Lakers Time Machine: Go back and nix the Deng/Mozgov blunder
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Aeneas Hunter
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 28, 2021 9:15 pm    Post subject:

governator wrote:
Out of all the young players we traded, BI might be the only one that can be argued is not replaceable. Randle, Hart, DLo, JC, Svi, Moe, Zubac... I think we can and in most case have replaced them with comparable players (arguably of course).


Again, that argument is ultimately a straw man. It's not like we had a binary choice: keep all of the kids or dump them. You can certainly justify trading Ingram and Hart (and Ball) for Davis. But what did we get in return for any of the others? There was also Nance and Bryant. For the most part, we dumped those players for cap space that we didn't use. You can say that we replaced them with comparable players, and that's a defensible position even if it is debatable. But what did we get back? We're looking at a short term future with lots of luxury tax and minimal draft assets. It could all work out, but it could also go south in a hurry.
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governator
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2021 4:50 am    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
governator wrote:
Out of all the young players we traded, BI might be the only one that can be argued is not replaceable. Randle, Hart, DLo, JC, Svi, Moe, Zubac... I think we can and in most case have replaced them with comparable players (arguably of course).


Again, that argument is ultimately a straw man. It's not like we had a binary choice: keep all of the kids or dump them. You can certainly justify trading Ingram and Hart (and Ball) for Davis. But what did we get in return for any of the others? There was also Nance and Bryant. For the most part, we dumped those players for cap space that we didn't use. You can say that we replaced them with comparable players, and that's a defensible position even if it is debatable. But what did we get back? We're looking at a short term future with lots of luxury tax and minimal draft assets. It could all work out, but it could also go south in a hurry.


Luxury tax, we would’ve been hit with or without the trade
The salary dumps (Nance, Bryant, Svi, Bonga, maybe even include Zubac since muscala was so useless) can be argued as unnecessary for sure but also possible that LeBron wouldn’t have signed without another open max space, who knows
What did we get in return from all these moves? Championship with a chance for more but like you said, that might be seen as short term for some and watching home grown talents blossom will always be a plus. I have no problem with people being more satisfied with Magic/Worthy/Kobe rings over Kareem/Shaq/LeBron/AD.
Personally I see ring as the ultimate goal and the fact that majority of our players are under 30 and some haven’t hit their prime puts as in position of having assets for long term too, the draft picks are price to pay. Good trades for both teams. Just my 2 cents
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Aeneas Hunter
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2021 7:37 am    Post subject:

governator wrote:
Luxury tax, we would’ve been hit with or without the trade
The salary dumps (Nance, Bryant, Svi, Bonga, maybe even include Zubac since muscala was so useless) can be argued as unnecessary for sure but also possible that LeBron wouldn’t have signed without another open max space, who knows
What did we get in return from all these moves? Championship with a chance for more but like you said, that might be seen as short term for some and watching home grown talents blossom will always be a plus. I have no problem with people being more satisfied with Magic/Worthy/Kobe rings over Kareem/Shaq/LeBron/AD.
Personally I see ring as the ultimate goal and the fact that majority of our players are under 30 and some haven’t hit their prime puts as in position of having assets for long term too, the draft picks are price to pay. Good trades for both teams. Just my 2 cents


As I said in an earlier post, we'll need to see how this all plays out before I pass judgment. I wasn't happy about it at the time, but I understood it. Jeanie and Magic wanted a quick turnaround after firing Mitch and Jim. We got one title out of it so far. If we win another title or two, or if Pelinka manages to transition us out of the Lebron era by signing another star or other players to keep us competitive, then it's going to be a clear success. It's a closer case if we get just the one title and then become mediocre or worse. We shall see.

As for the replacement players, it's important to remember that Schroder and Harrell are expiring contracts (player option in the case of Harrell). They actually have us over the barrel when it comes to contract negotiations. If they sign with another team, we would have limited ability to replace them. We could also see another team try to poach THT or Caruso. Again, if we lost them, we would have limited ability to replace them. You may have realized this, but I get the sense that a lot of people around here have not thought this through.

Finally, I think we all know that the only players on the current roster who really matter are Lebron and Davis. If you put together a roster of Harrell, Kuzma, THT, Casey P., and Schroder, you're talking about a squad at the level of the Detroit Pistons. Maybe those guys are entering their prime, but somehow I doubt that future NBA historians will be writing books about the prime of Kyle Kuzma.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2021 7:47 am    Post subject:

Yeah, I think our biggest difference is the valuing the worth of a ring. One ring in a decade is an accomplishment, two rings exceeds it. Hope everything work out for us
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Aeneas Hunter
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2021 8:20 am    Post subject:

governator wrote:
Yeah, I think our biggest difference is the valuing the worth of a ring. One ring in a decade is an accomplishment, two rings exceeds it. Hope everything work out for us


The opposing perspective is that one ring in a decade is not an accomplishment for a team with as many built-in advantages as the Lakers. The Lakers aren't going to be judged by the same standards as, say, the Jazz. Hopefully, we'll win another title or two in the Lebron era, so that this will be academic.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2021 8:26 am    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
governator wrote:
Yeah, I think our biggest difference is the valuing the worth of a ring. One ring in a decade is an accomplishment, two rings exceeds it. Hope everything work out for us


The opposing perspective is that one ring in a decade is not an accomplishment for a team with as many built-in advantages as the Lakers. The Lakers aren't going to be judged by the same standards as, say, the Jazz. Hopefully, we'll win another title or two in the Lebron era, so that this will be academic.


For sure, hope for more ring(s)
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mad55557777
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2021 9:20 am    Post subject:

Jeanies wallet will be hurt a lot by dents contract next year. 5 mil can turn into. 25 mil
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