OFFICIAL Class of 2015 Okafor/Mudiay/non-DLO Rookies Discussion
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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 31, 2015 5:29 am    Post subject:

Chronicle wrote:
I wanted Cauley-Stein and maybe after the Kings game other people will finally understand why


With maybe the 5th pick I was down too. Not with the 2nd.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 31, 2015 7:13 am    Post subject:

lakersfan32 wrote:
KAT exploded tonight, wow.


It blew my mind that people wanted Okafor over him.
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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 31, 2015 9:16 am    Post subject:

kaoss128 wrote:
lakersfan32 wrote:
KAT exploded tonight, wow.


It blew my mind that people wanted Okafor over him.

Yeah. That much should not have been in dispute. KAT is everything you want in a modern big man.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 31, 2015 9:33 am    Post subject:

thegreatest wrote:
Okafor played fine tonight. Favors guarded him for the most part, and when he got it in the post, he was usually doubled. He had issues putting a body on someone early and was bad on the defensive boards. Looks like someone got into his ear and he did better as the game went on. He hit a 15 footer and missed 2 other jumpshots. One of which he had to shoot because of the clock.

He had a few good sequences where he was doubled and kick it out and re posted. At times he rushed his shot, because he knew a double was coming. He handled the double much better today, so that was an improvement.

Defensively, he was lost on team defense. He played solid defense on Favors. Favors did most of his damage in the 3rd when Okafor was out of the game.

Still needs to work on his motor. That and conditioning are his biggest weaknesses. Even the last game I wasn't impressed with his motor. As that improves, his defense and rebounding will improve as well.

It looks like they want to mix up where he gets his touches. He is blessed to be on a team that isn't fooling themselves.


Good stuff right here.
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lakersken80
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 31, 2015 12:43 pm    Post subject:

lakersfan32 wrote:
KAT exploded tonight, wow.


He's the #1 pick for a reason....Double double in his 2nd NBA game, wow!
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 31, 2015 6:05 pm    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Drifts wrote:
Okafor is playing with total scrubs... Utah doubles him every time and he is kicking it out for bricks... his teammates are not even capable of driving and drawing for the dish... it's going to be harder for Okafor to score with defense focused on just stopping him.

he did school Gobert twice in the fourth, draw 2 fouls on Gobert, the defensive monster.
. Ok. But I didn't hear the "scrub" argument when he went 26/9. I think it had something to do with David Lee/zeller guarding him?


I was actually surprised Okafor got as many points as he did in the Boston game... he is surrounded by terrible talent, no shooters, no playmakers... all it takes is a strong double to make it difficult for him.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 31, 2015 6:23 pm    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Chronicle wrote:
I wanted Cauley-Stein and maybe after the Kings game other people will finally understand why


With maybe the 5th pick I was down too. Not with the 2nd.


I don't know man. People have different interpretations of best player available.

Randle and WCS up front would have been awesome. If he adds consistency to the mid-range shot, it's not even a stretch to play Hibbert/WCS at C/PF.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 31, 2015 6:38 pm    Post subject:

D'angelo Russell is a tall version of Steve Nash in 5 years. I am clueless at how you cant see it. His skill set is to get the ball to a man who is in scoring position. That is a skill that very little PGs have. Add that with Westbrook in 2 years, if he comes, you would have a threat to the GSW backcourt.

Lakers just need a coach who knows how to coach.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 31, 2015 6:50 pm    Post subject:

Oliver Reed wrote:
D'angelo Russell is a tall version of Steve Nash in 5 years. I am clueless at how you cant see it. His skill set is to get the ball to a man who is in scoring position. That is a skill that very little PGs have. Add that with Westbrook in 2 years, if he comes, you would have a threat to the GSW backcourt.

Lakers just need a coach who knows how to coach.


I agree with a Nash comparison. I can see it. But Nash was just so much more of a deadly shooter, and could actually make shots on the fly, leaning one way or another.

Honestly want Russell to learn from Nash.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2015 5:47 am    Post subject:

IMO after watching these guys a few games and SPL/preseason as well.

Towns - All-Star for sure, going to be someone maybe not as good as Anthony Davis, but close to that level. Remains to be seen if he can carry a team as the #1, because like Davis (and prime Dwight) numbers and impact are great, but not too many go to moves, usually relying on athleticism and others to create shots for him.

Okafor - All-Star likely as well. The Sixers team sucks, really horrible situation for him in that regard. The least they could have done is surround him and Noel with some 3 point shooters. The positive is Noel can compensate for some of Oak's main weaknesses which are D and rebounding. If you look at his numbers, he's averaging 18 ppg on 50 percent shooting, drawing doubles already. He'll probably be triple teamed on nights he's good because the Sixers have no perimeter threats. But look at his lack of rebounding and D, those knocks were legit. I see Tim Duncan like on O, but not Tim on D. He'll likely be a Pau Gasol caliber player IMO. Elite skillset, very good on O, but passion/D can and will come into question at times. Not as high on him as I was 4-5 months ago, but definitely the 2nd best player in this draft. I still see little reason for a team not to take Okafor at #2, because unlike Russ/Porzingis/WCS/Winslow etc. Okafor is a sure thing on O, you know what you're getting for the next decade. Rarely you get guys this ready to be impact on O right away.

Porzingis - For me, he's been a surprise. I had no clue why the Lakers were looking at him, but now I really do see it. He's got length, size and above average athleticism in that 7'2-7'3 frame. You look at him and he can shoot, he can handle the ball, he can post up even. In the Tri, it looks like he's moving off the ball well. Reminds me most of Andrei Kirilenko, a bigger AK, with less defensive ability but more shooting ability. This may be the Knicks best pick and move since Gallinari. Now just don't go trade him for a star, like they did with DG. Let him grow for 2-3 years. Major question for KP is health. Is he going to hold up in the NBA grind. By starting him, the Knicks right away look longer, more athletic and skilled.

Mudiay - Exactly what I thought he'd be. Natural fit in today's NBA. Quick, athletic, loves to run the O. Aggressive. Larry Brown called him the best PG in the draft, which seems accurate. Isn't on Wall's level, but should be an all-star caliber PG.

WCS - Really impressed by his athleticism. Runs the floor, plays active on D. finishes plays well. Tyson Chandler 2.0 wasn't a bad comparison.

If I had to do rank the prospects again in the draft - I think there's no doubt Towns should be #1. #2-7 will be interesting, it could go anyway. Right now I'd lean towards - Towns, Okafor, Porzingis, Mudiay, Russell, WCS and Winslow in that order. Russell has slipped a bit, but not because he's been bad, moreso because the other guys have been more than what I anticipated them to be.
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CandyCanes
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2015 9:27 am    Post subject:

If possible, I wish we would have traded the #2 pick for #6 and #8 or something and drafted WCS and either Stanley Johnson or Winslow.

Clarkson
Kobe
Stanley Johnson
Randle
WCS

Plus the cap space to potentially have signed Aldridge at PF and bring Randle off the bench.
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KeepItRealOrElse
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2015 9:58 am    Post subject:

CandyCanes wrote:
If possible, I wish we would have traded the #2 pick for #6 and #8 or something and drafted WCS and either Stanley Johnson or Winslow.

Clarkson
Kobe
Stanley Johnson
Randle
WCS

Plus the cap space to potentially have signed Aldridge at PF and bring Randle off the bench.


eh, but there was no team who had two picks in the top 10- making it pretty impossible to trade #2 for 2 top tens.
And also, just judging on college performance - I would have took Russell over a package of WCS and Stanley ; or Winslow and Mudiay. Russell really did look like the next lethal ball dominant guard in this league - in large part due to how he scored the ball. I'm optimistic that he can regain that
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CandyCanes
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2015 11:19 am    Post subject:

KeepItRealOrElse wrote:
CandyCanes wrote:
If possible, I wish we would have traded the #2 pick for #6 and #8 or something and drafted WCS and either Stanley Johnson or Winslow.

Clarkson
Kobe
Stanley Johnson
Randle
WCS

Plus the cap space to potentially have signed Aldridge at PF and bring Randle off the bench.


eh, but there was no team who had two picks in the top 10- making it pretty impossible to trade #2 for 2 top tens.
And also, just judging on college performance - I would have took Russell over a package of WCS and Stanley ; or Winslow and Mudiay. Russell really did look like the next lethal ball dominant guard in this league - in large part due to how he scored the ball. I'm optimistic that he can regain that


This has been beaten to a dead horse, but do you think he has the athleticism to be at that level? I get that guys like Steve Nash and Harden have gone on to be elite players with just shooting, ball-handling, and passing, but I would have been more comfortable going with someone with a higher athletic ceiling. Not really a fan of Mudiay either though.

As for the trade-down, not sure how it would have been done. But out of all the rookies, I like Towns, Stanley Johnson, and Winslow the most so far.
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KeepItRealOrElse
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2015 12:37 pm    Post subject:

CandyCanes wrote:
KeepItRealOrElse wrote:
CandyCanes wrote:
If possible, I wish we would have traded the #2 pick for #6 and #8 or something and drafted WCS and either Stanley Johnson or Winslow.

Clarkson
Kobe
Stanley Johnson
Randle
WCS

Plus the cap space to potentially have signed Aldridge at PF and bring Randle off the bench.


eh, but there was no team who had two picks in the top 10- making it pretty impossible to trade #2 for 2 top tens.
And also, just judging on college performance - I would have took Russell over a package of WCS and Stanley ; or Winslow and Mudiay. Russell really did look like the next lethal ball dominant guard in this league - in large part due to how he scored the ball. I'm optimistic that he can regain that


This has been beaten to a dead horse, but do you think he has the athleticism to be at that level? I get that guys like Steve Nash and Harden have gone on to be elite players with just shooting, ball-handling, and passing, but I would have been more comfortable going with someone with a higher athletic ceiling. Not really a fan of Mudiay either though.

As for the trade-down, not sure how it would have been done. But out of all the rookies, I like Towns, Stanley Johnson, and Winslow the most so far.


I really do think so. I'm not sure he would reach his ceiling, but if he plays like he did at OSU, then his floor is extremely high. His floor would be a lethal pull-up guy 3 and midrange guy, and that would open up passing lanes, it'd make him a top 3 passer in this league - that package would be his floor. And then you could also run him off offball screens and take even more advantage of the gravity of his shooting and moving the D. He just has to get his pull-up back to being lethal and he's an allstar IMO.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2015 12:40 pm    Post subject:

KeepItRealOrElse wrote:
CandyCanes wrote:
KeepItRealOrElse wrote:
CandyCanes wrote:
If possible, I wish we would have traded the #2 pick for #6 and #8 or something and drafted WCS and either Stanley Johnson or Winslow.

Clarkson
Kobe
Stanley Johnson
Randle
WCS

Plus the cap space to potentially have signed Aldridge at PF and bring Randle off the bench.


eh, but there was no team who had two picks in the top 10- making it pretty impossible to trade #2 for 2 top tens.
And also, just judging on college performance - I would have took Russell over a package of WCS and Stanley ; or Winslow and Mudiay. Russell really did look like the next lethal ball dominant guard in this league - in large part due to how he scored the ball. I'm optimistic that he can regain that


This has been beaten to a dead horse, but do you think he has the athleticism to be at that level? I get that guys like Steve Nash and Harden have gone on to be elite players with just shooting, ball-handling, and passing, but I would have been more comfortable going with someone with a higher athletic ceiling. Not really a fan of Mudiay either though.

As for the trade-down, not sure how it would have been done. But out of all the rookies, I like Towns, Stanley Johnson, and Winslow the most so far.


I really do think so. I'm not sure he would reach his ceiling, but if he plays like he did at OSU, then his floor is extremely high. His floor would be a lethal pull-up guy 3 and midrange guy, and that would open up passing lanes, it'd make him a top 3 passer in this league - that package would be his floor - If he can regain his scoring prowess, specifically w the pull-up 3s. And then you could also run him off offball screens and take even more advantage of the gravity of his shooting and moving the D. He just has to get his pull-up back to being lethal and he's an allstar IMO.


What do you think of Okafor?

And are you as optimistic about Randle, who's basically a rookie this year? He's starting to look like a bust to me. No jumpshot, poor decisionmaking, above-average ballhandling for a PF but not really anything special.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2015 12:49 pm    Post subject:

Okafor has been two different guys in the SL/pre and regular season. Before the regular season was pretty bad, under 40%Fg between the SL/pre and got 1/3 shots blocked in SL. But the first game of the regular season vs the Celtics, he looked great. He looked like the Okafor progressing from Duke. I still think he's going to struggle his first couple years, shoot in the low 40s until he gets crafty enough to finish around length. But maybe his developing face up game expedites that process.

Looks like Randle's whole game depends on the development of his jumpshot. I can't utter "potential bust" with him, because he's too skilled off the bounce and too quick. If the consistent J develops (which Davis, Griffin, Ibaka, Milsap all were bad shooters their rookie years) , then he'll be able to do fake shot dribble moves and get all the way to the rim and he'll be a star.
If the jumper doesn't develop, then he needs to get back to averaging 4assist per 36 like he did in preseason, and more. He can develop into a good drive and kick playmaker if he's not a big scorer - so I don't think he's guna be a bust. I worry about his D and off the finger tip rebounds more than anything.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2015 5:36 pm    Post subject:

Mudiay has a loooooong way to go between the ears.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2015 5:43 pm    Post subject:

Does Mudiay think he's a 19 year old or something? He needs to man up and play harder.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2015 7:35 pm    Post subject:

6/5/4 on 3-14 today for Mudiay against okc. I too fear for DLO against okc.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2015 9:58 pm    Post subject:

GoldenThroat wrote:
Mudiay has a loooooong way to go between the ears.


But Chinese competition is better than NCAA, right?
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 02, 2015 7:09 am    Post subject:

As of today:

Mudiay, 3 games, 13/4/5, 6 tpg, (39% from 3s...good for him!).
Oak, 2 games, 18/6/1, 5 tpg, playing 37 mpg (whoa).
DLO, 3 games, 9/3/2, 2 tpg, 25 mpg.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 02, 2015 7:49 am    Post subject:

Justice Winslow has looked very good defensively against both LeBron and Harden already.

LeBron made his shots against tough defense. Harden didn't.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 02, 2015 7:57 am    Post subject:

BPM, Top 10 Picks, 11/2/15

1) Willie Cauley-Stein...+11.7
2) Karl-Anthony Towns...+6.5
3) Stanley Johnson........+3.0
4) Justise Winslow.........+0.5
Average NBA Player...+0.0
5) D'Angelo Russell.........-1.7
6) Frank Kaminsky..........-4.7
7) Jahlil Okafor...............-5.6
8) Kristaps Porzingis.......-5.9
9) Mario Hezonja............-7.0
10) Emmanuel Mudiay.....-8.3
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 02, 2015 8:00 am    Post subject:

GoldenThroat wrote:
BPM, Top 10 Picks, 11/2/15

1) Willie Cauley-Stein...+11.7
2) Karl-Anthony Towns...+6.5
3) Stanley Johnson........+3.0
4) Justise Winslow.........+0.5
Average NBA Player...+0.0
5) D'Angelo Russell.........-1.7
6) Frank Kaminsky..........-4.7
7) Jahlil Okafor...............-5.6
8) Kristaps Porzingis.......-5.9
9) Mario Hezonja............-7.0
10) Emmanuel Mudiay.....-8.3


Defense ftw.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 02, 2015 8:15 am    Post subject:

Yeah, I didn't add any advanced stats. Just the simple box score stats.
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