8 wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Kobesystem wrote:
Looking back.

I think many folks should admit that they were blinded and biased towards the hometown kid...


#1 being the dumbass who didn’t even work Tatum out. Our drafting was pretty good prior to the Magic/Pelinka era. Maybe it’s a good thing that we traded our future picks away.


Magic is the one who made the Zo call iirc when the staff wanted Fox. The staff also wanted Mitchell Robinson and Magic was the one who made the Wagner call. He was hyped on Mo from the combine one year before if memory serves me correctly.

Even Lonzo admitted he had a horrible 1st draft workout for the Lakers and report came out after the workout Lonzo workout was bad. Magic wanted all the hype and almost screwed us big time. Nothing against Lonzo, but he ain’t worth top 5 pick. Plus, deal with his dad?
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 12:37 pm    Post subject:

kikanga wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
defense wrote:
Lol Ventura really hates magic


No, he just sucked as an exec. Do you disagree? Don’t be timid.


I just wish you judged Jim with the same level of critique. Considering Magic's primary job while here was cleaning up the mistakes of his predecessor.

Self-criticism is hard for the best of us.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 1:06 pm    Post subject:

la4win wrote:
Luminous8 wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Kobesystem wrote:
Looking back.

I think many folks should admit that they were blinded and biased towards the hometown kid...


#1 being the dumbass who didn’t even work Tatum out. Our drafting was pretty good prior to the Magic/Pelinka era. Maybe it’s a good thing that we traded our future picks away.


Magic is the one who made the Zo call iirc when the staff wanted Fox. The staff also wanted Mitchell Robinson and Magic was the one who made the Wagner call. He was hyped on Mo from the combine one year before if memory serves me correctly.

Even Lonzo admitted he had a horrible 1st draft workout for the Lakers and report came out after the workout Lonzo workout was bad. Magic wanted all the hype and almost screwed us big time. Nothing against Lonzo, but he ain’t worth top 5 pick. Plus, deal with his dad?


Hindsight,... is probably just take Donovan Mitchell. Not that it would really matter. Whatever player we got was headed out for AD regardless imo.
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venturalakersfan
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 1:58 pm    Post subject:

kikanga wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
defense wrote:
Lol Ventura really hates magic


No, he just sucked as an exec. Do you disagree? Don’t be timid.


I just wish you judged Jim with the same level of critique. Considering Magic's primary job while here was cleaning up the mistakes of his predecessor.


Jim was as bad as Magic. The only one who knew anything was Mitch.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 3:15 pm    Post subject:

Laker_Dynasty_01 wrote:
MJST wrote:
Laker_Dynasty_01 wrote:
Magic may have acted the fool many times, but Jim Buss was a pox onto our franchise.

Case in point...the coach he hired (Mike Brown) thought our roster was best suited to run the Princeton Offense.


No, the offense Mike Brown had us running was the Spurs twin tower offense.

It was Kobe that went to Mike Brown the next off-season and recommended the Princeton Offense as he wanted something a bit closer to the triangle, and that it'd be easier for him and Pau. Thus, Mike Brown obliged, and put together a staff to accommodate that.


Ah yes, that lockout season we did run the Twin Tower offense, but if Mike Brown obliged Kobe the following year and our FO went along with it, that was on them for shifting our offense from one extreme to the other just months later.

If they obliged Kobe once, why not stay consistent and take the next logical step, and return to the system that three of their five starters had won a ring with? Better than telling Pau to stand in the corner and shoot 3s...

Both Twin Tower and Princeton offenses rely on the bigs to make most of the plays/reads, and diminish the on-ball roles of the guards. This changed the type of players who wanted to stay/sign here, leaving us the antithesis of the prototypical MDA team. It was like a college football coach who specializes in the 3-4 defense showing up after signing day and taking over for a coach who ran a 4-2-5 for years.


To be honest, if Kobe hadn't said anything, and they'd stuck to the Spurs offense he was trying to run, it probably would have worked out for Dwight and Pau more than the Princeton would have, the triangle/Princeton is not an offense for Dwight Howard, nor Steve Nash unless he was primarily going to be off-ball shooting. Which would be deadly, but a waste of his talent.

To be honest, the team would have been better off, running the Spurs offense Mike Brown was attempting, but with Nash at the point, Dwight at the 5 and Pau at the 4. It would have kept Pau in the mid range and taken advantage of Dwight down low, allowed Nash to quarterback and Kobe to attack off ball.

But the "Princeton" idea, screwed everything over from the start. Then the moment Mike Brown dropped the idea entirely and they switched to the offense they went on to run under Bickerstaff, Brown was fired right before the game it would have started.

So, bad timing all around tbh. But it started with (and it hurts to say) listening to Kobe's take on what offense to run.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 3:53 pm    Post subject:

I am really wondering if Lonzo is going to stick around in the NBA. With his huge durability concerns and without LA media pumping out all of the weird stats that said he was one of the most impactful players in the game, I wonder if he will secure a long term spot.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 4:21 pm    Post subject:

14/4/7 tonight while shooting 4/8 from three in first game back from injury.
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