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paymonM
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 Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2019 2:17 pm Post subject: |
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| ribeye wrote: | | Goldenwest wrote: |
Let me ask your a question: what was the point of regime change in Libya and Syria? Was it worth all hose innocent lives? |
In Libya, the point was that the people did not want the Gaddafi government.
In Syria, the point was that the people did not want the Bashar al-Assad government. |
actually, No. It was Saudi Arabia who did not want the Bashar- Al-Assad government. Big difference |
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Wilt
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| Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2019 6:31 pm Post subject: |
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Trump has announced that the G-7 will not take place at his property in Miami.
Probably pressure from Republicans behind the scenes as even they couldn't defend the most blatant case of corruption. Or other leaders just said they wouldn't attend.
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ContagiousInspiration
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ContagiousInspiration
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| Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2019 9:32 pm Post subject: |
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While screaming about Hunter Biden Trumps DOJ hires of Son of one of his biggest supporters and defenders. A family neck deep in the current Ukraine scandal
More at link
https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2019/10/brady-toensing-justice-department/
Politics
October 17, 2019
The Justice Department Hired the Son of a Vocal Trump Defender
| Quote: |
The son of one of President Donald Trump’s most vocal defenders has a new gig in Trump’s Justice Department. Brady Toensing—whose mother Victoria Toensing and and step-father Joe diGenova are key players in the rapidly growing Ukraine scandal—joined the DOJ in June as a senior counsel in its Office of Legal Policy.
The DOJ won’t say how Brady Toensing got the job, but the entire family has close ties to Trump. In 2016, Brady Toensing served as Trump’s Vermont campaign chair. Last year, Victoria Toensing and diGenova—a husband-and-wife legal team who frequently appear on Fox News—agreed to represent Trump in special counsel Robert Mueller’s Russia probe. That arrangement quickly fell through, but the couple has since worked with Trump attorney Rudy Giuliani to dig up damaging information on Joe Biden in Ukraine and advance bogus theories about the origin of the Russia probe. They also represent Dmytro Firtash, a Kremlin-linked Ukrainian oligarch fighting extradition to the United States on bribery charges. Firtash reportedly employed two Giuliani associates who were involved in the effort to smear Biden and were arrested last week on campaign finance charges. |
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ribeye
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Joined: 10 Nov 2001
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 4:53 am Post subject: |
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| paymonM wrote: | | ribeye wrote: | | Goldenwest wrote: |
Let me ask your a question: what was the point of regime change in Libya and Syria? Was it worth all hose innocent lives? |
In Libya, the point was that the people did not want the Gaddafi government.
In Syria, the point was that the people did not want the Bashar al-Assad government. |
actually, No. It was Saudi Arabia who did not want the Bashar- Al-Assad government. Big difference |
You think the people were happy with him? Really?
I suppose, by that logic, that the reason the colonies wanted regime change from King George was because of France. |
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ribeye
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focus
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Joined: 23 May 2012
Posts: 2555
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 11:51 am Post subject: |
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| ribeye wrote: | | Goldenwest wrote: |
Let me ask your a question: what was the point of regime change in Libya and Syria? Was it worth all hose innocent lives? |
In Libya, the point was that the people did not want the Gaddafi government.
In Syria, the point was that the people did not want the Bashar al-Assad government. |
I don't have history at instant recall, but I believe this has never been "the" point of a US-backed regime change. |
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vanexelent
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ChefLinda
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ContagiousInspiration
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Joined: 07 May 2014
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Location: Boulder ;)
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 2:21 pm Post subject: |
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| vanexelent wrote: | https://twitter.com/MillenPolitics/status/1185587054257811456?s=19
HRC knew exactly what Trump would do. Believe her when she talks about Tulsi. |
Should be forwarded to every .mil email address there is
Almost 3 years a Russian Troll has been CiC |
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emililadjet
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Joined: 19 Dec 2018
Posts: 45
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 2:39 pm Post subject: |
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| paymonM wrote: | | ribeye wrote: | | Goldenwest wrote: |
Let me ask your a question: what was the point of regime change in Libya and Syria? Was it worth all hose innocent lives? |
In Libya, the point was that the people did not want the Gaddafi government.
In Syria, the point was that the people did not want the Bashar al-Assad government. |
actually, No. It was Saudi Arabia who did not want the Bashar- Al-Assad government. Big difference |
Nobody can invade Syria, all Syrian with their president Al-Assad to defend Syria against this dictatorship of erdogan.
But unfortunately Trump did not help the Syrians against the army of erdogan 
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ContagiousInspiration
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 2:52 pm Post subject: |
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Trump was doing what he's told to do
He is a Russian Troll in the least and most likey a terrorist |
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ChefLinda
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 6:17 pm Post subject: |
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Washington Post: Trump reversed course on hosting G-7 at his club after learning that impeachment-weary Republicans were tired of defending him
| Quote: | President Trump was forced to abandon his decision to host next year’s Group of Seven summit at his private golf club after it became clear the move had alienated Republicans and swiftly become part of the impeachment inquiry that threatens his presidency.
In a round of phone calls with conservative allies this weekend, Trump was told Republicans are struggling to defend him on so many fronts, according to an administration official who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss internal matters. |
| Quote: | Trump blamed his G-7 reversal on critics, saying on Twitter that his decision to scrap plans for a summit at the Doral club was “based on both Media & Democrat Crazed and Irrational Hostility.”
But behind closed doors, several aides and allies said, Trump changed his mind in response to pressure and frustration from his own party.
In the month since Democrats announced their impeachment inquiry, Republicans have struggled to offer a coherent response. With no White House war room, GOP lawmakers have seized on process-related responses. |
| Quote: | | At the same time, they’re being asked to defend the president’s erratic approach to policymaking, including his abrupt decision to withdraw U.S. troops and abandon Kurdish fighters in northeastern Syria. That announcement was roundly condemned by Republicans, including some of his staunchest defenders. Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (Ky.), in a rare public rebuke of Trump, wrote a withering op-ed in The Washington Post on Friday, just days after 129 House Republicans backed a resolution criticizing the president’s move. |
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greenfrog
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Joined: 02 Jan 2011
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Location: 502 Bad Gateway
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 6:55 pm Post subject: |
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| paymonM wrote: | | ribeye wrote: | | Goldenwest wrote: |
Let me ask your a question: what was the point of regime change in Libya and Syria? Was it worth all hose innocent lives? |
In Libya, the point was that the people did not want the Gaddafi government.
In Syria, the point was that the people did not want the Bashar al-Assad government. |
actually, No. It was Saudi Arabia who did not want the Bashar- Al-Assad government. Big difference |
https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/04/17/russias-gas-web-ensnares-europe/
| Quote: | | Russian oil machinations in Syria started well before the Kremlin’s 2015 military intervention. In 2009, Qatar proposed the construction of a pipeline to send gas from the massive South Pars/North Dome field (which it shares with Iran) via Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Syria, and Turkey. At Russia’s behest, Syrian President Bashar al-Assad refused to sign the plan, since Russia feared that the deal would diminish its own role in Europe’s natural gas market. As an alternative, Russia reportedly gave its approval to the construction of the Iran-Iraq-Syria pipeline under the assumption that it would have an easier time dealing with Iran than with Qatar. |
Possibly the countries Kerry was referring to.
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2013/09/04/kerry_arab_countries_have_offered_to_bear_costs_for_a_us_invasion_to_topple_assad_.html |
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Huey Lewis & The News
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Joined: 18 Dec 2015
Posts: 5234
Location: So what's the uh...topic of discussion?
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 9:35 pm Post subject: |
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On some of my orange county facebook pages that I follow, what's left of the old guard of GOP boomers are pushing a petition to recall Governor Newsom.
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kikanga
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Location: La La Land
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 11:00 pm Post subject: |
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| Huey Lewis & The News wrote: | | On some of my orange county facebook pages that I follow, what's left of the old guard of GOP boomers are pushing a petition to recall Governor Newsom. |
For what? Do they not like their taxes or something?
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ContagiousInspiration
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 11:30 pm Post subject: |
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Clicked on the article just to see what the items were etc.. but inside the article I see a bigger story about how easily people were tricked.
The vendors believed they received legitimate US Govt Purchase orders.
Vendors selling near top secret intelligence equipment thought they were fulfilling an order for the US Navy.. and sent the items valued at over 3 million..they also received near 8 million in random TVs and electronics
'Storage Wars' Property Seized by Feds After Discovery of Equipment Used In Possible 'Espionage Attack'
https://theblast.com/c/storage-wars-locker-auction-military-equipment-espionage-raid-homeland-security-us-attorney-lawsuit
| Quote: | The Blast has obtained a copy of an indictment out of the District Court of Maryland, where several individuals were charged with various crimes pertaining to the procurement of the intelligence equipment.
In the complaint, officials allege a “member of the conspiracy” established the email domain, “navy-mil.us.” The person then engaged with DRT, "while holding himself out to be a contracting officer of the United States Navy."
Through email, the suspect began the process of soliciting bids to purchase the intelligence equipment. In doing so, according to the complaint, an email was then sent "with an attachment containing a fraudulent purchase order and contract to purchase approximately $3,200,000 in communications equipment."
Shockingly, it worked. |
| Quote: | | The criminal enterprise was also accused of obtaining hundreds of high-end televisions and smartphones, for the total value of all of the item being at least $7,728,596. |
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governator
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| Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:39 am Post subject: |
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| Surfitall wrote: | | governator wrote: | | Surfitall wrote: | Anyone else see Andrew Yang’s Reddit AMA or his 15 hours of taking live questions online. I keep coming back to Yang as the common sense candidate. He has a background in business, is young enough to be computer and internet literate, and appeals to conservatives in ways Warren or Sanders will not despite embracing many of the same progressive policies. From his AMA...
“I'm one of only 2 candidates in the field that 10% or more of Trump voters say they would support in the general which gives me a better chance to beat Trump in the general than just about any other candidate, and I'm beating him in head-to-head matchups by 8 points in swing states. If you're looking to ensure Trump's defeat I'm the best bet or one of the best bets.”
Yang positions progressive policies in terms that conservative voters are more willing to embrace. As someone else posted:
“He sees government funded medicare as something that will give people freedoms: conservative problem solving. It gives the freedom to leave your job or to move because most people are reluctant to leave their insurance. It also gives more power to entrepreneurs if they don't have to insure their workers, it would boost small business and grow the GDP significantly.
It's a theme that runs through most of his policies: a conclusion that fits liberal ideologies, but with reasoning that fits conservative ideologies.” |
Not too familiar with his policies beside UBI, What don't you like about him? I was on the Beto train last year but he's not ready at all. |
I don’t like that he sometimes acts overly casual for someone running for President, but compared to Trump none of that really matters. His “Big 3 Policies” are the Freedom Dividend, Medicare for All, and Human Centered Capitalism. His site also has detailed policies on many other topics.
One of my favorite things he is for is changing the measurements of success from just GDP Growth, to the following list of metrics to be tracked:
Quality of life and health-adjusted life expectancy
Happiness/Well-Being and Mental Health
Environmental quality
Affordability
Childhood success rates
Underemployment
Income Inequality
Consumer and Student Debt
Work and civic engagement levels
Volunteerism
Infant mortality
Quality of infrastructure
Access to education
Marriage and divorce rates
Substance abuse and related deaths
National optimism
Personal dynamism/economic mobility
His belief is that you can’t manage what you don’t measure, and what you measure determines what you do. Measure the right things and government will start focusing on improving the right things! |
Ok, read some more on Yang, still need to see how he response when being attack by other candidates (might not see it if he doesn’t crack double digit and become viable). I don’t like how he attacked doctors instead of health care as a whole as the culprit for high health care cost (it’s a misconception, docs including dentists, podiatrists, PT/OT, chiropractors, DNP, PA constitute about 8% of US health care spending... there’s pages of these debate in this thread)... I’ll keep an open mind for Yang, I’m not fond of the older candidates due to their age but right now I’ll pick Warren ahead of Yang |
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ribeye
Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Nov 2001
Posts: 12665
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| Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2019 6:26 am Post subject: |
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| greenfrog wrote: | | paymonM wrote: | | ribeye wrote: | | Goldenwest wrote: |
Let me ask your a question: what was the point of regime change in Libya and Syria? Was it worth all hose innocent lives? |
In Libya, the point was that the people did not want the Gaddafi government.
In Syria, the point was that the people did not want the Bashar al-Assad government. |
actually, No. It was Saudi Arabia who did not want the Bashar- Al-Assad government. Big difference |
https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/04/17/russias-gas-web-ensnares-europe/
| Quote: | | Russian oil machinations in Syria started well before the Kremlin’s 2015 military intervention. In 2009, Qatar proposed the construction of a pipeline to send gas from the massive South Pars/North Dome field (which it shares with Iran) via Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Syria, and Turkey. At Russia’s behest, Syrian President Bashar al-Assad refused to sign the plan, since Russia feared that the deal would diminish its own role in Europe’s natural gas market. As an alternative, Russia reportedly gave its approval to the construction of the Iran-Iraq-Syria pipeline under the assumption that it would have an easier time dealing with Iran than with Qatar. |
Possibly the countries Kerry was referring to.
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2013/09/04/kerry_arab_countries_have_offered_to_bear_costs_for_a_us_invasion_to_topple_assad_.html |
I tend to avoid foreign policy discussion, as I know my understanding of most events is limited. I usually have to familiarize or re-familiarize myself. I have read a great deal on Iraq and Syria, and more than most on Libya and Saudi Arabia, but I know far to little to pretend to be sufficiently knowledgeable to have an intellectual discussion. What I do know is that civil wars in Syria and Libya began with their people unhappy with their rulers. This kinda fits the pattern. As events unfolded and atrocities or threats thereof became commonplace, the UN and other nations individually or as coalitions became involved. There were many motives from many different nations, from maintaining stability, to causing instability, to straightening alliances, to weakening alliances, to asserting power, to maintaining power, to establish, maintain and protect business interests and development, and last but not least, for humanitarian concerns. |
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ContagiousInspiration
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Joined: 07 May 2014
Posts: 13823
Location: Boulder ;)
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| Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2019 7:00 am Post subject: |
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Why did the US create the Arab Spring.. what was the end goal and did Trump destroy everything that was accomplished?
Did Vladimir Putin take notice at the PsyOps taken against those countries as a way to influence and overtake America? |
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Surfitall
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Joined: 12 Feb 2002
Posts: 3829
Location: South Orange County
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| Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2019 7:14 am Post subject: |
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| governator wrote: | | Surfitall wrote: | | governator wrote: | | Surfitall wrote: | Anyone else see Andrew Yang’s Reddit AMA or his 15 hours of taking live questions online. I keep coming back to Yang as the common sense candidate. He has a background in business, is young enough to be computer and internet literate, and appeals to conservatives in ways Warren or Sanders will not despite embracing many of the same progressive policies. From his AMA...
“I'm one of only 2 candidates in the field that 10% or more of Trump voters say they would support in the general which gives me a better chance to beat Trump in the general than just about any other candidate, and I'm beating him in head-to-head matchups by 8 points in swing states. If you're looking to ensure Trump's defeat I'm the best bet or one of the best bets.”
Yang positions progressive policies in terms that conservative voters are more willing to embrace. As someone else posted:
“He sees government funded medicare as something that will give people freedoms: conservative problem solving. It gives the freedom to leave your job or to move because most people are reluctant to leave their insurance. It also gives more power to entrepreneurs if they don't have to insure their workers, it would boost small business and grow the GDP significantly.
It's a theme that runs through most of his policies: a conclusion that fits liberal ideologies, but with reasoning that fits conservative ideologies.” |
Not too familiar with his policies beside UBI, What don't you like about him? I was on the Beto train last year but he's not ready at all. |
I don’t like that he sometimes acts overly casual for someone running for President, but compared to Trump none of that really matters. His “Big 3 Policies” are the Freedom Dividend, Medicare for All, and Human Centered Capitalism. His site also has detailed policies on many other topics.
One of my favorite things he is for is changing the measurements of success from just GDP Growth, to the following list of metrics to be tracked:
Quality of life and health-adjusted life expectancy
Happiness/Well-Being and Mental Health
Environmental quality
Affordability
Childhood success rates
Underemployment
Income Inequality
Consumer and Student Debt
Work and civic engagement levels
Volunteerism
Infant mortality
Quality of infrastructure
Access to education
Marriage and divorce rates
Substance abuse and related deaths
National optimism
Personal dynamism/economic mobility
His belief is that you can’t manage what you don’t measure, and what you measure determines what you do. Measure the right things and government will start focusing on improving the right things! |
Ok, read some more on Yang, still need to see how he response when being attack by other candidates (might not see it if he doesn’t crack double digit and become viable). I don’t like how he attacked doctors instead of health care as a whole as the culprit for high health care cost (it’s a misconception, docs including dentists, podiatrists, PT/OT, chiropractors, DNP, PA constitute about 8% of US health care spending... there’s pages of these debate in this thread)... I’ll keep an open mind for Yang, I’m not fond of the older candidates due to their age but right now I’ll pick Warren ahead of Yang |
Where is he attacking doctors instead of healthcare as a whole? I haven’t seen that...genuinely curious. |
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vanexelent
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Joined: 17 May 2005
Posts: 30081
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| Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2019 7:33 am Post subject: |
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Surfitall wrote:
| Quote: | “He sees government funded medicare as something that will give people freedoms: conservative problem solving. It gives the freedom to leave your job or to move because most people are reluctant to leave their insurance. It also gives more power to entrepreneurs if they don't have to insure their workers, it would boost small business and grow the GDP significantly.
It's a theme that runs through most of his policies: a conclusion that fits liberal ideologies, but with reasoning that fits conservative ideologies.” |
Bernie and Warren both talk abut these benefits from M4A. Bernie got a standing ovation during his Fox News town hall, on the subject of health care. Republicans view them all as Socialists, so it's curious how the only guy advocating to straight up pay people for nothing is the one a Trump voter would find appealing. |
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Wilt
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Joined: 29 Dec 2002
Posts: 13771
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| Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2019 7:46 am Post subject: |
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USA Today/Suffolk Poll in IOWA:
Biden 18
Warren 17
Buttigieg 13
Sanders 9
As I said a couple pages ago, Mayor Pete is trending upwards in Iowa.
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Hector the Pup
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Surfitall
Star Player
Joined: 12 Feb 2002
Posts: 3829
Location: South Orange County
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| Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2019 8:59 am Post subject: |
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| vanexelent wrote: | Surfitall wrote:
| Quote: | “He sees government funded medicare as something that will give people freedoms: conservative problem solving. It gives the freedom to leave your job or to move because most people are reluctant to leave their insurance. It also gives more power to entrepreneurs if they don't have to insure their workers, it would boost small business and grow the GDP significantly.
It's a theme that runs through most of his policies: a conclusion that fits liberal ideologies, but with reasoning that fits conservative ideologies.” |
Bernie and Warren both talk abut these benefits from M4A. Bernie got a standing ovation during his Fox News town hall, on the subject of health care. Republicans view them all as Socialists, so it's curious how the only guy advocating to straight up pay people for nothing is the one a Trump voter would find appealing. |
The NY Times had a decent article on this topic a couple months ago:
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/22/us/politics/on-politics-andrew-yang-bipartisan.html |
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