***LAKERS vs ROCKETS Game Thread 11/08***
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21_Blessings
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:51 pm    Post subject:

JUST-MING wrote:


Kobe and Trevor played a huge role in shutting down both McGrady and Artest. Across the board, they negated each other.


No, not really. Yao is their first option, Bynum is the Lakers 3rd option. Bynum played fantastic team defense while Yao didn't.

Reality is Houston depends on Yao to put up big offensive numbers in order to win games. The Lakers don't need scoring from Drew. Overall, Bynum played the better game and made Houston's best post player irrelevant.
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Spirit
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:51 pm    Post subject:

Anyone seen Trendsetter lately?

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dna.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:55 pm    Post subject:

My man-crush, or BROMANCE as ajaxxx put it, for Ariza just keeps growing. Give him a full year with this team (or even better, the amount of time Luke has had with the Lakers) and just imagine what he could become...

Great game. After a bad first half, we came back to show Houston what a top-tier team is all about. And this is early in the season - I expect our turnovers to drop a lot as well as our offense to run much more efficiently, as time goes by.
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SP_Fever
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 10:02 pm    Post subject:

dna. wrote:
Great game. After a bad first half, we came back to show Houston what a top-tier team is all about. And this is early in the season - I expect our turnovers to drop a lot as well as our offense to run much more efficiently, as time goes by.


i was thinking of that at first, but then realized that the Lakers just played a bad 1st quarter (outscored HOU 34-20 in the 2nd quarter). so yeah, we'll just blame that on the long layoff!
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AIRiza Fan
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 10:05 pm    Post subject:

aww, that was a good special on Mr. Adler.
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lalakersfan88
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 10:17 pm    Post subject:

did anyone notice when Kobe went and got the ball and like elbowed vlad rad in the face to get him out of the way. it still led to the lakers points. at that point, it showed the determination of kobe to jump start the lakers.

GO LAKERS!
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Amara D'Antona
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 10:29 pm    Post subject:

AIRiza Fan wrote:
aww, that was a good special on Mr. Adler.

I hope someone records that; I can't see it because league pass cuts off right after the game ends.
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Texas_Pete
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 10:37 pm    Post subject:

Nutty Professor: "Houston, we got a big #$# problem!"
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Lakers For Life
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2008 11:07 pm    Post subject:

Another 4th quarter K.O. by the Lakers.
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stillmatic
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 1:08 am    Post subject:

Damn, what a game. Kobe was amazing tonight, talk about bringing it on both sides of the floor. Pau, Farmar, man, everyone just brought it tonight even though the box score might not show it for certain players.

This team is just straight up nasty.
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Texas_Pete
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 4:22 am    Post subject:

Man I keep thinking about that blowout. 2nd quarter, Lakers down 32-16. PJ takes out all starters but Bynum:

Farmar
Sasha
Ariza
LO
Bynum

^This lineup had to be +1M! I'm talking swatting, rebounding, and playing the passing lanes. Man they put on a show!! I bet this lineup could kill a lot of teams.
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Dreamshake
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 7:35 am    Post subject: Re: Bynum > Yao

Buddha wrote:
Dreamshake wrote:
Buddha wrote:
Yes I said it. The only reason Yao scores more is because he gets more touches (and shoots better FT's). Otherwise Andrew does EVERYTHING better. EVERYTHING. Better rebounder, better defender (individual and team defender), shot blocker, passer, equal strength but better speed and stamina.

Had Andrew been drafted by an all-scrub team, he'd be putting up 20/10 by virtue of minutes and touches. Bynum > Yao already.


Better rebounder and shotblocker, yes. Yao is better in every other facet. If the Lakers only wanted to win this year (i.e. I can see keeping Bynum for the long-term) then they would trade for Yao in a heartbeat. You can't run the offense through Bynum. Bynum is not a better passer. Etc....

But we are all entitled to our opinions....


You can make an argument about the passing but that bolded part is just ridiculous. You can't anchor this type of defense with Yao. He's not quick enough and doesn't defend on the perimeter (e.g. Pick n Roll) well enough. Bynum is a better shot blocker and recover's on defense much better. Considering this season for the Lakers is gonna be all about defense, no way they take Yao over Bynum.


Why can't you? Yao has been anchoring a top 5 defense for almsot every season he has been in the league. You are correct that he isn't great at moving laterally....yet we are still a league leader every season. His weakness to move is masked when you have another PF that can (i.e. Gasol).

Bynum is a better help defender, shotblocker and rebounder. Man...no. Passer...no. Scorer...not even close. If you think the above 3 are better for your team, hey...we are all entitled to our opinions. I don't know too many coaches that would pass on the big that you can facilitate offense through...when the big isn't a bad defender (Yao is actually a good defender).

It's hilarious to me that your team defense would suffer with Yao when he has been anchoring one of the best defenses in the league for years. Even assuming Bynum was a better defender, you honestly don't think Jackson would take a slight step down defensively (Yao is not a bad defender) to add one of the games top 3 offensive pivots (either him, Duncan or Howard)...a dude that could also move out the paint so Gasol can post there at times, that is a better passer and a great FT shooter. I'm talking to win now only. Man please......
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JerryMagicKobe
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 8:37 am    Post subject:

Dream - win now as in this month? This week ?I wouldn't trade Drew for Yao for 1 game. Drew and Yao are current equals, and neither is 100%, but Bynum is getting better game by game, and I'll be surprised if Yao doesn't get worse. It is not all his fault - between the rigors of the Olympics and the lack of help he has down low, he just won't have enough time to recover over the course of all 82. And he still doesn't look right. And our team defense would suffer with Yao. Yao did anchor a top 5 D last year, but Drew anchors the early season #1 D this year. He is a better at most facets of D, but in particular with what has always been a Lakers weakness - screen and roll. Offensively, I'll take Drew from last January over Yao for our team. Especially when paired with Gasol, and even moreso when you consider that we don't run our offense though Drew and would't run it though Yao, either.

You keep Yao, we'll keep Drew and we'll see how the matchup fares over the season. More of the same if you ask me...
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AIRiza Fan
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 8:47 am    Post subject:

Amara D'Antona wrote:
AIRiza Fan wrote:
aww, that was a good special on Mr. Adler.

I hope someone records that; I can't see it because league pass cuts off right after the game ends.


are you serious? I hope someone puts it up too.
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LakerSanity
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 9:08 am    Post subject:

JerryMagicKobe wrote:
Dream - win now as in this month? This week ?I wouldn't trade Drew for Yao for 1 game. Drew and Yao are current equals, and neither is 100%, but Bynum is getting better game by game, and I'll be surprised if Yao doesn't get worse. It is not all his fault - between the rigors of the Olympics and the lack of help he has down low, he just won't have enough time to recover over the course of all 82. And he still doesn't look right. And our team defense would suffer with Yao. Yao did anchor a top 5 D last year, but Drew anchors the early season #1 D this year. He is a better at most facets of D, but in particular with what has always been a Lakers weakness - screen and roll. Offensively, I'll take Drew from last January over Yao for our team. Especially when paired with Gasol, and even moreso when you consider that we don't run our offense though Drew and would't run it though Yao, either.

You keep Yao, we'll keep Drew and we'll see how the matchup fares over the season. More of the same if you ask me...


Yao definitely looks like he is regressing a bit... as little lift as he used to have, it seems even worse now. Last night was also another prime example of my claim that Yao tires as the game goes on and isn't a 4th quarter player (which Dreamshake has always seemingly disagreed with me about).

Right now, you can run an offense through Yao, while realistically you probably couldn't YET with Bynum (although just give it a couple months). As far as defense, there is no comparison between Bynum and Yao. The only thing Yao does better on D than Bynum is hold his ground... otherwise, Bynum is a better team defender, a better help defender, a better shot blocker, and is more versatile as Bynum has shown an ability to defend small/quicker PFs on a switch while that is something Yao has a lot of trouble with.

Yao doesn't look right, Mcgrady doesn't look right... and they have the black hole on offense in Artest. They do miss Battier, but they are now a full year away from Thibideau and Van Gundy. Their offense was always streaky, but their defense kept them in games... I don't see that same D around any longer, which, to me, is the major problem for them.
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2008 2:16 pm    Post subject: Re: Bynum > Yao

Dreamshake wrote:
Buddha wrote:
Dreamshake wrote:
Buddha wrote:
Yes I said it. The only reason Yao scores more is because he gets more touches (and shoots better FT's). Otherwise Andrew does EVERYTHING better. EVERYTHING. Better rebounder, better defender (individual and team defender), shot blocker, passer, equal strength but better speed and stamina.

Had Andrew been drafted by an all-scrub team, he'd be putting up 20/10 by virtue of minutes and touches. Bynum > Yao already.


Better rebounder and shotblocker, yes. Yao is better in every other facet. If the Lakers only wanted to win this year (i.e. I can see keeping Bynum for the long-term) then they would trade for Yao in a heartbeat. You can't run the offense through Bynum. Bynum is not a better passer. Etc....

But we are all entitled to our opinions....


You can make an argument about the passing but that bolded part is just ridiculous. You can't anchor this type of defense with Yao. He's not quick enough and doesn't defend on the perimeter (e.g. Pick n Roll) well enough. Bynum is a better shot blocker and recover's on defense much better. Considering this season for the Lakers is gonna be all about defense, no way they take Yao over Bynum.


Why can't you? Yao has been anchoring a top 5 defense for almsot every season he has been in the league. You are correct that he isn't great at moving laterally....yet we are still a league leader every season. His weakness to move is masked when you have another PF that can (i.e. Gasol).


No offense but your defense is peanuts compared to what the Lakers will be doing this season. His defensive role on Houston from a team concept is simple: clog the lane, block/alter shots. The fact Yao has poor mobility, quickness, and lateral movement is the whole point. Many times Bynum has switched on the high screen rolls and closed off the PG. Yao would get burned.

Quote:
Bynum is a better help defender, shotblocker and rebounder. Man...no.


Yes.

Quote:
Passer...no.


Debatable.

Quote:
Scorer...not even close.


Yes actually. It's simply the way they get their points. You can say Yao's post game is much more mature. But he doesn't get the putbacks, or finish as well as Bynum on the lobs. The difference is simply that Yao gets more touches. Howard's post game is even less mature than Bynum's, yet statistically he's a better "scorer" than Yao.

Quote:
If you think the above 3 are better for your team, hey...we are all entitled to our opinions. I don't know too many coaches that would pass on the big that you can facilitate offense through...when the big isn't a bad defender (Yao is actually a good defender).


a) For no more than 25 mpg until he gets winded.
b) Not when the alternative (i.e. Bynum) is a far superior defender, and isn't a bad scorer (Bynum is actually a good scorer).

Quote:
It's hilarious to me that your team defense would suffer with Yao when he has been anchoring one of the best defenses in the league for years.


Already addressed this above:

No offense but your defense is peanuts compared to what the Lakers will be doing this season. His defensive role on Houston from a team concept is simple: clog the lane, block/alter shots. The fact Yao has poor mobility, quickness, and lateral movement is the whole point. Many times Bynum has switched on the high screen rolls and closed off the PG. Yao would get burned.

Add that to the fact Bynum is a better rebounder and shot blocker as well.

Quote:
Even assuming Bynum was a better defender, you honestly don't think Jackson would take a slight step down defensively (Yao is not a bad defender) to add one of the games top 3 offensive pivots (either him, Duncan or Howard)...a dude that could also move out the paint so Gasol can post there at times, that is a better passer and a great FT shooter.


Why would he? We were already #1 on Offense LAST SEASON without Bynum. Offense wasn't the problem. In case you haven't noticed, the Lakers MO this season is all about Defense. That favors Bynum.

Quote:
I'm talking to win now only. Man please......


Yes, and the Lakers are winning "now" with Bynum, whereas the Rockets are losing "now" with Yao.
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