OFFICIAL GENERAL FREE AGENCY/TRADE THREAD
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vasashi17+
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 4:52 pm    Post subject:

Four Decade Bandwagon wrote:
vasashi17+ wrote:
JUST-MING wrote:
vasashi17+ wrote:
JUST-MING wrote:
Lebron took a paycut in his prime to pair up with his fellow team USA teammates, and even recruited several other of his team USA teammates to join help him win a title. So, a past prime, like 40 year old Lebron, wouldn’t take a paycut to pair up with Giannis and Anthony in their prime?


But it only was a pay cut of 15m over 6 years (2.5m per).

https://www.espn.com/nba/news/story?id=5368003

If Giannis were to come here in 2021, Bron would have to take nearly half of his 41m player option to take Giannis’s 38m into space while still keeping Kuz, or Bron would have to take almost 10m less that year if we dump Kuz for future assets that don’t impact our books in 2021. Either way, the Miami paycut is a trivial amount to what Bron would have to give up at age 36 in possibly his last big pay day before the over-38 rule impacts any deal he signs after his current one expires.


Why are you talking about Kyle? He’s not even in the discussion. It’s Lebron, Anthony and Giannis. If Kyle wants to hang around, it’s on a merry minimum deal. He’s gone in 2021.


Okay, but a lot of things have to happen for that to be a possibility.

With no Kyle, THT, Caruso 2020 FRP (ie traded for future pick) and no 2021 FRP caphold (ie traded for future pick)...basically just no cap holds in general and it’s just Bron, AD, Giannis on the roster and that’s it:

AD 37.3m (2nd year of 30%max deal on a 115m cap signed in 2020)
Giannis 37.5m (30%max on a projected 125m cap)
Deng dead cap hit 5m
10 incomplete roster charge ~11m
= 34m in cap space

Bron would have to take about a 7m haircut from his 41m player option.

So you say let’s just have him make it up on a longer deal...but then you gotta consider the over-38 rule blocks that loophole.

If Bron opts out of his 41m in 2021, that means he is 36 and can only sign up to a 2yr deal from that point that doesn’t make it an over-38 contract.

So he can sign a 2yr 70m deal in 2021 while still making room for Giannis. At that point we could only round out the roster with the room exception (~5.4m) and vet mins.

Never say never...after all free agency has already shown us plenty of surprises. That being said, I still think the 2021 plan is unlikely. I would go the route of bringing in players that can help now and then facilitating a S&t for Giannis with this contracts, if he’s adamant in playing with Bron & AD.


Are you really expecting James to be physically competitive even as the third option in 2+ years? Or willing to accept that role?


James continues to do amazing things even on the face of Father Time, but no I not expect him to be a full time point guard/playmaker moving forward.

Ming just portrayed a 2021 scenario and I wanted to point out what it would take for that particular scenario to play out.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 4:56 pm    Post subject:

Four Decade Bandwagon wrote:
vasashi17+ wrote:
JUST-MING wrote:
vasashi17+ wrote:
JUST-MING wrote:
Lebron took a paycut in his prime to pair up with his fellow team USA teammates, and even recruited several other of his team USA teammates to join help him win a title. So, a past prime, like 40 year old Lebron, wouldn’t take a paycut to pair up with Giannis and Anthony in their prime?


But it only was a pay cut of 15m over 6 years (2.5m per).

https://www.espn.com/nba/news/story?id=5368003

If Giannis were to come here in 2021, Bron would have to take nearly half of his 41m player option to take Giannis’s 38m into space while still keeping Kuz, or Bron would have to take almost 10m less that year if we dump Kuz for future assets that don’t impact our books in 2021. Either way, the Miami paycut is a trivial amount to what Bron would have to give up at age 36 in possibly his last big pay day before the over-38 rule impacts any deal he signs after his current one expires.


Why are you talking about Kyle? He’s not even in the discussion. It’s Lebron, Anthony and Giannis. If Kyle wants to hang around, it’s on a merry minimum deal. He’s gone in 2021.


Okay, but a lot of things have to happen for that to be a possibility.

With no Kyle, THT, Caruso 2020 FRP (ie traded for future pick) and no 2021 FRP caphold (ie traded for future pick)...basically just no cap holds in general and it’s just Bron, AD, Giannis on the roster and that’s it:

AD 37.3m (2nd year of 30%max deal on a 115m cap signed in 2020)
Giannis 37.5m (30%max on a projected 125m cap)
Deng dead cap hit 5m
10 incomplete roster charge ~11m
= 34m in cap space

Bron would have to take about a 7m haircut from his 41m player option.

So you say let’s just have him make it up on a longer deal...but then you gotta consider the over-38 rule blocks that loophole.

If Bron opts out of his 41m in 2021, that means he is 36 and can only sign up to a 2yr deal from that point that doesn’t make it an over-38 contract.

So he can sign a 2yr 70m deal in 2021 while still making room for Giannis. At that point we could only round out the roster with the room exception (~5.4m) and vet mins.

Never say never...after all free agency has already shown us plenty of surprises. That being said, I still think the 2021 plan is unlikely. I would go the route of bringing in players that can help now and then facilitating a S&t for Giannis with this contracts, if he’s adamant in playing with Bron & AD.


Are you really expecting James to be physically competitive even as the third option in 2+ years? Or willing to accept that role?




1. Willing to accept that role?


It could depend on how things go for his quest to win a championship in LA for this season and next. If he has unfinished business, then he might be willing to accept that role.


2. Are you really expecting James to be physically competitive even as the third option in 2+ years?


Maybe, maybe not. Since he came here to revive the Lakers brand, he could have more influence over the FO decision making than you think.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 5:53 pm    Post subject:

LeBron will be offered the max by the Lakers whether via extension or FA, don’t bet against it
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 8:48 pm    Post subject:

I don't think it's far fetched to expect James to still be competitive at the end of his contract. He has certainly lost a step, but he's already dealing with that. His size will enable him to stay competitive so long as he can remain healthy. I'd expect him to lose a little every season, but he can still be competitive for a few more years if his health holds out. And he's had a remarkably healthy career.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 10:08 pm    Post subject:

He can play the draymond green role until he is 50
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 11:42 pm    Post subject:

scout0_0 wrote:
He can play the draymond green role until he is 50


Or Millsap till he’s 60. 😝
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 12:14 am    Post subject:

1 game is not a indicator of what this player will do. I think he played well in the situation he was put in, which was to be a spacer and play D.

Caruso is not a Rondo replacement. Rondo does have better number despite having similar mpg.
Dion Waiters is the only option in the market that can up both these guys in numbers, but don't know this guy's head is in right place for playing Basketball

pmacla wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Honestly, it's long overdue. But I still think we need to do this:

1. formalize Caruso taking most of Rondo's minutes/duties. Rondo becomes the Jared Dudley of the point guard rotation. Break in case of emergency.

2. still would look for a shot creator from the wing position. Best options likely Waiters (Pelinka and Klutch connection) or JR Smith (we've reached that point. Yikes).

3. Still need a big wing defender. Of course Mo Harkless is the #1 choice. But if he's not available, still need to address this. At this juncture we aren't going to find any really good players, but we still do need a big wing defender. (we've been saying this since...well, July 2019 ).


Caruso has never played a full 82 or a playoff schedule, maybe and hopefully Wednesday was a preview of what will be unleashed in 2nd half of season to keep him fresh
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 5:17 am    Post subject:

AFireInside619 wrote:
scout0_0 wrote:
He can play the draymond green role until he is 50


Or Millsap till he’s 60. 😝


He has a blue print already, 40yr old Karl Malone
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 6:08 am    Post subject:

I may be wrong on this, but it would not surprise me at all if Lebron were a top 5 PG in the NBA until age 40. Sort of like Magic, it does not require Lebron elite athleticism to get you 8-10 assists a night. He knows how to set up players and throw incredible passes. In a way that is why I think the Lakers put him at PG now. They probably can envision his scoring going down each season as he gets older but the assists staying high.

What we will see is more perimeter or post up Lebron. As a guy that is going to shoot a lot of 3s, and a lot of post ups for his FGAs, but also rake in the assists. It will require the Lakers to have AD, another all-star wing that can create his shot, and 2 high quality shooters to make it work.

I do think it is very reasonable to expect Lebron to give you 18-20 points, 8-10 assists, in 30-32 minutes, many years from now. Like I said, the things Lebron does really well such as passing and bullying people in the paint, declining athleticism will not affect. What will be affected is how much he can do drive and kicks, which truth be told we already seeing he is not elite at anymore. Our #1 priority longterm should be to get a drive and kick guard or wing who is an all-star caliber player next to old Lebron and in prime AD. And of course as many high quality 3nD role players as possible.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 6:16 am    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:
I may be wrong on this, but it would not surprise me at all if Lebron were a top 5 PG in the NBA until age 40. Sort of like Magic, it does not require Lebron elite athleticism to get you 8-10 assists a night. He knows how to set up players and throw incredible passes. In a way that is why I think the Lakers put him at PG now. They probably can envision his scoring going down each season as he gets older but the assists staying high.

What we will see is more perimeter or post up Lebron. As a guy that is going to shoot a lot of 3s, and a lot of post ups for his FGAs, but also rake in the assists. It will require the Lakers to have AD, another all-star wing that can create his shot, and 2 high quality shooters to make it work.

I do think it is very reasonable to expect Lebron to give you 18-20 points, 8-10 assists, in 30-32 minutes, many years from now. Like I said, the things Lebron does really well such as passing and bullying people in the paint, declining athleticism will not affect. What will be affected is how much he can do drive and kicks, which truth be told we already seeing he is not elite at anymore. Our #1 priority longterm should be to get a drive and kick guard or wing who is an all-star caliber player next to old Lebron and in prime AD. And of course as many high quality 3nD role players as possible.


A true point power forward, no guarding wings, def doable but AD gotta slide at the 5
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 6:25 am    Post subject:

governator wrote:
wolfpaclaker wrote:
I may be wrong on this, but it would not surprise me at all if Lebron were a top 5 PG in the NBA until age 40. Sort of like Magic, it does not require Lebron elite athleticism to get you 8-10 assists a night. He knows how to set up players and throw incredible passes. In a way that is why I think the Lakers put him at PG now. They probably can envision his scoring going down each season as he gets older but the assists staying high.

What we will see is more perimeter or post up Lebron. As a guy that is going to shoot a lot of 3s, and a lot of post ups for his FGAs, but also rake in the assists. It will require the Lakers to have AD, another all-star wing that can create his shot, and 2 high quality shooters to make it work.

I do think it is very reasonable to expect Lebron to give you 18-20 points, 8-10 assists, in 30-32 minutes, many years from now. Like I said, the things Lebron does really well such as passing and bullying people in the paint, declining athleticism will not affect. What will be affected is how much he can do drive and kicks, which truth be told we already seeing he is not elite at anymore. Our #1 priority longterm should be to get a drive and kick guard or wing who is an all-star caliber player next to old Lebron and in prime AD. And of course as many high quality 3nD role players as possible.


A true point power forward, no guarding wings, def doable but AD gotta slide at the 5

I expect crunch time AD to be at the 5 now and in the future, most of the time. Again it also depends on the 3, right now our positional 3 if Lebron is a our PG is Danny Green who is a pretty decent 3nD guy, but not a player you would want around old Lebron.

I do not classify current Lebron as old, for me that is like when Tim Duncan was in his last few years. If you saw TD late in his career, the Spurs still won titles and competed in NBA Finals with old TD. They threw the ball into TD, but instead of a go to post scorer, he was a facilitator from in there, He was doing a lot of things prime TD was still doing, just not as obvious and definitely not scoring. With Lebron, old Lebron would need to be the same way in the sense he can not drive and kick or be a 25 points a night guy. We would be needing someone else to do that for us.

I guess in this hypothetical you have signed Giannis, which is a long shot, but again if we are talking hypotheticals here, Lebron is a 18p-9a PG, and Giannis and AD are in primes. I can see them win rings with the right role players around them, for sure. Not sure if Lebron sees it that same way, but judging by how he embraced AD as a 1st option, I think he would do the same for Giannis and defer even more to being a Magic type PG.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 6:31 am    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:
governator wrote:
wolfpaclaker wrote:
I may be wrong on this, but it would not surprise me at all if Lebron were a top 5 PG in the NBA until age 40. Sort of like Magic, it does not require Lebron elite athleticism to get you 8-10 assists a night. He knows how to set up players and throw incredible passes. In a way that is why I think the Lakers put him at PG now. They probably can envision his scoring going down each season as he gets older but the assists staying high.

What we will see is more perimeter or post up Lebron. As a guy that is going to shoot a lot of 3s, and a lot of post ups for his FGAs, but also rake in the assists. It will require the Lakers to have AD, another all-star wing that can create his shot, and 2 high quality shooters to make it work.

I do think it is very reasonable to expect Lebron to give you 18-20 points, 8-10 assists, in 30-32 minutes, many years from now. Like I said, the things Lebron does really well such as passing and bullying people in the paint, declining athleticism will not affect. What will be affected is how much he can do drive and kicks, which truth be told we already seeing he is not elite at anymore. Our #1 priority longterm should be to get a drive and kick guard or wing who is an all-star caliber player next to old Lebron and in prime AD. And of course as many high quality 3nD role players as possible.


A true point power forward, no guarding wings, def doable but AD gotta slide at the 5

I expect crunch time AD to be at the 5 now and in the future, most of the time. Again it also depends on the 3, right now our positional 3 if Lebron is a our PG is Danny Green who is a pretty decent 3nD guy, but not a player you would want around old Lebron.

I do not classify current Lebron as old, for me that is like when Tim Duncan was in his last few years. If you saw TD late in his career, the Spurs still won titles and competed in NBA Finals with old TD. They threw the ball into TD, but instead of a go to post scorer, he was a facilitator from in there, He was doing a lot of things prime TD was still doing, just not as obvious and definitely not scoring. With Lebron, old Lebron would need to be the same way in the sense he can not drive and kick or be a 25 points a night guy. We would be needing someone else to do that for us.

I guess in this hypothetical you have signed Giannis, which is a long shot, but again if we are talking hypotheticals here, Lebron is a 18p-9a PG, and Giannis and AD are in primes. I can see them win rings with the right role players around them, for sure. Not sure if Lebron sees it that same way, but judging by how he embraced AD as a 1st option, I think he would do the same for Giannis and defer even more to being a Magic type PG.


Man, if we have rebounding point forward LeBron with Giannis and AD jointing him in the front court... game over lol. Can you imagine the fast breaks... the block swats... the ringsss
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 6:34 am    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:
governator wrote:
wolfpaclaker wrote:
I may be wrong on this, but it would not surprise me at all if Lebron were a top 5 PG in the NBA until age 40. Sort of like Magic, it does not require Lebron elite athleticism to get you 8-10 assists a night. He knows how to set up players and throw incredible passes. In a way that is why I think the Lakers put him at PG now. They probably can envision his scoring going down each season as he gets older but the assists staying high.

What we will see is more perimeter or post up Lebron. As a guy that is going to shoot a lot of 3s, and a lot of post ups for his FGAs, but also rake in the assists. It will require the Lakers to have AD, another all-star wing that can create his shot, and 2 high quality shooters to make it work.

I do think it is very reasonable to expect Lebron to give you 18-20 points, 8-10 assists, in 30-32 minutes, many years from now. Like I said, the things Lebron does really well such as passing and bullying people in the paint, declining athleticism will not affect. What will be affected is how much he can do drive and kicks, which truth be told we already seeing he is not elite at anymore. Our #1 priority longterm should be to get a drive and kick guard or wing who is an all-star caliber player next to old Lebron and in prime AD. And of course as many high quality 3nD role players as possible.


A true point power forward, no guarding wings, def doable but AD gotta slide at the 5

I expect crunch time AD to be at the 5 now and in the future, most of the time. Again it also depends on the 3, right now our positional 3 if Lebron is a our PG is Danny Green who is a pretty decent 3nD guy, but not a player you would want around old Lebron.

I do not classify current Lebron as old, for me that is like when Tim Duncan was in his last few years. If you saw TD late in his career, the Spurs still won titles and competed in NBA Finals with old TD. They threw the ball into TD, but instead of a go to post scorer, he was a facilitator from in there, He was doing a lot of things prime TD was still doing, just not as obvious and definitely not scoring. With Lebron, old Lebron would need to be the same way in the sense he can not drive and kick or be a 25 points a night guy. We would be needing someone else to do that for us.

I guess in this hypothetical you have signed Giannis, which is a long shot, but again if we are talking hypotheticals here, Lebron is a 18p-9a PG, and Giannis and AD are in primes. I can see them win rings with the right role players around them, for sure. Not sure if Lebron sees it that same way, but judging by how he embraced AD as a 1st option, I think he would do the same for Giannis and defer even more to being a Magic type PG.



Yep, hypothetically. In reality I see little chance Giannis moves to a big market, he's expressed his love of small markets. That along with him not even participating in LeBron camps, because he wants to beat him makes assume that there is no world, outside of hypothetical, in which Giannis becomes a Laker.

IF the FO holds out, ala KL, for the Freak; it will be one sour free
agency, hypothetically speaking.... IMO.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 6:38 am    Post subject:

Probably. The Lakers will have to investigate all that, and also at the same time, regardless, moving into next season, upgrade the wing spots if LBJ keeps playing PG, which I think he will.

Judging by our interest in Morris and before that Bogdanovic, and even offering Kuzma for BB, I think there is a good chance we will upgrade around LBJ regardless of Giannis-FA in 2021.

What we really need to focus on is someone that can allow Lebron to play perimeter QB, and not have to force to run the ball in the middle, and be a drive and kick PG. Someone Lebron can deliver the ball to at the wing from the perimeter or even as soon as LBJ grabs the rebound or inbound pass to get the ball to this player, who can then create at a very high level via drive and kick, drive and dish, etc. It should be our priority longterm around AD and an eventual OLD Lebron to keep the title window open.

Giannis is obviously option 1 and pipe, but we could trade for someone lesser who is still a very good player. Lakers need to hopefully focus in on that, this coming summer, at latest by summer 2021.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 7:13 am    Post subject:

Giannis waiting will be like Kawhi and George waiting.
Waste of time when good players can be found.
The Lzkers are not in a position go have go have him.

Next year need to fill the holes if the Clippers will allow it.
A good backup or starting PG. A must.
A backup defensive SF.
Keep up the search for good shooters.
Keep Howard.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 7:27 am    Post subject:

Can someone update the FA list to summer 2020?
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 7:27 am    Post subject:

Rudy Gobert if Giannis doesn't come.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 8:32 am    Post subject:

Dr. Laker wrote:
Rudy Gobert if Giannis doesn't come.

As good as he is, do not see the value in Gobert, when in the 4th Q, you can have AD do all of what Gobert does. I rather invest the max or significant money in the area you probably lose with Lebrons age-physical decline. Guard dribble penetration, drive and kick ability from the wing etc.

Giannis does exactly what we would be losing with Lebrons age, so he would be an incredible get, but we could get it elsewhere. Will not be easy, and we will need to be smart traders longterm using assets like the 2020 pick, Kuzma, expiring contracts like Danny Green, very well. I am not all in for the 2021 free agency if we could get a star caliber wing before then.

If Kuzma fails to step up in the playoffs or by seasons end, I am all for Kuzma-Green-2020 pick for the BPA who fits the needs we have at the wing-guard next to LBJ-AD. I just do not know what that kind of package could realistically fetch you in the summer of 2020.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 8:33 am    Post subject:

https://twitter.com/themariashow_/status/1228507469556699136?s=21
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 8:38 am    Post subject:

LakerSD wrote:
https://twitter.com/themariashow_/status/1228507469556699136?s=21

They will not do it for Kuz, Green, 2020 pick.
I would, most Lakers fans would.
Bulls would pass.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 8:56 am    Post subject:

Joe Harris for the MLE? Or would you rather use it on Dragic?
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 8:58 am    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:
LakerSD wrote:
https://twitter.com/themariashow_/status/1228507469556699136?s=21

They will not do it for Kuz, Green, 2020 pick.
I would, most Lakers fans would.
Bulls would pass.


our only hope of getting LaVine this summer is if he demands a trade.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 9:08 am    Post subject:

Inspector Gadget wrote:
wolfpaclaker wrote:
LakerSD wrote:
https://twitter.com/themariashow_/status/1228507469556699136?s=21

They will not do it for Kuz, Green, 2020 pick.
I would, most Lakers fans would.
Bulls would pass.


our only hope of getting LaVine this summer is if he demands a trade.

And he will be traded to other team like it happened with PG and Kawhi.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 9:12 am    Post subject:

I wonder if LaVine would bother to defend if he was the third option?
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 9:13 am    Post subject:

LaVine would also kill the Giannis dream.
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