Lakers Smokescreen Article, per Hoopsword...

AV · Starting Rotation Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 606

It's not LO hate, just out of all the laker pieces available he probably has the most value, so that's why his name comes up so often...we may get something for Mihm but nothing earth shattering, Bynum as well but it seems like the lakers are committed to him and his salary is quite small at the moment, so then that really leaves LO in terms of what needs to be moved in a "bigger" move....if LO stays that's fine give the team another year see how they do, I might not do that, but if that's what the lakers do it wouldn't be craziness....but if they do something big I just don't see how LO isn't involved

Dennis_D · Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 12:50 pm Post subject:

THE_SHOES · Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 12:52 pm Post subject:

ValisJason · Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 12:56 pm Post subject:

I certainly have no hate for Odom. Really admire than man and his game. At the end of last season I was giving much love to Odom. That being said, he was inconsistent offensively for most of the season, and I do have some doubt about whether, at his salary, he can be the second offensive player next to Kobe that the Lakers need to contend for a championship. I think that is entirely reasonable, Shoes. The Lakers need at least one 20 ppg player next to Kobe in order to contend. Plus a mix of other players that can consistently score double digits, play some solid defense, rebound, pass etc.

As Ive said all along, if the Lakers trade Odom it has to be for two starters. This deal potentially would give them that. Every other deal Ive heard does not do that (including the horrid GS Dunleavy deal, OY!). If you can turn Odom into two starters that can bring a mix of defense and scoring ... you have to consider it. Do I wish Tyson had some offensive ability? Yes. Do I wish his contract was not huge? yes. But in either case, if those things were true, the Lakers couldnt get him.

LakerSailor · Sixth Man Joined: 20 Mar 2006 Posts: 95

ValisJason · Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 12:58 pm Post subject:

And if you cant turn Odom into two starters, then keep him! Use the MLE and a Mihm package to trade for two starters: Banks and Miles, and then aim for a 50 win season next year. That team might even be better, record wise, than a team with Roy and Chandler instead of Odom. I just don't know.

Mark_in_Tulsa · Franchise Player Joined: 11 Jul 2005 Posts: 12977

ValisJason · Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 1:02 pm Post subject:

Socks · Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 1:03 pm Post subject:

THE_SHOES · Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 1:05 pm Post subject:

Fan0Bynum17 · Franchise Player Joined: 30 Nov 2005 Posts: 15436

ValisJason · Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 1:10 pm Post subject:

Socks, I dont necessarily disagree with you. I certainly hope and expect Odom to be more consistent this year. But, he will not average 20 ppg. 17 and 10? Consistent? I would love that. But, we are still left with holes to fill. A scorer at the PG? Not that easy to find. Banks might be good, but I would just be happy if he averages 12ppg. He wont average more than that certainly. A scorer at the 4? Very hard to find. Almost impossible at this point in time for the Lakers to obtain a scorer/shot blocker at the 4. Lamar to the 4? That ends the matchup nightmare and becomes a defensive problem for the Lakers. DO I think Odom could do it? Certainly, but it would not be optimal. Odom is not "potential" anymore. He is actuality. He is not a "young" forward anymore. He is a solid NBA veteran. Put him next to alot of athletes and watch him go to work. I think the Bulls drool over the thought of Odom with their athletes. The Lakers on the other hand, just have alot of holes.

This is why I say that I can imagine the Lakers trading Odom for two starters. It fills the most difficult holes, scorer/defender at the 1, and defense/rebounding at the 4 with a super athlete who I hope can average 10 ppg with garbage offense. I think Roy can average 12-15 ppg next year as a starter for the Lakers. ROY candidate. Then you plug in a MLE or traded SF and you have a versatile, deep team. Not a perfect team, but one that I think has a higher ceiling in the long term.

THE_SHOES · Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 1:14 pm Post subject:

ValisJason · Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 1:15 pm Post subject:

Shoes, I am not hyping Chandler. This is not 3 years ago. I think he will be a very good defender rebounder, and would be very pleased if he averaged 10 ppg. Injury concerns? Yep.

As for Roy, he is not overhyped. No one has ever said he is LBJ. I said that I think he will be a solid NBA starter, ala Byron Scott or Eddie Jones. And I think he will contribute immediately, yes. That is not a rare opinion. is it just an opinion? Yes.

That is EXACTLY what the Lakers need right now ... (why oh why did Mithc including Grant instead of Eddie in the trade??):

Quality starting players next to Kobe so that he doesnt have to carry the load by himself. And as I say earlier, I dont think Odom is necessarily the second scorer next to Kobe. He might be. But at the 3? We need at least one 20ppg scorer next to Kobe, and I dont think Odom will ever average 20 ppg. I love his rebounds and assists, love his slashing to the hoop, hate his inconsistent long range jumper.

Dennis_D · Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 1:16 pm Post subject:

Socks · Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 1:16 pm Post subject:

ValisJason, I'm with you, the Lakers do indeed have lots of holes. I'm also with you that if you trade LO, you either trade him in a package for a big-time star or for two starters. I just don't think these are the right two.

That said, LO is still relatively young. Also, he is still potential. Yeah, he's been in the league awhile, but the rule of thumb on learning the triangle (particularly as the initiator) is two years. We've seen where he is after one year in this offense and the leap he made from the first half to the second. It's not inconceivable to think he still has room to grow. I agree, not necessarily a 20 PPG kind of scorer, but if you give Kwame room to add a few PPG more, and Smush to add a few PPG more, or you add a FA or youngster who could add some scoring punch, you help make up for this.

I agree, it still doesn't get us all the way there, there are too many holes to fill. Chandler and Roy (particularly Chandler) just seem like too huge a risk for LO right now.

THE_SHOES · Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 1:19 pm Post subject:

I'll tell you one thing for sure...

If the Lakers do make this deal Chicago will jump on it in a hearbeat...

I wouldn't blame em either...

They will have made out like a MF!!!

The killing thing about that is middway through Novemeber provided the in house lynch mob has even that much patience the same people endorsing such a move would be laying out Mitch hate threads like tiles on a bathroom floor, they would be so many!
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"According to ESPN.com's conference projections, the Lakers will finish 12th in the West, which prompted Bryant to tweet earlier this offseason, "12th I see.."

Fan0Bynum17 · Franchise Player Joined: 30 Nov 2005 Posts: 15436

Runway8 · Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 1:21 pm Post subject:

It's kinda funny how the media never learns. You figure after so many years they would learn that there is no such thing as, "this is the weakest draft in years." I mean how many times do you hear this phrase year after year? And what do you know, there are always superstars and diamonds in the roughs in every freaking draft, and the NBA constantly grows. I particularly recall hearing this cliche after the very strong 1992 draft that featured Shaq, Mourning and Christian. Year after year ever since, it has been "the weakest draft." Kobe, T-Mac, Wade, Boozer, AK47, CP3, the list goes on and on.. these guys are all from draft years that were dubbed "weakest draft."

ValisJason · Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 1:24 pm Post subject:

Socks: Cant disagree with a word you said. As Ive said earlier, I dont think the Lakers are going to do this trade. I can imagine them doing it, and its the first of the Bulls related rumors that make any sense for the Lakers, and Ive been trying to lay out why I think it would make sense. it certainly seems like something is up with the Lakers ... but it could have all fallen apart. If Phil is really high on Roy, which it seems he is, then I can imagine this trade going through. I am also not confident at the moment that Mitch is going to trade Mihm or use the MLE on a young starting quality player like Banks. It would seem insane, but its a feeling Im getting.

That being said, in another thread, I speculate about Peja joining the Lakers after Roy and Chandler. Now THAT is a contending team, I think. I dont think the Pacers will trade Peja to the Lakers for a Mihm package, but if it were to happen, a line-up of

Kobe / Sasha
Roy / Smush
Peja (not good defense but backed by Tyson) / Walton
Chandler / Turiaf
Kwame / Bynum

If that line-up worked ... could be a very nice combination of offense and defense. But, now I am in total pipe land.

THE_SHOES · Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 1:25 pm Post subject:

ValisJason · Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 1:28 pm Post subject:

halosage · Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 1:28 pm Post subject: