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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 11:22 am    Post subject:

nickuku wrote:
oldlakerfan wrote:
jodeke wrote:
Can a sitting president be drug tested.


Now I don't think that would have been to good for Obama


Oh are you insinuating he smokes marijuana because he happens to be black?


He admits to smoking dope . . . in college. There's absolutely no indication that he did so during his Presidency. But olf doesn't have anything of substance to offer, so he just goes with a lame attempt at a smear.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 11:30 am    Post subject:

oldlakerfan wrote:


Trump is against

Open Borders and the Crime and Drugs and Child trafficking that Democrats let happen.


99.9% of Americans are against Open Borders, Crime, and Child Trafficking. Only a complete moron would believe otherwise, and since I refuse to believe you are a moron, I have to question your motives for choosing to make such a statement.


oldlakerfan wrote:
Trump is for lower taxes to grow the economy


No. Trump is for lower taxes to line the pockets of he and his fellow wealthy people. By engaging in the irresponsible budget crushing revenue reduction in the manner that he has GUARANTEES that future generations will be paying FAR higher taxes than they would have otherwise. Nothing is free and when the government is spending more than it's taking in, then the remaining balance is put on the National credit card for future generations to pay off. What Trump did is no different than if you maxed out your credit card and then left the bill to be paid by your family after you croke. Only a complete deadbeat would willing choose to do that to his family.


oldlakerfan wrote:
Trump is for lower regulations to grow the economy and attract business to the USA


No. Trump is for lower regulations so it's easier for conglomerates to rape the environment thus shortening the capacity of planet earth to sustain life. And what's this imaginary business that's been attracted to the US???


oldlakerfan wrote:
Trump is for growing jobs and raising wages by growing the economy & stopping illegal immigration


Actually the rate of job growth under the first 2 years of Trump lags behind the rate of job growth under the last 2 years of Obama. Wages have flatlined, and inflation has been rising for 5 straight quarters. When inflation rises faster than wage growth, consumers are able to purchase less, so their net well being is lower thanks to Trump.

Quote:
As inflation increases it puts a damper on wages. While average hourly earnings have increased from $26.34 per hour to $27.05, or 2.7% over the past year, inflation at 2.9% has actually lead to real wages falling a small amount from $10.78 per hour a year ago to $10.76 in July this year.

For July the CPI, or Consumer Price Index, rose at a 2.9% rate which matches last months increase. This is close to double the 1.6% rate when Trump was elected and up from the 2.1% increase in December 2016, the month before he entered office.


Trumps Economy


oldlakerfan wrote:
Trump is Pro life


No he's not. He's been VERY clear on the matter. He is ANTI-ABORTION, but PRO CHOICE. Here, listen to him in his own words explain completely why he's taken the position he has over the entirety of his adult life. When he wanted to get elected President, he told people at rallies he was Pro Lifee because he knew they'd be too irresponsible to investigate his long held, and very well explained, positions on the matter.

Trump Admitting He's Pro Choice


oldlakerfan wrote:
Trump does not want to burden tax payers with illegal Alien costs


Ahem, Americans have had to pay MORE MONEY in the past 2 years for "Illegal Alien Costs". The burden has gone UP instead of down. And he's begging Congrees for MORE of Americans hard earned money. In what alternate universe is paying more less burdoning?



oldlakerfan wrote:

Trump is pro Israel, pro Christian and for individual rights


Congrats. you finally got one half right. Trump definitely is very Pro Israel. Ahem, you do understand that means that he has to be Anti-American at times to maintain his affirmative Pro Israel stance. Yeah I know. Details. And you started off that statement on the right track, but then had to mess it up with that Trump is pro individual rights goobligook. He's openly admitted that he's jealous of Dictators and despots in that he can't just arbitrarily squash individual rights at his whim. The US Press Corp also says HELLO.


oldlakerfan wrote:
Trump is against authoritarian policies that limit our 1st and 2nd amendment rights.
.


Trump. Champion of the Free Press. Thanks for the laugh. That's priceless. And Trump supports policies that make it easier to incarcerate Americans, yet somehow that's less authoritarian? On what planet? And Trump is indeed a YUGE supporter of the NRA, the organisation that just got exposed for being infiltrated and influenced by a Russian Spy. Hmmmm, What would the Russians gain by suggesting the NRA stand on a platform of supporting policies that assure more Americans kill one another and foment unrest? I just can't quite put my finger on it?
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Last edited by Aussiesuede on Fri Dec 14, 2018 11:35 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 11:31 am    Post subject:

oldlakerfan wrote:


Of course this is supposed to be about Russian collusion which we still don't have any proof of yet.


They've uncovered so many crimes in the meantime that it may take years to get back to that part of the investigation
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 11:55 am    Post subject:

oldlakerfan wrote:
Aussiesuede wrote:
jodeke wrote:
ChefLinda wrote:
jodeke wrote:
Is this a case of plausible deniability? It won't stray me but it most likely will his supporters.

Trump says he never told former lawyer Michael Cohen to break the law

LINK


Quote:
The President did not dispute directing Cohen to make payments to women who accused him of having an affair in order to keep them quiet, but said he did not direct Cohen to break the law while doing so.
"I never directed Michael Cohen to break the law. He was a lawyer and he is supposed to know the law," Trump tweeted.
"It is called 'advice of counsel,' and a lawyer has great liability if a mistake is made," he added.


1) There is already a Cohen tape of him contradicting this claim.
2) The newer story placing him in the room with Cohen and National Enquirer supersedes this story and blows his crap lie out of the water.
3) The prosecutors and judges have the goods so it doesn't matter what lies he tells on twitter.
4) After the fact, the Trump Organization created a fraudulent account to repay the money to Cohen in installments and label it "consulting fees." This is fraud, money laundering and tax evasion. That's on top of the illegal campaign donation.


But..But..But, He didn't know it was against the law. Michael should have told him it was illegal. It's Michael's fault, not his. Idiot 101


Everyone seems to be missing a very salient point to what happened last friday.

#1. A Federal Prosecutor filed a motion in which he stated that he had EVIDENCE that Individual One committed a felony.

#2. Michael Cohen admitted guilt to committing that felony.

#3. The federal prosecutor can't just rely on the word of Michael Cohen. They have to collect evidence corroborating what he has told them and the rules of evidence require that they can NOT tell a Judge that they have such evidence unless they actually do have such evidence.

#4. Any time you pay somebody to commit a felony on your behalf, legally, you have effectively also committed the same felony.

#5. That's why Trump is saying he didn't tell Cohen to make the payments on his behalf. But the prosecutors can't tell the judge they have corroborating evidence (which they have told the judge) unless they do indeed have corroborating evidence.

#6 The rules of evidence also REQUIRE that prosecutors MUST do something with that evidence once it becomes known to them. The fact that the included the fact that they have Evidence against Individual One means they have no choice but to act upon said evidence.

Trumps goose was officially cooked at the very moment on Friday that Federal Prosecutors made the filing. There is no way out. And the fact that Individual One wasn't charged at the same time is a GREAT indicator that more charges are coming and will be filed together. The only question is the "How" of the matter since they have to deal with the justice Dept memorandum on procedure in this regard.


There are many such as Andrew McCarthy the do not believe that Cohen pleaded to a crime. Remember this plea has not be tried in court. Paying someone off before you were a candidate with funds that ultimately come out of you own wealth is going to be pretty hard to prosecute. Also Obama was had a FEC violation and was only fined 375K. He also paid 150k in hush money to that bigot preacher Rev Wright.

Of course this is supposed to be about Russian collusion which we still don't have any proof of yet.


We do have proof of delusion though
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 11:57 am    Post subject:

This is just (bleep) crazy.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 12:24 pm    Post subject:

oldlakerfan wrote:


There are many such as Andrew McCarthy the do not believe that Cohen pleaded to a crime. Remember this plea has not be tried in court. Paying someone off before you were a candidate with funds that ultimately come out of you own wealth is going to be pretty hard to prosecute. Also Obama was had a FEC violation and was only fined 375K. He also paid 150k in hush money to that bigot preacher Rev Wright.

Of course this is supposed to be about Russian collusion which we still don't have any proof of yet.


You do realise that Michael Cohen has already been sentenced. The judge just gave him 3 years in prison after HE PLEADED GUILTY to a CRIME. That crime was a payoff DURING Trumps candidacy, and at the express direction of Trump. Prosecutors have evidence of the CRIME, as well as a felony being committed by "Individual One".

Quote:
Michael D. Cohen, a former lawyer for President Trump, was sentenced to three years in prison on Wednesday after denouncing Mr. Trump and explaining that “I felt it was my duty to cover up his dirty deeds.”

Mr. Cohen gave an emotional apology to the court for his involvement in a hush-money scandal that could threaten the Trump presidency — a scheme to buy the silence of two women who said they had affairs with Mr. Trump to protect his chances before the 2016 election. Mr. Cohen said his blind loyalty to Mr. Trump led him to ignore “my own inner voice and my moral compass.”

The sentencing in federal court in Manhattan capped a startling fall for Mr. Cohen, 52, who had once hoped to work by Mr. Trump’s side in the White House but ended up a central figure in the inquiry into payments to an adult-film star and a former Playboy model before the 2016 election.


Cohen Get's 3 Years in Prison

So is Fox news really not even covering these string of guilty pleas, because that's the only way anyone not living under a rock would not know these things.
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Last edited by Aussiesuede on Fri Dec 14, 2018 12:31 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 12:25 pm    Post subject:

ChefLinda wrote:
oldlakerfan wrote:
jodeke wrote:
Can a sitting president be drug tested.


Now I don't think that would have been to good for Obama


You add absolutely ZERO to this discussion -- every single time. It's a talent.


Yeah, in fact, after many, many interactions with oldlakerfan: 1) Posting absolutely silly arguments that are clearly either insane or intentional trolls; 2) Never engaging in the discourse that follows in any meaningful way; and 3) Never altering his position on the basis of refuting evidence with which he's presented (or formulating his arguments at all without cherry-picking only what agrees with his internal narrative), it's time for this to stop.

OLF, we welcome your presence and participation here. We welcome a productive and reasonable dialog. We do not welcome what I described above, and we've seen enough from you to have a clear idea where this is headed. Consider this a final warning to engage in a productive dialog with us. We'd love for you to do that. Failing that, we'd welcome you self-selecting not to participate in this thread at all, while enjoying the remainder of this site. But any more of what I described above will end your tenure here.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 12:34 pm    Post subject:

I found this to be informative and a useful guide to use as a refresher for what could and could not be charged and why:

Conspiracy! Treason! Espionage! FARA?: Your guide to laws for l'Affaire Russe


Regarding Treason, and treason only, here is a snippet:

Quote:
Treason (U.S. Constitution, Article III, Section 3; 18 U.S.C. §2381)

Let’s get this one out of the way first, because people get very excited about it. Collusion with Russia to influence the outcome of an American presidential election is quite probably, in layman’s terms, “treasonous”. But it isn’t treason in the legal sense, which “shall consist only in levying war against [the United States], or in adhering to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort.”

Two hundred years of jurisprudence agree; “enemies” here specifically requires we actually be at war. It doesn’t matter that we’re philosophical opponents of Russia. It doesn’t matter that Russia has tried to interfere with the working processes of our government. It doesn’t matter that Mueller, or anyone else, has described Russian activity as “cyber warfare”. We are not at war with Russia, and so they are not our “enemies” for the purpose of a treason charge.

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2018/12/14/1819124/-Conspiracy-Treason-Espionage-FARA-Your-guide-to-laws-for-l-Affaire-Russe
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 12:42 pm    Post subject:

Aussiesuede wrote:
oldlakerfan wrote:


Essentially, a bunch of useless pap

Essentially, some very sound points


Well done Aussiesude!
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 1:00 pm    Post subject:

The family of grifters:

Trump’s Inauguration Paid Trump’s Company — With Ivanka in the Middle

Quote:
As the inaugural committee planned the landmark celebration, internal concerns were raised about whether Trump’s Washington hotel was overcharging for event space. The spending could be a violation of the law.


Quote:
When it came out this year that President Donald Trump’s inaugural committee raised and spent unprecedented amounts, people wondered where all that money went.

It turns out one beneficiary was Trump himself.

The inauguration paid the Trump Organization for rooms, meals and event space at the company’s Washington hotel, according to interviews as well as internal emails and receipts reviewed by WNYC and ProPublica.

During the planning, Ivanka Trump, the president-elect’s eldest daughter and a senior executive with the Trump Organization, was involved in negotiating the price the hotel charged the 58th Presidential Inaugural Committee for venue rentals.A top inaugural planner emailed Ivanka and others at the company to “express my concern” that the hotel was overcharging for its event spaces, worrying of what would happen “when this is audited.”


Quote:
On Thursday, The Wall Street Journal reported that federal prosecutors in New York have opened a criminal investigation into whether the inaugural committee misspent money and whether donors gave in return for political favors, citing people familiar with the matter. In addition, The New York Times reported that prosecutors are examining whether foreigners illegally funnelled money to the inauguration.


And earlier this year there was a report that one of the event planners that received a large chunk of the money that also seemed like overcharging, was a good friend Melania's, and had no prior experience planning this kind of event.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 1:16 pm    Post subject:

Trump's empire is built on a mountain of NDAs too.

Most politicians who became Presidents in the modern era could not rely on NDAs b/c they were often in public office before they became President.

So Trump probably believed a wall built with mountains of NDAs would insulate him from all the crookery and treachery he engaged in. Of course they are not.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 4:36 pm    Post subject:

oldlakerfan wrote:
jodeke wrote:
Can a sitting president be drug tested.


Now I don't think that would have been to good for Obama


pls explain
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 4:49 pm    Post subject:

ChefLinda wrote:
oldlakerfan wrote:
jodeke wrote:
Can a sitting president be drug tested.


Now I don't think that would have been to good for Obama


You add absolutely ZERO to this discussion -- every single time. It's a talent.

I stopped responding to olf long time ago. I use a method taught, if you ignore it maybe it will go away.

It's disturbing, a sitting president crushes and snorts Adderall and it's accepted. It seems to be known by many in high offices. To date the moniker Teflon Don fits. The wall are closing in. Mueller is backing Trump into a corner. His personality says he'll strike back. That alarms me.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 5:07 pm    Post subject:

oldlakerfan wrote:
He also paid 150k in hush money to that bigot preacher Rev Wright.


A Trump supporter calling someone else a bigot.
You can either be a Trump supporter or you can take the moral high ground. You can't do both. Talk about having your cake and eating it too.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 5:44 pm    Post subject:

The Weekly Standard will shut down, after 23 years of existence.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 6:07 pm    Post subject:

BREAKING NEWS: Federal judge in Texas declares Obamacare unconstitutional.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 6:33 pm    Post subject:

Wilt wrote:
<b>BREAKING NEWS</b>: Federal judge in Texas declares Obamacare unconstitutional.


LINK to article
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 7:09 pm    Post subject:

Wilt wrote:
<b>BREAKING NEWS</b>: Federal judge in Texas declares Obamacare unconstitutional.


Almost everyone thinks it's a weak ruling and will be reversed on appeal. People in the know (health care/policy/gov't experts) think even SCOTUS would uphold ACA if it came to that. Roberts doesn't want his legacy to be taking healthcare away from 20 million people. And the 5 justices who upheld it last time are all still on the court.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 7:13 pm    Post subject:

oldlakerfan wrote:
Trump is against authoritarian policies that limit our 1st...amendment rights.


Dude.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 7:22 pm    Post subject:

Wilt wrote:
<b>BREAKING NEWS</b>: Federal judge in Texas declares Obamacare unconstitutional.


When a story starts with: "Federal judge in Texas declares", you pretty much just stop taking anything that follows seriously just as you would reading a story that starts with: "A Pedophile in Florida suggests". What follows those openings is most often going to be complete utter nonsense...
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 8:38 pm    Post subject:

non-player zealot wrote:
oldlakerfan wrote:
Trump is against authoritarian policies that limit our 1st...amendment rights.


Dude.


Right?
.
I'm stunned that anyone would make such an obviously preposterous statement. The level of irony is stupefying.

"The press is the enemy of the people."

-Donald Trump

That is literally an authoritarian advocating the subversion first amendment rights.

Olf is lucky that the mods here are so lenient
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Last edited by DaMuleRules on Fri Dec 14, 2018 8:48 pm; edited 2 times in total
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 8:40 pm    Post subject:

ChefLinda wrote:
oldlakerfan wrote:
jodeke wrote:
Can a sitting president be drug tested.


Now I don't think that would have been to good for Obama


You add absolutely ZERO to this discussion -- every single time. It's a talent.


There's no talent at all. Just mindless BS.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 8:44 pm    Post subject:

Huey Lewis & The News wrote:
oldlakerfan wrote:
jodeke wrote:
Can a sitting president be drug tested.


Now I don't think that would have been to good for Obama


pls explain


He’s telling you he’s a virulent racist. And he needs your attention.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 9:03 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
Huey Lewis & The News wrote:
oldlakerfan wrote:
jodeke wrote:
Can a sitting president be drug tested.


Now I don't think that would have been to good for Obama


pls explain


He’s telling you he’s a virulent racist. And he needs your attention.


oh I know, I just wanted him to impale himself a bit further
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 10:45 pm    Post subject:

ChefLinda wrote:
Wilt wrote:
<b><b>BREAKING NEWS</b></b>: Federal judge in Texas declares Obamacare unconstitutional.


Almost everyone thinks it's a weak ruling and will be reversed on appeal. People in the know (health care/policy/gov't experts) think even SCOTUS would uphold ACA if it came to that. Roberts doesn't want his legacy to be taking healthcare away from 20 million people. And the 5 justices who upheld it last time are all still on the court.

Right. If Roberts wanted to overturn ACA, he'd have done so in Sebelius. This is a clever lawsuit but it's also pretty weak on the facts; much weaker than Sebelius where Roberts' reasoning to support it was pretty contrived. I can't imagine him reversing.
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