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jodeke
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 1:07 pm    Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:
jodeke wrote:
Dems have to regroup. They didn't see the hand writing on the wall. When Trump was making the outlandish statements his poll numbers didn't fall. Dems seem to think it meant nothing.

I had a feeling it did. Which is why I kept re-posting the Dewey defeats Truman headline.

I voiced concern when the first two states went Trump. I knew they carried few electoral votes but I just couldn't shake the feeling,

I'm a Dem and feel we have to do a overhaul. During the campaign I thought it was the Republicans that would have to do that.

I'm going to wait and see what kind of policies Trump tries to implement. I hope he moves away from his campaign rhetoric.

It probably won't do anygood but I can see motion for a vote of no confidence a possibility if Trump acts on his campaign platform.


A lot of us could see the train coming. I saw a lot of premature celebration that HRC would be the next president when votes weren't even cast yet. All they had were polls which themselves are flawed since they only take a small number of volunteers to represent how people might vote.

Another thing I said during the campaign, I had little faith in polls. I kept getting FiveThirtyEight, Gallup and Nate Silver predictions. I truly wish they were right and my gut was just gut. I've doubled my Xanax order for the next four years.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 1:17 pm    Post subject:

governator wrote:
ribeye wrote:
adkindo wrote:
ribeye wrote:
Barack received 7,854,285 votes in Cali (60.24%) and 4,485,741 (63.35%), in NY. Hillary, thus far, has received 7,230,669 votes in Cali (61.6%) and 4,143,874 (58.8%), in NY.

Eyeballin', as a percentage, Barack received a slightly higher percentage of votes in those states--somewhere just beyond a point.

Recent totals per Wiki: Trump, Popular vote: 61,958,044 (46.56%); Hillary: 63,640,193 (47.83%)

Hillary's lead is nearly 1.6M.

Trump, thus far, has received 46.56% of the popular vote and 56.88% of the electoral vote.


Why does it matter? A candidate would run a totally different campaign if the goal was to get the most overall votes.


Yep. Donald could win more popular votes in some states by changing tactics. That could also affect the popular votes in those states he previously campaigned in. Zero sum gain? Dunno.


yeah, trump won fair and square (within the game)... move on

focus on what DNC gonna do instead


Yes, the Donald won fair and square--that is if blatant and repeated lying, having Russia, Wikileaks and the FBI against you is fair and square.

The point is not to belabor who won, but to understand exactly what happened, so as not to overreact and over-correct, to try to figure what is best in order. As this thread shows, Democrats don't seem to agree on that solution.

Oddly, Republicans went through this four years ago and they decided they needed to branch out to recruit minorities, particularly Latinos and Hispanics, yet they did just the opposite, and won "fair and square."
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jodeke
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 1:20 pm    Post subject:

I'm concerned with two two things the incoming administration has to address.

1) Obama care. Will they repeal it or make adjustments to it? I think the right path is to make adjustments. Millions will be affected if the plan is scrapped completely.

2) Business interest conflicts. Will he divorce himself of his businesses as he campaigned Hillary should have relating to her foundation?

As President he'll be in a decision making position to greatly enhance his business interests monetarily with foreign leaders.
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Last edited by jodeke on Mon Nov 21, 2016 1:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
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lakerjoshua
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 1:21 pm    Post subject:

ribeye wrote:
governator wrote:
ribeye wrote:
adkindo wrote:
ribeye wrote:
Barack received 7,854,285 votes in Cali (60.24%) and 4,485,741 (63.35%), in NY. Hillary, thus far, has received 7,230,669 votes in Cali (61.6%) and 4,143,874 (58.8%), in NY.

Eyeballin', as a percentage, Barack received a slightly higher percentage of votes in those states--somewhere just beyond a point.

Recent totals per Wiki: Trump, Popular vote: 61,958,044 (46.56%); Hillary: 63,640,193 (47.83%)

Hillary's lead is nearly 1.6M.

Trump, thus far, has received 46.56% of the popular vote and 56.88% of the electoral vote.


Why does it matter? A candidate would run a totally different campaign if the goal was to get the most overall votes.


Yep. Donald could win more popular votes in some states by changing tactics. That could also affect the popular votes in those states he previously campaigned in. Zero sum gain? Dunno.


yeah, trump won fair and square (within the game)... move on

focus on what DNC gonna do instead


Yes, the Donald won fair and square--that is if blatant and repeated lying, having Russia, Wikileaks and the FBI against you is fair and square.

The point is not to belabor who won, but to understand exactly what happened, so as not to overreact and over-correct, to try to figure what is best in order. As this thread shows, Democrats don't seem to agree on that solution.

Oddly, Republicans went through this four years ago and they decided they needed to branch out to recruit minorities, particularly Latinos and Hispanics, yet they did just the opposite, and won "fair and square."


Not quite yet (just an opinion article but it is a good read none the less)

Quote:
Donald Trump was not elected on November 8. Under the Constitution, the real election will occur on December 19. That’s when the electors in each state cast their votes.


Quote:
It is “desirable,” Alexander Hamilton wrote in Federalist 68, “that the sense of the people should operate in the choice of” president. But is “equally desirable, that the immediate election should be made by men most capable of analyzing the qualities adapted to the station.” These “men”—the electors––would be “most likely to possess the information and discernment requisite to such complicated investigations.” And because of their discernment—because they possessed wisdom that the people as a whole might not—“the office of President will never fall to the lot of any man who is not in an eminent degree endowed with the requisite qualifications.”

As Michael Signer explains, the framers were particularly afraid of the people choosing a demagogue. The electors, Hamilton believed, would prevent someone with “talents for low intrigue, and the little arts of popularity” from becoming president. And they would combat “the desire in foreign powers to gain an improper ascendant in our councils.” They would prevent America’s adversaries from meddling in its elections. The founders created the Electoral College, in other words, in part to prevent the election of someone like Donald Trump.


Good read on the Electorial College
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 1:27 pm    Post subject:

jodeke wrote:
I'm concerned with two two things the incoming administration has to address.

1) Obama care. Will they repeal it or make adjustments to it? I think the right path is to make adjustments. Millions will be affected if the plan is scrapped completely.

2) Business interest conflicts. Will he divorce himself of his businesses as he campaigned Hillary should have relating to her foundation?

As President he'll be in a decision making position to greatly enhance his business interests monetarily with foreign leaders.


Trump has said there are some good thing about it that he would like to keep. He's not going to scrap it. I believe the 2 things so far are the age limit for staying on your parents' insurance and the previous illnesses.

Of course, its still not good enough for his detractors. Now they're saying he's flip flopping where I say, at least he's trying to work with it.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 1:30 pm    Post subject:

LakerSanity wrote:
adkindo wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
Keith Ellison for DNC Chair? They can't be serious.

http://www.latimes.com/politics/essential/la-pol-ca-essential-politics-updates-keith-ellison-who-might-be-the-next-1479495275-htmlstory.html


On the surface, it would seem to be doubling down or getting a bigger shovel...most liberals consider him a little too liberal.


Its only doubling down if you think that Hillary lost because she was too liberal. If, like me, you believe that had little to do with her losing, Keith Ellison would actually be a shift away from the likes of Hillary.


Like many, I have been wrong in most of my political predictions recently....but as a Conservative, I would love if the DNC goes with Ellison. I just do not see that as a step in the direction of winning back states like Michigan, Ohio and PA.....but maybe just another example of my political miscalculation.
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governator
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 1:32 pm    Post subject:

frijolero01 wrote:
jodeke wrote:
I'm concerned with two two things the incoming administration has to address.

1) Obama care. Will they repeal it or make adjustments to it? I think the right path is to make adjustments. Millions will be affected if the plan is scrapped completely.

2) Business interest conflicts. Will he divorce himself of his businesses as he campaigned Hillary should have relating to her foundation?

As President he'll be in a decision making position to greatly enhance his business interests monetarily with foreign leaders.


Trump has said there are some good thing about it that he would like to keep. He's not going to scrap it. I believe the 2 things so far are the age limit for staying on your parents' insurance and the previous illnesses.

Of course, its still not good enough for his detractors. Now they're saying he's flip flopping where I say, at least he's trying to work with it.


To financially cover for 26 under parents and pre-existing conditions, you need the healthy young people to contribute to the pool aka the mandate.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 1:35 pm    Post subject:

ribeye wrote:
governator wrote:
ribeye wrote:
adkindo wrote:
ribeye wrote:
Barack received 7,854,285 votes in Cali (60.24%) and 4,485,741 (63.35%), in NY. Hillary, thus far, has received 7,230,669 votes in Cali (61.6%) and 4,143,874 (58.8%), in NY.

Eyeballin', as a percentage, Barack received a slightly higher percentage of votes in those states--somewhere just beyond a point.

Recent totals per Wiki: Trump, Popular vote: 61,958,044 (46.56%); Hillary: 63,640,193 (47.83%)

Hillary's lead is nearly 1.6M.

Trump, thus far, has received 46.56% of the popular vote and 56.88% of the electoral vote.


Why does it matter? A candidate would run a totally different campaign if the goal was to get the most overall votes.


Yep. Donald could win more popular votes in some states by changing tactics. That could also affect the popular votes in those states he previously campaigned in. Zero sum gain? Dunno.


yeah, trump won fair and square (within the game)... move on

focus on what DNC gonna do instead


Yes, the Donald won fair and square--that is if blatant and repeated lying, having Russia, Wikileaks and the FBI against you is fair and square.

The point is not to belabor who won, but to understand exactly what happened, so as not to overreact and over-correct, to try to figure what is best in order. As this thread shows, Democrats don't seem to agree on that solution.

Oddly, Republicans went through this four years ago and they decided they needed to branch out to recruit minorities, particularly Latinos and Hispanics, yet they did just the opposite, and won "fair and square."


I am not sure comparing Hillary's vote totals to Obama's says much considering both Romney and McCain received more votes than Trump and lost.....except this was just a lower turnout election, which is about the only thing that I expected to happen that actually happened. Most voters did not see the candidates as inspirational.
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adkindo
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 1:36 pm    Post subject:

governator wrote:
frijolero01 wrote:
jodeke wrote:
I'm concerned with two two things the incoming administration has to address.

1) Obama care. Will they repeal it or make adjustments to it? I think the right path is to make adjustments. Millions will be affected if the plan is scrapped completely.

2) Business interest conflicts. Will he divorce himself of his businesses as he campaigned Hillary should have relating to her foundation?

As President he'll be in a decision making position to greatly enhance his business interests monetarily with foreign leaders.


Trump has said there are some good thing about it that he would like to keep. He's not going to scrap it. I believe the 2 things so far are the age limit for staying on your parents' insurance and the previous illnesses.

Of course, its still not good enough for his detractors. Now they're saying he's flip flopping where I say, at least he's trying to work with it.


To financially cover for 26 under parents and pre-existing conditions, you need the healthy young people to contribute to the pool aka the mandate.


and I just dont see GOP going for the mandate....it was always the problem for Conservatives.
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governator
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 1:37 pm    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
governator wrote:
frijolero01 wrote:
jodeke wrote:
I'm concerned with two two things the incoming administration has to address.

1) Obama care. Will they repeal it or make adjustments to it? I think the right path is to make adjustments. Millions will be affected if the plan is scrapped completely.

2) Business interest conflicts. Will he divorce himself of his businesses as he campaigned Hillary should have relating to her foundation?

As President he'll be in a decision making position to greatly enhance his business interests monetarily with foreign leaders.


Trump has said there are some good thing about it that he would like to keep. He's not going to scrap it. I believe the 2 things so far are the age limit for staying on your parents' insurance and the previous illnesses.

Of course, its still not good enough for his detractors. Now they're saying he's flip flopping where I say, at least he's trying to work with it.


To financially cover for 26 under parents and pre-existing conditions, you need the healthy young people to contribute to the pool aka the mandate.


and I just dont see GOP going for the mandate....it was always the problem for Conservatives.


they might repeal it anyway just to get Obama's name out of ACA
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 1:38 pm    Post subject:

frijolero01 wrote:
jodeke wrote:
I'm concerned with two two things the incoming administration has to address.

1) Obama care. Will they repeal it or make adjustments to it? I think the right path is to make adjustments. Millions will be affected if the plan is scrapped completely.

2) Business interest conflicts. Will he divorce himself of his businesses as he campaigned Hillary should have relating to her foundation?

As President he'll be in a decision making position to greatly enhance his business interests monetarily with foreign leaders.


Trump has said there are some good thing about it that he would like to keep. He's not going to scrap it. I believe the 2 things so far are the age limit for staying on your parents' insurance and the previous illnesses.

Of course, its still not good enough for his detractors. Now they're saying he's flip flopping where I say, at least he's trying to work with it.


Things like this are what make Trump so puzzling. He says one thing but will turn at the drop of a hat. It also gives me hope he may do the right thing in a lot of cases.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 1:44 pm    Post subject:

Well his VP says a repeal is what they are focusing on

http://www.politico.com/tipsheets/politico-pulse/2016/11/trump-to-prioritize-obamacare-repeal-insurer-mega-merger-trials-get-underway-how-cmmi-could-survive-217513

Quote:
"Decisions have been made by the president-elect that he wants to focus out of the gate on repealing Obamacare and beginning the process of replacing Obamacare with the kind of free-market solutions that he campaigned on," Pence said.


I'm sure this "free-market solution" will be the best. Yuge, yuge healthcare!
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 1:46 pm    Post subject:

governator wrote:
adkindo wrote:
governator wrote:
frijolero01 wrote:
jodeke wrote:
I'm concerned with two two things the incoming administration has to address.

1) Obama care. Will they repeal it or make adjustments to it? I think the right path is to make adjustments. Millions will be affected if the plan is scrapped completely.

2) Business interest conflicts. Will he divorce himself of his businesses as he campaigned Hillary should have relating to her foundation?

As President he'll be in a decision making position to greatly enhance his business interests monetarily with foreign leaders.


Trump has said there are some good thing about it that he would like to keep. He's not going to scrap it. I believe the 2 things so far are the age limit for staying on your parents' insurance and the previous illnesses.

Of course, its still not good enough for his detractors. Now they're saying he's flip flopping where I say, at least he's trying to work with it.


To financially cover for 26 under parents and pre-existing conditions, you need the healthy young people to contribute to the pool aka the mandate.


and I just dont see GOP going for the mandate....it was always the problem for Conservatives.


they might repeal it anyway just to get Obama's name out of ACA

That would cutting off your nose to spite your face. I hope cooler heads will prevail and they'll do what's best for the people and put the party second for a change.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 1:54 pm    Post subject:

jodeke wrote:
governator wrote:
adkindo wrote:
governator wrote:
frijolero01 wrote:
jodeke wrote:
I'm concerned with two two things the incoming administration has to address.

1) Obama care. Will they repeal it or make adjustments to it? I think the right path is to make adjustments. Millions will be affected if the plan is scrapped completely.

2) Business interest conflicts. Will he divorce himself of his businesses as he campaigned Hillary should have relating to her foundation?

As President he'll be in a decision making position to greatly enhance his business interests monetarily with foreign leaders.


Trump has said there are some good thing about it that he would like to keep. He's not going to scrap it. I believe the 2 things so far are the age limit for staying on your parents' insurance and the previous illnesses.

Of course, its still not good enough for his detractors. Now they're saying he's flip flopping where I say, at least he's trying to work with it.


To financially cover for 26 under parents and pre-existing conditions, you need the healthy young people to contribute to the pool aka the mandate.


and I just dont see GOP going for the mandate....it was always the problem for Conservatives.


they might repeal it anyway just to get Obama's name out of ACA

That would cutting off your nose to spite your face. I hope cooler heads will prevail and they'll do what's best for the people and put the party second for a change.


they know all of that, and still try to repeal it 60 times. They have their republican president now so I hope you're right
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 2:18 pm    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
governator wrote:
frijolero01 wrote:
jodeke wrote:
I'm concerned with two two things the incoming administration has to address.

1) Obama care. Will they repeal it or make adjustments to it? I think the right path is to make adjustments. Millions will be affected if the plan is scrapped completely.

2) Business interest conflicts. Will he divorce himself of his businesses as he campaigned Hillary should have relating to her foundation?

As President he'll be in a decision making position to greatly enhance his business interests monetarily with foreign leaders.


Trump has said there are some good thing about it that he would like to keep. He's not going to scrap it. I believe the 2 things so far are the age limit for staying on your parents' insurance and the previous illnesses.

Of course, its still not good enough for his detractors. Now they're saying he's flip flopping where I say, at least he's trying to work with it.


To financially cover for 26 under parents and pre-existing conditions, you need the healthy young people to contribute to the pool aka the mandate.


and I just dont see GOP going for the mandate....it was always the problem for Conservatives.


Yep. If I were a betting man, I'd wager that they'll just trot out pretty much the exact plan that Paul Ryan released in June:


Paul Ryans Health 'Savings' Obamacare Replacement



Quote:
While the Ryan plan gets rid of the mandate to buy insurance, it otherwise has many provisions that will be familiar to people who know Obamacare. It would offer tax credits to help people pay for insurance. And it would protect people with existing illnesses and medical conditions from being dropped by their health plans.

The main difference from the Affordable Care Act reflects the conservative view that a market approach could make health care more efficient, and cheaper.

While the Ryan proposal is more detailed than many, it does lack some key information. Most importantly, the size of the subsidies that would be offered is unknown, as is the level of insurance that would be tied to them.

Obamacare bases its financial assistance on a policy that pays a set percentage of a person's health care costs and that carries a minimum set of benefits. Ryan has only hinted at what level of insurance coverage his subsidies are expected to buy.

But a major aim of his overhaul is to move people to insurance policies that carry high deductibles. To pay those deductibles and other health care costs, people would have tax-free health savings accounts. The individual, government or employer could contribute to such an account.


Vision for Obamacare Replacement
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 2:30 pm    Post subject:

There is only one viable replacement and that is single payer....all the other options like a HSA are a huge joke on the middle class.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 2:31 pm    Post subject:

trmiv wrote:
Well his VP says a repeal is what they are focusing on

http://www.politico.com/tipsheets/politico-pulse/2016/11/trump-to-prioritize-obamacare-repeal-insurer-mega-merger-trials-get-underway-how-cmmi-could-survive-217513

Quote:
"Decisions have been made by the president-elect that he wants to focus out of the gate on repealing Obamacare and beginning the process of replacing Obamacare with the kind of free-market solutions that he campaigned on," Pence said.


I'm sure this "free-market solution" will be the best. Yuge, yuge healthcare!


The free market solution was a disaster and that is why they came up with the ACA.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 2:45 pm    Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:
There is only one viable replacement and that is single payer....all the other options like a HSA are a huge joke on themiddle class.


Even if the federal government deposits money directly in to peoples HSA?
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 2:47 pm    Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:
trmiv wrote:
Well his VP says a repeal is what they are focusing on

http://www.politico.com/tipsheets/politico-pulse/2016/11/trump-to-prioritize-obamacare-repeal-insurer-mega-merger-trials-get-underway-how-cmmi-could-survive-217513

Quote:
"Decisions have been made by the president-elect that he wants to focus out of the gate on repealing Obamacare and beginning the process of replacing Obamacare with the kind of free-market solutions that he campaigned on," Pence said.


I'm sure this "free-market solution" will be the best. Yuge, yuge healthcare!


The free market solution was a disaster and that is why they came up with the ACA.


I bet the vast majority of the public not receiving subsidies would much prefer a return to pre ACA healthcare market.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 2:48 pm    Post subject:

dont_be_a_wuss wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
There is only one viable replacement and that is single payer....all the other options like a HSA are a huge joke on themiddle class.


Even if the federal government deposits money directly in to peoples HSA?


the size of this subsidy has to be large enough to replace the mandated $ from young healthy people (both actual insurance premiums + penalties)
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 2:49 pm    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
trmiv wrote:
Well his VP says a repeal is what they are focusing on

http://www.politico.com/tipsheets/politico-pulse/2016/11/trump-to-prioritize-obamacare-repeal-insurer-mega-merger-trials-get-underway-how-cmmi-could-survive-217513

Quote:
"Decisions have been made by the president-elect that he wants to focus out of the gate on repealing Obamacare and beginning the process of replacing Obamacare with the kind of free-market solutions that he campaigned on," Pence said.


I'm sure this "free-market solution" will be the best. Yuge, yuge healthcare!


The free market solution was a disaster and that is why they came up with the ACA.


I bet the vast majority of the public not receiving subsidies would much prefer a return to pre ACA healthcare market.


we would actually still be subsidizing those without health insurance via ER visits (thru tax payer payment for the ER)
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 2:52 pm    Post subject:

jodeke wrote:
frijolero01 wrote:
jodeke wrote:
I'm concerned with two two things the incoming administration has to address.

1) Obama care. Will they repeal it or make adjustments to it? I think the right path is to make adjustments. Millions will be affected if the plan is scrapped completely.

2) Business interest conflicts. Will he divorce himself of his businesses as he campaigned Hillary should have relating to her foundation?

As President he'll be in a decision making position to greatly enhance his business interests monetarily with foreign leaders.


Trump has said there are some good thing about it that he would like to keep. He's not going to scrap it. I believe the 2 things so far are the age limit for staying on your parents' insurance and the previous illnesses.

Of course, its still not good enough for his detractors. Now they're saying he's flip flopping where I say, at least he's trying to work with it.


Things like this are what make Trump so puzzling. He says one thing but will turn at the drop of a hat. It also gives me hope he may do the right thing in a lot of cases.


someone re-quoted a quote I think from John Dean during the election....to paraphrase...."his mind is like a seat cushion, it takes on the form of the last person that set their ass in it"
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adkindo
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 2:55 pm    Post subject:

governator wrote:
adkindo wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
trmiv wrote:
Well his VP says a repeal is what they are focusing on

http://www.politico.com/tipsheets/politico-pulse/2016/11/trump-to-prioritize-obamacare-repeal-insurer-mega-merger-trials-get-underway-how-cmmi-could-survive-217513

Quote:
"Decisions have been made by the president-elect that he wants to focus out of the gate on repealing Obamacare and beginning the process of replacing Obamacare with the kind of free-market solutions that he campaigned on," Pence said.


I'm sure this "free-market solution" will be the best. Yuge, yuge healthcare!


The free market solution was a disaster and that is why they came up with the ACA.


I bet the vast majority of the public not receiving subsidies would much prefer a return to pre ACA healthcare market.


we would actually still be subsidizing those without health insurance via ER visits (thru tax payer payment for the ER)


that is a much deeper discussion, and gets into the true failures of the ACA and/or most plans I have heard discussed from either party. Most neglect to address over utilization, and all the problems that actually drive health care costs.
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governator
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 2:59 pm    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
governator wrote:
adkindo wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
trmiv wrote:
Well his VP says a repeal is what they are focusing on

http://www.politico.com/tipsheets/politico-pulse/2016/11/trump-to-prioritize-obamacare-repeal-insurer-mega-merger-trials-get-underway-how-cmmi-could-survive-217513

Quote:
"Decisions have been made by the president-elect that he wants to focus out of the gate on repealing Obamacare and beginning the process of replacing Obamacare with the kind of free-market solutions that he campaigned on," Pence said.


I'm sure this "free-market solution" will be the best. Yuge, yuge healthcare!


The free market solution was a disaster and that is why they came up with the ACA.


I bet the vast majority of the public not receiving subsidies would much prefer a return to pre ACA healthcare market.


we would actually still be subsidizing those without health insurance via ER visits (thru tax payer payment for the ER)


that is a much deeper discussion, and gets into the true failures of the ACA and/or most plans I have heard discussed from either party. Most neglect to address over utilization, and all the problems that actually drive health care costs.


it actually has to shy away from profit driven model. Currently, all the players (health insurance industries, providers, hospitals, medical supply industries, etc) are making almost guaranteed profits. Opening health care insurance to complete free market will guaranteed continuation of profits. To control cost, you have to control all those industries which I think is impossible without single payer system
One way to curb the cost increase is to allow medicare as a whole unit to bargain for prescription prices/services (currently "it" is not allowed, only allowed to take the avg of bargained prices from private industries)


Last edited by governator on Mon Nov 21, 2016 3:01 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Aussiesuede
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 3:00 pm    Post subject:

governator wrote:
adkindo wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
trmiv wrote:
Well his VP says a repeal is what they are focusing on

http://www.politico.com/tipsheets/politico-pulse/2016/11/trump-to-prioritize-obamacare-repeal-insurer-mega-merger-trials-get-underway-how-cmmi-could-survive-217513

Quote:
"Decisions have been made by the president-elect that he wants to focus out of the gate on repealing Obamacare and beginning the process of replacing Obamacare with the kind of free-market solutions that he campaigned on," Pence said.


I'm sure this "free-market solution" will be the best. Yuge, yuge healthcare!


The free market solution was a disaster and that is why they came up with the ACA.


I bet the vast majority of the public not receiving subsidies would much prefer a return to pre ACA healthcare market.


we would actually still be subsidizing those without health insurance via ER visits (thru tax payer payment for the ER)


And that's exaclty what happens without a mandate, young & healthy individuals simply won't purchase insurance because they know that emergencies will be covered under Reagan's EMTALA guarantee.
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