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unleasHell
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 Posted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 9:02 pm Post subject: |
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| LakerLanny wrote: | So much story resolution between Walt and Hank in the first episode...not to mention I loved the opening showing the future.
Wow. Just wow. |
Cool episode, very powerful...
What was Walt retrieving from his house at the beginning? Ricin?
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 9:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Wilt wrote: | | I'm speechless. That last scene tonight. Flawless acting, incredible tension. I can't think of a scene so representative of an entire arch of a single show. And it's just the first episode. |
Seriously . . . "then maybe your best course is to tread lightly . . ."
Walter White. Serious bad ass. |
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 9:31 pm Post subject: |
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| LakerLanny wrote: | So much story resolution between Walt and Hank in the first episode...not to mention I loved the opening showing the future.
Wow. Just wow. |
I loved how he says hello to his neighbor and all is well in the next scene.
That's always been one of my favorite aspects of the show - those glimpses ahead. You're never sure what they mean or how they fit in, but you know something's coming. Two of the best have been the kid catching the tarantula and the floating teddy bear in the pool. |
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 9:31 pm Post subject: |
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| LakerLanny wrote: | So much story resolution between Walt and Hank in the first episode...not to mention I loved the opening showing the future.
Wow. Just wow. |
I loved how he says hello to his neighbor and all is well in the next scene.
That's always been one of my favorite aspects of the show - those glimpses ahead. You're never sure what they mean or how they fit in, but you know something's coming. Two of the best have been the kid catching the tarantula and the floating teddy bear in the pool. |
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 9:39 pm Post subject: |
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| unleasHell wrote: | | LakerLanny wrote: | So much story resolution between Walt and Hank in the first episode...not to mention I loved the opening showing the future.
Wow. Just wow. |
Cool episode, very powerful...
What was Walt retrieving from his house at the beginning? Ricin? |
Yep. That's the vial that was meant for Fring. It's also the vial that Jesse thought was in his cigarette and had poisoned Brock. Walt told him it was Fring who poisoned Brock. But we learned it was a plant that he got sick from . . . a plant that was in Walt's backyard. |
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Brandon98
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| Posted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 9:50 pm Post subject: |
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| I love how the inevitable confrontation with Hank/Walt finally came in the first episode. I figured it would take a few episodes of the two of them walking on egg shells with each other before the cat was finally out of the bag. We still don't know for sure if Hank's sold, but regardless, they got right to business with 7 episodes still to go. |
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 10:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Brandon98 wrote: | | I love how the inevitable confrontation with Hank/Walt finally came in the first episode. I figured it would take a few episodes of the two of them walking on egg shells with each other before the cat was finally out of the bag. We still don't know for sure if Hank's sold, but regardless, they got right to business with 7 episodes still to go. |
I watched "Talking Bad" and Vince Gilligan said that they wanted to get that confrontation right out there at the beginning. There's obviously a lot left to happen on that front. I'm wondering if the whole ricin retrieval thing may come into play in that regard. |
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GoldenThroat
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GoldenThroat
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| Posted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 10:22 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | Brandon98 wrote: | | I love how the inevitable confrontation with Hank/Walt finally came in the first episode. I figured it would take a few episodes of the two of them walking on egg shells with each other before the cat was finally out of the bag. We still don't know for sure if Hank's sold, but regardless, they got right to business with 7 episodes still to go. |
I watched "Talking Bad" and Vince Gilligan said that they wanted to get that confrontation right out there at the beginning. There's obviously a lot left to happen on that front. I'm wondering if the whole ricin retrieval thing may come into play in that regard. |
The ricin retrieval is interesting in context with his neighbor's shock, his cancer presumably in remission with his hair grown back, and the fact that he'd already been outed as Heisenberg, as evidenced by the graffiti in the house.
I don't think Hank's the reason for the ricin retrieval, because Walt's motive to kill him is because Hank can out him. That's obviously already happened in the flash forward. I think Walt kills Skylar. |
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Black Salt
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| Posted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 10:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Why would he kill Skylar? |
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GoldenThroat
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| Posted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 10:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Black Salt wrote: | | Why would he kill Skylar? |
I think that he's trying to regain a normal life, and it's possible that she doesn't fall back in love with him and leaves him, then he freaks out because in his mind he did all of this for her/them.
FWIW, in the flash forward that they did to start this season, where he's in the diner and has the New Hampshire plates, he has a driver's license where he uses the last name of Lambert, which is Skylar's maiden name.
It's just a hunch I have. I have no idea what's going to happen, which is part of what makes this show great. It could go in so many different directions. |
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Brandon98
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| Posted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 10:33 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | Brandon98 wrote: | | I love how the inevitable confrontation with Hank/Walt finally came in the first episode. I figured it would take a few episodes of the two of them walking on egg shells with each other before the cat was finally out of the bag. We still don't know for sure if Hank's sold, but regardless, they got right to business with 7 episodes still to go. |
I watched "Talking Bad" and Vince Gilligan said that they wanted to get that confrontation right out there at the beginning. There's obviously a lot left to happen on that front. I'm wondering if the whole ricin retrieval thing may come into play in that regard. |
I couldn't stop wondering about the ricin as well. I figured initially he may have gotten to a dark enough point where he's considered using it on Hank, but if he's already gone through the trouble of an identity change (plus the house repossession), then I'm sure Hank has let the entire DEA know by now. |
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 10:49 pm Post subject: |
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| GoldenThroat wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | Brandon98 wrote: | | I love how the inevitable confrontation with Hank/Walt finally came in the first episode. I figured it would take a few episodes of the two of them walking on egg shells with each other before the cat was finally out of the bag. We still don't know for sure if Hank's sold, but regardless, they got right to business with 7 episodes still to go. |
I watched "Talking Bad" and Vince Gilligan said that they wanted to get that confrontation right out there at the beginning. There's obviously a lot left to happen on that front. I'm wondering if the whole ricin retrieval thing may come into play in that regard. |
The ricin retrieval is interesting in context with his neighbor's shock, his cancer presumably in remission with his hair grown back, and the fact that he'd already been outed as Heisenberg, as evidenced by the graffiti in the house.
I don't think Hank's the reason for the ricin retrieval, because Walt's motive to kill him is because Hank can out him. That's obviously already happened in the flash forward. I think Walt kills Skylar. |
I could be wrong, but I'm not so sure that the Heisenberg graffiti is that specific. The house has been taken over as a skater hangout , and I'm wondering if the Heisenberg reference is just a coincidental shout out to the cook. And Walt is clearly still free. If it were to to the point that Hank had outed Walt, Walt would be in jail. I don't see Hank revealing Walt but not acting on that legally. It's not in Hank's blood.
I can see a situation where if Walt were in remission he might view Skylar as the last witness he needs to execute, but Skylar seems to be on board at this point. But, Jesse would certainly have to be killed first. He knows a whole lot more. And his death would definitely set Hanks wheels in motion. I don't see a situation where Hank would have cause to murder her. Though doing so would really serve Vince Gilligan's intent to tell the story of a guy who went completely bad. So you may be on to something.
I found Vince Gilligan's hint on Talking Bad to be very interesting. He referenced Lydia's mention of the parts starting to come apart now that Walt is "retired". |
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DaMuleRules
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| Posted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 10:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Brandon98 wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | Brandon98 wrote: | | I love how the inevitable confrontation with Hank/Walt finally came in the first episode. I figured it would take a few episodes of the two of them walking on egg shells with each other before the cat was finally out of the bag. We still don't know for sure if Hank's sold, but regardless, they got right to business with 7 episodes still to go. |
I watched "Talking Bad" and Vince Gilligan said that they wanted to get that confrontation right out there at the beginning. There's obviously a lot left to happen on that front. I'm wondering if the whole ricin retrieval thing may come into play in that regard. |
I couldn't stop wondering about the ricin as well. I figured initially he may have gotten to a dark enough point where he's considered using it on Hank, but if he's already gone through the trouble of an identity change (plus the house repossession), then I'm sure Hank has let the entire DEA know by now. |
The reason I think it may relate to Hank is that the flash forwards have always been pretty specific to the context they show up in. Walt believes he's going to die soon. He tells Hank to back off because of that, as he says, "what's the point?". If Walt goes into remission, suddenly Hank is a real issue with a whole ton of point. |
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GoldenThroat
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| Posted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 11:03 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | I could be wrong, but I'm not so sure that the Heisenberg graffiti is that specific. The house has been taken over as a skater hangout , and I'm wondering if the Heisenberg reference is just a coincidental shout out to the cook. And Walt is clearly still free. If it were to to the point that Hank had outed Walt, Walt would be in jail. I don't see Hank revealing Walt but not acting on that legally. It's not in Hank's blood.
I can see a situation where if Walt were in remission he might view Skylar as the last witness he needs to execute, but Skylar seems to be on board at this point. But, Jesse would certainly have to be killed first. He knows a whole lot more. And his death would definitely set Hanks wheels in motion. I don't see a situation where Hank would have cause to murder her. Though doing so would really serve Vince Gilligan's intent to tell the story of a guy who went completely bad. So you may be on to something.
I found Vince Gilligan's hint on Talking Bad to be very interesting. He referenced Lydia's mention of the parts starting to come apart now that Walt is "retired". |
I'm purposely avoiding Talking Bad, so forgive me for closing my eyes, sticking my fingers in my eyes, and saying LA LA LA LA LA! when I got to that point of your post. 
I don't think Hank necessarily outs Walt. Hank's in a no win situation, because even if he outs him, his DEA career is still over because this kingpin druglord has been under his nose the entire time. I just think that after Walt's outed...which seems to be the case in the flash forward, although I'm not 100% sure...there's no longer a reason for Walt to kill Hank. I don't think Hank necessarily outs him, but I do think the cat's out of the bag at that point and he's definitely on the run. (although probably from some other bad guys and/or Madrigal folks)
You're right that the Heisenberg graffiti could have just been a shout out to the cocinero, but that in conjunction with his neighbor's reaction to him tells me that people know exactly who he is at that point. Although he could have perhaps faked his own death or something along those lines, and that's why Carol was shocked to see him. |
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dont_be_a_wuss
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| Posted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 11:13 pm Post subject: |
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| DaMuleRules wrote: | | Brandon98 wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | Brandon98 wrote: | | I love how the inevitable confrontation with Hank/Walt finally came in the first episode. I figured it would take a few episodes of the two of them walking on egg shells with each other before the cat was finally out of the bag. We still don't know for sure if Hank's sold, but regardless, they got right to business with 7 episodes still to go. |
I watched "Talking Bad" and Vince Gilligan said that they wanted to get that confrontation right out there at the beginning. There's obviously a lot left to happen on that front. I'm wondering if the whole ricin retrieval thing may come into play in that regard. |
I couldn't stop wondering about the ricin as well. I figured initially he may have gotten to a dark enough point where he's considered using it on Hank, but if he's already gone through the trouble of an identity change (plus the house repossession), then I'm sure Hank has let the entire DEA know by now. |
The reason I think it may relate to Hank is that the flash forwards have always been pretty specific to the context they show up in. Walt believes he's going to die soon. He tells Hank to back off because of that, as he says, "what's the point?". If Walt goes into remission, suddenly Hank is a real issue with a whole ton of point. |
Rather than going to the police, perhaps Hank will go to the criminals, thinking it will work faster. There are probably a few out there who would like to kill him. |
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GoldenThroat
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| Posted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 11:20 pm Post subject: |
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| dont_be_a_wuss wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | Brandon98 wrote: | | DaMuleRules wrote: | | Brandon98 wrote: | | I love how the inevitable confrontation with Hank/Walt finally came in the first episode. I figured it would take a few episodes of the two of them walking on egg shells with each other before the cat was finally out of the bag. We still don't know for sure if Hank's sold, but regardless, they got right to business with 7 episodes still to go. |
I watched "Talking Bad" and Vince Gilligan said that they wanted to get that confrontation right out there at the beginning. There's obviously a lot left to happen on that front. I'm wondering if the whole ricin retrieval thing may come into play in that regard. |
I couldn't stop wondering about the ricin as well. I figured initially he may have gotten to a dark enough point where he's considered using it on Hank, but if he's already gone through the trouble of an identity change (plus the house repossession), then I'm sure Hank has let the entire DEA know by now. |
The reason I think it may relate to Hank is that the flash forwards have always been pretty specific to the context they show up in. Walt believes he's going to die soon. He tells Hank to back off because of that, as he says, "what's the point?". If Walt goes into remission, suddenly Hank is a real issue with a whole ton of point. |
Rather than going to the police, perhaps Hank will go to the criminals, thinking it will work faster. There are probably a few out there who would like to kill him. |
Good call. |
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Jeffs
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| Posted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 11:24 pm Post subject: |
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Don't forget that Walt also has that rifle in his trunk that he purchased at the beginning of the season. I get the feeling that the ricin and the rifle are not meant for the same person.
The house looks abandoned and torn apart, but I didn't see any police tape or any other indicators of a DEA raid. Maybe Walt is on the run from Madrigal (or whoever Lydia is working with overseas) rather than the authorities. I think that would explain the rifle moreso than Hank outing him.
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C M B
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| Posted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 11:52 pm Post subject: |
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All of my bets are on Walt losing everyone he sought to protect in the first place. The stars of the show have all described the series conclusion as "apocalyptic". That sounds like a liquidation to me. Ricin for Walt Jr., Skylar kills herself, I have no guess for what happens to the baby.
And Hank looks like he poured at least 30% of his body weight into that toilet between seasons.
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Wilt
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| Posted: Mon Aug 12, 2013 3:46 am Post subject: |
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Bryan Cranston directed the episode as well. What a talent.
I think Carol appeared to be shocked not because she knows that Walt is some criminal mastermind, but because she thinks Walt should be dead, but isn't.
The entire confrontation between Hank and Walt shouldn't have happened because both know that the evidence on Walt is rather weak. The book and GPS tracking would be inadmissible in court and/or are inconclusive at best. But Walt just HAD to be the smartest guy in the room and had to release his inner Heisenberg. If Hank really believes that Walt is Heisenberg, he knows Walt could kill him immediately or could have him killed, but he just had to punch that wimp Walt, whom he never respected in the first place. It was a perfect scene and a microcosm of the entire series.
I like the idea of Hank telling one of the cartels about Walt, so that they would have him killed. There's no way Hank would ever go to the police about the information he has now. There's a reason he brought all of the boxes to his house.
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numero-ocho
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| Posted: Mon Aug 12, 2013 6:37 am Post subject: |
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| Wilt wrote: |
The entire confrontation between Hank and Walt shouldn't have happened because both know that the evidence on Walt is rather weak. The book and GPS tracking would be inadmissible in court and/or are inconclusive at best. But Walt just HAD to be the smartest guy in the room and had to release his inner Heisenberg. If Hank really believes that Walt is Heisenberg, he knows Walt could kill him immediately or could have him killed, but he just had to punch that wimp Walt, whom he never respected in the first place. It was a perfect scene and a microcosm of the entire series.
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The book is just what finally opened Hank's eyes to what was right in front of his face the whole time. There was evidence linking Walt back to his involvement in the blue meth going back to season 1 when they first found the gas mask that was stolen from Walt's old school.
Walt knows that Hank may not be as smart as he is, but he knows Hank is good at his job. He's had first-hand knowledge of Hank's relentlessness and knowledge about Heisenberg and the blue meth business. Once he suspected Hank had the "Leaves of Grass" book and decided to check his car for the GPS tracker, he had to confront him to gauge his reaction. After their small talk, he realized by Hank's uncomfortable reaction that he did suspect him and was in the process of investigating him. It was only a matter of time before all the other clues that have been building up over the years fell into place. Hank had even less evidence to suspect Fring's involvement but Walt saw how he built that hunch into a solid case when no one else suspected him.
This confrontation had to happen.
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numero-ocho
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| Posted: Mon Aug 12, 2013 6:53 am Post subject: |
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| Jeffs wrote: | Don't forget that Walt also has that rifle in his trunk that he purchased at the beginning of the season. I get the feeling that the ricin and the rifle are not meant for the same person.
The house looks abandoned and torn apart, but I didn't see any police tape or any other indicators of a DEA raid. Maybe Walt is on the run from Madrigal (or whoever Lydia is working with overseas) rather than the authorities. I think that would explain the rifle moreso than Hank outing him. |
I'm guessing the poison is for Walt and the M60 is either for Declan's crew or Lydia's associates and that he's planning to make a Scarface, last stand with it. I just can't see how Walt would get close enough to anyone now to use the poison as it's only effective if the person doesn't know they've been poisoned.
I'm also guessing the house was seized either by the DEA or the IRS. It's possible that either Ted Benecke ratted out Skylar to the IRS or she and the kids went into witness protection and just abandoned it.
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cmonkee
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| Posted: Mon Aug 12, 2013 8:25 am Post subject: |
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I loved last night's episode. Agree with Wilt that Walt may have faked his death - maybe he finally used that "cleaner" that they didn't have the money for before? (since Skyler gave it to Ted).
Other things I noticed:
* Walt & Skyler wanting to buy more car washes - they're in the empire business!
* Walt channeling the mannerisms of Gus: his convo with Lydia at the car wash was just like the ones Gus used to have with Walt at Los Pollos Hermanos, and he even vomited in the bathroom like Gus (when he poisoned the Cartel) - sink on, folded towel in front of the toliet bowl. Weird thing though is that Walt never witnessed Gus doing this, so this was probably meant more for the viewers to make the connection.
* Jesse's changed so much - his complete detachment from Badger & Skinny Pete's Star Trek convo is the type of conversation he would have had a ton of fun with back in season 1
* Walt telling Jesse not to focus on the "darkness behind them"... and in that shot he's behind Jesse, in the dark, and out of focus.
* Jesse can be pretty bright at times, but he talks like a dumbass. He's the only other cook capable of matching the purity of Walt's meth (only 68% for Todd after months of drama-free cooks with Walt), and he's sharp enough to know that Walt killed Mike.
* Walt's not a very good liar - he always oversells his lies, and tends to use the word "Absolutely" when doing so.
* Hank didn't wash or flush. And what's up with using the Master Bathroom when you're a guest at someone else's house? |
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dont_be_a_wuss
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| Posted: Mon Aug 12, 2013 8:36 am Post subject: |
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| cmonkee wrote: | I loved last night's episode. Agree with Wilt that Walt may have faked his death - maybe he finally used that "cleaner" that they didn't have the money for before? (since Skyler gave it to Ted).
Other things I noticed:
* Walt & Skyler wanting to buy more car washes - they're in the empire business!
* Walt channeling the mannerisms of Gus: his convo with Lydia at the car wash was just like the ones Gus used to have with Walt at Los Pollos Hermanos, and he even vomited in the bathroom like Gus (when he poisoned the Cartel) - sink on, folded towel in front of the toliet bowl. Weird thing though is that Walt never witnessed Gus doing this, so this was probably meant more for the viewers to make the connection.
* Jesse's changed so much - his complete detachment from Badger & Skinny Pete's Star Trek convo is the type of conversation he would have had a ton of fun with back in season 1
* Walt telling Jesse not to focus on the "darkness behind them"... and in that shot he's behind Jesse, in the dark, and out of focus.
* Jesse can be pretty bright at times, but he talks like a dumbass. He's the only other cook capable of matching the purity of Walt's meth (only 68% for Todd after months of drama-free cooks with Walt), and he's sharp enough to know that Walt killed Mike.
* Walt's not a very good liar - he always oversells his lies, and tends to use the word "Absolutely" when doing so.
* Hank didn't wash or flush. And what's up with using the Master Bathroom when you're a guest at someone else's house? |
Also, Dean Norris lost 20 pounds while taking a dump. |
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dont_be_a_wuss
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| Posted: Mon Aug 12, 2013 8:40 am Post subject: |
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| numero-ocho wrote: | | Jeffs wrote: | Don't forget that Walt also has that rifle in his trunk that he purchased at the beginning of the season. I get the feeling that the ricin and the rifle are not meant for the same person.
The house looks abandoned and torn apart, but I didn't see any police tape or any other indicators of a DEA raid. Maybe Walt is on the run from Madrigal (or whoever Lydia is working with overseas) rather than the authorities. I think that would explain the rifle moreso than Hank outing him. |
I'm guessing the poison is for Walt and the M60 is either for Declan's crew or Lydia's associates and that he's planning to make a Scarface, last stand with it. I just can't see how Walt would get close enough to anyone now to use the poison as it's only effective if the person doesn't know they've been poisoned.
I'm also guessing the house was seized either by the DEA or the IRS. It's possible that either Ted Benecke ratted out Skylar to the IRS or she and the kids went into witness protection and just abandoned it. |
I was thinking about this, and the thing I was wondering is why ABQ? He said that was his final destination in 501. Maybe it was a pit stop for the ricin, but a scientist like him could probably make more ricin if it meant saving a few hundred miles drive. Who is (might be) in ABQ?
Hank is in ABQ - "tread lightly"
Jesse is in ABQ - Shows motif of boss killing #1 man. Tuco kills no doze, Gus kills Victor....Walt kills Jesse. (3 times makes a motif)
Everyone else is in Texas aren't they?
Also Walt has "tracer" rounds, which suggests he is going to be shooting from a far distance at night. |
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10 seconds of TV I've ever seen.
