Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67754 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
Posted: Tue Apr 21, 2020 3:41 pm Post subject:
Kim is set on taking Howard down. Saul has reservations. I think Kim's going to be the one who forges the plan. She's shown she's the smarter of the two. They are going to make a formidable team. I'm thinking Howard is toast. _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
Joined: 15 Sep 2012 Posts: 29382 Location: La La Land
Posted: Tue Apr 21, 2020 7:29 pm Post subject:
Great season finale.
Nacho is screwed.
I give Kim 1 more season alive, tops.
And I wonder if there are any more ties between BCS and BB they can make. Make more ATF stuff with Hank and his partner. _________________ "Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better”
Joined: 10 Dec 2006 Posts: 52663 Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.
Posted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 8:14 am Post subject:
kikanga wrote:
Great season finale.
Nacho is screwed.
I give Kim 1 more season alive, tops.
And I wonder if there are any more ties between BCS and BB they can make. Make more ATF stuff with Hank and his partner.
Well, considering that's all there is left . . . _________________ You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Jason Isbell
Man, do those lyrics resonate right now
Last edited by DaMuleRules on Wed Apr 22, 2020 12:29 pm; edited 1 time in total
Joined: 27 Jul 2004 Posts: 18234 Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 9:37 am Post subject:
kikanga wrote:
Great season finale.
Nacho is screwed.
I give Kim 1 more season alive, tops.
And I wonder if there are any more ties between BCS and BB they can make. Make more ATF stuff with Hank and his partner.
I expect we'll see the return of Gale Boetticher and the blue meth. We had a brief flashback in BB of Fring hiring Gale to setup the lab and later of him testing the purity of the blue. They might expound on how Fring became aware of Walt's product.
I also expect we'll see overlap between this final season of BCS and seasons 1 & 2 of BB so I'll be on the lookout for appearances of characters like Badger, Skinny Pete, and Tuco Salamanca. Hoping we'll see Walt and Jesse towards the end. _________________ "Suck it up. Don't be a baby. Do your job." - Kobe Bryant
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67754 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
Posted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 11:38 am Post subject:
kikanga wrote:
Great season finale.
Nacho is screwed.
I give Kim 1 more season alive, tops.
And I wonder if there are any more ties between BCS and BB they can make. Make more ATF stuff with Hank and his partner.
I'm betting on Nacho. I'm betting on anyone Mike likes.
If you give her one more season you expect her to be there at the series end. Next season BCS is finito. _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
Joined: 20 Jul 2002 Posts: 3111 Location: Orange County, CA
Posted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 2:17 pm Post subject:
Tony Dalton (Lalo) talking about the season finale and the scene at the end of ep.9 "Bad Choice Road" on The Ringer podcast:
I'm glad Lalo was not killed because he is easily one of the most interesting characters on the show.
I hope there is not too much time in between now and the final season but they had long breaks between seasons usually even before Covid-19. Gonna be a really long wait I assume.
I thought Succession was my favorite show, but this is my favorite after the last few episodes. What an incredible season.
Kim's ending up in jail.
She was definitely pointing those guns of hers like an outlaw. Jail would make some sense. But she really flexed in front of Lalo...so I think that's got to be tied to her arc in some fundamental way.
Tony Dalton (Lalo) talking about the season finale and the scene at the end of ep.9 "Bad Choice Road" on The Ringer podcast:
I'm glad Lalo was not killed because he is easily one of the most interesting characters on the show.
I hope there is not too much time in between now and the final season but they had long breaks between seasons usually even before Covid-19. Gonna be a really long wait I assume.
That actor is great at maintaining a spoken dialog that's banal, while letting you read his internal dialog (which says everything) on his face. But I'm sure a lot of the latter is also due to the way scenes are developed, shot & edited.
Joined: 20 Jul 2002 Posts: 3111 Location: Orange County, CA
Posted: Thu Apr 23, 2020 12:26 am Post subject:
DancingBarry wrote:
justsomelakerfan wrote:
I thought Succession was my favorite show, but this is my favorite after the last few episodes. What an incredible season.
Kim's ending up in jail.
She was definitely pointing those guns of hers like an outlaw. Jail would make some sense. But she really flexed in front of Lalo...so I think that's got to be tied to her arc in some fundamental way.
(Season finally of Succession was so good...)
That scene mirrored the season 4 finale but flipped the roles of Jimmy and Kim.
You can see the scenes played back-to-back on this season finale episode review video:
I’m upset we never got a Lalo-Heisenberg face off. Would have been legendary. I feel like Gus would lose to Lalo if he didn’t have Mike on his side.
In a straight up shootout I think Mike would also lose to Lalo. Mike's advantage is that he is meticulous and plans everything in advance. But if they meet in a dark alley I think Lalo wins. _________________ “Properly read, the bible is the most potent force for atheism ever conceived.”
― Isaac Asimov
I’m upset we never got a Lalo-Heisenberg face off. Would have been legendary. I feel like Gus would lose to Lalo if he didn’t have Mike on his side.
In a straight up shootout I think Mike would also lose to Lalo. Mike's advantage is that he is meticulous and plans everything in advance. But if they meet in a dark alley I think Lalo wins.
Mike is super resourceful, remember in BB, he bought the Mylar balloons to short out a transformer? _________________ “Always remember... Rumors are carried by haters, spread by fools, and accepted by idiots.”
Joined: 10 Dec 2006 Posts: 52663 Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.
Posted: Thu Apr 23, 2020 12:26 pm Post subject:
LarryCoon wrote:
Triumph wrote:
Tony Dalton (Lalo) talking about the season finale and the scene at the end of ep.9 "Bad Choice Road" on The Ringer podcast:
I'm glad Lalo was not killed because he is easily one of the most interesting characters on the show.
I hope there is not too much time in between now and the final season but they had long breaks between seasons usually even before Covid-19. Gonna be a really long wait I assume.
That actor is great at maintaining a spoken dialog that's banal, while letting you read his internal dialog (which says everything) on his face. But I'm sure a lot of the latter is also due to the way scenes are developed, shot & edited.
As an editor, I can say that while performance is very important (and Dalton's performance is excellent), the other elements you mention are crucial in shaping the performance and using them to desired effect. The Director's choices of angles and the Editor's choices of sequencing and pacing are what ultimately shapes how a character is perceived.
For example, the scene where Nacho is trying to get outside to unlock the gates for the assassins can be cut several ways, each leaving a different impression of Nacho and Lalo. As it currently plays, Nacho works his plan to get outside, manages to dodge one of the henchman and successfully goes on to the patio and Lalo is revealed there waiting, apparently for him. Lalo seems cunningly one step ahead of Nacho. That feeling comes more from cutting patterns than performance.
I can make that scene play with a different impression of each, with the exact same performances, by changing the sequencing of what we see. If I start the scene with a shot of Lalo outside, he seems like he's just hanging out. When I go to Nacho and his effort to sneak out, now the tone changes. We think "Oh no! Dude! Nacho's out there!" and it feels like Nacho's about to make a mistake by going outside and the emphasis shifts to him. We are anticipating him bungling into Lalo and Lalo doesn't seem like he's one step ahead of Nacho anymore. It seems more coincidental than planned on Nacho's part. He was just chilling and happened to see Nacho coming outside.
That's not to take anything away from Dalton's performance in regards to his character. But you are correct, the overall impression of his character is a cumulative effort of the various elements you mention. _________________ You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
this show is clearly better than breaking bad, one major reason being that there's no skyler-equivalent _________________ one dog goes that way the other dog goes the other way
Joined: 10 Dec 2006 Posts: 52663 Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.
Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 6:04 am Post subject:
PHILosophize wrote:
this show is clearly better than breaking bad, one major reason being that there's no skyler-equivalent
LOL!
Yeah I feel that way too. But as I believe I have said here before, BCS has the advantage of having a wealth of future story points to draw upon. We know the legacy that is to come from what we are seeing now, so that gives it a depth it wouldn't have if we were just seeing Jimmy McGill's decline into Saul Goodman the way we saw Walter White transition into Heisenberg. It gives the writers more room to play I think and can give nuances to characters that they couldn't otherwise. I also think that after all these years in the BB world, Gilligan et al have a much more focused and robust sense of what they are working with. _________________ You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
this show is clearly better than breaking bad, one major reason being that there's no skyler-equivalent
LOL!
Yeah I feel that way too. But as I believe I have said here before, BCS has the advantage of having a wealth of future story points to draw upon. We know the legacy that is to come from what we are seeing now, so that gives it a depth it wouldn't have if we were just seeing Jimmy McGill's decline into Saul Goodman the way we saw Walter White transition into Heisenberg. It gives the writers more room to play I think and can give nuances to characters that they couldn't otherwise. I also think that after all these years in the BB world, Gilligan et al have a much more focused and robust sense of what they are working with.
Yeah, BCS can pick and choose some story lines and characters that were vetted already by BB. So there is already some layering there of built-in awesomeness. Then, they can work on their origins or explore them in other ways that will naturally be fascinating.
It also has advantages of built in suspense in that you know a couple characters aren't there in the future and you can play with that. (I always think of John Locke on Lost in that you know this guy is in a wheelchair but you don't know how he gets there and the writers play with that. So you are continually thinking, "Is this when it happens?" when you go back into his past.)
Or for Saul, it's quite a while before we get to see him as "Saul" so we spend a lot of time wondering how's he get there, what the triggers are, etc.
They did such a masterful job in BB in all of these supporting characters that they can leave behind the main characters of that show and explore the world of these interesting supporting characters without losing much at all (or as PHILosophize attested, even make it better for some viewers).
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67754 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 10:28 am Post subject:
Does anyone have a season debut? _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
Joined: 10 Dec 2006 Posts: 52663 Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.
Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 11:34 am Post subject:
jodeke wrote:
Does anyone have a season debut?
For Season 6? They don't have one. They say they hope come back next year in the fall, but I'm sure that depends heavily on how the industry ramps back up.
The final season will have 13 episodes though. _________________ You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67754 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2020 11:40 am Post subject:
DaMuleRules wrote:
jodeke wrote:
Does anyone have a season debut?
For Season 6? They don't have one. They say they hope come back next year in the fall, but I'm sure that depends heavily on how the industry ramps back up.
The final season will have 13 episodes though.
Thx. I hope there is another season. _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
As an editor, I can say that while performance is very important (and Dalton's performance is excellent), the other elements you mention are crucial in shaping the performance and using them to desired effect. The Director's choices of angles and the Editor's choices of sequencing and pacing are what ultimately shapes how a character is perceived.
For example, the scene where Nacho is trying to get outside to unlock the gates for the assassins can be cut several ways, each leaving a different impression of Nacho and Lalo. As it currently plays, Nacho works his plan to get outside, manages to dodge one of the henchman and successfully goes on to the patio and Lalo is revealed there waiting, apparently for him. Lalo seems cunningly one step ahead of Nacho. That feeling comes more from cutting patterns than performance.
I can make that scene play with a different impression of each, with the exact same performances, by changing the sequencing of what we see. If I start the scene with a shot of Lalo outside, he seems like he's just hanging out. When I go to Nacho and his effort to sneak out, now the tone changes. We think "Oh no! Dude! Nacho's out there!" and it feels like Nacho's about to make a mistake by going outside and the emphasis shifts to him. We are anticipating him bungling into Lalo and Lalo doesn't seem like he's one step ahead of Nacho anymore. It seems more coincidental than planned on Nacho's part. He was just chilling and happened to see Nacho coming outside.
That's not to take anything away from Dalton's performance in regards to his character. But you are correct, the overall impression of his character is a cumulative effort of the various elements you mention.
Thanks for the explanation -- that's fantastic. Got a new appreciation for the art when I saw this video:
One thing I'd be interested in your opinion on, since we've been talking about BCS vs. BB. Skylar vs. Kim. The former received a mixed reaction at best from the audience, and the latter is pretty soundly liked. it's the same creators of the characters and writers of the dialogs. Different actresses, but not THAT different. What do YOU see between how those two are presented?
^ in my opinion is was because if Skylar got what she wanted then the show would have gotten boring. And the drama with her and Walt was never all that compelling so there was no reason to root for her - even if she was right about most things.
On rewatches she’s a much more relatable and likable character. But when you’re watching for the first time and rooting for Heisenberg’s work to all pay, you side with Walt in thinking she is overreacting. Only when you know the end of the story do you realize she was reacting appropriately.
Kim never really opposed Jimmy. She was always supportive of him and even when she disagreed the conversations were far more of a discussion than a lecture or some sneaky scheming. They’re pretty much on the same page about everything and since we do know where Jimmy ends up we can side with her when she gives some advice or tells him his scams are a bad choice road.
TLDR; we know where Saul ends up so can see when she’s right about where a choice could lead, with BB we didn’t know his future info so leaned more towards Walt’s corner and thought Skylar was overreacting.
Joined: 09 Dec 2009 Posts: 4330 Location: Meeting the man who met Andy Griffith.
Posted: Sat Apr 25, 2020 10:52 am Post subject:
After Terry from Three’s Company, Malorie from Family Ties and Ginger, Rhea Seehorn is my new TV love. She is the most bad ass character on the set. Even more than Mike. I love that girl. _________________ "The best there is. The best there was. The best there ever will be.", said Bret Hart regarding the Los Angeles Lakers.
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