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LakerSanity Moderator
Joined: 30 Nov 2006 Posts: 33474 Location: Long Beach, California
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Posted: Mon Jan 20, 2020 10:59 am Post subject: |
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audioaxes wrote: | wolfpaclaker wrote: | Many touted the Sixers model as proof, or the Thunder model even. Yet years later, the Thunder now have zero superstars despite some great management. The Sixers have pretty much gotten rid of all their young talent minus Embiid and Simmons, who are not exactly looking like a realistic championship level team. What we acheived with this AD and Lebron pairing, and the timing to have the cap to sign Kawhi on top of it, had 2-3 championships written all over it. Even without Kawhi, I see us being in contention realistically for 2 years. For sure after that, it will come down to some smart decisions by Rob and co, on what they want to do. Because the expiration date on Lebron's championship window is about 2-3 years at most. Hopefully they don't make the same mistake done with Kobe, late in his career. |
I agree. My only complaint is the Lakers put all their cards on the table too soon in the AD negotiations. They could have drove a harder bargain and not given up so many draft picks. I put some of that on Magic who I assume offered everything last year, and our previous LAZY coaching staff for not even developing our young players. If our youth looked more polished and developed from the previous season our trade package doesnt need multiple 1st round sweeteners. |
At the end of the day, there is only one objective measure - after all is said and done, did you or did you not end up with a ring? If the answer is yes, then you don't have to wonder what you could have done differently. If the answer is no, you (and those who criticized you) have grounds to question, if not condemn, the moves made.
If we don't win a title, we are no better than any other teams who didn't, including the old Thunder, the current 76ers or any other team, no matter whether they took the rebuilding or trade route in an attempt to build a contender. If we don't win a title with Lebron/AD, I'll always wonder what could have been if we kept the young guys. If even we never won a title with them, I probably would have enjoyed watching them grow into a playoff contender more than enjoying just watching Lebron/Ad play together with no title. _________________ LakersGround's Terms of Service
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SocalDevin Star Player
Joined: 26 May 2016 Posts: 7825 Location: Long Beach
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Posted: Mon Jan 20, 2020 1:53 pm Post subject: |
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LakerSanity wrote: | audioaxes wrote: | wolfpaclaker wrote: | Many touted the Sixers model as proof, or the Thunder model even. Yet years later, the Thunder now have zero superstars despite some great management. The Sixers have pretty much gotten rid of all their young talent minus Embiid and Simmons, who are not exactly looking like a realistic championship level team. What we acheived with this AD and Lebron pairing, and the timing to have the cap to sign Kawhi on top of it, had 2-3 championships written all over it. Even without Kawhi, I see us being in contention realistically for 2 years. For sure after that, it will come down to some smart decisions by Rob and co, on what they want to do. Because the expiration date on Lebron's championship window is about 2-3 years at most. Hopefully they don't make the same mistake done with Kobe, late in his career. |
I agree. My only complaint is the Lakers put all their cards on the table too soon in the AD negotiations. They could have drove a harder bargain and not given up so many draft picks. I put some of that on Magic who I assume offered everything last year, and our previous LAZY coaching staff for not even developing our young players. If our youth looked more polished and developed from the previous season our trade package doesnt need multiple 1st round sweeteners. |
At the end of the day, there is only one objective measure - after all is said and done, did you or did you not end up with a ring? If the answer is yes, then you don't have to wonder what you could have done differently. If the answer is no, you (and those who criticized you) have grounds to question, if not condemn, the moves made.
If we don't win a title, we are no better than any other teams who didn't, including the old Thunder, the current 76ers or any other team, no matter whether they took the rebuilding or trade route in an attempt to build a contender. If we don't win a title with Lebron/AD, I'll always wonder what could have been if we kept the young guys. If even we never won a title with them, I probably would have enjoyed watching them grow into a playoff contender more than enjoying just watching Lebron/Ad play together with no title. |
Never thought of it that way.. interesting take. I would also derive more joy watching home grown talent flourish as oppose to Bron/AD not winning it all.
I guess the only counter argument is, you increase the probability of meeting the objective of obtaining a title if you go the Bron/AD route. |
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Omar Little Moderator
Joined: 02 May 2005 Posts: 90306 Location: Formerly Known As 24
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Posted: Mon Jan 20, 2020 2:28 pm Post subject: |
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There's also a more nuanced argument that says even if you accomplish winning a title, proper asset management can extend your window. _________________ “We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel |
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SocalDevin Star Player
Joined: 26 May 2016 Posts: 7825 Location: Long Beach
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Posted: Mon Jan 20, 2020 2:33 pm Post subject: |
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Omar Little wrote: | There's also a more nuanced argument that says even if you accomplish winning a title, proper asset management can extend your window. |
So you saying you smarter than us huh? lol.. Agree btw.. |
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Luminous8 Star Player
Joined: 26 Apr 2017 Posts: 2192
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Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 12:59 pm Post subject: |
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Going after LBJ we all always knew we were selling our souls. Going after an AD type before going after LBJ would have allowed the assets needed for a run at a PG13 or AD while keeping enough assets to still build around these guys. The Bron era will either be looked at, as a win for the team or an epic failure of mass proportions. |
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KindCrippler2000 Franchise Player
Joined: 02 May 2003 Posts: 15821
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Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 1:29 pm Post subject: |
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Luminous8 wrote: | Going after LBJ we all always knew we were selling our souls. Going after an AD type before going after LBJ would have allowed the assets needed for a run at a PG13 or AD while keeping enough assets to still build around these guys. The Bron era will either be looked at, as a win for the team or an epic failure of mass proportions. |
Most players don't win championships, let alone make it to the finals, so the trade would be worth it if they win one this year. The expectations for them are fairly clear in the next 2-3 seasons, and Pelinka knows this as well as anyone. That being said, it would have been nice to have some kind of youth movement on this team. A part of me wishes we kept Brook (that one still hurts), signed PG or Kawhi, and stuck with BI-Ball-Hart. I know Caruso and Kuz are "young", but (bleep) ain't the same as Brown and Tatum doing their thing on the Celtics. |
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cencio_999 Starting Rotation
Joined: 12 Nov 2019 Posts: 264
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Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 2:58 pm Post subject: |
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KindCrippler2000 wrote: | Luminous8 wrote: | Going after LBJ we all always knew we were selling our souls. Going after an AD type before going after LBJ would have allowed the assets needed for a run at a PG13 or AD while keeping enough assets to still build around these guys. The Bron era will either be looked at, as a win for the team or an epic failure of mass proportions. |
Most players don't win championships, let alone make it to the finals, so the trade would be worth it if they win one this year. The expectations for them are fairly clear in the next 2-3 seasons, and Pelinka knows this as well as anyone. That being said, it would have been nice to have some kind of youth movement on this team. A part of me wishes we kept Brook (that one still hurts), signed PG or Kawhi, and stuck with BI-Ball-Hart. I know Caruso and Kuz are "young", but (bleep) ain't the same as Brown and Tatum doing their thing on the Celtics. |
I hardly recall a team winning it all without having at least one all star drafted by the team itself.
It's a weird and uncommon feeling |
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TheBlackMamba Star Player
Joined: 23 Apr 2007 Posts: 9057
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Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 6:30 pm Post subject: |
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Omar Little wrote: | There's also a more nuanced argument that says even if you accomplish winning a title, proper asset management can extend your window. |
There's a less nuanced argument that says if I wouldn't want to be in a fox hole with a player, he's got to go.
https://media1.tenor.com/images/69666cb40394bf2282b62f953c56dd0d/tenor.gif |
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SocalDevin Star Player
Joined: 26 May 2016 Posts: 7825 Location: Long Beach
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Posted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 9:00 pm Post subject: |
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What a lousy performance tonight.. |
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Luminous8 Star Player
Joined: 26 Apr 2017 Posts: 2192
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Posted: Thu Jan 23, 2020 12:49 am Post subject: |
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SocalDevin wrote: | What a lousy performance tonight.. |
Just couldn’t knock some of the shots he was getting down. Move on and play better is all he can do. Next game he better be ready. |
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SocalDevin Star Player
Joined: 26 May 2016 Posts: 7825 Location: Long Beach
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Posted: Thu Jan 23, 2020 3:06 am Post subject: |
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Luminous8 wrote: | SocalDevin wrote: | What a lousy performance tonight.. |
Just couldn’t knock some of the shots he was getting down. Move on and play better is all he can do. Next game he better be ready. |
Big stage, talking heads hyping him up as an all-star.. I wanted a good showing from him.
Yea hopefully he'll play better next game. |
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lonzobryant Starting Rotation
Joined: 05 Sep 2017 Posts: 594
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Posted: Thu Jan 23, 2020 12:40 pm Post subject: |
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BI is gonna be Zion's Kobe. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Thu Jan 23, 2020 12:41 pm Post subject: |
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lonzobryant wrote: | BI is gonna be Zion's Kobe. |
So there's going to be a breakup in the picture? _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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BigGameHames Star Player
Joined: 24 May 2015 Posts: 7982
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Posted: Thu Jan 23, 2020 1:50 pm Post subject: |
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lonzobryant wrote: | BI is gonna be Zion's Kobe. |
It’s hard for me to imagine these two coexisting long term. I just don’t see a good fit but they have half a year to figure it out. My guess is BI accepts a very lucrative contract from the Knicks this offseason. |
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Aeneas Hunter Retired Number
Joined: 12 Jul 2005 Posts: 31763
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Posted: Thu Jan 23, 2020 2:03 pm Post subject: |
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BigGameHames wrote: | lonzobryant wrote: | BI is gonna be Zion's Kobe. |
It’s hard for me to imagine these two coexisting long term. I just don’t see a good fit but they have half a year to figure it out. My guess is BI accepts a very lucrative contract from the Knicks this offseason. |
Yeah, from the limited bit I saw, it didn't look like a good fit. On the other hand, Ball and Zion seemed to be a decent fit. |
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KindCrippler2000 Franchise Player
Joined: 02 May 2003 Posts: 15821
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Posted: Thu Jan 23, 2020 3:01 pm Post subject: |
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The team was shell shocked by all the Zion hoopla. All those cameras, the national (and international) coverage destroyed continuity. Lots of nerves last night, and crazy that BI missed some easy shots and gimmes, but he'll be fine.
Zion's a generational talent if he's healthy. It's definitely going to be "his team" (not that it matters), but he's an unselfish player and scoring comes naturally to him. Unlike other talents, he's very likeable.
He'll make BI's life easier and defenses can't double/triple him in the post without serious consequences now. |
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cencio_999 Starting Rotation
Joined: 12 Nov 2019 Posts: 264
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Posted: Thu Jan 23, 2020 3:46 pm Post subject: |
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The main fit problem with zion is with favors and hayes, not with brandon |
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SocalDevin Star Player
Joined: 26 May 2016 Posts: 7825 Location: Long Beach
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Posted: Thu Jan 23, 2020 4:32 pm Post subject: |
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The fit narratives persist.. |
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BigBoi Star Player
Joined: 13 May 2012 Posts: 3115
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Posted: Thu Jan 23, 2020 6:27 pm Post subject: |
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SocalDevin wrote: | The fit narratives persist.. |
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venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144468 Location: The Gold Coast
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Posted: Thu Jan 23, 2020 7:51 pm Post subject: |
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cencio_999 wrote: | The main fit problem with zion is with favors and hayes, not with brandon |
And if Zion can play on the perimeter, he could be a nice fit with Jaxon. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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cencio_999 Starting Rotation
Joined: 12 Nov 2019 Posts: 264
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Posted: Thu Jan 23, 2020 11:23 pm Post subject: |
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venturalakersfan wrote: | cencio_999 wrote: | The main fit problem with zion is with favors and hayes, not with brandon |
And if Zion can play on the perimeter, he could be a nice fit with Jaxon. |
I like him staying on the perimeter as a small ball 5, to lure away the opposite center from the paint, as he did with poeltl.
But as a 4 with hayes, I'm not sure.
He would fit much better with a brook lopez type, just like Julius did |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Fri Jan 24, 2020 7:45 am Post subject: |
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I hope BI makes the all star game over PG13. |
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BigGameHames Star Player
Joined: 24 May 2015 Posts: 7982
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Posted: Fri Jan 24, 2020 1:26 pm Post subject: |
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cencio_999 wrote: | The main fit problem with zion is with favors and hayes, not with brandon |
You think Zion needs to play next to a stretch 5? I don’t. Or do you think he should be the 5? |
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cencio_999 Starting Rotation
Joined: 12 Nov 2019 Posts: 264
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Posted: Fri Jan 24, 2020 2:04 pm Post subject: |
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BigGameHames wrote: | cencio_999 wrote: | The main fit problem with zion is with favors and hayes, not with brandon |
You think Zion needs to play next to a stretch 5? I don’t. Or do you think he should be the 5? |
I think that the spacing was awful when zion was on the floor with favors or hayes.
And I haven't seen him enough yet to say that he can play the 5 against the likes of adams or even mcgee, let alone elite centers like embiid or KAT |
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BigGameHames Star Player
Joined: 24 May 2015 Posts: 7982
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Posted: Fri Jan 24, 2020 2:40 pm Post subject: |
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cencio_999 wrote: | BigGameHames wrote: | cencio_999 wrote: | The main fit problem with zion is with favors and hayes, not with brandon |
You think Zion needs to play next to a stretch 5? I don’t. Or do you think he should be the 5? |
I think that the spacing was awful when zion was on the floor with favors or hayes.
And I haven't seen him enough yet to say that he can play the 5 against the likes of adams or even mcgee, let alone elite centers like embiid or KAT |
So a stretch 5. Agree to disagree. |
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