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epak
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 10:40 am    Post subject:

Fortysixn2 wrote:
Not to be overly negative regarding BI, but is there a single thing he does well? Is it defending? Midrange shot creation? Finishing drives?

As a player who is not going to be the primary option on offense on a winning team I think it’s critical that we identify what advantage he offers and then try to adjust schemes to take advantage of it.

I struggle to identify what BI does well.


In my opinion he defends well against wings who aren't running around using screens all game. Another thing he does well, or has been doing well is being an alternate passer as a wing player. You have to use that perspective though: as a wing player. It's not fair to him to use the lens of a point guard. Again IMO.

And like GT's video's have been showing, he makes good basketball plays moving off the catch (either it be passing or scoring).
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 10:51 am    Post subject:

epak wrote:
Fortysixn2 wrote:
Not to be overly negative regarding BI, but is there a single thing he does well? Is it defending? Midrange shot creation? Finishing drives?

As a player who is not going to be the primary option on offense on a winning team I think it’s critical that we identify what advantage he offers and then try to adjust schemes to take advantage of it.

I struggle to identify what BI does well.


In my opinion he defends well against wings who aren't running around using screens all game. Another thing he does well, or has been doing well is being an alternate passer as a wing player. You have to use that perspective though: as a wing player. It's not fair to him to use the lens of a point guard. Again IMO.

And like GT's video's have been showing, he makes good basketball plays moving off the catch (either it be passing or scoring).


To answer OP’s original question, sometimes BI’s penetrating passes can be a thing of beauty. Sometimes is can be a detriment to the team. In time, I think he’ll be deadly from inside the key. Dishing, shooting, taking fouls or making those fancy spin layups. He’s not there yet, so his best attribute currently is to disrupt players like Durant and PG13.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 10:53 am    Post subject:

VicXLakers wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
VicXLakers wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
epak wrote:
Inspector Gadget wrote:
LakerSD wrote:
Quote:
Really should be emphasized: BI erasing PG in the 4Q probably won LA the game since the latter was absolutely unstoppable beforehand. And there's no other player on the team that could have done that. Hart/KCP are too small, Kuz/Beas aren't good enough there. Major props to BI.


https://twitter.com/brosales12/status/1086154428497809408?s=21


It is never easy to slow down Paul George for anyone in the NBA, not just guys like KCP/Hart... BI also did a good job on KD... guys who can guard top notch scorers is a rarity that’s why I don’t see Ingram going anywhere unless it’s a deal we can’t refuse.


In the 2 games against OKC, PG averaged only 19 possessions against BI. And only averaged 3.5 shot attempts for 28.6% fg%.

Against Hart: 22 possessions a game and 4.5 fga on 77.8% fg%
Against KCP: 23 possessions a game and 8.5 fga on 52.9% fg%

Heck, are we saving putting BI on PG for the playoffs?


Figure it out Luke!


Luke played that fiddle like a virtuoso last night


Why the hesitation though?


from earlier in the thread...


VicXLakers wrote:


good players will adjust by the 4th if you stick with the same defender or at least that's what I saw with Kobe...good move by Luke


You have to change things up...PG knew it was coming and couldn't adjust fast enough...that's the way I saw it


Phil Jackson used to do the same thing. It's good coaching.

He'd let guys get comfortable. Then late in the game, when timeouts are precious, throw a new wrinkle at a player, allowing us to get stops when it counts.

Above poster is right. Players adjust. That's why you don't show your hand too early. Plus, it keeps BI out of foul trouble.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 12:15 pm    Post subject:

O.G fan from 2010? LOL
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 12:17 pm    Post subject:

epak wrote:
Fortysixn2 wrote:
Not to be overly negative regarding BI, but is there a single thing he does well? Is it defending? Midrange shot creation? Finishing drives?

As a player who is not going to be the primary option on offense on a winning team I think it’s critical that we identify what advantage he offers and then try to adjust schemes to take advantage of it.

I struggle to identify what BI does well.


In my opinion he defends well against wings who aren't running around using screens all game. Another thing he does well, or has been doing well is being an alternate passer as a wing player. You have to use that perspective though: as a wing player. It's not fair to him to use the lens of a point guard. Again IMO.

And like GT's video's have been showing, he makes good basketball plays moving off the catch (either it be passing or scoring).


Clean up his shot mechanics and he'll be a really good all-around player. Most of the struggles he's had this year have been the result of him being miscast, IMO. My biggest hope for him this year was that he'd take a leap forward on defense and he's done exactly that. There's been a noticeable improvement in his decision-making recently too. I hope he's able to continue that when LeBron comes back and there are fewer touches.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 12:22 pm    Post subject:

GoldenThroat wrote:
epak wrote:
Fortysixn2 wrote:
Not to be overly negative regarding BI, but is there a single thing he does well? Is it defending? Midrange shot creation? Finishing drives?

As a player who is not going to be the primary option on offense on a winning team I think it’s critical that we identify what advantage he offers and then try to adjust schemes to take advantage of it.

I struggle to identify what BI does well.


In my opinion he defends well against wings who aren't running around using screens all game. Another thing he does well, or has been doing well is being an alternate passer as a wing player. You have to use that perspective though: as a wing player. It's not fair to him to use the lens of a point guard. Again IMO.

And like GT's video's have been showing, he makes good basketball plays moving off the catch (either it be passing or scoring).


Clean up his shot mechanics and he'll be a really good all-around player. Most of the struggles he's had this year have been the result of him being miscast, IMO. My biggest hope for him this year was that he'd take a leap forward on defense and he's done exactly that. There's been a noticeable improvement in his decision-making recently too. I hope he's able to continue that when LeBron comes back and there are fewer touches.


Yeah, there was a particular play that stood out to me yesterday, I can't remember when it was, but BI made some moves around the FT line, and then pulled away from a jumper from near the top of the key against I think it was Dennis Schroder. Schroder somehow managed to get a hand up pretty good and BI left it short I think.

I mean there is no reason that a guy that is 6'1" should be bother a 6'9" player on a fallaway. That has got to be something with the mechanics or form or whatever.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 12:39 pm    Post subject:

265387 wrote:
Shaq right now is still a bigger offensive threat than Ingram. **** ingram


To think of all the possible superstar trades we could've done for this jack of all trades borderline starter. He didn't live up to his draft status and people are grasping onto his age like Jahill Okafor. That's basically what we've ended up with. We have a prime Wesley Johnson with Nicolas Batum ceiling. We messed up this summer not moving him at the peak of his value.


Last edited by Lazlow on Fri Jan 18, 2019 12:41 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 12:40 pm    Post subject:

Fortysixn2 wrote:
Not to be overly negative regarding BI, but is there a single thing he does well? Is it defending? Midrange shot creation? Finishing drives?

As a player who is not going to be the primary option on offense on a winning team I think it’s critical that we identify what advantage he offers and then try to adjust schemes to take advantage of it.

I struggle to identify what BI does well.


Nothing.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 12:43 pm    Post subject:

ringfinger wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
epak wrote:
Fortysixn2 wrote:
Not to be overly negative regarding BI, but is there a single thing he does well? Is it defending? Midrange shot creation? Finishing drives?

As a player who is not going to be the primary option on offense on a winning team I think it’s critical that we identify what advantage he offers and then try to adjust schemes to take advantage of it.

I struggle to identify what BI does well.


In my opinion he defends well against wings who aren't running around using screens all game. Another thing he does well, or has been doing well is being an alternate passer as a wing player. You have to use that perspective though: as a wing player. It's not fair to him to use the lens of a point guard. Again IMO.

And like GT's video's have been showing, he makes good basketball plays moving off the catch (either it be passing or scoring).


Clean up his shot mechanics and he'll be a really good all-around player. Most of the struggles he's had this year have been the result of him being miscast, IMO. My biggest hope for him this year was that he'd take a leap forward on defense and he's done exactly that. There's been a noticeable improvement in his decision-making recently too. I hope he's able to continue that when LeBron comes back and there are fewer touches.


Yeah, there was a particular play that stood out to me yesterday, I can't remember when it was, but BI made some moves around the FT line, and then pulled away from a jumper from near the top of the key against I think it was Dennis Schroder. Schroder somehow managed to get a hand up pretty good and BI left it short I think.

I mean there is no reason that a guy that is 6'1" should be bother a 6'9" player on a fallaway. That has got to be something with the mechanics or form or whatever.


KIROE spotted this a long time ago. Instead of bringing it straight up on the gather, he cocks it back. That makes it a two-part shot and more of a flick than a shot, really. Same is true on most of his 3's, where he has footwork issues too.

Watch how Kawhi (similar wingspan) doesn't bring the ball behind his head and instead has a one-motion shot that guys can't really bother with contests.



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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 12:48 pm    Post subject:

^ Thanks GT -- yes that is exactly the play I'm talking about!

I just couldn't believe a player 8 inches shorter could get all up into the player he is defending particularly when said player is considered to be exceptionally lengthy.

He's got to fix that otherwise, what's the point in being long if you're going to play short?
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 12:52 pm    Post subject:

ringfinger wrote:
^ Thanks GT -- yes that is exactly the play I'm talking about!

I just couldn't believe a player 8 inches shorter could get all up into the player he is defending particularly when said player is considered to be exceptionally lengthy.

He's got to fix that otherwise, what's the point in being long if you're going to play short?


He’ll never be a respectable shooter unless he changes his shot .. simple as that imo.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 12:53 pm    Post subject:

LKA wrote:
Fortysixn2 wrote:
Not to be overly negative regarding BI, but is there a single thing he does well? Is it defending? Midrange shot creation? Finishing drives?

As a player who is not going to be the primary option on offense on a winning team I think it’s critical that we identify what advantage he offers and then try to adjust schemes to take advantage of it.

I struggle to identify what BI does well.


Nothing.

Nothing is what posters like you are contributing to this thread, if you guys can't figure out what his strength's are then maybe stick to the other threads.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 12:56 pm    Post subject:

GoldenThroat wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
epak wrote:
Fortysixn2 wrote:
Not to be overly negative regarding BI, but is there a single thing he does well? Is it defending? Midrange shot creation? Finishing drives?

As a player who is not going to be the primary option on offense on a winning team I think it’s critical that we identify what advantage he offers and then try to adjust schemes to take advantage of it.

I struggle to identify what BI does well.


In my opinion he defends well against wings who aren't running around using screens all game. Another thing he does well, or has been doing well is being an alternate passer as a wing player. You have to use that perspective though: as a wing player. It's not fair to him to use the lens of a point guard. Again IMO.

And like GT's video's have been showing, he makes good basketball plays moving off the catch (either it be passing or scoring).


Clean up his shot mechanics and he'll be a really good all-around player. Most of the struggles he's had this year have been the result of him being miscast, IMO. My biggest hope for him this year was that he'd take a leap forward on defense and he's done exactly that. There's been a noticeable improvement in his decision-making recently too. I hope he's able to continue that when LeBron comes back and there are fewer touches.


Yeah, there was a particular play that stood out to me yesterday, I can't remember when it was, but BI made some moves around the FT line, and then pulled away from a jumper from near the top of the key against I think it was Dennis Schroder. Schroder somehow managed to get a hand up pretty good and BI left it short I think.

I mean there is no reason that a guy that is 6'1" should be bother a 6'9" player on a fallaway. That has got to be something with the mechanics or form or whatever.


KIROE spotted this a long time ago. Instead of bringing it straight up on the gather, he cocks it back. That makes it a two-part shot and more of a flick than a shot, really. Same is true on most of his 3's, where he has footwork issues too.

Watch how Kawhi (similar wingspan) doesn't bring the ball behind his head and instead has a one-motion shot that guys can't really bother with contests.




This whole team could use a shooting coach, I don't understand why it's not a top priority given how most of our players struggle shooting the ball. Especially FT which has lost them plenty of games.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 12:58 pm    Post subject:

BI needs to spend some time working with Rasheed "unblockable jumper" Wallace.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 12:58 pm    Post subject:

Mr.81 wrote:
LKA wrote:
Fortysixn2 wrote:
Not to be overly negative regarding BI, but is there a single thing he does well? Is it defending? Midrange shot creation? Finishing drives?

As a player who is not going to be the primary option on offense on a winning team I think it’s critical that we identify what advantage he offers and then try to adjust schemes to take advantage of it.

I struggle to identify what BI does well.


Nothing.

Nothing is what posters like you are contributing to this thread, if you guys can't figure out what his strength's are then maybe stick to the other threads.


or hold true to your pledge to give us a break until Bron comes back
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 1:02 pm    Post subject:

Mr.81 wrote:
LKA wrote:
Fortysixn2 wrote:
Not to be overly negative regarding BI, but is there a single thing he does well? Is it defending? Midrange shot creation? Finishing drives?

As a player who is not going to be the primary option on offense on a winning team I think it’s critical that we identify what advantage he offers and then try to adjust schemes to take advantage of it.

I struggle to identify what BI does well.


Nothing.

Nothing is what posters like you are contributing to this thread, if you guys can't figure out what his strength's are then maybe stick to the other threads.


I mean it’s just facts. The best part of him being on the court is for defensive purposes, and even as a defender I wouldn’t call him elite or a specialist, he’s a pretty good defender. Mainly due to his length. It’s not like he’s exceptional laterally with quick hands like a Lonzo.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 1:14 pm    Post subject:

LKA wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
^ Thanks GT -- yes that is exactly the play I'm talking about!

I just couldn't believe a player 8 inches shorter could get all up into the player he is defending particularly when said player is considered to be exceptionally lengthy.

He's got to fix that otherwise, what's the point in being long if you're going to play short?


He’ll never be a respectable shooter unless he changes his shot .. simple as that imo.


Why does he shoot with his arm bent like that? Instead of the release happening at full extension? He's giving up nearly all of his length advantage doing it that way. Grrr.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 1:18 pm    Post subject:

LKA wrote:
Mr.81 wrote:
LKA wrote:
Fortysixn2 wrote:
Not to be overly negative regarding BI, but is there a single thing he does well? Is it defending? Midrange shot creation? Finishing drives?

As a player who is not going to be the primary option on offense on a winning team I think it’s critical that we identify what advantage he offers and then try to adjust schemes to take advantage of it.

I struggle to identify what BI does well.


Nothing.

Nothing is what posters like you are contributing to this thread, if you guys can't figure out what his strength's are then maybe stick to the other threads.


I mean it’s just facts. The best part of him being on the court is for defensive purposes, and even as a defender I wouldn’t call him elite or a specialist, he’s a pretty good defender. Mainly due to his length. It’s not like he’s exceptional laterally with quick hands like a Lonzo.

Well you just named something he does well, he is also averaging 7rb/5ast for the month so even though he really has struggled to score recently he brings other things to the table. I think he needs to fix his jumper and gain some weight over the summer and he can make a big jump offensively next year. He is not that far off from being a 20/5/5 type player with solid defense, at 21 he has plenty of time to improve as a player.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 1:24 pm    Post subject:

ringfinger wrote:
LKA wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
^ Thanks GT -- yes that is exactly the play I'm talking about!

I just couldn't believe a player 8 inches shorter could get all up into the player he is defending particularly when said player is considered to be exceptionally lengthy.

He's got to fix that otherwise, what's the point in being long if you're going to play short?


He’ll never be a respectable shooter unless he changes his shot .. simple as that imo.


Why does he shoot with his arm bent like that? Instead of the release happening at full extension? He's giving up nearly all of his length advantage doing it that way. Grrr.


I wish I knew. His slow release has always frustrated me. Reason why imo he’s Tayshaun Prince and will never be an elite shot creator like a KD or Kawhi. He looks just like Prince on the court tbh even shoots like him
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 1:28 pm    Post subject:

LKA wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
LKA wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
^ Thanks GT -- yes that is exactly the play I'm talking about!

I just couldn't believe a player 8 inches shorter could get all up into the player he is defending particularly when said player is considered to be exceptionally lengthy.

He's got to fix that otherwise, what's the point in being long if you're going to play short?


He’ll never be a respectable shooter unless he changes his shot .. simple as that imo.


Why does he shoot with his arm bent like that? Instead of the release happening at full extension? He's giving up nearly all of his length advantage doing it that way. Grrr.


I wish I knew. His slow release has always frustrated me. Reason why imo he’s Tayshaun Prince and will never be an elite shot creator like a KD or Kawhi. He looks just like Prince on the court tbh even shoots like him


There’s a very large middle ground between those players and that’s where I realistically hope he ends up. Secondary shot creator/elite wing defender/serviceable shooter who you can’t leave wide open is my hope for him in his prime.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 1:33 pm    Post subject:

his length is actually detrimental to his shot right now; at least on most shots. He shoots over some smaller guys nicely on 10ft fades - but when they really stay close to his body. & seek out his shooting arm to contest, they can always get to it - as you saw Shcroeder do - he couldn't full extend the follow-through because of the contest

All the extra motion causes him to shoot on the way down often, imo. He’s so long the ball goes way behind his head and takes longer to unravel - doesn’t have enough time in the air and shoots on the way down. And the extra motion is extra time, allowing closer contests
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 1:51 pm    Post subject:

Are fans the only ones seeing this? Does BI ever ask himself, "Why are all my shots contested from the tallest to the shortest defenders?" Does the coaching staff bring this up? Zubak, BI.. examples of piss poor player development. Zu showed us he could play his rookie yr, somehow we didn't jump on that. Same way how we messed around with Nance, even letting him start over Randle, instead of focusing on the higher ceiling player.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 2:46 pm    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
BI needs to spend some time working with Rasheed "unblockable jumper" Wallace.


Does that mean BI has to walk by the Chalkboard every game before hitting the court?
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 2:58 pm    Post subject:

Mr.81 wrote:
LKA wrote:
Fortysixn2 wrote:
Not to be overly negative regarding BI, but is there a single thing he does well? Is it defending? Midrange shot creation? Finishing drives?

As a player who is not going to be the primary option on offense on a winning team I think it’s critical that we identify what advantage he offers and then try to adjust schemes to take advantage of it.

I struggle to identify what BI does well.


Nothing.

Nothing is what posters like you are contributing to this thread, if you guys can't figure out what his strength's are then maybe stick to the other threads.


Yes, please just GTFO trolls! You suck.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 3:10 pm    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
BI needs to spend some time working with Rasheed "unblockable jumper" Wallace.


Loved Sheed's game, don't think he realized how good he could have been.
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